More heroic heroes, please


Agonus

 

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Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake View Post
i understand that you are probably just being silly, but we have had the "city of drizzet" worriers with dual blades, city of "captain america" complainers with shields, even had some people scared of bows because everyone will just make legolas(apparently coh doesn't have much of a inu-yasha fanbase, i had a kagome alike in beta). and really, neither really stayed long. people do a dumb joke and move on, this should never be a real concern, so long as its far enough that nobody can get sued.
You forgot "city of neo" when trenchcoats were announced.

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
See, that's my BIGGEST problem with non-lethal force - taking lethal weapons and cheesing your way out of using them as intended. Shooting enemies' guns away, stunning them, blowing up vehicles as people clamber out, or out and out hitting people with your gun are just cheap. If you're gonna' use a gun, frikkin' USE it! Like I said, I don't necessarily need to see blood and guts and death, but any time I watch a cartoon or read a comic book where a character passes up a perfectly good opportunity to just shoot someone and instead tries to, say, shoot a rock high above so a boulder will fall down, or shoot a rope so the trap door under him will open, it just ruins my suspension of disbelief.

I am literally more willing to accept people getting shot and not getting injured too much (with the assumption that shooting them more will eventually have an effect) than I am to accept people perfectly capable of killing each other, yet not doing so in favour of more and more contrived ways to use lethal force to non-lethal effect. The aforementioned full-scale military battles ending up without a single casualty are just absurd, and it that REALLY shows especially in cartoons that try to avoid bloodshed. Even if they cop-out and call them "blasters" and claim they're non-lethal, they will STILL try to avoid depicting people shooting each other with them.

Bleh!
There are rubber bullets as well, still going to hurt but won't penetrate flesh. There is already the Beanbag power in Assault Rifle, which only stuns the target.

As for Archery on the other hand...


 

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Originally Posted by Lazarus View Post
You forgot "city of neo" when trenchcoats were announced.
I think there was a little surge in their numbers after Matrix Online shut down too


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

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I think I would feel worse if half the enemies I were fighting weren't robots, magic powered humans with venomous swords, drug addicted trolls throwing boulders at me, and clowns with half their bodies replaced with metal.

These aren't fragile purse snatchers.


 

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Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake View Post
even had some people scared of bows because everyone will just make legolas
That one happened. Boy, did it happen. It was a fad, and like all fads it passed, but it was just as annoying as we thought it would be while it was going on.


 

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Originally Posted by Gaelic_Reign View Post
We don't kill them. As far as I know, they are transported to a hospital or infimary in the Zig. I know it's hard to suspend reality while playing a video game where we fly, teleport, shoot fire from our hands, and seemingly pull weapons out of thin air, but we all try.
This. If you can rationalize the energy bolts flying out of your hands, how is the other part such a stretch? Illusion characters give you mental/imaginary wounds. You may have noticed that if you're hurt by a Carnie Illusionist and then defeat her, a moment later you get a large green number over your head. That's the illusion wearing off. No reason ALL your powers can't be illlusions, even if you didn't choose that as a powerset. Fire is easy to imagine as an illusion. Broadsword and Disembowel is harder, but again... you rationalized flight. You can do it!


~Missi

http://tinyurl.com/yhy333s

Miss Informed in 2016! She can't be worse than all those other guys!

 

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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
That one happened. Boy, did it happen. It was a fad, and like all fads it passed, but it was just as annoying as we thought it would be while it was going on.
City of 300 was more annoying after that movie came out. There was a small resurgence of Spartans once shields were live too, but nothing compared to when the movie was first released.


 

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Originally Posted by RemianenI View Post
Uh, you do realize Batman has killed people before yes? With a gun no less (most recently, shooting and killing Darkseid in Final Crisis #6).

...
Which is the exception, not the rule, for what it's worth. Batman used guns when he started, but he hadn't used lethal force in -years- prior to the silliness of Final Crisis. Storylines have been done that show just how strongly Bruce Wayne feels about not killing.


Tales of Judgment. Also here, instead of that other place.

good luck D.B.B.

 

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I have a Fire / Psi Blaster and the way I reason her use of Fire Powers is that the Fire is a Psychic Manifestation of her ability. The Thugs only think they are being set on Fire. They Drop unconcious because they They Believe they are being set on fire and pass out from the mental Shock.


 

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Mind control is your friend


@Damz Find me on the global channel Union Chat. One of the best "chat channels" ingame!

 

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
or out and out hitting people with your gun are just cheap. If you're gonna' use a gun, frikkin' USE it!
-looks up at the Bane Spider behind Sam, ready to [Pummel] him for considerable damage, before finishing with a [Bayonet]-

Oh, there's ways to use them, right enough.
Sometimes it's about making a point


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Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

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Originally Posted by Arnabas View Post
...I would have liked to have bokken under katana options, or escrima sticks under dual blades, but I am told the devs said they would never do that. I'm not sure why. I think dual blades would be great with non-lethal weapons. A staff set would be nice too, but I have seen that asked for a number of times and it seems that a majority of people have no interest in it.
I can see the point that it doesn't make sense that bokken or escrima sticks would do the same kind of damage as a bladed weapon.
On the other hand with power customization, it really shouldn't make any difference what the FX looks like.

A character that can hold "normal" shield on their arm is not necessary going to be strong enough to hold a manhole cover up with one arm! - and that's an option.

There is a baseball bat in the mace weapons-customization selections, so any reasoning behind not allowing batons or baseball bats for dual blades or katana are kind of thrown right out the window.

Bring on the non-lethal power-customizations for the more brutal power sets!

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Does anyone else think it might be nice to have new powersets that allow us to not kill opponents? Or am I in the minority, thinking that heroes don't need to kill?
Martial arts?

Super Strength (just don't pick the power to throw boulders at people!)?

Fighting Power Pool?


 

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Maybe when they roll out power customization more, there could be an option to replace any power animation at all with /e slap? Then you could do things like Nova or Assassin Strike, but it'd look like you just had a very strong arm.


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

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It's easy, really. The whole combat system is a big, pretty abstraction, well removed from what actually happens. Look at Super Reflexes characters. When an attack misses they get a little 'dodged' message. But what really happened is they leaped aside at the last minute, and did a backflip off a wall, and came up into some awesome attack move. The engine can't handle that, so we get an abstraction.

Hitpoints are an abstraction for most characters (possibly excepting Invincibility characters and other supernatually tough bruisers). In the game, your blaster takes a triple round of bullets, and loses some health. What actually happened was that those bullets came a little closer than was comfortable, chipping away some of your cover. Soon your luck may run out...

So what you see on the screen is thugs getting blasted with fire, shot and cut up by swords. What actually happened is the stuff in the comics, with clever disarming, non-lethal, disabling wounds, and forcing the bad guys to surrender before they really get hurt.

Unless you're playing red-side.


 

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Edit: Stupid double post.


 

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More heroic heroes, please
My heroes are frikkin heroic. It's not always fun to clean and stuff a turkey for Thanksgiving, but I'll be danged if it doesn't taste good when it's done.

--NT


They all laughed at me when I said I wanted to be a comedian.
But I showed them, and nobody's laughing at me now!

If I became a red name, I would be all "and what would you mere mortals like to entertain me with today, mu hu ha ha ha!" ~Arcanaville

 

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Originally Posted by NuclearToast View Post
My heroes are frikkin heroic. It's not always fun to clean and stuff a turkey for Thanksgiving, but I'll be danged if it doesn't taste good when it's done.
Are you saying you eat the people you arrest?


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

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Only the white meat.

--NT


They all laughed at me when I said I wanted to be a comedian.
But I showed them, and nobody's laughing at me now!

If I became a red name, I would be all "and what would you mere mortals like to entertain me with today, mu hu ha ha ha!" ~Arcanaville

 

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Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
Maybe when they roll out power customization more, there could be an option to replace any power animation at all with /e slap? Then you could do things like Nova or Assassin Strike, but it'd look like you just had a very strong arm.
Coul just imagine the things going with the uber-slap attacks.

"I've been saving my good pimp slappin' hand for you!"

(yes pimps in Saints Row 2 do actually say this if you anger them occasionally...that reminds me...can we have MM pet customisation where I replace the thugs with increasingly fancy pimps? Oh and the Gang warfare emote is firing a flare into the sky which explodes in the symbol used by Prince. Seriously you hit one in Saints Row 2 and 30 of them swarm out of seemingly nowhere like incredibly colourful ninjas....)


 

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
See, that's my BIGGEST problem with non-lethal force - taking lethal weapons and cheesing your way out of using them as intended. Shooting enemies' guns away, stunning them, blowing up vehicles as people clamber out, or out and out hitting people with your gun are just cheap. If you're gonna' use a gun, frikkin' USE it! Like I said, I don't necessarily need to see blood and guts and death, but any time I watch a cartoon or read a comic book where a character passes up a perfectly good opportunity to just shoot someone and instead tries to, say, shoot a rock high above so a boulder will fall down, or shoot a rope so the trap door under him will open, it just ruins my suspension of disbelief.
I do see your point, but I don't find the trick shooting an entire suspension of belief. Not after reading what the real Annie Oakley was capable of doing.


 

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I imagine it this way, to be effective in Paragon city, any gang-mob-evil organization is going to outfit it's people with some sort of base-defense/resistance to all forms of attack. What we do is overcome that defense/resistance until our power overwhelms them and they collapse. This is why the bad guys tend to run when those levels get too low, our attacks are starting to hurt...alot. What idiot is going to try to snatch a purse in a city where every third person has heat-vision?


"Samual_Tow - Be disappointed all you want, people. You just don't appreciate the miracles that are taking place here."

 

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Originally Posted by Rodoan View Post
I do see your point, but I don't find the trick shooting an entire suspension of belief. Not after reading what the real Annie Oakley was capable of doing.
Oh, I'm not saying trick shooting in itself is a suspension-breaker. Far from it. It's when it's overused to the point where it pops up in more and more absurd situations and completely bumps off the REAL use of guns that it bugs me. One character consistently trick-shotting, that I can swallow. Everyone always trick-shotting or, failing that, just holding their fire? Ugh...


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Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

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Originally Posted by The_Alt_oholic View Post
I can see the point that it doesn't make sense that bokken or escrima sticks would do the same kind of damage as a bladed weapon.
On the other hand with power customization, it really shouldn't make any difference what the FX looks like.

A character that can hold "normal" shield on their arm is not necessary going to be strong enough to hold a manhole cover up with one arm! - and that's an option.

There is a baseball bat in the mace weapons-customization selections, so any reasoning behind not allowing batons or baseball bats for dual blades or katana are kind of thrown right out the window.

Bring on the non-lethal power-customizations for the more brutal power sets!



Martial arts?

Super Strength (just don't pick the power to throw boulders at people!)?

Fighting Power Pool?

Ummm....let me requote this...

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There is a baseball bat in the mace weapons-customization selections, so any reasoning behind not allowing batons or baseball bats for dual blades or katana are kind of thrown right out the window.
Baseball bat in mace works, because BOTH...let me bold that...BOTH...are smashing damage.

Dual Blade and Katana are lethal weapon sets. The devs have already said (or was it just BABs?) they weren't going to give lethal damage weapon sets, smashing damage weapon skins and vice versa.

So, no, the reason for it isn't thrown out the window.


BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

 

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Originally Posted by BrandX View Post
Baseball bat in mace works, because BOTH...let me bold that...BOTH...are smashing damage.

Dual Blade and Katana are lethal weapon sets. The devs have already said (or was it just BABs?) they weren't going to give lethal damage weapon sets, smashing damage weapon skins and vice versa.

So, no, the reason for it isn't thrown out the window.
BABs said that, and I agree with him. While I may still want to see elemental weapons in as alternatives for conventional weapon sets, I still want to see them retain the set's FUNCTION. Swords stab and swords slash. That is, literally, the entire point of having them. Baseball bats don't stab very well, and I'm not sure it's possible to even IMAGINE them cutting. Therefore, a baseball bat in a set that's all about cutting and stabbing is out of place. Big time.


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Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

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I have to have a concept I can embrace to overcome my altitis.
I don't actively RP, but the concept helps me form the character in my head.
I've avoided Assault Rifle on blasters for that very reason, I could just never get behind a Hero using a gun. Always seemed more... vigilante like.
Even with rubber bullets and the like.

I rolled up an Archery/Mental few months back and found the combo very enjoyable. But, I was having a hard time rationalizing using Arrows to defeat the mobs.
Then I realized, he's a superhuman with uncanny accuracy, his arrows never actually penetrate flesh. Instead he simply pins them to crates, walls, floor, what have you. Rendering them motionless.
Blazing Arrow isn't actually on fire, it's an Illusion he creates.
Mental Marksman has become one of my all time favorites now!

My Fire/Ice blaster wasn't as easy to explain. I ended up asking myself what it'd really feel like to be hit in the chest with a ball of fire.
I tried to visualize how I could do it in real life.
From what I could imagine, it wouldn't really hurt all that much. Even more so if you were clothed. The fire would splash about, maybe cinging them.
So it was okay to see him hurl a fireball at the mob and not expect it to do much, just overcome them with smoke.
Sure, he could walk up to someone and just hold his hands out and flashfry them. But he's a Hero so he tones it down. Besides, he has Ice powers to cool them down afterwards.
Coming up with these little 'insider secrets' is actually part of the fun for me when creating new toons.


As far as the alternate skins options go, I'm all for it. Though, if I recall correctly. The Dev's said they wouldn't give alternate weapons to a set unless they matched the damage type. I.E. if your set had alot of stabbing attacks the weapon had to have a point. If the set was slashing based, weapons had to have an edge.
Otherwise you could pick Katana for you WarMace tanker and it just wouldn't 'feel' right.
That said, they do seem to be going the way of more cusumization/ less restrictions. So we'll see.


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Keep Calm & Chive On!