Microcosm
-
Posts
1126 -
Joined
-
Damnit all, this is unacceptable. THB, light the microsignal, I'm gonna go try to save the game
-
I find it is better to try to do more AoE damage than the fluffies to keep mobs mad at you since dwarf taunt has such a low Target cap. You can certainly try barrier, though that would feel like a waste to me as the resistance would do little for the character himself. There are also the hybrid powers, so you could get a taunt aura or a defense buff for the pets. Others have had some luck using gravitic emanation to keep the mobs from attacking at all.
-
Quote:Just want to say I think this is a phenomenally good idea.Originally Posted by Smiling_Joe
I guess it's sort of like the opposite of Spectral Wounds.
So anyway, to sum it all up I had speculated about changing our inherent to give teammate-based procs similar to the way interface attaches procs to powers.
Instead of a straight up damage buff for every kheld-appropriate teammate in range, peacebringers and warshades would get a chance for extra energy (or NE) damage with each attack for every appropriate teammate in range.
The slow resistance granted by other epics would be replaced by a small recharge proc, and - after having thought about it - the resist bonus would be replaced by an absorption proc.
Alone and on small to medium-sized teams there'd be no measurable difference in performance. On leagues and large teams, however, it would free us from our respective caps and let us contribute something besides versatility, which is in abundance with or without us in those circumstances.
Just summing it up here in case it got lost in the storm of farming debates... -
It's called The Results Are In, but it only covers SO performance and is not necessarily valid anymore because of game changes. I don't think it takes into account primary and secondary combos, which is a significant part of the equation.
-
Quote:I do. In fact I have a very strong db elec scrappers that had the top scrappers pylon time for quite a while. His ST was very good, his AoE was good, and his survival was good. My warshade's ST is ok, his AoE is very good, and his survival is extreme. I would never say the scrapper was just better than the warshade unless I was just looking at ST dps in a vacuum.Originally Posted by EvilGeko
You must not play Scrappers or Brutes then?
-
There is indeed a new wonky chain that includes form shifting, I just havent had the time or the inclination to do formal calcs for a while (I still haven't corrected the peacebringer numbers that are posted in another thread).
-
Quote:Knew you wouldOriginally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Kinda disagree here.
Umm, 'kay.Quote:Originally Posted by Rakeeb
Enjoy playing your underpowered squids, you'll always be weaker than brutes and scrappers. -
Quote:I really want them to give it the wb nuke recharge time of 120 seconds, cause human shades really could use a little more AoE damage.Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
Wait a second, our nukes have a crash? Silly me, I never really noticed.
Seriously, though, I am looking forward to the nuke buff finding its way to my warshade. -
They removed the +resist/-resist toggle presumably because it would affect foes, and gave stalkers a pbaoe sleep toggle, because we all know stalkers have no AoE's and don't team with people who do.
The scrapper version of bio armor will be both more durable and more damaging (not even considering the damage aura) than the stalker version. That is poor balance 101. Stalkers get overall higher regen % with the combined powers, but the effect is still lower than the scrapper version because of the difference in hp between the two.
-
Waiting til it hits live and hoping they make the stalker version as resilient as the scrappers. Right now the stalker version sacrifices some resistance and gains the most useful thing of all to replace a damage aura: a sleep aura. /sarcasm.
-
AIB, you need someone against whom to run. Anyone volunteer?
-
Quote:I wont argue against more damage, certainly, because i feel the same way, however I would temper those comparisons with the fact that a pb can have seriously ridiculous survivability, to the point that it is more appropriate to compare them to tanks or brutes. As for comparing them to warshades, there is still too large a gap between them in terms of damage, however the consistency that they bring to the table should not be discounted. I don't think a pb should ever reach the heights that a warshade can, but that is because it should not reach the lows either.Originally Posted by John_Printemps
No, I'm not pointing fingers at anyone but the Devs in regards to where PB's sit in single-target damage. Compared to their brethren Warshades, Peacebringers neither impress on AoE nor ST, and they should on one of those two scales. If Warshades got designed to do impressively well on the AoE front, then transversely Peacebringers should excel at ST. To be clear, I'm not saying they should be buffed to the gills on damage, but a simple review of--at the least--their animation times, would be a stellar improvement. I get they're supposed to be somewhat Jack of All Trades, but--to me--they've always felt like an insanely survivable Blapper with terrible damage and two neat graphics-powers to help level up with before they become obsolete.
Ultimately, the part that bugs me the most, is that their competition Epic AT outshines them on nearly every level. The lowest, most generic version of the Arachnos Soldiers is the Hunstman style build, and that on its own with the same Incarnate Metric of T4 Musculature and T4 Reactive starts its average paper-DPS in the 200-220 range. I'm looking at a chain right now that's 224 DPS not counting any pets or -Res debuffs that it gets in its own set. The chain doesn't even require a back-breaking amount of recharge either, just 70% Global that is easily achieved. Compare that to a PB who has to starve itself into the 150+% range to do anything higher than 120 DPS.
Regarding veats, simply put they do too much for their survival levels compared to almost any other at in the game, and i would not shed a single tear if they were nerfed to reasonable levels. (Looking at the crab spider that can down a pylon in under thirty seconds.) -
Quote:I don't think anyone was claiming they do stellar damage. I think a build striving for dps could hit ~220 pre-hybrid or be very close. Whether that is still too low or not is another question.Originally Posted by John_Printemps
Thing is, 220 is the "Paper DPS", the practical DPS in dealing with things like Light Form and Hasten and Light Form's crashes and Inner Light every 30/s, I'm really not surprised the DPS wasn't 100% where I desired it to be. Running the actual test and only getting an average 175 (Achilles' Heel PPM aside), that's actually much lower than 220. I even attempted to damage cap with inspirations and see where I was ending up, and stalled a hair under 200 (196). Even using an Incandescent Strike chain only projected to be 2.6 DPS higher, ~5 DPS more if I tried working at least one proc in there, and about ~7 DPS more if I were to try and fit two procs (one being the Purple Hold-Set's Damage Proc). If I were crawling tooth and nail for DPS, then that'd be a direction to go in, but it doesn't change the facts. PB's aren't doing stellar damage.
-
Quote:My calcs show db passing it, though you have to allow yourself a little gap in your chain.Originally Posted by ricohdah
I am beginning to think DB can surpass StJ in ST DPS in longer fights. Getting 2:30ish pylon times running T4 Agility Core and T4 Reactive Radial. Getting 2:00 min times with T4 Hybrid Core. If I did not need the recharge to run the SB-SS-SB-AS attack chain, Musculature would definitely put DB over the top.
-
Quote:Even lamer if it doesn't work. I will be taking it for the set bonuses.Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
This is so lame. As if Kheldians need more survivability. Give us damage procs or leave us alone.
-
Quote:Ah, see 220 before hybrid is much closer to my own. Not happy to hear that bout Achilles ppm. Once ppms become involved it will probably be better to use rakeeb's chain that includes Istrike.Originally Posted by John_Printemps
You know, really hard to tell which direction you were going with that.
lollowdpswut? Or doubleuTfhowugetdatdps?
So I'll just point to the data I personally have, and you can carry it either direction you like. Which, incidentally, I was able to improve my previous concept of DPS a bit so I'm glad you questioned it. Still doesn't put it somewhere I'm happy with (compared to other AT's), but it'd do. I stuck each of the single target attacks into NoChain based on best possible slotting I could manage with variations on which of the three ranged blasts could be present in the build and spun the wheel.
Previously I had been looking at 167 DPS with Perma Inner Light. Chain was: Radiant > G.Blast > G.Eye > Radiant > G.Blast > Incandescent and the Achille's Proc in G.Eye would be potentially up to ~185 DPS.
After I changed things up and re-ran with all the ST attacks, I'm now looking at Gleaming Blast > Gleaming Bolt > Radiant Strike, for 220 DPS with T4 Musculature and T4 Reactive.
Edit to avoid a secondary post. Fleshed out a prospective build on Beta and have seen the sad realization of what PPM does to Achilles' Heel. Without Hybrid, at all, T4 Musculature Core and T4 Reactive Radial, ranged 170-180 with a minimum of 41.3% Global +Dam (Including Inner Light's 28.8%). The inability to keep the Heel going for more than ~30/s out of every minute really kills it, and popping Light Form/Hasten constantly doesn't really help the DPS much either. Tested against a Pylon. -
"Human-PB's would be lucky to tackle 200 DPS with Hybrid: Assault."
What the heck kind of PB are you looking at? -
FYI waterspout does knockup
-
Quote:As an all human, you might feel a little short on AoE if all you have is Solar Flare (and dawn strike). Proton Scatter being a cone can be annoying since you want to be surrounded for flare, but then detonation causes kb and you can only have one of the -kb IOs. It is kind of a catch 22. If your concept didn't dictate all human, I might recommend dwarf just for double flare with instant form shifts.Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
Hey guys, (particularly Microcosm), I've been playing this a while now, only level 40, but I'm really reconsidering Proton Scatter. I think I'll give up on the e/n defense too. Move the ATIO to Dawn Strike? What power should I take in place of Scatter? Conserve power? Glowing touch?
Seems you grabbed Pulsar. Some like it, but I personally don't: its activation time is so long for a mag 2 stun. My recommendation for utility power would be Conserve Energy. Endurance crashes from light form and hasten as well as your general end consumption can be a little much at times, so this really helps. Glowing Touch is nice, but Conserve Energy is far more useful, at least on my build. -
You would just need to do max survival analyses for the two. (The responsible for the team thing-- you should know by now teammates falling doesnt bother me :P)
As far as the doms go, I just end up skipping most of the primary, at which point I feel I'd rather have an armor set or buffs/more damage. That's just me though. -
That's a slippery slope my friend. "The brute will survive most things a tank will, play them and get more damage. The scrappers will survive most things a brute will..." The line of what is 'good enough' survival is dependant on the person. For me, there are things that defender build will not survive that my pb will, and I want to survive those things while still putting out the pb's level of damage. This is also why I cant get behind doms often: they crank out damage but their survival tools of control dont work well enough against things I want to survive (multiple AV's, GM's).
-
Defenders do not have comparable survival to pb's. In fact fully tuned up pb's have very good survival by even tank standards. Granite tank? No, but just about anything else.
I will need to see some max defender dps times to compare st damage (excluding kin). I seriously doubt they are beating pbs.
Defenders are obviously the force multipliers and there are several things still wonky for pbs as rakeeb mentioned, but I do not think this comparison is valid or doomworthy. -
A) I don't think this change will make defenders outdamage PB's except in cases where they could significantly boost their own damage, which was already the case.
B) Comparing Defenders to PB's is pretty useless as they serve completely different roles. It is much more worthwhile to compare PB's to Tanks and Brutes. -
Because dm needed more damage compared to other sets...