I keep foiling AE teams
By
Adult_Swim,
Posted on: 2009-08-03 05:08 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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LOL ... somebody lives in a fantasy world other than Paragon City. Silly AE Enforcer, rules arent important ... its all down to who you know and how you can bypass them ... Look at our President and his Chief of staff and you would realize that ... *sigh* people will never learn.
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Originally Posted by Prof_Backfire
You're still in high school aren't you?
In the real world, rules are actually important. |
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That would be your president, and in the past 8 years your president has indeed made a mockery of the rules.|
Originally Posted by Enfernoe
LOL ... somebody lives in a fantasy world other than Paragon City. Silly AE Enforcer, rules arent important ... its all down to who you know and how you can bypass them ... Look at our President and his Chief of staff and you would realize that ... *sigh* people will never learn.
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You may be playing a game, but the game has rules. They will be applied to you, and complaining will only make them be applies to you quicker. You're paying for the privilege of being able to access NCsoft's servers, under their terms and their rules, and they can do whatever they want with it.
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The important corrolary to this being that if you don't like their rules, you are also free to make your displeasure known by taking your money elsewhere.
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Originally Posted by Prof_Backfire
That would be your president, and in the past 8 years your president has indeed made a mockery of the rules.
You may be playing a game, but the game has rules. They will be applied to you, and complaining will only make them be applies to you quicker. You're paying for the privilege of being able to access NCsoft's servers, under their terms and their rules, and they can do whatever they want with it. |
The wisdom of Shadowe: Ghostraptor: The Shadowe is wise ...; FFM: Shadowe is no longer wise.
; Techbot_Alpha: Also, what Shadowe said. It seems he is still somewhat wise 
; Bull Throttle: Shadowe was unwise in this instance...; Rock_Powerfist: in this instance Shadowe is wise.; Techbot_Alpha: Shadowe is very wise *nods*; Zortel: *Quotable line about Shadowe being wise goes here.* *sigh* i love how all the people quote only half my message and complety ignore the second half where i go on about Farming pre and post AE and how they are nothing a loike and "ae farms" thus TO THIS SEASONED FARMER are...not
AE # 67087: Journey through the Looking Glass - Save the World
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Actually what i find funny is that you quote the real world... cause in the real world we all have capes and spandex and fly around or can run around at super speeds... *shakes head* seriously?|
Originally Posted by Prof_Backfire
You're still in high school aren't you?
In the real world, rules are actually important. |
Look, report all you want. If the people that call the shots (notice I didn't say Devs) didn't like farming or thought it was bad for the game and the bottom line, they would just remove the facilities to do such things. It's simple. Pre-AE with the demons they could have done it. Now it looks like with the new issue they are adding a feature to allow you to set your team size without having the people on the team... sure sounds like they hate farming...
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Actually, the devs said that they didn't want AE to be used for farming. They said it before AE came to the test server, and it obviously went in one ear and out the other. Then they had to reinforce that they didn't want it to be used for farming after fixing the rikti comm. Still, people are still shocked on these boards when someone reports a farm. It really amazes me.|
Originally Posted by _Prankster_
Look, report all you want. If the people that call the shots (notice I didn't say Devs) didn't like farming or thought it was bad for the game and the bottom line, they would just remove the facilities to do such things. It's simple. Pre-AE with the demons they could have done it. Now it looks like with the new issue they are adding a feature to allow you to set your team size without having the people on the team... sure sounds like they hate farming...
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I'd like to point out that the devs don't mind non-AE farms that much. There's still Battle Maiden, a freak farm, BP mask farm, etc. So they really don't hate the farms that much.
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i'd completely forgotten that, though now that you posted it it sounds really familiar. Marvel didn't help their position when they had employees create attempts at clones of Marvel characters in the game IIRC. (Which i probably don't recall correctly at all since i'd already forgotten the prior bit.)
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Originally Posted by Enfernoe
The judge dismissed more than half of Marvel's claims against NCsoft and Cryptic Studios, including claims that the two firms directly infringed Marvel's registered trade marks and are liable for purported infringement of Marvel's trade marks by City of Heroes' users.
All these claims were dismissed without leave to amend, meaning that they cannot be re-filed. According to NCsoft and Cryptic Studios, Judge Klausner noted, "it is uncontested that defendants' game has a substantial non-infringing use. Generally the sale of products with substantial non-infringing uses does not evoke liability for contributory copyright infringement." The sky is falling |
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
I realize farms are like porn, you know it when you see it. But what are the guidelines to what is and isn't a farm?
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Actually, you do recall rather well. it was a little more than "didn't help their case." That was the reason that those claims were discarded (you can't infringe upon yourself, so claiming that they were examples of CoH 'enabling' infringers wasn't correct.)|
Originally Posted by Schismatrix
i'd completely forgotten that, though now that you posted it it sounds really familiar. Marvel didn't help their position when they had employees create attempts at clones of Marvel characters in the game IIRC. (Which i probably don't recall correctly at all since i'd already forgotten the prior bit.)
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The problem is that, because that WAS the reason that most examples were dropped, we never got a definitive answer on whether a non-Marvel player making these clones would be an infringement.
IIRC, there were a few issues left that could have gone to court. NCSoft cared to settle (in my opinion) as risk-management. They weren't guaranteed a win on the remaining issues, so the cost of settling was more prudent.
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Lady, I think people are just offended by the smugness of the reporters.
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Originally Posted by Lady_Sadako
I believe you're right. The flag is something like 'Passed content review'.
Look at it this way. 1. Nobody, no matter how pro-farming they are, is supporting exploitative farms. 2. Farms that aren't exploitative don't get deleted, no matter how often someone reports them. So anyone objecting to people reporting farms is either covertly supporting exploits, or protesting an action that did nothing but use up the reporter's time. |
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You were not hugged a lot as a child were you?
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Originally Posted by Prof_Backfire
That would be your president, and in the past 8 years your president has indeed made a mockery of the rules.
You may be playing a game, but the game has rules. They will be applied to you, and complaining will only make them be applies to you quicker. You're paying for the privilege of being able to access NCsoft's servers, under their terms and their rules, and they can do whatever they want with it. |
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I never said that "Devs" like farming.. I said|
Originally Posted by Atheism
Actually, the devs said that they didn't want AE to be used for farming. They said it before AE came to the test server, and it obviously went in one ear and out the other. Then they had to reinforce that they didn't want it to be used for farming after fixing the rikti comm. Still, people are still shocked on these boards when someone reports a farm. It really amazes me.
I'd like to point out that the devs don't mind non-AE farms that much. There's still Battle Maiden, a freak farm, BP mask farm, etc. So they really don't hate the farms that much. |
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| . If the people that call the shots (notice I didn't say Devs) |
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Making comments and opinions about rules makes them apply quicker? That's the most asinine thing I've ever heard. Is CoH a communist community where if you state your ideals you'll get put down and punished?
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Originally Posted by Prof_Backfire
You may be playing a game, but the game has rules. They will be applied to you, and complaining will only make them be applies to you quicker.
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In the Grand scheme of things people don't know when to shut up.
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Originally Posted by _Prankster_
I never said that "Devs" like farming.. I said
Sure the dev's don't want farming in AE, and if they made the decisions I'm sure there wouldn't be any. But there always needs to be a way to farm in any game that requires as much grinding as this game does. Now if you are talking about exploits of game bugs, I can understand wanting to get rid of those. But how is AE farming any different from the demon,freakshow or family farms? It's only a different scenery with MUCH harder foes... you can go in there and think your gonna just prance through and make lotsa xp for no work, but for an all boss mission you need a good team and some teamwork unless you want to faceplant multiple times and even then you still might. |
I think we're using different definitions of "farm" here.
You seem to be using it in a way that's synonymous with "grinding" (taking mission after mission after mission to get through.) That's basic hunting, not farming.
Farming involves "cultivation"- sticking with a single thing/place (different AE missions don't count) that offers optimal reward (whatever you're interested in- gold, kills, xp, etc) at minimal risk. That's why it's so often associated with "exploit" -- by pushing the limits of maximizing reward and minimizing risk, the farm often steps into exploit territory.
If you're just running missions toward a goal, still experiencing risk that's proportionate to the reward, that's not the 'farm' we're talking about.
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QFT. Especially if a mission (it's never an arc) has a default contact and little or no text.|
Originally Posted by Prof_Backfire
Basic mission teams aren't all bosses.
And if a mission gets reported by a lot of people, guess what? It's probably a farm. |
--NT
They all laughed at me when I said I wanted to be a comedian.
But I showed them, and nobody's laughing at me now!
If I became a red name, I would be all "and what would you mere mortals like to entertain me with today, mu hu ha ha ha!" ~Arcanaville
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i don't see how this addresses what i said at all so let's go over this again:|
Originally Posted by Prof_Backfire
You're still in high school aren't you?
In the real world, rules are actually important. |
you said: i'm not playing hall monitor, i'm doing this because i think it makes the game a better place!
i said: i don't see how the two are mutually exclusive so i'd like you to explain the distinction you're making
¿comprende?
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That may not be the 'farm' that YOU are talking about but trust me your definition is not the consensus... If you ask everyone in this forum what a farm is they will tell you a hundred different answers. But if you walk them into a map with alot of enemies and an open map they will tell you it's a farm. So what I'm saying is that due to the publicly accepted basic definition of farms, good people with acceptable missions are being painted wrongdoers.|
Originally Posted by Chase_Arcanum
I think we're using different definitions of "farm" here.
You seem to be using it in a way that's synonymous with "grinding" (taking mission after mission after mission to get through.) That's basic hunting, not farming. Farming involves "cultivation"- sticking with a single thing/place (different AE missions don't count) that offers optimal reward (whatever you're interested in- gold, kills, xp, etc) at minimal risk. That's why it's so often associated with "exploit" -- by pushing the limits of maximizing reward and minimizing risk, the farm often steps into exploit territory. If you're just running missions toward a goal, still experiencing risk that's proportionate to the reward, that's not the 'farm' we're talking about. |
Also, to quote Prof_Backfire's Sig line: "If you're having fun, you're doing it right."
People can't even agree on a working definition of farming. I can assure you exploiting != farming. Though an exploit will often be farmed.
It is true the dev's said they did not intend for AE to be used for farming, but they didn't intend for a lot of things to be utilized in the way they are.
Not "liking" something and not "tolerating" something are two different levels. Very different.
I've been farming the crap out of AE. All boss spawns are about 6x harder than anything in vanilla content short of some crazy mobs like Ralaruu, but no one every wants to fight them. Boss spawns actually reward fairly when weighted against their difficulty relative to vanilla.
I've been on farms that have hundreds of votes and are very easy to find in the search browser. Not one of them has been deleted from what I can tell.
"Intentions" are meaningless. Follow-through is the only thing that really matters. I'll stop farming MA when the dev's code it so that I can't do it, or they make it absolutely clear that farming is not tolerated in this game. I highly doubt either is going to happen. All that is happening right now is a minor process to appease of the puritans. If the GM's ban a few farms they can make the claim that they are fighting the war on farming, which keeps those people happy and also lets the vast majority of farmers go about their merry way.
It is not a new concept.
For everything the devs have done to reduce farming they have done just as much to encourage it. I can assure you that if you believe they are actively pursuing the total elimination of farming you are delusional.
1) Exploits are aganst the rules.
2) Copyright infringement is against the rules.
3) AE was not designed for farming. Positron was pretty clear on this. While the rules are blurry, the fact is it's viewed negatively. In short: Don't expect sympathy from any of us.
If you break the rules, you face the music. We, the community, have been charged with the task of being the eyes and ears of the Devs. They cannot monitor everything, so they rely on the whole of the playerbase to do that for them. If you have a problem with that, maybe you should request that they introduce paid Game Masters? Then you can really feel the hammer fall as you're judged by merciless NCSoft employees.
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That is the Question, according to some there should be no farms . But yet Kills Skulls badge is aquired by repeatedly killing Skulls. Is not seeking one thing out and going after it over and over again till you get the designated reward farming?And did the Devs not write this code - just like the AE. I really wonder if Matt miller would applaud the OP taking his pug out of the Ae all together or would he want them steered to what he wrote the code for?
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Originally Posted by Adult_Swim
I realize farms are like porn, you know it when you see it. But what are the guidelines to what is and isn't a farm?
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ROFLOL.... wow!|
Originally Posted by AkuTenshiiZero
1) Exploits are aganst the rules.
2) Copyright infringement is against the rules. 3) AE was not designed for farming. Positron was pretty clear on this. While the rules are blurry, the fact is it's viewed negatively. In short: Don't expect sympathy from any of us. If you break the rules, you face the music. We, the community, have been charged with the task of being the eyes and ears of the Devs. They cannot monitor everything, so they rely on the whole of the playerbase to do that for them. If you have a problem with that, maybe you should request that they introduce paid Game Masters? Then you can really feel the hammer fall as you're judged by merciless NCSoft employees. |
Farming is not against the rules.... Farming is not an exploit.... Ae wasn't designed to not allow farming either.... I dont' care what Posi said....
But funny reply anyway.. gave me a chuckle...
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Which is a shame because the community can't agree on a unified definition of farming, or infringement. So everyone will just flag whatever they personally feel is in violation even if it is not in violation. I know I could join 20+ AE missions and not pick out the farm, I don't know enough about them or have a clear definition of what one is to be able to flag something as inappropriate. |
Originally Posted by AkuTenshiiZero
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We, the community, have been charged with the task of being the eyes and ears of the Devs. . |
But if being CoX farming police is what makes people happy then more power to them. Just seems like an incredible waste of time to me personally. To each their own.
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Ah the 'if the game allows it it's fine' defense and the 'willful ignorance' defense.
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Originally Posted by _Prankster_
Ae wasn't designed to not allow farming either.... I dont' care what Posi said...
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@Demobot
Also on Steam
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"I reject reality and will substitute my own!"|
Originally Posted by _Prankster_
Ae wasn't designed to not allow farming either.... I dont' care what Posi said....
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--NT
They all laughed at me when I said I wanted to be a comedian.
But I showed them, and nobody's laughing at me now!
If I became a red name, I would be all "and what would you mere mortals like to entertain me with today, mu hu ha ha ha!" ~Arcanaville
All these claims were dismissed without leave to amend, meaning that they cannot be re-filed. According to NCsoft and Cryptic Studios, Judge Klausner noted, "it is uncontested that defendants' game has a substantial non-infringing use. Generally the sale of products with substantial non-infringing uses does not evoke liability for contributory copyright infringement."
The sky is falling
Enfernoe - Fire/Fire Blaster, Thermal Force - Fire/Fire Tank, Perfirator - Spines/Regen Scrapper, ThermalBlast - Fire/Ice Blaster, BlackSpire - Spines/DA Scrapper. FlaschFire - Fire/Kin troller