Discussion: 57 & 60 Month Veteran Rewards!
By
AARGH_NA,
Posted on: 2009-01-21 17:33 in News, Events and Announcement Discussion
I was pretty upset at this at first. I've been playing on and off since launch (mostly off) and am only currently at 6 months. I will never get to 60 months.
Then I found out you could buy a jetpack for all your toons for $5 a month. Thats an awful lot less than the 60 month vets have spent and I don't have to use ANY power slots. Granted, the jet pack could look better, but for mission to mission travel it does the job nicely. Im sure the cost is upsetting to some, but it is pretty minimal considering the time i spend on the game.
Anyway, im gonna get back to the travel-power free brute i just started working on. He's a super strength/fire named volcanosaur!
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I think they should just allow people to buy Vet rewards early. That way you can wait get em for free, or if your one of the noobs screaming DOOOOM!! you can just open up your wallet and pay $5 per reward.
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Now wait a sec. I paid 720 dollars to get the 60 month reward after "waiting" for 5 years, and a newbie gets them all for $100. Granted I understand that would be upfront and I could see a discount being applied for shelling it out in a lump sum, but that is one hell of a disparity.
--Rad
/whereami:
I can *almost* see the point being made against the 60 month VetReward. As I'm reading through the feedback, the arguments make sense on the surface - this does indeed allow a Veteran to potentially dispense with a power in a tight build that he/she woudl otherwise have been forced to take, a build advantage that could create a gulf between haves and have-nots.
However, let's look at the four travel powers. The obvious weak cases are Flight and Super Jump, since temp power analogs of these can already be easily obtained and maintained forever by doing any of a number of things (spending real money, spending inf, doing an Ouroboros arc - if redside - and even just logging off in the right spot). Those temp powers create an even larger build issue if you argue it on these merits, since they allow you to skip not only the prereq but the power itself if you're so minded.
So let's look at the two you can't easily replace with temp powers - Teleport and Super Speed. Teleport temp powers are rare and to the best of my knowledge not possible to attain on a permanent basis (for one Siren's Call has to be in your faction's control, and the other is a villain-only temp that's not renewable - yet, anyway). Furthermore, the 60-month reward allows the much beloved Hover-Teleport combo to unlock with only two power choices rather than three. This is I think the strongest case, since Veterans already have acces to a team teleport power and therefore may not think much of dropping Recall Friend given the opportunity. The alternative, Teleport Foe, is useful but often situational. I can see a great many teleport-using characters dropping the prereq for something more useful.
Then there's Super Speed. With IOs, the stealth portion of the power can be attained with any number of other powers, so that's hardly a concern. And as for skipping the prereqs, the prereq that's overwhelming chosen here is Hasten, and I don't see that vanishing from many builds that are using it now.
So, I can see a case for a clear Veteran game-changing advantage in only one of the four travel power pools. But this is mitigated by the fact that a non-Veteran, if so minded, can create an even larger build advantage by relying on temp powers for travel rather than using a travel power pool at all. Yes, this reward is significant, but I don't feel it's game-breaking in light of the temp powers available to all players.
As for it acting as a negative for the retention of new players who feel they can't catch up, in my experience people who get upset because they can't have something RITE NAO usually get bored once they do have it. Just my opinion of course, but I suspect anyone the game loses over an issue like this they'd have lost in any case.
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Now wait a sec. I paid 720 dollars to get the 60 month reward
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No, you didn't. You paid to play the game, or else I want to be able to play for a discount without accumulating Vet badges.
Goodbye may seem forever
Farewell is like the end
But in my heart's the memory
And there you'll always be
-- The Fox and the Hound
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*does the "that's so badass" dance*
Unlock Tier 1, 2 and 3 travel powers at level 6?
Flight without Hover? Superspeed without Hasten? Teleport without Recall Friend?
Baaaaaaaad. Can you dig it?
[/ QUOTE ]This is huge. Extremely huge. This is too good to be true. This is the best reward ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!! 
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That is much more useful than I was originally thinking it was. Ooooh, ok, that I might use.
But it's MY sadistic mechanical monster and I'm here to make sure it knows it. - Girl Genius
List of Invention Guides
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Now wait a sec. I paid 720 dollars to get the 60 month reward
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No, you didn't. You paid to play the game, or else I want to be able to play for a discount without accumulating Vet badges.
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Mine and all players fees go into development and operational costs. This fee allowed access to the game. Not arguing that. But, my point was not that I am against the idea per se. More on the dollar amount proposed (this was particularly in the portion you snipped out).
--Rad
/whereami:
Not bad. I approve that msg.
(1) Don't take a low level pool you don't want
(2) Travel fast at 6
Both seriously badass rewards.
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Now wait a sec. I paid 720 dollars to get the 60 month reward
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No, you didn't. You paid to play the game, or else I want to be able to play for a discount without accumulating Vet badges.
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Mine and all players fees go into development and operational costs. This fee allowed access to the game. Not arguing that. But, my point was not that I am against the idea per se. More on the dollar amount proposed (this was particularly in the portion you snipped out).
--Rad
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The dollar amount in question was irrelevant due to the fact that whether it's $5 for all of it or $100 it's still more than it actually cost to get the bonuses the normal way.
Goodbye may seem forever
Farewell is like the end
But in my heart's the memory
And there you'll always be
-- The Fox and the Hound
now if only they wold take the coolness of this vet reward and replace the 45 month vet reward with something a little more happy medium and a less lame than another respec
Bonnie and her bunny
Arc ID: 59406
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Considering how Whirlwind is laughable, Team Teleport has forever been bugged (and has reduced range and huge End cost), Group Fly is barely usable (and is slow and has huge End cost), and Acrobatics has been cut back from 100 mag kb protection to 9 (and IOs often take its place in many builds), then how about throwing out the prerequisites for Tier 4 Travel Pool Powers for everyone? Or move it to be on par with Tier 3 requiring only one pre-req instead of two? If you do that for everyone, it might make the gift for the Vets more palatable. It'll also allow folks to take Group Fly and Team Teleport together so that together they can compensate for each other's weaknesses.
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I think they should just allow people to buy Vet rewards early. That way you can wait get em for free, or if your one of the noobs screaming DOOOOM!! you can just open up your wallet and pay $5 per reward.
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Exactly opposite of the purpose of Vet rewards.
The purpose from the devs point of view, from the good-of-the-game POV.
From those POV,
The ONLY purpose for VR is to keep people paying and playing longer . . PERIOD.
To get people to play for 5 years, yes. But also to get groups of people who would have quit after 12 months, to play 24 instead. etc. to keep people from taking 3 to 12 month breaks from the game, etc. (Those can turn into complete quit easily.)
There are silly things mixed in, like kilts and boxing shorts. But spaced regularly in there are nice shinies. Being able to just cherry-pick the shiny rewards early, stops the sequence of waiting for the next GOOD VR.
VRs and the way the GOOD VRs are spaced out through the list, keep people playing, or at least paying... keeps us playing longer than we would have, and discourages us from taking breaks.
Picking and choosing early completely breaks the purpose for VetRewards.
.
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I get the feeling Mids' head is gonna asplode because of this.
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LOL! Took the words out of my mouth. 
Hover-TP wheeeeeeeeeee!
[/ QUOTE ]Stamina has a level requirement of level 20, and 2 prerequisites. Stamina is a tier 4 power. Health is tier 3. You'd be able to get Health with no prereqs, but you'd still have to have 2 powers and level 20 for Stamina.
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*nitpick* There are no tier 4 powers. Health is tier 2 and Stamina is tier 3. Hurdle and Swift are both tier 1.
But, yes, you are correct that there have not been any dev posts saying that the pre-reqs for tier 3 have changed so if Fitness followed the same route it would not free up Stamina early for anyone.
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Actually, it means you can SKIP taking the first or second power in the Travel Power Pools and, at level 6, pick the travel power immediately. No pre-requisites.
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Is this for real? This is... A bit much for a reward this late in the years...
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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the 50% discount is bad...real bad. i dont think you guys even tried with that one. i have like 50 free tailor sessions now..why would i need a discount??
40 50s so far.
if you dont like me....i dont really care.
respect is earned , never given
Sorry, complete and utter failure for me.
I haven't paid for a costume change in 2 years, and my main has 50 or so free tokens, plus all my toons have loads of vet tokens. Where is the free respec that should have been in the 57 month reward that would actually have been useful for me. I use respecs for moving IOs from toon to toon and as I level up.
I no longer take travel powers villain side (except SS if I want the stealth to stack with something else I have) as there are plenty of temps to get you all the way to 50. I also tend to find the precursor powers (hasten, CJ, recall, air sup) at least as much use as the travel powers themselves, so can't imagine ever skipping them.
*edit - the only use I can see would be if you're building a toon to run Posi or Cap TFs, as it makes the build less tight
It's true. This game is NOT rocket surgery. - BillZBubba
The 60 month vet rewards with the assemble team one, to me means that everyone gets the benefit from it. Lets say 1 or 2 ppl have it, they travel to mish and can team tp the rest without any risk to those that dont have it.
As for as opening an extra power, IMHO depends on build. As some have stated, some will benefit, others won't.
Now that I think about it, a certain toon that had all 4 travel powers (i think) that pvp'd will probably benefit the most...Curious on his take of this.
The 60 month vet badge is awesome. I've been wondering when they would add something like this. I'm very happy this has been put in and I'm so looking forward to it.
The 57 month badge however, is a major let down. I mean c'mon, 50% off at the tailor? By the time I get that badge, all my toons will already have more free tailor sessions than I'll know what to do with. My main alone has 84 free tailoring sessions...
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Massive, epic FAIL. Something so profoundly, massively balance altering as being able to skip a travel prereq being doled out as a veteran reward? I thought these were supposed to be perks and conveniences, not ways for vets to ignore the power rules the rest of us have to follow.
Seriously, this is an absolutely insane change to give to just a small segment of the population. Given that this reward kicks in at 5 years, it's frankly unlikely that most will *ever* get to this reward during the lifetime of the game.
And, yes, I'm mostly annoyed that I doubt I'll ever get to use this. I have about 8 billion builds that would benefit immensely from being able to drop the travel prereq. But, seriously, this is by far the biggest thing they've ever given out in a vet reward, and frankly I think it's way *too* big to give out as a vet reward. I obviously can't say for sure how I'd react if I *was* in line to get this - I know I'd be quite interested in the options it would open up - but I'd like to think that I'd find this a bit iffy even then. Allowing just a small portion of the population to ignore such a fundamental rule seems more than a bit unfair.
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Yep.
Things like this will only alienate new players and make them feel like they can never compete or catch up.
Things like this don't encourage me to stay subscribed, in fact, they only re-enforce why I should not waste my money staying subscribed because there's no way I'll ever be able to "catch up" and have access to half this stuff. I'll always be perpetually years behind everyone else, even if I were to stay subscribed permanently right now from this point on.
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All i can say is.. wow.
I'm very disappointed seeing something this huge to be given out as that 60 month vet reward, as though it is a extremely nice reward, fact is that many will never reach it, leaving them out in the cold, so to speak.. while the vets who've likely been here since the beta are able readjust/modify their builds around this benefit.
*shrug*
So yeah, seeing that this is something i'll never be able to achieve, doesn't exactly make me want to stick around, but.. heh, nice reward, for those who actually can get it. 
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Meh.
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Seriously. I'm not usually one to complain about free stuff, but I'm struggling to think of any instance where I would get any use out of either of these.
Given how excited other people are, I hope I'll find it more fun than it sounds.
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I am sure you cant even fathom or see yourself flying across the hollows at lvl 6.... or super speeding thru kings row at lvl 6.... yeah
No one goes there anymore, it's too crowded...
"The potato goes in the FRONT."
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The 60 month vet badge is awesome. I've been wondering when they would add something like this. I'm very happy this has been put in and I'm so looking forward to it.
The 57 month badge however, is a major let down. I mean c'mon, 50% off at the tailor? By the time I get that badge, all my toons will already have more free tailor sessions than I'll know what to do with. My main alone has 84 free tailoring sessions...
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Oddly my newest toon (32nd character on Virtue) has NO free sessions, so the 50% off is nice.
Thanks Dev's /e thumbsup
@bpphantom
The Defenders of Paragon
KGB Special Section 8
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Lol...it's not that big guys. Acting like it's some game breaking advantage is just silly.
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It's not silly at all, it opens up a lot of options for vets who have played for YEARS while the rest of us are screwed in that regard.
Anyone who has played a PB or WS knows how nice it is to have a REAL travel power at low level as opposed to a crappy knock off temp power.
People here, to my knowledge, haven't even mentioned what I think is truly game breaking. You can now take the pre-requisite to another pool, and then the travel power from another pool, freeing up at LEAST one power pick to take other things. That's very powerful. I can now take Hasten and Super Jump! Gone, for 60 month vets, are the days of getting stuck with Super Speed cause they needed Hasten but couldn't fit another travel pool! They can just mix and match now!
Also, if there isn't a limit to this, like, if they can now take Flight, Super Speed, Super Jump, Teleport without any of the prerequisites, they could stack the hell out of those sexy Universal Travel bonuses (not that I would waste all 4 pools on travel, but you COULD if you wanted).
This just screams of unfair advantages in too many ways to count. This feels like the devs lied to me when they said that vet rewards would never give unfair advantages, only perks... but that's exactly what this is.
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So play a PB or WS then....
Virtue and Freedom
Hi, my name is Northman, and I am an Altoholic. No wait, I'm Lost Nova, no wait, Arc Havoc, no, Dragon Moon, no, Lord Fury......
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You still dont get it, being able to buy the powers via real money or inf in game means you dont have to pick a power period. That in itself is more game changing than this change we have coming.
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True, but it's something that has never been intended for serial purchase (for what that's worth ... probably not much). Regardless, temp travel powers do not allow for slotting (esp. the oh so sexy universal travel sets) nor can they achieve the speed of pool powers ... they are just neutered versions of the real thing. Also, not to be forgotten, there exists no alternative to the pool superspeed or teleport powers.
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This is not correct for TP.
Teleport: Jaunt Initializer
Besides that villains have (although it is very limited and not renewable): Nictus Shadow Step
--Rad
/whereami: