"Null the Gull, please supress knockback in my powers"

Actually, rather than fight with the folk who are cheering this I think I'll offer a bit of advise to the OP. When I first get any power that has a bad rap I go to Perez park and pound the tar out of skuls with it until I figure out exactly what locations look like. I did this with wormhole when I first got it and could dump the forward spawn back where the team is after I'd done this for a while. You get so you can see a small ledge or corner to bounce a spawn against easily.

I hope this never happens because teams will start requiring you to turn off Knockback.

WARNING: I bold names.

I love knockback apologists.

Three days ago, in that other topic about knockback being underrated: "the people who dislike knockback are a minority of minmaxers, they just complain loudly".

Now, here: "so many people dislike knockback the option to turn knockback off would be an obligation".

People, it has to be one or the other. You can't just flip-flop and claim the exact opposite thing as fact whenever it's convenient to your argument.

Same goes for "knockback is useful and awesome" (in "is KB good" topics) vs "lowering KB on powers would make some too powerful" (in "option for less KB" topics).

Special gold star for Sailboat who manages to say all those things at once in the same post while also admitting he's against any change to KB just to spite people who enjoy the game differently than The One True Way It Is Meant To Be Played, By Sailboat.

Knockback is the best ranged mitigation! Anyone who dislikes KB is a powergaming munchkin! Uh... If KB is the best mitigation, wouldn't a powergaming munchkin be all over it? But I'm sure there's some crazy conspiracy theory to cover that one, like all powergaming munchkins are stupid and Sailboat, as a superior human being, comprehends the game and optimizes in a way mere commoners cannot do. Wouldn't that make Sailboat the god of all powergaming munchkins? No, stupid, because Sailboat doesn't use numbers nor prove his assertions in any way, which makes him pure and holy as we all know numbers are evil and words are good.

You can just picture all these players joining teams and laughing to themselves as they purposefully grief their teammates. Reminds me of the "incarnate content must be gated to trials" folks ; such terrible, egotistical people they are afraid nobody would team with them if they weren't forced to - and rightfully so.

I would love it if this was done as it would make so many more power sets playable. I might even be able to stomach playing a peace bringer to 50 then.

I'd love to see some kind of power that caps knockback magnitude at .67 when toggled on. To make it not completely broken, suppressed knockback powers could apply 5-10 seconds of -KB or something. This would make knockback powers less situational, which would lead to them being used more often (without annoying people!) and I think that's a good thing. It's probably either too much work or downright impossible, but I can definitely dream. All that aside, I'd definitely settle for a Null the Gull option. I'd probably like my Peacebringer a lot more if I could use Solar Flare with reckless abandon.

First off, I don't care one way or the other about KB, (so why am I posting here?) but I think most people who are playing this game don't care either..

I have been playing almost 7 years (back right after the second update)...and I can count maybe three times I had someone on a team complained about KB, and that person was jumped because the offending KBer was a PB and well most his powers has KB.

Turn it on or turn it off, don't care if someone gets kicked for KB, I will quit as well, and have. not because I am pro KB (personally as long as the mob dies errr arrested its all xp baby) but because its my 15 or so dollars and not yours to tell me how to spend it, only the Devs can do that because I agreed to their conditions to play this addiction of mine.

I would do the same if someone insists that all powers have their KB turned off, I would quit after explaining in no uncertain terms as to why and if anyone else feels this way, join me on a new team.

And to be honest I think most players feel the same way.

Everyone who likes KB is bad and can't play the game, everyone who doesn't like KB is bad and can't play the game.

Yawn.

I'm practicing perp juggling techniques with a Kinetics/Energy Blast Defender, slotted for endurance reduction, accuracy, and knockback. I'm looking forward to trying out the combo of Spring Attack with Repel turned on, for example. I'm trying to think of other interesting combos.

How exactly is Sailboat the one who's wildly out of line when all he's arguing for is the status quo? Doesn't the burden of proof lie on those who want to completely change how the game has worked for seven and a half years? Knockback is in the game. Deal with it. You have been dealing with it for up to seven and a half years, why is it suddenly too much for you now?

Wait, now min/maxers are incapable of being irrational? Anything they want they should get? News to me.

Neggy, claiming that those powers are so uncontrollable as to be literally useless is laughable. I can believe that you can't control them. I have energy blast characters and storm characters and I somehow manage to control them. Am I blessed by Dionysus himself? Could well be.

It's "uncontrollable" because it's a random proc in a power that under typical use would be applied to clustered enemies which you want to stay clustered. If I'm capable of taking Hand Clap, I wouldn't be an AT that wouldn't want enemies in melee range, my motivation for taking it would be to disorient them while keeping them in range of Fiery Aura, Against All Odds, Rise to the Challenge, Entropy Aura, etc. Similarly, if I throw an Explosive Blast on a crowd, its because the opportunity cost in damage is too high not too, the same reason others might throw a Venom Grenade or Fire Ball at that same crowd.

How about this- a Knockback Debuff enhancement? Just as Knockback enhancements increase KB magnitude, a Knockback Debuff enhancement would decrease the magnitude.

On most powers, it would reduce the KB to less than one, creating Knockdown (which most people like) or no secondary effect. On higher KB powers like Bonfire, it would take multiple enhancements to negate the knockback (of course, why would you take and slot Bonfire just to nerf the KB?)

This would mean you would have to commit at least one slot per knockback power to shut down the knockback. So you could make a build of a 50 energy blaster that was both powerful and knockback-free, but teammates on a level 22 PuG wouldn't really expect you to have your KB shut down.

these threads always go the same way: some people who play KB-intensive sets think KB is useful, everyone who doesn't thinks it's terrible.

There was a time when KB was valuable on some teams (mostly back when mobs lacked ranged attacks), but in the game as it exists today, it's awful. Every other gameplay incentive in the game encourages keeping mobs in a nice clump so that they can be debuffed, aoe'd and otherwise managed, and then there's the one guy with knockback who scatters them all over.

I personally wish KB were removed from every aoe power or replaced with KD, and that one or two single target powers in each offensive set had a KB proc attached to them. It does feel really cool and super-hero-y when you knock a guy over a railing or ragdoll makes a guy do something funny, and it's too bad that's currently banished to a few under-played power sets.

I can understand peoples annoyance with KB powers, but it's really the players who make the skill "bad". Yes, a player that scatters the mobs to the four winds is generally annoying his team and making people think "KB sux" But it can also be useful for clumping a spawn for better AoE, or pushing a few guys back into the deathzone.

KB is a tool, and it's the people using it poorly that make it so hated, not the effects of the power. If someone throws a hammer through your windshield, you don't get mad at the hammer, you get mad at the guy that threw it.

I'd say KB is available in some of the most popular sets there are. Energy blast and super strength are the two sets that everyone picks the first time they play the game, and the latter happens to also be flavor of the century for tankers and brutes. Claws, pistols, archery, assault rifle, sonic, dark blast, martial arts, street justice, psi blast, kinetic melee, storm, elec melee, all of the epic ATs, illusion, mind... Need I go on? The devs have always judiciously spread KB around and have shown no signs of stopping.

Why should they? This is the only MMO I'm aware of that has ragdolls at all, to say nothing of the rest of the elaborate physics system. How, pray tell, is it in their interests to remove from their game something they worked hard to add and continually support, and which sets their game apart from anything you could call its competition? As you may have noticed, this question was rhetorical.