Discussion: Introducing Tweet Code Thursdays!
By
Absolut_,
Posted on: 2012-07-11 13:32 in News, Events and Announcement Discussion
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Boooo! But the retweeting thing I can do though |
Originally Posted by Zwillinger
In short, no.
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Ty for doing that though
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Something for ppl to use
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After giving this further thought, I'm going to continue to develop this code in the hopes to sell it for large sums of cash to companies that are attempting to attract people to social media. I'm sure that there are plenty of companies that are in the same position as Paragon Studios. |
Originally Posted by Zwillinger
Snow, I do appreciate what you're trying to do here, really I do, but the reality is that would probably take months to get pushed through the Web team. Ideally, we would have a web developer here, at Paragon, that could just fire things like this out the door.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
At the end of the day though, we will disappoint someone. Years of running contests and promotions have shown me that this will happen, no matter what you do.
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About the only people that would be upset over that would be those that like lording the exclusives over others. Is that really the type of customer you want to foster?
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
I am going to be very clear about something, and it's going to make some of you angry. I hope that you will all take it in a reasonable and rational manner.
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FUN FACT: That burst of light when you level up is actually the effectiveness escaping from your enhancements all at once.
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Originally Posted by Hit Streak
We've modified the way Tweet Code Thursdays are going to work.
For item codes, we'll announce when the codes will be going out, and we'll give people a specific amount of time to re-tweet our post. If you re-tweet our post, we'll respond directly to you with a code to use. No scramble. No luck involved. No twitchy fingers required. Simply re-tweet our post in the timeframe given and we'll direct message you with a code. In short, if you want an item code, do the following:
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Thank you so so much for this.
Cannot stress enough how much I appreciate you all taking the time to do this differently.
Thank you, again!
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I'm not angry. I'm irritated. If I was angry, my account would be suspended and I'd just move on.|
Originally Posted by Zwillinger
I am going to be very clear about something, and it's going to make some of you angry. I hope that you will all take it in a reasonable and rational manner.
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| We are not going to ask permission each and every time we want to run a promotion. |
And the fact that you're running a promotion isn't the reason people are tearing you a new one over this.
But hey, if Paragon's going to pass up a chance to monetize content, that's on you guys. Never mind that it was the point of putting in a cash store in the first place.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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I *just* finished saying I would suggest it in a product management meeting a few posts back. I'm pretty sure it will have buy in once some time has passed for exclusivity purposes. |
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
I'm not angry. I'm irritated. If I was angry, my account would be suspended and I'd just move on.
That's not what I asked and you know it Andy. You've been acting as if you're somehow stunned or caught off guard at the vehemence of the response here. And the fact that you're running a promotion isn't the reason people are tearing you a new one over this. But hey, if Paragon's going to pass up a chance to monetize content, that's on you guys. Never mind that it was the point of putting in a cash store in the first place. |
You are so buying me a beer next weekend.
Andy Belford
Community Manager
Paragon Studios
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Just one?
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
You are so buying me a beer next weekend.
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pohsyb: so of all people you must be most excited about the veats
Arachnos Commander: actually, I am
pohsyb: I mean you kinda were one already anyways ^_^
Arachnos Commander:
Since it bears repeating
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TL;DR : We WANT to give you money! Let us do so for cool stuff! (Well, more cool stuff.) Don't keep cool, otherwise available stuff away!
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Originally Posted by Snow Globe
But here is what we're telling you: That if you run these contests (whether Super Packs, special editions, conventions, or social media contests they all involve the same principle), let people buy the items at a later date. This same refrain gets repeated over and over again. You satisfy the players that get it first for a time, you satisfy players that are willing to wait, and you can possibly get some money too. About the only people that would be upset over that would be those that like lording the exclusives over others. Is that really the type of customer you want to foster? |
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Hrm. Yeah, not going to participate in this. Twitter, Facebook, etc.....just don't appeal to me at all. Kudos for trying to market something socially, though!
I do agree with making said items available eventually for purchase through the store, however.
Just my two cents.
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hmm..... so does that mean no screaming and comparisons to Hitler?
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
We are not going to ask permission each and every time we want to run a promotion. We are going to do things that some people don't like. You are invited to voice your displeasure, in a rational and constructive manner, should this occur.
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You know who else didn't ask permission to do things?|
Originally Posted by Ironblade
hmm..... so does that mean no screaming and comparisons to Hitler?
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HITLER.
FUN FACT: That burst of light when you level up is actually the effectiveness escaping from your enhancements all at once.
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Now you know what I'm saying about irritation. |
Originally Posted by Zwillinger
I *just* finished saying I would suggest it in a product management meeting a few posts back. I'm pretty sure it will have buy in once some time has passed for exclusivity purposes.
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As to the exclusivity "period". Cool. That's really all people are asking for.
I'm sorry that people (myself included) had to dig at you so hard to get this sort of response. But there are times when your "diplomatic answers" just get in the way. Or worse, makes it worse.
Hopefully we won't have to rake you over QUITE so many coals to get an "unflowery" response next time.
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| You are so buying me a beer next weekend. |
And I'm kinda tubby, so if you want to thrash me, that's fine. I'm well padded.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
Alright folks, let's settle down a bit. They've listened to our feedback and made a compromise that definitely works for the moment. I'd say everything should be cool now.
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*Looks up from sharpening various cutting implements*|
Originally Posted by Dawnshift
Alright folks, let's settle down a bit. They've listened to our feedback and made a compromise that definitely works for the moment. I'd say everything should be cool now.
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But...
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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That's all that's needed to deal with any objections to one form of promotional give away or another. "We're giving this away now this way. You'll be able to get it in the future in the store, but get it now and get it free."|
Originally Posted by Zwillinger
I *just* finished saying I would suggest it in a product management meeting a few posts back. I'm pretty sure it will have buy in once some time has passed for exclusivity purposes.
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And I hope you aren't putting too much stock on exclusivity as a motivator. Making it exclusive during the promotional period so if you want it now, you participate is good, now and free are good motivators. But from what I've experienced of the community "I'll have this to show off and most of the players won't be able to get it" is rarely a motivator and counterbalanced by the demotivational aspect of those who see it and can't get it.
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I just want to say this is my only post in this thread.
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And my reactions were quick enough to be the first to quote it.
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Originally Posted by Zombie Man
I just want to say this is my only post in this thread.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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I have often volunteered to be the anti-Zwillinger. My title would be "Community Mismanager" and my job would be to give everyone asking for a red name response the specific response they deserved at that moment.|
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
I'm sorry that people (myself included) had to dig at you so hard to get this sort of response. But there are times when your "diplomatic answers" just get in the way. Or worse, makes it worse
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Positron vetoed the idea, because he's thinking he can get at least 25000 paragon points selling the position in the Paragon Store.
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Are you sure ZM?
For once I read almost every post in a thread, hoping to see some changes that may give me a chance to join in. Good to see that some changes were made to help more people get involved.
However, I could had saved myself some time by reading the first post more, I missed the bit on the time it starts each Thursday - 10:00 AM PDT, that's 3AM for me so it affectively excludes me anyway no matter what.
And before someone posts; no I'm not complaining about the time, daytime US makes sense, just pointing out that I missed it on the original post. It's not the first activity I missed due to time zones and nor do I expect to get involved in most events.
Just another long-time player (eight years plus) here who doesn't use any "social media." I'm not a twit. My books have covers, not faces. I use plain old Google to search, not Plus Iron or whatever that plus is for.
When you think of using social media, please remember they're online services that take up people's time and give them no inherent monetary gain. Social media is a form of online recreation which is in direct competition with NCSoft/Paragon Studios. Someone can spend their time on those other sites or spend their time on the City of Heroes forums or ingame in City of Heroes, directly supporting this product.
So, why is NCSoft/Paragon Studios directly supporting their competitors by releasing rewards on those other sites? Would they rather have us spend our time on Twitter, Facebook, or Google+ than logged into these forums or in their own game? If so, I'm fine with that. It'll save me $15 a month.
Sometimes, things really don't make ANY sense. Am I the only one to whom this seems a bit counter-productive? It's like Burger King having special promotional coupons which are only available at KFC restaurants.
It boggles the mind.
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Well, it starts at 3am for you, but the post also says they'll be tweeting "all throughout the day," which I assume could mean as late as 5pm Pacific. That's 10am for you if my math is right.|
Originally Posted by Badaxe
However, I could had saved myself some time by reading the first post more, I missed the bit on the time it starts each Thursday - 10:00 AM PDT, that's 3AM for me so it affectively excludes me anyway no matter what.
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Assuming you have a typical, active-during-daytime-hours schedule, you may still be able to get in there.
FUN FACT: That burst of light when you level up is actually the effectiveness escaping from your enhancements all at once.
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Quite.|
Originally Posted by Zombie Man
I just want to say this is my only post in this thread.
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@Oathbound & @Oathbound Too
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They've already said why they use those sites.|
Originally Posted by Power_Play
Just another long-time player (eight years plus) here who doesn't use any "social media." I'm not a twit. My books have covers, not faces. I use plain old Google to search, not Plus Iron or whatever that plus is for.
When you think of using social media, please remember they're online services that take up people's time and give them no inherent monetary gain. Social media is a form of online recreation which is in direct competition with NCSoft/Paragon Studios. Someone can spend their time on those other sites or spend their time on the City of Heroes forums or ingame in City of Heroes, directly supporting this product. So, why is NCSoft/Paragon Studios directly supporting their competitors by releasing rewards on those other sites? Would they rather have us spend our time on Twitter, Facebook, or Google+ than logged into these forums or in their own game? If so, I'm fine with that. It'll save me $15 a month. Sometimes, things really don't make ANY sense. Am I the only one to whom this seems a bit counter-productive? It's like Burger King having special promotional coupons which are only available at KFC restaurants. It boggles the mind. |
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
On a weekly basis, we reach (actual reach, not potential) about ten times more people on Facebook than we do on the Official Forum. I have numbers to show this. Why is this? Because your average user is more inclined to check Facebook at work/home/on their phones/on the toilet/wherever than they are the fora.
There's a lot of things we can do to promote/encourage forum use such as securing mobile skinned fora, however that kind of stuff is out of my hands and squarely at the mercy of Seattle. I've requested it, but something like upgrading fora software is an org wide decision that affects more than just CoH. Social Media is something we (Paragon) have direct control over. It's measurable, it's accessible to everyone and it's tapping into a huge market that we otherwise wouldn't be able to here in our walled garden that is the forums. For example, did you know that social media is huge in Brazil? We can track the number of people who visit the account sign up page from Facebook from a country like Brazil. That number is very interesting to watch, to say the least. To say that we'd be foolish not to do everything we can to have a great engagement on Social Media platforms would be an understatement. I understand that some of you are *very* resistant to Social Media. People say that Facebook is free...it's not. You pay with your metrics, your clicks, your likes, all of that information that allows companies to more effectively market to you and people who also match your similar demographic. You have to decide if that information is worth the convenience that services like Facebook offer, the ability to connect with people around the world in a moment, to share your life experiences. For me, that answer is yes, to a degree, for some it's no, and I grok that. I've said this before; we're not going to stop promoting and growing our social media presence. It's not the future, it's the now. Social Media is here and it's a HUGE part of building strong and vibrant Communities. We're not going to stop interacting on the forums, in fact that's the main reason to come to the forums, a direct and more personal way to interact directly with the team that makes CoH. There *will be* exclusive giveaways. There *will be* exclusive media content. For all venues, not just social media. |
I've seen several players that have had questions answered (by CoH Staff or by players) on the Facebook page that have later started playing and buying things in the Paragon Market or actually subscribing.
Why would they not want to take advantage of reaching potential new customers in this manner?
Decisions like that aren't rocket surgery.
If the game spit out 20 dollar bills people would complain that they weren't sequentially numbered. If they were sequentially numbered people would complain that they weren't random enough.
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Thanks for the reply, Zwill. And, lost in my complaints was my recognition of this stuff. Not only do I like the fact that you guys do these promotions at all, I did understand and notice that your plans were way beyond just this Twitter promotion (and that you'd be trying to hand out this aura in many ways, as Paladin had also been reminding people).|
Originally Posted by Zwillinger
EK,
We've been giving these codes away in game, we're planning on giving them away over Twitter and we're going to be giving some away at the upcoming CapeCon. While it's not super easy to get this particular item, we're doing what we currently are able to do to share it more broadly. |
My appreciation for your work is sometimes stated, but wasn't included in any of my replies to today... not so much anyways, hehe.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
I grok what you're saying. I really understand it and I can empathize with what you're saying. You feel as though because we utilize costume-type stuff as promotional material that your playstyle is being singled out. I get that.
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And, as I said before, I understand if you guys choose to continue to do things this way. It's got to be somebody's ways and I know that it is not mine, hehe. I may not like it, but... That's life!
Even if I gave this pastime up over any of this, it's not like I'd harbor negativity towards the team nor the game over it. Just wanted to make that all clear. While I have strong opinions and preferences and all, I still get it and understand that it's not my show and that things might work for you guys, even if they don't jive with me.
I may think that things would be better overall by doing it my way, haha, but that and 2 Inf won't get me a Training Enhancement.
Anyway, thanks for taking the time and grasping this stuff.
It's an odd interaction sometimes...
You're here working and we're sometimes coming here to escape our troubles, which can make our disappointments seem rather out of whack... but that's also sometimes the point, ain't it. Not only are we fans (which already makes us wacky), but we don't really want certain levels of disappointment from what we're looking for the big time fun from.
Anyway... nothing you don't know... just was on my mind.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
I can't promise you that you'll be able to buy it in the Paragon Market in a few months because that decision hasn't been made yet. I can say I'll suggest it in one of our weekly product management meetings.
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Also... Good luck... we're all counting on you!
Seriously though, I'd love to see you guys embrace the practices that other people have expressed earlier: Ditch long-term exclusivity! Always have that plan to make things accessible, even if it is after some time.
I don't know... it just seems like such a nicer and greater practice.
I get that you guys want to make whatever you're offering enticing enough to get people to jump the hoops (whatever they may be for each case), but it truly seems like people are impatient and eager enough that they'll move on the immediate path over patiently waiting for months before they can purchase things in a more normal fashion.
Again... I accept it if you guys disagree and don't go in that direction (with things that I believe you should). Just letting the rest of my rambling peter out...
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
I am going to be very clear about something, and it's going to make some of you angry. I hope that you will all take it in a reasonable and rational manner.
We are not going to ask permission each and every time we want to run a promotion. We are going to do things that some people don't like. You are invited to voice your displeasure, in a rational and constructive manner, should this occur. We will do what we can to make a promotion appealing to as many people as we possibly can. At the end of the day though, we will disappoint someone. Years of running contests and promotions have shown me that this will happen, no matter what you do. |
I'm all there and for it when people want to express their opinions, but I also completely respect that it's not my show to run.
I mean... yeah, ditch all this exclusivity with costumes NAO or else, but... Hehe, but it's not your job to follow my instructions.
Actually... is there someone I can speak with to make that our jobs?
Once again, Zwill, thank you very much for the communications and the efforts to make things work as best as you can manage.
Hopefully you only see these things as disagreements and differences of opinions and never as anything to do with actual personal negativity.
I know you're quite experienced with this stuff, but we're all only human (well, most of you are anyway, muhaha*cough*cough*hack* damnit... Ahem).
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
People here ARE cognizant of the difference between "want to" and "can do".
What's got people up in arms is this relapse into lack of foresight that we had thought Paragon had freed itself of months ago.
Did you HONESTLY think that people were NOT going to be getting out pitchforks and torches when you announced something like this? Especially when they'd made it QUITE clear on MULTIPLE occasions that this kind of thing is patently NOT okay?
We are not going to ask permission each and every time we want to run a promotion. We are going to do things that some people don't like. You are invited to voice your displeasure, in a rational and constructive manner, should this occur. We will do what we can to make a promotion appealing to as many people as we possibly can. At the end of the day though, we will disappoint someone. Years of running contests and promotions have shown me that this will happen, no matter what you do.
Andy Belford
Community Manager
Paragon Studios