Super Packs Update - 12/2/2011
By
Adeon Hawkwood,
Posted on: 2011-12-02 18:45 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
AO maybe? I know Archetype has traditionally been abbreviated as AT but it's just one word, makes sense enough to say AO.
Or possibly $O but that's a bit too unsubtle even for me.
A circle forms, everybody comes round
Just to hear the incredible sound
Of a genius smashing expectations
- Jonathan Coulton
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No, I was mainly hoping that people wouldn't work themselves up into a moral outrage and instead just not buy the packs. |
Originally Posted by Mokalus
This post is unnecessary. I hope you don't think all the people who were against the pack were saying "I hate this but I'll buy them anyway". I imagine it's that sort of rigid thinking that got the idea the go-ahead in the first place.
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It's a moot point now, so I'm not going to spend too much more time on it.
De minimis non curat Lex Luthor.
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Yep. I never wanted the ATIOs in the first place.
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Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
Still going to cost me way more than 400 points for the costume set, though isn't it.
Not happy till that is made no exclusive to the pack. |
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now the only question that remains for me is how much the ATOs are gonna cost at the vendors
Excellent developments!
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ArchIOs?
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
"ATIOs" (you need a better name for them).
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Arc #40529 : The Furies of the Earth
Those are some great additions for the ATO's, I hope something equally sensible comes for the costume pieces (the only things I really care about out all of this. 
)
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Again, not if you don't care for any of that stuff. Which is one of the main points against the packs, or at least against including exclusive costumes in them.|
Originally Posted by Bosstone
Windfalls and XP Boosters currently cost 90 apiece, best price. If they stay that way then the Super Packs are still worth it.
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| I'm pretty sure we're going to see more rioting over the uncertain costume exclusivity, though. You gave 'em an inch, Z, and they'll be out for blood. |
just,
@True Metal
Co-leader of Callous Crew SG. Based on Union server.
*goes to take out a loan on her kids*
I know I'm going to be buying some of these....I want that costume set.
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6 months!? That's a long time, but yea I wouldn't be opposed to a system like this if it was implemented.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
As for making pack-exclusive costumes available through other means over the Paragon Store... Sell them. Simply delay the sets by six months from the time they show up in the gambling packs to the time they show up as a regular purchase and then price them either normal or double. That way, people who don't have the patience of a saint will be inclined to try and get the pieces they want early by gambling on them, and people like me who have ZERO patience for uncertain returns for my money will simply wait it out.
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@True Metal
Co-leader of Callous Crew SG. Based on Union server.
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While I'm fine with the Super Packs now - then again, I was fine with them as announced at the Pummit, too - what Samuel proposes here was almost exactly the same compromise I was pondering on as people were grumbling about the 'exclusivity' of costume pieces. |
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Huh... Well, that's surprising. I came in here ready to be outraged, but the new information is actually pretty encouraging. The specifics are obviously up in the air, but hearing that "ATIOs" (you need a better name for them) will be available for in-game activity is a pleasant surprise. I probably still won't actually want them, but as a matter of principle, this is very, very good to hear.
As for making pack-exclusive costumes available through other means over the Paragon Store... Sell them. Simply delay the sets by six months from the time they show up in the gambling packs to the time they show up as a regular purchase and then price them either normal or double. That way, people who don't have the patience of a saint will be inclined to try and get the pieces they want early by gambling on them, and people like me who have ZERO patience for uncertain returns for my money will simply wait it out. Additionally, consider making these costumes available for purchase immediately, but restrict that purchase to VIPs only and release these costumes to Free and Premium players only in the gambling packs. That way, I have one more reason to maintain a subscription. |
As I said, I personally don't mind. Then again, I've been a casual M:tG player since it came out. So I've got a lot of experience with collecting random swag that others may not agree with. My 2 cents, is I would prefer - yes you heard me right, *prefer* - that the costume pieces from the boosters be *kept* exclusive, since to me that sounds like being able to be a VIP. Which, you have to be to get them, as I recall.
And who doesn't want to be able to display being a VIP? The people griping about the exclusive costume pieces, I guess. Doesn't make sense to me but then some people seem to need something to complain about, perhaps, I dunno. Frankly, the gripes about the exclusivity and how it'll cost them points is LUDICROUS considering that the normal method to obtain them is...
Oh right. Spending points. Sheesh. What hypocrisy.
@Raven Lord, who's fine with being the odd man out, as that's 24/7 for him anyways.
Even against certain death, it matters not how or if we fight, only that we do.
Most amusing complement I've ever been paid on an outfit, from @Ukase regarding my Blue Eyed She-Devil Anson Maddocs "Fallen Angel" homage:
"She gives my ex-wife a run for the money."
"She gives my ex-wife a run for the money."
rofl
How about sell the costume pieces like you sell the other costume pack - bundle or pieces. Also, I would really suggest lowering prices on your costume bundles - $5 for 12 pieces is a joke (Halloween and CoT packs).
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Zwillinger HITS you! Placate power was autohit.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
Now for the new stuff:
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Yeah, echoing the 'this works for me'. Because I'm easily pleased.
In the room the women come and go
Talking of Michelangelo.
Costume pieces are the biggest deal breaker for me. I concur with an idea earlier on suggesting that they be made available outside these super packs to VIPs only.
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The Super Packs, as currently outlined, have nothing to do with being VIP. Premiums can buy them. (Free players, strictly speaking, cannot, but only because in buying the points for the packs they'd be upgraded to premium.)|
Originally Posted by RavenSoul
My 2 cents, is I would prefer - yes you heard me right, *prefer* - that the costume pieces from the boosters be *kept* exclusive, since to me that sounds like being able to be a VIP. Which, you have to be to get them, as I recall.
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Originally Posted by RavenSoul
Frankly, the gripes about the exclusivity and how it'll cost them points is LUDICROUS considering that the normal method to obtain them is...
Oh right. Spending points. Sheesh. What hypocrisy. |
If the Elemental Order costume pieces are offered for sale outside the Super Packs, I will buy them unless they're priced too exorbitantly. I will not buy Super Packs, regardless of whether the expected cost of buying packs until I have the whole set is less than the cost of buying the pieces separately, or even if it's the only way to get the pieces.
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In any case, thank you for the update, Zwillinger. It's encouraging news, and I hope that the costume pieces are made available outside the Super Packs.
Glad to see there will be a way to earn the ATIOs in the game instead of only being able to buy them.
I don't have strong feelings about the costume pieces. From what I've seen, they look good and I would probably buy them, however I won't be buying the super packs. I don't spend money on uncertain outcomes (well, there is that whole stock market thing that I do with my retirement money, but that's a little different).
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That's my problem with them. They're not exclusive to VIPs, they're exclusive to people who can justify the gamble, and those don't have to be VIPs. When things like this happen, I start to question precisely what perks my VIP subscription is bringing me, and I'm running out of answers.|
Originally Posted by Placta
The Super Packs, as currently outlined, have nothing to do with being VIP. Premiums can buy them. (Free players, strictly speaking, cannot, but only because in buying the points for the packs they'd be upgraded to premium.)
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Originally Posted by Placta
I'm willing to spend points on the Elemental Order costume pieces. Heck, I want to spend points on the pieces. However, I refuse to spend points on a pack that that might contain one or more pieces and the rest of the slots filled with junk I don't want.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I think VIPs should have a way to get the costume items outside of the super packs.
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Gesundheit.
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Originally Posted by Obscure Blade
ArchIOs?
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My thoughts exactly. Thanks, Z!
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Originally Posted by Deebs
I had no issues with the packs as is but im sure this should make alot of folks happy and I won't begrudge them happiness
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We've been saving Paragon City for eight and a half years. It's time to do it one more time.
(If you love this game as much as I do, please read that post.)
Consider me very surprised that PS decided to make the ATIOs obtainable outside the store. There wasn't a ton of negative feedback about "paid performance" in the big thread, but it was there, and these plans nip those worries in the bud too.
Leaving the costumes in the packs (for now) doesn't have the random problem in the same way, since (as I understand it) you can't get duplicates. So eventually you'd get the whole set if you bought enough super packs. I'm still cold to the idea of paying more for those just because it comes with other stuff. Someone remind me - do you always get a costume piece, or is there a chance you won't? If there's a chance you won't, I definitely wouldn't be buying packs to to get the costumes.
Overall, though, color me happy with two things: the way Zwil chats with us (likely bad for his blood pressure) and that we get updates about the discussion showing feedback was considered.
Blue
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Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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You put this a LOT more diplomatically than I would have- suffice to say this decision makes the Packs a possible buy for me, where as before there was NO way in hell I would touch them.
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Originally Posted by Lazarillo
People who had a problem with predatory marketing being happy with not being treated as prey is funny? It rather makes perfect sense to me, especially since people still seem happy to pay for what they want.
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"Well, there's going to be some light music and a short note of apology saying, 'The universe ended last week, we're really sorry, we don't know what you're doing here, didn't you get the message?'"- Steve Moffat
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VIP only: Incarnate content, including most of issue 22. Also the VIP exclusive costume sets like Celestial.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
That's my problem with them. They're not exclusive to VIPs, they're exclusive to people who can justify the gamble, and those don't have to be VIPs. When things like this happen, I start to question precisely what perks my VIP subscription is bringing me, and I'm running out of answers.
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VIP perks: Free access to several powersets including the upcoming darkness control, free costume sets like the IDF set, free access to various systems like GR and alignment and IOs and AE, etc, etc...
Someone could, with a LOT of cash, get an experience approximating VIP status. But they wouldn't get everything. Personally, I'd rather stay VIP and not need to go on a spending spree to get myself near that level again.
As for the super pack changes...
Now that everything in the pack is available, and a lot of it as in-game rewards (I wasn't expecting ATIOs for merits, that's pretty sweet) I remove any objections I had. The costs for getting the items directly may be excessive, but... the cost of the packs is quite low, and there are alternatives, which is all we really needed to justify this project.
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TO = Training Origin
DO = Dual Origin
SO = Single Origin
IO = Invention Origin
ATO = Archetype Origin