As for shields:
Ok they're not exactly 'shields' but Stalker Dark Armor's mez toggles (O. Gloom and Cloak of Fear) get suppressed now when they're hidden so that they don't have to detoggle/retoggle them, a recent change (happened in my absence so I'm not sure when). They could apply the same for the human shields while in forms.
Also, +1 for Solar Flare changing to .9 kb, that way you'd simply add a dam/kb IO and have your kb back. Which I doubt many people would do, you don't see players slotting KB in Footstomp, Fault or Tremor (well except Castle who said he was having fun once with an Axe/SR Brute slotted with KB enhancers when he was testing both sets but I guess he didn't like Fury and stuff 
)
Something else I think should be considered: make pool powers usable in forms. This is not so much for hasten etc., but because of survival.
What is the purpose of Dwarf? Higher survival +mez protection for a sacrifice in damage. I can use break free's or Clarion or even Light Form for the mez protection to the point that I never need Dwarf for it. Currently, if I switch to dwarf, I gain only a tiny amount of resistance vs my human shields, but I lose defense from pool powers like Maneuvers, Combat Jumping, Stealth, or Weave. I am actually losing survivability by shifting to Dwarf. The extra hp from Dwarf could possibly offset this, except a pb with good recharge can hit the hp cap in human off-and-on anyway. Even if they made pool powers suppressed like we have been asking for human shields, I still would have very little reason to switch to Dwarf because I am putting myself at greater risk without that defense.
It used to be at least partially a mechanics thing that we couldn't access pools in forms, but I don't believe that is true anymore because of inherent fitness and various accolades/temp powers.
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Quote:
well i mean currently the biggest incentive to use dwarf is the mez prot and the hp bonus. I could see them increasing the hp cap for khelds and increase the amount of +HP given by dwarf. |
Originally Posted by Microcosm
Something else I think should be considered: make pool powers usable in forms. This is not so much for hasten etc., but because of survival.
What is the purpose of Dwarf? Higher survival +mez protection for a sacrifice in damage. I can use break free's or Clarion or even Light Form for the mez protection to the point that I never need Dwarf for it. Currently, if I switch to dwarf, I gain only a tiny amount of resistance vs my human shields, but I lose defense from pool powers like Maneuvers, Combat Jumping, Stealth, or Weave. I am actually losing survivability by shifting to Dwarf. The extra hp from Dwarf could possibly offset this, except a pb with good recharge can hit the hp cap in human off-and-on anyway. Even if they made pool powers suppressed like we have been asking for human shields, I still would have very little reason to switch to Dwarf because I am putting myself at greater risk without that defense. It used to be at least partially a mechanics thing that we couldn't access pools in forms, but I don't believe that is true anymore because of inherent fitness and various accolades/temp powers. |
if you couple that with a change that lets you use your shields in forms and make the shields defense based or a defense component, i'd prefer that over letting pool powers usable. i think not having pool powers usable is a fair trade off and limitation to sets.
but I also really liked the idea of making the forms toggles and use the respective powers in the human set while in forms.
Positron's i13 letter: We are trying to make PvP more accessible to new players, while giving experienced PvP'ers the advantage that comes with formulating tactics around the new systems we're putting in place. PvP from now on will be on our priority list. If something isn't working out, we'll be in there tweaking it and making it work, for the entire future of the product, not just Issue 13.
Match the mezes issuing forth from the Peace Bringers two powers that can mez. Stun and stun or prefereably Hold and Hold. Not the useless mixed bag of a mag 2stun and the mag 3 hold they are now.
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Interesting ideas. It almost makes you wonder if you could make Kheldians have a branching level tree like EATs. Pick one branch, it is like they have always been, you can pick all forms like it is now. Pick the other, and your Human shields have mez protection but you can't pick Nova or Dwarf.
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Originally Posted by PC_guy
well i mean currently the biggest incentive to use dwarf is the mez prot and the hp bonus. I could see them increasing the hp cap for khelds and increase the amount of +HP given by dwarf.
if you couple that with a change that lets you use your shields in forms and make the shields defense based or a defense component, i'd prefer that over letting pool powers usable. i think not having pool powers usable is a fair trade off and limitation to sets. but I also really liked the idea of making the forms toggles and use the respective powers in the human set while in forms. |
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I dont like any ideas that make Khelds more like VEAT, or using human/pool powers in dwarf/nova either. Dwarf and nova work great the way they are suppose to now. Again just work on the inherent some for solo, make Solar Flare KU and match the CC's.
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I agree they don't need to be like VEATs, but Dwarf does not work all that great for a pb for the reasons I stated above: minorly higher resistance, loss of any defense, can hit hp cap in human off-and-on, and lower damage. It should very clearly be tougher than human form, but it is not in the case of pb's. (Warshades can't cap their hp in human form, so they don't have this issue).
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Originally Posted by Jot
I dont like any ideas that make Khelds more like VEAT, or using human/pool powers in dwarf/nova either. Dwarf and nova work great the way they are suppose to now. Again just work on the inherent some for solo, make Solar Flare KU and match the CC's.
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Quote:
/agree|
Originally Posted by Microcosm
I agree they don't need to be like VEATs, but Dwarf does not work all that great for a pb for the reasons I stated above: minorly higher resistance, loss of any defense, can hit hp cap in human off-and-on, and lower damage. It should very clearly be tougher than human form, but it is not in the case of pb's. (Warshades can't cap their hp in human form, so they don't have this issue).
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No Veat clone and no to pool powers in forms..
just make the forms change shorter and suppress toggles when changed instead of dropping them..
But micro your explanation of the hp cap might lead them to nerf essence boost. and we dont want that.. they should raise the cap of both dwarf anyway. maybe to 3k in that form..
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I like that the set is underperforming, and you're worried we might be nerfed. |
Originally Posted by IronAlex
But micro your explanation of the hp cap might lead them to nerf essence boost. and we dont want that.. they should raise the cap of both dwarf anyway. maybe to 3k in that form..
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I can see why you might think that though. Mez protection was kept away from Dwarf form because otherwise there's no reason to choose Dwarf. Why not just make Dwarf form better at its job?
Yeah. Allowing pool powers in forms seems fine for me (the strength of them can be changed in each form, so Weave on Dwarf provides much more defence than Weave on Nova).
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Just because u lose defense by switching to dwarf doesnt mean that we should make such a major change to forms as to allow pool powers or some human powers to be used in them. Some people dont take the human shields and dwarf is a big difference in survivability with its +res and mez protection. Plus I do fairly good damage in dwarf with procs and fully slotted. Thats one of the important things about peacebringers or khelds is there are many diff viable ways to build them.
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Originally Posted by Microcosm
I agree they don't need to be like VEATs, but Dwarf does not work all that great for a pb for the reasons I stated above: minorly higher resistance, loss of any defense, can hit hp cap in human off-and-on, and lower damage. It should very clearly be tougher than human form, but it is not in the case of pb's. (Warshades can't cap their hp in human form, so they don't have this issue).
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So just give the shields a mez component and defense component and make them useable I dwarf form so that those players who like dwarf as is and didn't shields ect. Don't lose anything but those who do gain more from it?|
Originally Posted by Jot
Just because u lose defense by switching to dwarf doesnt mean that we should make such a major change to forms as to allow pool powers or some human powers to be used in them. Some people dont take the human shields and dwarf is a big difference in survivability with its +res and mez protection. Plus I do fairly good damage in dwarf with procs and fully slotted. Thats one of the important things about peacebringers or khelds is there are many diff viable ways to build them.
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The man is right, there should be a big difference in surivablity between human and dwarf and there isn't for either kheld with the way iOS work and how easy it is to get defense I human form, the best/easiest way to leverage that is to add hp and resistance. I don't think pools should be usable I forms, but I completely agree with his premise for making said change
Positron's i13 letter: We are trying to make PvP more accessible to new players, while giving experienced PvP'ers the advantage that comes with formulating tactics around the new systems we're putting in place. PvP from now on will be on our priority list. If something isn't working out, we'll be in there tweaking it and making it work, for the entire future of the product, not just Issue 13.
Listed below is how Cosmic Balance buffs a Peacebringer.
Tanker, Mastermind, Corruptor or Defender = Increase Damage
Scrapper, Brute, Stalker or Blaster = Increase Resistance
Peacebringer, Warshade, Arachnos Widow or Arachnos Soldier = Recharge Slow Resist
Controller or Dominator = Limited protection from Control effects
My idea for a Buff for Cosmic Balance is to change it to accept only one Common IO. The enhancements allowed would be Damage, Resist, Slow or a Hold IO. If you leave Cosmic Balance unslotted then it will default to the original setting as it has always been. If it is slotted with one of the 4 IOs allowed then you will gain the stats as having a full team of that one buff. Once this happens and you are on a team, you will not gain the original buff of Cosmic Balance. For example if slot a Common Damage IO and I will have the damage buff of being on a full team of 8 (Tanker, Mastermind, Corruptor or Defender) and not gain the buffs from any other member on the team from cosmic balance. If I slot a Common Hold IO I will gain the Limited protection from Control effects as if I was on a full team of Controllers or Dominators. This will work the same for Warshades also.
I hope my idea is not confusing, because I had a hell of a time trying to put my idea in writing.
Proton Sentry Peacebringer:lvl 50+++ - Human Build / Triform Build
Quasar Sentry Warshade:lvl 50+- Human Build / Triform Build
Red Katipo Arachnos Soldier:lvl 50+++ - Crab Build / Bane Build
Black Katipo Arachnos Widowlvl 50+++ - Fortunata Build / Night Widow Build
Quote:
Not a bad proposal at all.
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Originally Posted by Big_Soto
Listed below is how Cosmic Balance buffs a Peacebringer.
Tanker, Mastermind, Corruptor or Defender = Increase Damage Scrapper, Brute, Stalker or Blaster = Increase Resistance Peacebringer, Warshade, Arachnos Widow or Arachnos Soldier = Recharge Slow Resist Controller or Dominator = Limited protection from Control effects My idea for a Buff for Cosmic Balance is to change it to accept only one Common IO. The enhancements allowed would be Damage, Resist, Slow or a Hold IO. If you leave Cosmic Balance unslotted then it will default to the original setting as it has always been. If it is slotted with one of the 4 IOs allowed then you will gain the stats as having a full team of that one buff. Once this happens and you are on a team, you will not gain the original buff of Cosmic Balance. For example if slot a Common Damage IO and I will have the damage buff of being on a full team of 8 (Tanker, Mastermind, Corruptor or Defender) and not gain the buffs from any other member on the team from cosmic balance. If I slot a Common Hold IO I will gain the Limited protection from Control effects as if I was on a full team of Controllers or Dominators. This will work the same for Warshades also. I hope my idea is not confusing, because I had a hell of a time trying to put my idea in writing. |
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except that it doesn't fix the core problem with cosmic balance in that it still does jack solo
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Originally Posted by Socorro
Not a bad proposal at all.
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Positron's i13 letter: We are trying to make PvP more accessible to new players, while giving experienced PvP'ers the advantage that comes with formulating tactics around the new systems we're putting in place. PvP from now on will be on our priority list. If something isn't working out, we'll be in there tweaking it and making it work, for the entire future of the product, not just Issue 13.
Quote:
My idea was also ment to work solo as well. If you are solo and slot one common resist I.O. You will get the stats of being on a team of 8.
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Originally Posted by PC_guy
except that it doesn't fix the core problem with cosmic balance in that it still does jack solo
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Proton Sentry Peacebringer:lvl 50+++ - Human Build / Triform Build
Quasar Sentry Warshade:lvl 50+- Human Build / Triform Build
Red Katipo Arachnos Soldier:lvl 50+++ - Crab Build / Bane Build
Black Katipo Arachnos Widowlvl 50+++ - Fortunata Build / Night Widow Build
Quote:
That explains the look of horror on Statesman's face.
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Originally Posted by PC_guy
except that it doesn't fix the core problem with cosmic balance in that it still does jack solo
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Since we are throwing around ideas, one I would like is make peacebringers eye blasts animation more like warshades and not just two tiny beams.
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Thanks. I just wanted to come up with an idea that did not stray to far from the original concept of cosmic balance. I also like the idea of making it accept knockback common io's, but it might be to much. I do think this will help a little, but it is not a fix that the kheldians need.
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Originally Posted by Socorro
Not a bad proposal at all.
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Proton Sentry Peacebringer:lvl 50+++ - Human Build / Triform Build
Quasar Sentry Warshade:lvl 50+- Human Build / Triform Build
Red Katipo Arachnos Soldier:lvl 50+++ - Crab Build / Bane Build
Black Katipo Arachnos Widowlvl 50+++ - Fortunata Build / Night Widow Build
Build Up definitely needs a buff. The difference between that and Sunless Mire+Dwarf Mire is worlds apart.
Making it a Fiery Embrace clone would be awesome.
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Quote:
While I never thought that each form having its own set of powers (excluding all powers from other forms) was a great idea, with things as they are, some power, such as Buildup, really should be allowed usage in forms. You lose almost half of your 'Buildup Time' as you fire it, then scramble to shift to Nova/Dwarf and fire off an attack or two before it expires.
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Originally Posted by Auroxis
Build Up definitely needs a buff. The difference between that and Sunless Mire+Dwarf Mire is worlds apart.
Making it a Fiery Embrace clone would be awesome. |
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Yeah, its a fairly common suggestion. Either more like fiery embrace where you deal extra energy damage as a proc for 20-30 seconds, or like rage where its a smaller damage boost over a longer duration. Id be fine with either...|
Originally Posted by Socorro
While I never thought that each form having its own set of powers (excluding all powers from other forms) was a great idea, with things as they are, some power, such as Buildup, really should be allowed usage in forms. You lose almost half of your 'Buildup Time' as you fire it, then scramble to shift to Nova/Dwarf and fire off an attack or two before it expires.
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Then again id be fine with just about anything as long as they were paying attention to us...
I'd be perfectly happy with converting Build Up into being something more like Power Siphon from Kinetic Melee, where it's something that ramps up and ramps down through stacking of the buff over time.
Mind you, PBs have got Cones and Target AoEs (human and nova) and PBAoEs (human and dwarf) which do not have anywhere near the same availability, in terms of a continuous attack chain, like stalkers/scrappers/brutes/tankers do with Kinetic Melee ... which has important implications for being able to self-stack this sort of buff via hitting multiple targets. Easiest way to deal with that "problem" is to have the Build Up Buff self-suppress the ability to "hit more targets" for 1 second after a successful Proc on any attack. That then basically means that you'd get no more than +1 Buff on the stack from any One Attack ... meaning that single target and AoEs would be playing on the same field at that point ... rather than determining the number of Build Up Buffs gained from the number of Targets Hit (which if allowed, tilts the advantage to AoE powers by an absurdly crazy amount).
If you code a PB derivative of Power Siphon that is driven by Attacks, rather than by Targets Hit ... you then have the "luxury" of being able to make the probability of Proc-cing the Buff relatively high (if not at 100% chance), because there's a limit to how many attack powers can be executed within any given window of time, due to their Animation Times. If you do the reverse, and have the power Proc off the number of Targets Hit instead ... then you have to make the chance to Proc relatively low, simply to account for situations where you can saturate your Max Targets limit, and the single target powers will "suffer" for the need to "balance" the AoEs.
It's the end. But the moment has been prepared for ...
Quote:
Power Siphon as it stands is driven by attacks, as Burst will only ever give you one charge. That's how I remember it anyway from when I played my KM scrapper, which has since been deleted.
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Originally Posted by Redlynne
I'd be perfectly happy with converting Build Up into being something more like Power Siphon from Kinetic Melee, where it's something that ramps up and ramps down through stacking of the buff over time.
Mind you, PBs have got Cones and Target AoEs (human and nova) and PBAoEs (human and dwarf) which do not have anywhere near the same availability, in terms of a continuous attack chain, like stalkers/scrappers/brutes/tankers do with Kinetic Melee ... which has important implications for being able to self-stack this sort of buff via hitting multiple targets. Easiest way to deal with that "problem" is to have the Build Up Buff self-suppress the ability to "hit more targets" for 1 second after a successful Proc on any attack. That then basically means that you'd get no more than +1 Buff on the stack from any One Attack ... meaning that single target and AoEs would be playing on the same field at that point ... rather than determining the number of Build Up Buffs gained from the number of Targets Hit (which if allowed, tilts the advantage to AoE powers by an absurdly crazy amount). If you code a PB derivative of Power Siphon that is driven by Attacks, rather than by Targets Hit ... you then have the "luxury" of being able to make the probability of Proc-cing the Buff relatively high (if not at 100% chance), because there's a limit to how many attack powers can be executed within any given window of time, due to their Animation Times. If you do the reverse, and have the power Proc off the number of Targets Hit instead ... then you have to make the chance to Proc relatively low, simply to account for situations where you can saturate your Max Targets limit, and the single target powers will "suffer" for the need to "balance" the AoEs. |
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Auroxis - Emp/Rad/Power Defender Pylon Video Soloing an AV
Pelvic Thunder - SS/Elec/Mu Brute
Sorajin - Elec/Nin Stalker
Neuropain - Sonic/Mental/Elec Blaster
Quote:
You'd want to make that an alternate animation option, since I prefer the Peacebringer version. Warshade powers are nice to look at, but the extra... gob of something that the Warshade version has is weird to me. I like the traditional energy beam look of Peacebringers.|
Originally Posted by Jot
Since we are throwing around ideas, one I would like is make peacebringers eye blasts animation more like warshades and not just two tiny beams.
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And I'm all for Build up being improved for Peacebringers somehow. Duration isn't long enough, and the devs now have plenty of options they could mimic with it that would be more acceptable. Fiery Embrace seems best to me if they are keeping Cosmic Balance as is, since you can get so close to the cap currently (depending on teammates and your own powers).
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Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
I would change Photon Seekers (which despite many attempts to fix them, have never worked exactly as they are described) and make them aggro managers, similar to Phantom Army. Give them an increased threat level or Taunt aura, and a couple of control/damage powers like Stuns or Holds to match the PB character's powers.
Making the Seekers more like PA or Dark Servant would increase the effectiveness of a PB solo as well as help a team control groups. And PBs would no longer have to find workarounds for a power that doesn't do what it says in the description.
Priority for me is still, in order:
Inherent useful when solo (resistance not so worried about, but damage, yes). Solar Flare KU or KD, not KB. Mez protection/resistance.
Secondary wishlist:
Simplify the Forms, making them more dynamic, perhaps by letting them use Human Form attack powers instead of their own, and still use the shield toggles (but the effectiveness of them will be reduced in nova, and increased in dwarf).
But I like these little tweaks. They sound pretty fun. I recently played my PB again and found Glowing Touch infinitely more useful with the range boost, so good work there, devs!
OMG! How like, totally kewl are these characters?!1