NCsoft is NOT our enemy
By
Acroyear2,
Posted on: 2012-09-04 10:26 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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I guess you didnt read your own post then.
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Originally Posted by HI IM A UNICORN
This has to be the dumbest thing i've read in this entire thread.
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It has itself on ignore.
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Originally Posted by Starsman
I guess you didnt read your own post then.
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@bpphantom
The Defenders of Paragon
KGB Special Section 8
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$15 to troll the board of a wounded game community. I'll just let that fact stand on its own and keep a thought out for the few poor souls who have to deal with you in real life.
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Originally Posted by HI IM A UNICORN
I think if I cared for anyones view on my attitude it would have changed from the first post. Keep trying to get under my skin, its endearing at best.
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Blood Widow Ricki * Tide Shifter * T-34 * Opposite Reaction * Shaolin Midnight * ChernobylCheerleader
NCSoft may have done a lot for us in the past, but they also shut down Paragon Studios and tossed all of their employees out the door without notice. They didn't just decide to close down the game, they fired everyone on the spot and shut down everything but the actual servers without notice. That isn't something I'm prepared to forgive... not just because I'm mad that the game is ending, but because I feel for the entire studio of people who showed up to work on August 31 only to find out that they no longer had a job.
Maybe that's normal procedure for large scale layoffs. I neither know nor care. I just know that I would be angry with any corporation who did it ("everyone else does it" is not a valid reason for being total jerks) and when it also means my favorite MMO is going away, then yes... I'm even madder.
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Originally Posted by StrykerX
NCSoft may have done a lot for us in the past, but they also shut down Paragon Studios and tossed all of their employees out the door without notice. They didn't just decide to close down the game, they fired everyone on the spot and shut down everything but the actual servers without notice. That isn't something I'm prepared to forgive... not just because I'm mad that the game is ending, but because I feel for the entire studio of people who showed up to work on August 31 only to find out that they no longer had a job.
Maybe that's normal procedure for large scale layoffs. I neither know nor care. I just know that I would be angry with any corporation who did it ("everyone else does it" is not a valid reason for being total jerks) and when it also means my favorite MMO is going away, then yes... I'm even madder. |
I enlarged and bolded the pertinent statement here.
This is the reason why we should start fighting back. Because it's common practice now for corporations to commit social injustices, environmental atrocities, and even yes...kill. Perhaps not go out, buy the gun and the bullets...put it to a head and pull the trigger...but yes, through actions and policy...kill. Perhaps not people...but certainly end things for assorted species.
And the ONLY justification a corporation can give for doing all of these things is MOAR MONEY FOR ME.
/WE/ can change this. /WE/ must change this, for corporations certainly won't change it for us. Not as long as we're content to sit aside and let them get away with it.
Edmund Burke said, "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."
Let that sit for a second. Digest it. Then look back over the last thirty years...(if you've lived that long...if not...check history)...and see that corporations have been crapping on us for AT LEAST that long.
This event? Straw. Camel's back. For me, at least. I'm tired of being walked on. Yes, I want my game back. Yes, I've done -everything- suggested in these forums to help.
But I'm -also- gonna take the radical approach and boycott. Blog. Tweet. Hand out flyers at game cons and anime cons and such. Because the more people that know....the more chances there are of someone else doing something to make a difference.
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They shut down Paragon Studios. Yes. Business decision. This is why NCSoft isn't a tax-free charity.|
Originally Posted by StrykerX
NCSoft may have done a lot for us in the past, but they also shut down Paragon Studios and tossed all of their employees out the door without notice.
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They didn't toss their employees out the door without notice.
Friday WAS the notice. If you watch the last Coffee talk from Wednesday (as I did last night), Zwill was talking about the job fairs they have coming through for the employees. They're getting severance packages, and some people are on board until the company shuts the servers off.
In the real world, companies don't give employees 2 years's notice.
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| They didn't just decide to close down the game, they fired everyone on the spot and shut down everything but the actual servers without notice. |
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| That isn't something I'm prepared to forgive... not just because I'm mad that the game is ending, but because I feel for the entire studio of people who showed up to work on August 31 only to find out that they no longer had a job. |
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| Maybe that's normal procedure for large scale layoffs. I neither know nor care. |
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| I just know that I would be angry with any corporation who did it ("everyone else does it" is not a valid reason for being total jerks) and when it also means my favorite MMO is going away, then yes... I'm even madder. |
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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Okay. The whole "escort them to the door" started BECAUSE people couldn't be civil.|
Originally Posted by mercykilling
I enlarged and bolded the pertinent statement here.
This is the reason why we should start fighting back. Because it's common practice now for corporations to commit social injustices, environmental atrocities, and even yes...kill. Perhaps not go out, buy the gun and the bullets...put it to a head and pull the trigger...but yes, through actions and policy...kill. Perhaps not people...but certainly end things for assorted species. |
Second. Where has NCSoft committed some "social injustice"?
They closed down a property THEY OWNED.
They haven't, to my knowledge, committed any environmental atrocities.
And as far as I know, they haven't killed anyone.
So acting as if they're Dynatox Industries, going out and dumping nuclear waste on seal pups and laughing about it (while uploading it to a web video) is a HUGE overreaction.
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| And the ONLY justification a corporation can give for doing all of these things is MOAR MONEY FOR ME. |
As will anyone in business that isn't a charity. And even for charities, there's a certain amount of that.
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| /WE/ can change this. /WE/ must change this, for corporations certainly won't change it for us. Not as long as we're content to sit aside and let them get away with it. |
With with and, if necessary, around them.
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| Edmund Burke said, "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." |
Know how to make a small fortune in the gaming industry?
Start with a larger one.
If you wanna be angry, more power to you.
But please try to be somewhat civil. Otherwise, you could do or say something that could severely hurt others' chances for helping the game and community out.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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Greed runs the world. Don't like it? Quit buying ****.
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
As will anyone in business that isn't a charity. And even for charities, there's a certain amount of that.
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Be well, people of CoH.
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It's okay. Arcanaville has proved lots of us wrong before. We know how you feel.
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Originally Posted by HI IM A UNICORN
Its not the point. NCsoft are not going to give a **** what Arcana has to say to them, lets be serious here, if Arcana was anything even remotely big in the real world he wouldn't have as much spare time as he has had in the past 8 years just sitting on his *** all day number crunching something as stupid and insignificant to the real world as arcanatime. Not trolling, just being realistic.
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I know the amazing efforts that are taking place to keep this game alive, but I gotta be honest with some of you - you simply can not tell people not to be angry at NCSoft right now. It was their decision, yes a business decision of which we can argue all day if we agree or not with it being a smart decision, but their decision nonetheless. That's their right.
And it's the consumer's / customer's right to direct their disgust / dissatisfaction towards that business that made that decision if they so choose.
It's the duty of that business to perform what is called PR. That's, public relations. This is why corporations have a PR Department, or in some cases it's part of the Marketing Department. To deal with not only the advertisement and sales of the company, but provide PR with those things that aren't quite as pretty.
And so far.....I haven't seen diddley-squat of any type of PR or public statements. So if they want to help ease the damage they have inflicted upon themselves by such a decision, then they need to speak up and do a little PR and talk to us, the customers.
So far, all we've been hearing from is the developers, and actual staff they just laid off, as PART OF this decision that THEY made. Leaving it up to THEM to tell us about it...and NOT allowing them to say all that much more due to NDAs
I'm sorry, but that ain't gonna cut it. Not if you want to keep the future business of paying customers. The ball is in their court, if they don't want customers mad at their company name.
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I originally had "smothered us with a pillow" as the second half, but I felt you can't really top Sunset Boulevard when it comes to dead narrators.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
NCSoft is the person who, when we were about to default on our mortgage, swooped in, bought us a new house, got us a big screen TV, asked us to invite all our friends over, then locked us in and set it on fire.
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The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
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Oh, that reminds me. I have to go add that to my resume. Invented Arcanatime on MMO axed by Koreans.
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Originally Posted by HI IM A UNICORN
This has to be the dumbest thing i've read in this entire thread. No offence but being a number cruncher on an MMO doesn't translate to anything in the real world. I don't think a millionaire korean business owner is going to give two ***** what the person who invented 'arcanatime' on a stupid game has to say anyway. peace out *****
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Did you really invent it or did you discover and name it?
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Oh, that reminds me. I have to go add that to my resume. Invented Arcanatime on MMO axed by Koreans.
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Be well, people of CoH.
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Well, technically speaking I don't speak Korean.|
Originally Posted by HI IM A UNICORN
Its not the point. NCsoft are not going to give a **** what Arcana has to say to them, lets be serious here,
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| if Arcana was anything even remotely big in the real world he wouldn't have as much spare time as he has had in the past 8 years just sitting on his *** all day number crunching something as stupid and insignificant to the real world as arcanatime. Not trolling, just being realistic. |
A lot of people who loved this game really wanted to know, and enjoyed knowing how it worked. Even some people who didn't min/max and didn't want to deal with the numbers liked reading about them and knowing what was happening: I have the PMs to prove that.
What it might suggest to some people is that I have a job where I mostly sit around and do nothing. But actually, all it means is I spend more of my time these days doing design work and less doing work work. And I have multiple monitors and computers on my desk. The forums actually run continuously in a VM on my desktop isolated from all my work. Although when I had work work, I tended to disappear or greatly reduce my posting.
As is generally the case when someone claims to be being realistic before wildly guessing, this is just another case where being realistic means extrapolating a small degree of ignorance into a much larger one.
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I would like to think that as a business they would be willing to sell the game or at least license it so they just get money without having to invest in any ongoing venture.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
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Neither, exactly. I discovered the phenomenon, and then invented the calculations that generate the best estimate for attack power rooted time. I called it "best estimate for attack power rooted time." Werner decided to start calling it "Arcanatime" and pretty soon everyone decided Arcanatime was better than "best estimate for attack power rooted time" or my other catchy name for it "server side clock-induced lag."|
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba
Did you really invent it or did you discover and name it?
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I discovered that it happened, invented a way to estimate it, and Werner then named it.
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Nice. 
Be well, people of CoH.
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you forgot that we also had all the food for a big party prepped and ready to be delivered, but they ambushed the truck and put a bullet through the driver's head.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
NCSoft is the person who, when we were about to default on our mortgage, swooped in, bought us a new house, got us a big screen TV, asked us to invite all our friends over, then locked us in and set it on fire.
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I re-upped SPECIFICALLY for the pepperoni-and-banana-peppers pizza with extra cheese (Blaster enhancements), so this leaves me particularly hungry. And out a fair bit of money, too. It won't break me, but it's still my money.
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Originally Posted by nytflyr
you forgot that we also had all the food for a big party prepped and ready to be delivered, but they ambushed the truck and put a bullet through the driver's head.
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The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
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Keith was delivering the food?
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Originally Posted by nytflyr
you forgot that we also had all the food for a big party prepped and ready to be delivered, but they ambushed the truck and put a bullet through the driver's head.
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For myself, I have a certain emotional investment in the characters I have created and played in CoH/V. But the continued existence of those characters was dependent on two factors: my continued patronage and/or the continuance of this game. The former is completely dependent on me. The latter completely dependent on a variety of people: from developers to the owners.
For those of us with a vested interest in this game, the method of closure was most unkind. It was sudden and those likening it to a back stab are not far off.
Would a different investor and owner have handled the closure better? Who knows. Given NCSoft's history with closing Western MMOs and retaining the IP, we should not be terribly surprised by their action nor should we expect that they will sell the IP to anyone. While some people fault UnSub for whatever their reasons, his analysis of what we can expect from NCSoft is most likely accurate: They won't sell the IP if it means losing what remains of the CoH/V customers who may buy in to other NCSoft games to a competitor.
NCSoft is a company - and all companies are run by people. These people have certain interests and none of them is losing their shirt. But they are also susceptible to human failings such as prejudice and pride. That a Korean company shows preference to Korean made and supported games is no surprise - especially when it comes to which "failing" product to toss out the door.
The method of closure and lack of information from them whatsoever is what really grates at me, however. I do not think I will be involved in any future games from NCSoft so that the only way they could possibly continue to see my money is if they change their minds about CoH/V - I have to much invested in that game to not give it another chance if they do so as well.
CatMan - some form on every server
Always here, there, and there again.
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
If you wanna be angry, more power to you.
But please try to be somewhat civil. Otherwise, you could do or say something that could severely hurt others' chances for helping the game and community out. |
Totally left out the part where I said I have done -everything- suggested so far to help save this game. Way to go. I've even printed flyers with the site addresses for the petition and titan network's plea and the call to boycott NCSoft products and handed them out at PAX in Seattle recently.
So...do NOT accuse me of not trying to help.
But!! I'm not going to simply keep my displeasure at what they've done secret, either. I've also been far more civil (lately) than a boatload of posters decrying NCSoft.
I will admit to being angry right after the news, and posting inflammatory remarks. This I do apologize for.
BUT...nothing in the post you quoted was uncivil, sir or ma'am. Kinda like this one.
I'm over the original outrage, but still displeased enough to plea with others to not buy NCSoft products and not purchase them myself. After all, as you've so eloquently put...a corporation is out to make money. Quickest and easiest way to show them they've made a mistake? Cut off revenue. Pragmatic solution, nothing more.
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Leaving aside my doubts about the source for a moment, I just don't buy into this reasoning. If NCsoft had any concern about retaining CoH players as customers they'd have went about this differently. If they do think that they're going to lure people over to GW2 or (lol) Aion by killing the game, wiping out Paragon Studio in a day and sitting on the IP then they're even more out of touch than I'd have thought.|
Originally Posted by CatMan
Would a different investor and owner have handled the closure better? Who knows. Given NCSoft's history with closing Western MMOs and retaining the IP, we should not be terribly surprised by their action nor should we expect that they will sell the IP to anyone. While some people fault UnSub for whatever their reasons, his analysis of what we can expect from NCSoft is most likely accurate: They won't sell the IP if it means losing what remains of the CoH/V customers who may buy in to other NCSoft games to a competitor.
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Indeed, I think the anger we've seen directed at NCsoft so far will get even worse if and when they start offering players 'rewards' to go to their other games.
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Can you think of one example of a game they closed which they have sold off?|
Originally Posted by NightshadeLegree
Leaving aside my doubts about the source for a moment, I just don't buy into this reasoning. If NCsoft had any concern about retaining CoH players as customers they'd have went about this differently. If they do think that they're going to lure people over to GW2 or (lol) Aion by killing the game, wiping out Paragon Studio in a day and sitting on the IP then they're even more out of touch than I'd have thought.
Indeed, I think the anger we've seen directed at NCsoft so far will get even worse if and when they start offering players 'rewards' to go to their other games. |
Having worked for corporations, this mentality is not surprising and if you plan to stay in business, it sometimes makes sense. Consider the nature of the people running NCSoft and the investors, they are individuals and don't necessarily think of CoH/V like you or I.
Most gamers and game designers make lousy business men. Most business men make lousy game supporters.
Apple kills Samsung's products through a legal tactic, not to win supporters but to remove competition. NCSoft most likely won't sell CoH/V, not to win more subscriptions but to prevent further competition to their existing and future games.
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Kill 'em all. Let XP sort 'em out.