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There is a significant difference between Ayn Rand saying, "I oppose the right of the state to infringe upon the rights of an individual to engage in abhorrent behavior" and And Rayn saying, "I support people who engage in abhorrent behavior against other people."|
Originally Posted by Westley
I doubt your doubting:
"It is not very inspiring to fight for the freedom of the purveyors of pornography or their customers. But in the transition to statism, every infringement of human rights has begun with the suppression of a given rights least attractive practitioners. In this case, the disgusting nature of the offenders makes it a good test of ones loyalty to a principle. If she supports the rights of "hard core pornographers", then I'm sure she supports the rights of "lolRP". |
One is opposition to statism and collectivism. The other is her saying it's okay to behave like an ***.
In fact if you read her qualifying first sentence, the implication there is that clearly she believes even though people have a right to create and consume pornographic material, there is something she finds personally objectionable about it. On that level, if you apply her objectivist philosophy to it, if she finds it objectionable, she probably believes that this is behavior that individuals should govern for themselves and take personal responsibility for ending on their own.
Which coincidentally was the very same philosophy I was applying to the ongoing conversation before we started this drift into philosophical discussion.
At any rate, the quote is not convincing. I still don't see anything there that would convince me that Ayn Rand would believe that adherence to an objectivist philosophy would grant one person carte blanche to treat another person poorly if doing so netted the person nothing other than a fleeting moment of entertainment.
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Originally Posted by Arctic_Princess
Then they alted to a Stone Armour Tank and proceeded to teleport into my vicinity, effectively pushing me out of the ski chalet. The user also did this to a number of other groups of users who were chatting in character. |
Report them and Move On dear. Life is much, much harsher then this princess.
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Sure she would, because she's against the initiation of force... that is.... actual physical force, the taking of someone's property, while she is also one of the staunchest free speech advocates.|
Originally Posted by Sister_Twelve
At any rate, the quote is not convincing. I still don't see anything there that would convince me that Ayn Rand would believe that adherence to an objectivist philosophy would grant one person carte blanche to treat another person poorly if doing so netted the person nothing other than a fleeting moment of entertainment.
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Speech is speech, actions are actions. They are totally two different things, at least if you believe in the Constitution, which gives people the right to speak whatever they want to and only governs the ACTIONS of people.
Then we can get into a debate about whether speaking is an action or not, which is technically true in the literal sense, you are moving your lips... but not true in the sense that "I can cause you physical harm". Unless you're Mariah Carey, she could probably cause physical harm with her voice if she hits the right decibel.
Let's invoke Godwin, shall we?
"The communists and the Nazis are merely two variants of the same evil notion: collectivism. But both should be free to speakevil ideas are dangerous only by default of men advocating better ideas."
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Unless you have decided to grant me some authority I don't possess, then we are not talking about me stripping you of any right to anything. I, as one citizen, utilized my free speech to criticize how you chose to utilize your free speech. Since we are both private citizens, the actions of the state don't enter this equation at all and, on that level, neither does the philosophy of objectivism.|
Originally Posted by Westley
Sure she would, because she's against the initiation of force... that is.... actual physical force, the taking of someone's property, while she is also one of the staunchest free speech advocates.
Speech is speech, actions are actions. They are totally two different things, at least if you believe in the Constitution, which gives people the right to speak whatever they want to and only governs the ACTIONS of people. Then we can get into a debate about whether speaking is an action or not, which is technically true in the literal sense, you are moving your lips... but not true in the sense that "I can cause you physical harm". Unless you're Mariah Carey, she could probably cause physical harm with her voice if she hits the right decibel. |
I don't have the power to take away your 'rights.' But I certainly have the 'freedom' to call you on it when you behave like a toad and advocate to you that you cease doing so.
Whether you exercise the freedom to do so or not is certainly your choice. However, if you don't, that certainly doesn't take away my 'right' to call you on it again at some later date and for you to completely misinterpret an old philosopher's philosophy to defend objectionable behavior.
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Possibly valid when the ranter has the stones to perform his actions within arms length of those who have let themselves be offended by his existientially neutral actions. For in that instance he lets himself be hurt when they strike him.|
Originally Posted by Westley
Offense is created by the offended, not the offender. If nothing upsets or offends you, then guess what? Nobody has that power over you, and you lead a much happier life.
People GIVE others the power to hurt them. If someone is hurting you with words... simply take that power away from them. Give their words no weight or meaning. There, problem solved and you end up with an idiot that's ranting and raving his head off to no effect, wasting HIS time instead of yours. |
Otherwise, he is a posturing little coward.
My scrapper doesn't need an AoE. She IS an AoE.
I would say that trolling and harassment only qualify as rational egoism if one's aptitude for rational thought is extremely poor. Or you're really sociopathic and get a lot of pleasure from making others' lives difficult.
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In your defense, Nietzsche wasn't very perspicacious when he argued this, either.
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Originally Posted by Westley
Offense is created by the offended, not the offender. If nothing upsets or offends you, then guess what? Nobody has that power over you, and you lead a much happier life.
People GIVE others the power to hurt them. If someone is hurting you with words... simply take that power away from them. Give their words no weight or meaning. There, problem solved and you end up with an idiot that's ranting and raving his head off to no effect, wasting HIS time instead of yours. |
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[JFA2010]Mod08: And I will strike down upon thee (enrious) with great vengence and .... oh wait wrong script
@enrious, @sardonicism, @MyLexiConIsHugeSon
If you haven't joined a global channel, you're not really looking for team.
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Guhhh.... big wurd hurt brain... you sayin' I sweat alot?
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Originally Posted by enrious2
In your defense, Nietzsche wasn't very perspicacious when he argued this, either.
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Hey, hey, hey!
Sister_Twelve! Westley! STOP FIGHTING!
I don't like it when two of my favorite people go at it. 
Edit: See what you did? You made me an UNhappy camper! For shame!
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I'd say that the more different people report a griefer indepentantly from eachother the more weight is added to the 'accusations', even if it does 'clog up' the petition line. The more the merrier.
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Originally Posted by oreso
Does it help or hinder if multiple people petition? On the one hand, it would be nice for everyone to vent constructively (ya know, otherwise you're helpless to stop the fun-ruiner) and the GMs would get a better sense of the scale of the perp's annoyingness, but... One petition is all that is required I suppose, and much easier for the GMs to work with.
What's the stance here? |
@True Metal
Co-leader of Callous Crew SG. Based on Union server.
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Originally Posted by Fire Lilly
Hey, hey, hey!
Sister_Twelve! Westley! STOP FIGHTING! I don't like it when two of my favorite people go at it. Edit: See what you did? You made me an UNhappy camper! For shame! |
They aren't fighting they are rp'n about a play slap fight....it's cute....really...
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Actually, as described here, it's harassment/griefing, and very much something the GMs cared about. Sounds like the person even chagned characters because it was a better griefing tool? That verges on stalking... Trust me, the GMs know their job is more secure the more people enjoy their time here.
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Originally Posted by Xanatos
I doubt the GM's would care. If someone is being a pest then either ignore them or leave. Don't get butthurt and stand your ground to "defend your honour." That will just end in tears.
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Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
www.repeat-offenders.net
Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
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i thought that it meant that you were going stand on the edge of a cliff, though that may have just been a bluff.
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Originally Posted by Westley
Guhhh.... big wurd hurt brain... you sayin' I sweat alot?
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There are alot of idiots that thrive on griefing others. You did the right thing by /ignoring and petitioning the person.
Remember kids to show you're super srs while posting use big letters, bold and colors. That way everyone knows that it's srs bsns. This thread made my day. Also the tags are great.
Elec/Cold Troller AV/Pylon/GM/TF/SF Soloing Antics
everytime...he gets me everytime.... DAMN U BOOMIE
-- _Ilr_
Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
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This.
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Originally Posted by Tank_Washington
Report them and Move On dear. Life is much, much harsher then this princess.
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Ouch.|
Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
i thought that it meant that you were going stand on the edge of a cliff, though that may have just been a bluff.
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I mean, I make bad puns. But just... ouch.
My first thought is...couldn't he just say he was RPing his character as being annoying?
Rude. Annoying. I don't think I'd agree to it being bannable, or even worth the GMs time, personally.
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
Today I spent a couple of hours buzzing around the chalet with my new holiday jetpack, pelting folks with snowballs. I even used my second build to include Tactics so Id be more accurate (dunno if this helped).
Id try not to target anyone doing any kind of sitting or leaning emote though, and I did my best not to hit the same person more than once. And of course Id never molest anyone on a ski run.
Anyone standing around though (exiting missions, blabbing in the lodge, etc) was fair game for me. Oh its juvenile alright, and Ill admit Im easily amused, but holy monkey, whenever I hear that WHAP sound as their head snaps back, I very nearly piss myself with laughter! Im not trying to ruin anyones RP (most of my attacks are hit and run), but hey its winter, theres snow on the ground, we have the emote
PIFF! Thats gonna leave a mark!
Nobody said anything to me about knocking it off, but if they had, Id have left them alone. Thats because Im a sweetheart. (No, Im not the guy from the OPs encounter, though I thought I might be when I read the thread title
)
Larry: Owen, what the hell did you do to my wife?
Owen: Well I don't want to say on the phone - all I can tell you is that I killed her last night.
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So anyone not on the run is fair game?|
Originally Posted by Plug_Nickel
And of course Id never molest anyone on a ski run.
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Elec/Cold Troller AV/Pylon/GM/TF/SF Soloing Antics
everytime...he gets me everytime.... DAMN U BOOMIE
-- _Ilr_Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
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Snowball-wise of course! I'd never molest anyone without a snowball, whether they were on a ski run or not!
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Originally Posted by Boomie
So anyone not on the run is fair game?
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Larry: Owen, what the hell did you do to my wife?
Owen: Well I don't want to say on the phone - all I can tell you is that I killed her last night.
My money is on the Dev's doing as much about people deliverately being annoying in game just for their own amusement as they do about people being deliberately annoying on this thread for their own amusement...
It is easier to tell reasonable people to ignore it and move on than it is to deal with an instigator.
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Ah, ok then. Shame, up until now I'd formed a reasonably good impression of him. A pity. | ya know, i agree with you, but westly really isn't the guy who you should take so seriously, he jokes around for reactions, so reacting only feeds him. |
Back to the OP, I'd say this is the major reason I avoid places like PD or the Ski Chalet. Sure, they're a nice location, but I find they attract all kinds of idiots who have decided that your passtime makes you unworthy of their respect as an individual. Shame that the forum has a few floating around too. There's a huge city out there so I prefer finding those spots that don't attract tools like that. Personally I think that trying to RP in the same area as a contact (especially for an event) is a mistake as both local and broadcast get jammed up with spam. But that doesn't help you with your problem.
I'd say report them and move on is the best that you can do. A shame I know, but unless a GM turns up that moment with a massive BanHammer, they're going to just be an *** and disrupt your fun. If you're with friends, suggest that you all move elsewhere away from the jerk. He'll move onto someone else who either is less polite or complains too. In the end, he'll be the author of his own downfall, pillocks like that normally are.
@Dante EU - Union Roleplayer and Altisis Victim
The Militia: Union RP Supergroup - www.themilitia.org.uk
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Sadly, that's not always an easy thing to accomplish.|
Originally Posted by Dante
Ah, ok then. Shame, up until now I'd formed a reasonably good impression of him. A pity.
Back to the OP, I'd say this is the major reason I avoid places like PD or the Ski Chalet. Sure, they're a nice location, but I find they attract all kinds of idiots who have decided that your passtime makes you unworthy of their respect as an individual. Shame that the forum has a few floating around too. There's a huge city out there so I prefer finding those spots that don't attract tools like that. Personally I think that trying to RP in the same area as a contact (especially for an event) is a mistake as both local and broadcast get jammed up with spam. But that doesn't help you with your problem. I'd say report them and move on is the best that you can do. A shame I know, but unless a GM turns up that moment with a massive BanHammer, they're going to just be an *** and disrupt your fun. If you're with friends, suggest that you all move elsewhere away from the jerk. He'll move onto someone else who either is less polite or complains too. In the end, he'll be the author of his own downfall, pillocks like that normally are. |
RP wise, the point of being in some more popular areas, is because it's a place the characters would be.
Don't want to always be out in the middle of no where, on top of some tall building, in the hopes that someone doesn't decide they see you and want to interrupt. :P
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
If you set rules then you should be willing to enforce them. If you don't plan to enforce them, then the rule is useless to begin with.
If people are harassing others then they should be warned/banned, simple.
All I have to say pertaining to the matter, is I can't tell which subject we are talking about anymore....
But that's the point is it not PK?
P.S. Well played!
MY FAREWELL GIFT
It is never truly gone, as long as there is someone left to remember.