Would You Be Willing to Delay the Lore Slot to Change the Pets?
By
Acemace,
Posted on: 2011-03-02 22:56 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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I have to agree with these sensible words from the man from down under.
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Originally Posted by SuperOz
I'd vote for a delay, but this isn't really so much of an issue about pets or whatever, but it's the thrust of why the Incarnate System exists in the first place.
To me, pets that have powers are interchangeable things with animations that should be customisable. Honestly, if the point of the Incarnate System is to achieve 'godly levels of power' or however the game or you as the player want to explain it, there's an expected level of customisation or signature ability display (and really, didn't this start with people saying 'hey, Statesman has that cool lightning power, how can we do that?') then why can't you as the player have some say in just how that manifests? Currently as it stands, the way you spend your shards to get the Alpha power of your choice (and to be fair, you have a good range of choices) has a desired level of flexibility. You want Damage/Defense, you can specialise in that. Great. It's fine that this continues into the Lore slot, but why tie a system that's obstensibly about customisation and mixing these Incarnate Abilities to something that is extremely visually specific? I don't want one of the biggest threats to Primal Earth's pets. That's like saying 'hey, well those Nazis over there? We need to stop them, so we'll use Nazis too.' If we're drawing on the power of the Well and that implies some degree of ability to use it, then let us have the choice of what we draw upon. I could care less about the mechanical/gameplay effects...they can be the same, and we know this from seeing the Mastermind pets. Don't throw away customisation this late in the game to feed the beast that is the Praetorian storyline. There's stuff beyond Praetoria; let's have a stepping stone on that road not be so closely tied to it rather than be tied to the greater story, that of the road of the Incarnate. S. |
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Did you read the OP? He's talking about changing the LORE power. That's the powers team. Some of you care about customizing the LORE pets. I wasn't responding to you. |
Originally Posted by Eva Destruction
Power Proliferation is a Powers issue. The appearance of the pets is an art and animation issue. What do you want them to do, animate you an Illusion Dom? The pets' mechanics aren't the issue for a lot of people. They can get art and animation redoing the look of the pets, while the powers team gets cracking on the Martial Arts Blaster secondary
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Not everyone is asking for customizable powers. Some of us are just asking for a customizable or non-Praetorian appearance. Of course some people are asking for the moon, some people will always ask for the moon, but what many of us are asking for isn't a balance issue at all. It's an art issue. Then they should stop writing terrible stuff. |
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If it meant ditching the pet altogether and replacing it with a different power? Absolutely.
Personally, I don't give a fig what the pet does or doesn't look like. Temp pets in this game have thus far been about as useful and fun as rubbing lemon juice into a paper cut, so I'll never summon it. So for me, they could make the Lore slot give us a TO worth of power modification subject to ED, and it would still be more useful than the current version.
The worst part, I think, is that it's tied to a level shift. If there were no level shift involved, then you could just unlock the slot on your way to the next and never have to do anything with it. Sadly, I don't think the direction they're going with the endgame will allow for the level shift to be 'optional' for much longer.
re:OP Nope.
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I agree with this. I think my opinion on the pets has been stated enough. I don't think they'll delay the slot.|
Originally Posted by Void_Huntress
At this point, they're not likely to delay the slot. They've got their stuff scheduled for I20, and barring any serious issues (and the Alpha slot delay was because of serious issues, not just story concerns), they're going to deliver it.
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For those who want to help make it clear to the devs you want something else as soon as they can find the dev resources for it? Once the issue releases, unlock the slot, then put NOTHING in it. Don't craft any Lore powers, keep the slot empty, well past the time you obviously COULD put something in it. Vote with your characters. |
I think all people that don't like the pets can do at this point is ask for other options down the line (probably not for several issues, since they work so far ahead).
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Yes, I read the OP, and furthermore I read the freaking THREAD TITLE. In case you're suffering from a self-induced case of reading comprehension just so you can tell people to shut up and suck it some more, let me help you out:|
Originally Posted by EvilGeko
Did you read the OP? He's talking about changing the LORE power. That's the powers team. Some of you care about customizing the LORE pets. I wasn't responding to you.
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Thread title:
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| Re: Would You Be Willing to Delay the Lore Slot to Change the Pets? |
Now for the OP:
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| Just curious about this. I know that the alpha slot was delayed for a few months to change it up. Obviously I have no experience with the Lore slot directly, but if there is truth to the claim that it grants us Praetorian pets, it would be worth the wait to me to change it. Or leave it be and add other pets as well. I don't want to be too negative about it, but my feeling about the concept of Praetorian pets as a power selection is that it's a terrible idea. |
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| This is assuming there isn't another option on the table for us. E.g. I would be willing to trade the pet power for 2 or 3 extra enhancement slots, as long as I got the level shift. Obviously I don't know everything that is planned, but I am very much not pleased by the Praet concept. In fact, the less future content has to do with Praetoria the better. |
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| I'm curious about whether other people would also be ok with slot being delayed to "fix" it to something more appropriate, whatever that is. This is not an attempt to enforce that change on people, but hopefully to register just how unimpressed I am with this power from a concept standpoint. |
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No, I wouldn't accept a delay for this reason, even putting aside the fact that it's totally unrealistic to expect anything to change. When the feature I wanted (create your own missions and arcs) was released, I don't remember the powergaming, Type A, ambition-focused players who drive me so crazy arguing that it should be delayed because it didn't fit what they wanted out of the game. So, no, even though I think the implementation is pretty wretched, mechanical character improvements like the Lore slot shouldn't be delayed simply because its backstory grounding and visual presentation is pretty wretched.
Someone in either this or another thread (it's getting hard to keep them straight) argued that "art wasn't a priority" for development. Well, no, of course it isn't. While there are players out there, including me, some roleplayers and some not, who view this game primarily as an animated movie about their characters, not all players think that way, and the devs certainly don't seem to.
The devs are game mechanics engineers. They, and, incidentally, a lot of players, view this as "game," not in the sense of "a game of 'let's pretend,'" but in the sense of "a game of football" or "a game of Monopoly." For those players, and for a majority of the dev team, the game is something that can be "won," in one fashion or another. Art and story are means to support the ends of gameplay, not ends in themselves.
For example, those who are AE mavens may remember Dr. Aeon stating that much of his job consisted of being told things like "write an arc about a hero who goes bad" or some other, rather broad, direction. He doesn't create a story about Incarnates and then send Positron and his minions off to develop a system to support it; it's the other way around. (Yes, I'm aware that development probably isn't quite that one-sided, but years of dev discussion of the way they work convinces me that I'm more or less correct.)
Similarly, Going Rogue was born not because the devs really wanted to show off Praetorian Earth, but to provide a mechanism for switching sides and for gluing an end-game system onto a game that hadn't previously had one.
With that kind of development structure, you're going to get some serious misses if you're the kind of player who prefers the "support" of art and story over the "meat" of gameplay. I'm not arguing that those priorities are necessarily right, but I think they have to be acknowledged.
Further, the gameplay element here, I think, is seen as particularly crucial to the life of the franchise. Incarnates are this game's attempt to capture the raider-/advancement-driven market of the hardcore MMO player. Rightly or wrongly, it's an attempt to bring in a demographic that hasn't been part of the game's primary market before. And I suspect that, for that reason, here even more than elsewhere, art and story have been even less of a driving force in creating the new content. I can clearly imagine a dev raising the kinds of objections players here have at a development meeting three years ago and being told in response, "Yeah, those players will be dissatisfied, but they got all those years of costumes and power customization and that AE thing. They'll be satisified with that. Anyway, people will only do this endgame stuff if they really want to win more parts of the game."
Now, you can argue that this represents a misunderstanding on the devs' part of how players can cross from one demographic to another, but I don't think it's a totally unreasonable mode of thinking. Yes, I'd be happier if some consideration had been given to granting me the ability to tailor Incarnate content to my characters in nonmechanical ways. But I can't really fault the devs for overlooking that option. They weren't expecting someone like me to use the Incarnate system in the first place.
So, to all those disappointed with the (over)emphasis on Tyrant, the Praetorian Lore pets, or the inability to make the fire from your Pyronic WhiteWall Radial Judgement green, I suggest keeping in mind that you're not the target audience for this stuff. The devs believe, rightly or wrongly, that you're already loyal to the game, that you have enough features to keep you occupied without this. Those boosts are meant to ensnare and keep players who just want to "beat the game."
Now, I question the wisdom of that design philosophy. I don't much like that kind of contest-oriented thinking, in a game or in life, for that matter. This new direction the game is taking troubles me on some level, but I'm not willing to hold back the enjoyment of people who have been screaming for it for years. I am not the only player here. I don't have to love everything.
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Possible solution:
Release it as-is with the current pets, and add more options later.
This is assuming that such a thing would even be feasible. But if so, it should be done like that. No unnecessary delays in releasing it, but getting the option for more pets in the not too distant future.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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I don't think "add more later" is ever off the table.
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Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Possible solution:
Release it as-is with the current pets, and add more options later. This is assuming that such a thing would even be feasible. But if so, it should be done like that. No unnecessary delays in releasing it, but getting the option for more pets in the not too distant future. |
Furio--Lvl 50+3 Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster, Virtue
Megadeth--Lvl 50+3 Necro/DM/Soul MM, Virtue
Veriandros--Lvl 50+3 Crab Soldier, Virtue
"So come and get me! I'll be waiting for ye, with a whiff of the old brimstone. I'm a grim bloody fable, with an unhappy bloody end!" Demoman, TF2
For my part, I'd have liked to see five options - one pet set themed to each origin. Sure, that may have missed the mark for a lot of people as well, but at least it won't be so intrinsicly tied to Praetoria.
Perhaps....
Natural = Gun-wielding/Martial Arts specialists (sidekick-esque)
Mutant = Various super-powered spandex clad types (Longbow-esque, but not actually LB as that'd not suit villains)
Tech = Robots, of course! (perhaps even Warworks could be kept)
Science = Zombies? (Not my fave origin this, someone might have a better idea!)
Magic = Floating will-o-wisps (like the veteran buff pets)
It'd need to be very vague types of pets to appeal to the widest "market share".
That said, since my only Incarnate is Master Zaprobo and he's been lusting after the Goliath Warworks since he saw them I'm not unhappy with the choices available.
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One should support the other, and vice versa.|
Originally Posted by Olantern
With that kind of development structure, you're going to get some serious misses if you're the kind of player who prefers the "support" of art and story over the "meat" of gameplay. I'm not arguing that those priorities are necessarily right, but I think they have to be acknowledged.
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I mean gameplay in the sense of "beat this guy." The story should give us a compelling guy to beat, and the guy and the means by which we beat him should fit the story. The art should be used to bring the story elements to life and to make beating that guy look cool.
Gameplay in the sense of character creation, advancement, and improvement should be as removed from overarching story restrictions as humanly possible. The only concerns here should be mechanical balance and looking cool, keeping in mind that different people think different things are cool.
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And I suspect that, for that reason, here even more than elsewhere, art and story have been even less of a driving force in creating the new content. I can clearly imagine a dev raising the kinds of objections players here have at a development meeting three years ago and being told in response, "Yeah, those players will be dissatisfied, but they got all those years of costumes and power customization and that AE thing. They'll be satisified with that. Anyway, people will only do this endgame stuff if they really want to win more parts of the game." Now, you can argue that this represents a misunderstanding on the devs' part of how players can cross from one demographic to another, but I don't think it's a totally unreasonable mode of thinking. Yes, I'd be happier if some consideration had been given to granting me the ability to tailor Incarnate content to my characters in nonmechanical ways. But I can't really fault the devs for overlooking that option. They weren't expecting someone like me to use the Incarnate system in the first place. |
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| So, to all those disappointed with the (over)emphasis on Tyrant, the Praetorian Lore pets, or the inability to make the fire from your Pyronic WhiteWall Radial Judgement green, I suggest keeping in mind that you're not the target audience for this stuff. The devs believe, rightly or wrongly, that you're already loyal to the game, that you have enough features to keep you occupied without this. Those boosts are meant to ensnare and keep players who just want to "beat the game." |
I got into a similar argument during the story vs rewards AE debate. Some people want both. A lot of people don't seem to get that, which worries me.
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A lot of what you've said here speaks to my thoughts lately. My favorite indie game, not naming names, just won 5 awards at the GDC. It is primarily a sandbox game with some survival elements.|
Originally Posted by Olantern
Someone in either this or another thread (it's getting hard to keep them straight) argued that "art wasn't a priority" for development. Well, no, of course it isn't. While there are players out there, including me, some roleplayers and some not, who view this game primarily as an animated movie about their characters, not all players think that way, and the devs certainly don't seem to.
The devs are game mechanics engineers. They, and, incidentally, a lot of players, view this as "game," not in the sense of "a game of 'let's pretend,'" but in the sense of "a game of football" or "a game of Monopoly." For those players, and for a majority of the dev team, the game is something that can be "won," in one fashion or another. Art and story are means to support the ends of gameplay, not ends in themselves. <snip> Now, I question the wisdom of that design philosophy. I don't much like that kind of contest-oriented thinking, in a game or in life, for that matter. This new direction the game is taking troubles me on some level, but I'm not willing to hold back the enjoyment of people who have been screaming for it for years. I am not the only player here. I don't have to love everything. |
For better or worse, I prefer computer games of "let's pretend." In another thread--or maybe this one--someone asserted quite strongly that this is not a sandbox game. In terms of game play, this is certainly true. But as a seven year player the thing that has kept me around and coming back on the few occasions that I strayed has been how character customization really tickles my imagination and serves many of my desires for some sort of sandbox-y, highly personalized creative outlet within our game space.
The game play itself in this game has historically been highly repetitive and rather easy. But for me that's always taken a back seat to being able to robustly realize characters from my imagination. That's the draw of CoX for me. It was the draw of why I at least TRIED the competition with some of what CO promised. It's also why I have no interest in the latest competition. It's the reason I momentarily considered genre jumping to try out APB. But even with its 7 year old low requirements and base library of parts and power animations and effects, CoX has consistently proven for my tastes to be the most open and adaptable game space for tickling my imagination.
I'm glad that the devs are exploring ways to make the newer game play more strategic and varied. I'm glad that something like team teleport now may actually have a use (avoiding sword bombs, silly as they are). And unlike some other avid posters, my taste for retro silver age camp leaves me comfortable with any of the new writing or at the very least able to hand wave away that which I'm not interested in. But despite all the things I do appreciate about the new direction that endgame development is moving in, it really does feel like the dev team has forgotten or is at the very least temporarily deliberately neglecting those of us for whom customization is key.
Point in fact: I am honestly MORE excited about the single new free aura made live today and the battleship (as scenery) added to IP than anything else I've seen regarding i20. And there are some aspects, like the reasonably perceived total lack of power customization for the new incarnate system, that actually has me downright disappointed and currently disinterested in the system.
I honestly have no idea how large a percentage of the player base is constituted by players like me. From a few of the posts in these threads, I see I'm not alone. May be just part of a passionate vocal minority or part of a more significant slice of those that still subscribe. Either way, I do reiterate to the dev team this reminder: For some of us, this MMO lives and dies by the costume creator and the character customization it affords, including power customization.
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The biggest concern about this would be the fairly mixed track record over the game's history of SOME new systems and advancements being revisited and refined quite thoroughly while others have gotten entirely neglected. "Add more later" quickly turns into "soon(tm)" which, as those of us who've been around since the first year, has turned into "never" about 50% of the time.|
Originally Posted by Furio
I don't think "add more later" is ever off the table.
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Related to this, I understand wholly why those that just want the tools, the powers, etc. for whom character customization is a nominal element of their enjoyment of the game--why those players strongly want no delay whatsoever. Because any delay might turn the aspects they are looking forward to in i20 into a "soon(tm)" that may also devolve into a "never."
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I'd go along with this only if we got to pick outside our origin or change our origin. I want robots! Not Warworks though, the only ones that I still think are cool are the War Walkers and they're too big to be practical as pets.|
Originally Posted by Master Zaprobo
For my part, I'd have liked to see five options - one pet set themed to each origin. Sure, that may have missed the mark for a lot of people as well, but at least it won't be so intrinsicly tied to Praetoria.
Perhaps.... Natural = Gun-wielding/Martial Arts specialists (sidekick-esque) Mutant = Various super-powered spandex clad types (Longbow-esque, but not actually LB as that'd not suit villains) Tech = Robots, of course! (perhaps even Warworks could be kept) Science = Zombies? (Not my fave origin this, someone might have a better idea!) Magic = Floating will-o-wisps (like the veteran buff pets) |
Magic could be "spirits" of some kind, to keep with the humanoid theme.
Zombies, meh. Twisted abominations resulting from the fateful words "God shmod, I want my monkeyman!" are way cooler than zombies, but rather limited concept-wise.
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My recollection is that Positron stated that one of the reasons was content related, but not necessarily specifically "story" related. I'm also thinking of his public statement on the matter:|
Originally Posted by Zombie Man
The delay was over 'story', not mechanics. Lack of story was what the rabble decried. It's what Positron said was the reason it was delayed. And when it finally debuted, the 'story' was the only thing that was different. It was the story -- one four mission story which made everything perfect!
Lore Slot has a story... people should be happy! |
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As you know, Ive been spearheading the End-Game system for City of Heroes, to give players a lot of what theyve been asking for: more powers, greater customization, more epic battles, and most of all, more content to do with their Level 50s. That last point was something that we got great feedback on in the GR Closed Beta. Even though it was just a sneak peak, the Alpha Slot doesnt benefit the player in a way that we had envisioned it would. Because of this feedback we have decided to act sooner rather than later. Since Alpha Slot Incarnate Abilities do not exemplar down (and we're not changing that), we find that players end up with Power that has limited use. We recognize that the Alpha Slot experience is something that a lot of you are eagerly awaiting for and we want to make sure that it is awesome, and most of all fun, when we bring the system on-line. We still want to do an Alpha Slot Sneak Peek, but we want it to happen once more of the system and content are closer to being ready for prime time. |
Remove all mention of the Well of Furies in Ramiel's arc, and just make it where the menders tell me that one day I would become a powerful incarnate, but all record of how was lost except that one day I would go on a quest to find a special shard, and the content connective game design requirement would have been satisfied mechanically. It is in that sense that I mean there was a content requirement connected to the Incarnate power system that doesn't have a specific story requirement. Large elements of this could have been relegated to future backstory or even left open to interpretation. I'm not saying that is always good, by the way, only that it was possible.
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This post is just all kinds of awesome! I really wish more folks had your attitude. Thank you.
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Originally Posted by Olantern
No, I wouldn't accept a delay for this reason, even putting aside the fact that it's totally unrealistic to expect anything to change. When the feature I wanted (create your own missions and arcs) was released, I don't remember the powergaming, Type A, ambition-focused players who drive me so crazy arguing that it should be delayed because it didn't fit what they wanted out of the game. So, no, even though I think the implementation is pretty wretched, mechanical character improvements like the Lore slot shouldn't be delayed simply because its backstory grounding and visual presentation is pretty wretched.
Someone in either this or another thread (it's getting hard to keep them straight) argued that "art wasn't a priority" for development. Well, no, of course it isn't. While there are players out there, including me, some roleplayers and some not, who view this game primarily as an animated movie about their characters, not all players think that way, and the devs certainly don't seem to. The devs are game mechanics engineers. They, and, incidentally, a lot of players, view this as "game," not in the sense of "a game of 'let's pretend,'" but in the sense of "a game of football" or "a game of Monopoly." For those players, and for a majority of the dev team, the game is something that can be "won," in one fashion or another. Art and story are means to support the ends of gameplay, not ends in themselves. For example, those who are AE mavens may remember Dr. Aeon stating that much of his job consisted of being told things like "write an arc about a hero who goes bad" or some other, rather broad, direction. He doesn't create a story about Incarnates and then send Positron and his minions off to develop a system to support it; it's the other way around. (Yes, I'm aware that development probably isn't quite that one-sided, but years of dev discussion of the way they work convinces me that I'm more or less correct.) Similarly, Going Rogue was born not because the devs really wanted to show off Praetorian Earth, but to provide a mechanism for switching sides and for gluing an end-game system onto a game that hadn't previously had one. With that kind of development structure, you're going to get some serious misses if you're the kind of player who prefers the "support" of art and story over the "meat" of gameplay. I'm not arguing that those priorities are necessarily right, but I think they have to be acknowledged. Further, the gameplay element here, I think, is seen as particularly crucial to the life of the franchise. Incarnates are this game's attempt to capture the raider-/advancement-driven market of the hardcore MMO player. Rightly or wrongly, it's an attempt to bring in a demographic that hasn't been part of the game's primary market before. And I suspect that, for that reason, here even more than elsewhere, art and story have been even less of a driving force in creating the new content. I can clearly imagine a dev raising the kinds of objections players here have at a development meeting three years ago and being told in response, "Yeah, those players will be dissatisfied, but they got all those years of costumes and power customization and that AE thing. They'll be satisified with that. Anyway, people will only do this endgame stuff if they really want to win more parts of the game." Now, you can argue that this represents a misunderstanding on the devs' part of how players can cross from one demographic to another, but I don't think it's a totally unreasonable mode of thinking. Yes, I'd be happier if some consideration had been given to granting me the ability to tailor Incarnate content to my characters in nonmechanical ways. But I can't really fault the devs for overlooking that option. They weren't expecting someone like me to use the Incarnate system in the first place. So, to all those disappointed with the (over)emphasis on Tyrant, the Praetorian Lore pets, or the inability to make the fire from your Pyronic WhiteWall Radial Judgement green, I suggest keeping in mind that you're not the target audience for this stuff. The devs believe, rightly or wrongly, that you're already loyal to the game, that you have enough features to keep you occupied without this. Those boosts are meant to ensnare and keep players who just want to "beat the game." Now, I question the wisdom of that design philosophy. I don't much like that kind of contest-oriented thinking, in a game or in life, for that matter. This new direction the game is taking troubles me on some level, but I'm not willing to hold back the enjoyment of people who have been screaming for it for years. I am not the only player here. I don't have to love everything. |
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
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This|
Originally Posted by ultrawatt
Yes
But not if it will delay the other slots, judgement, interface, and destiny. |
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So ...
How many people are like me: I roll a new toon, show up at the costume creator and hit "Random" until I find something that's not awful. If necessary, I'll tweak the colours so I don't have to look at urine yellow or lime green.
I find the range of costume and power customization options completely bewildering. Frankly ... I'd be happier with fewer options. No, really. I'd even like a random option for names so I wouldn't be stuck with howlers like Trappity. A generic origin story would be fine with me since, frankly, I can't even remember how to get to the screen where I'd otherwise write one. My last attempt at a backstory was so incompetent, I deleted it.
I really don't want new shinies delayed for an aspect of the game that frustrates me. Although I sympathise with those who would.
Edit: Seriously, I'd be happy to have a fugly pet like the walking cat turd from Earth ... just 'cause it'd be a new button to click.
No.
I'd rather see the Pool Powers get their customization first.
YES YES and YES!
And not just "to change the pets", delay it to completely revamp the slot. No more pets! I am sure you can find something much better than that.
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Just to throw another monkey wrench into this mangled conversation...
I expect the primary reason that the Lore pets are all praetorian is graphical. They are the latest enemy groups created, they are fully enabled for ultra-mode, so they have the most animations and on high end machines they look the best. If the intend to attract new players, they want new content to roll-out with their best stuff. If the devs are eventually planning on upgrading all the art, then any non-praetorian content they use is going to have to be upgraded as well. Why not use only content that won't need revisiting?
In hindsight, what they should have done is introduce more variety of enemies in Praetoria. There are zero fantasy-based enemies. The Praetorian storyline is almost entirely composed of science, tech, and natural elements. So of course it clashes with fantasy, magic, and mutant-based heroes. That missed opportunity is coming back to bite them on the spandex briefs.
My suggestion -- use the floating swords from the Apex TF. They're reasonably fantastical, and can be retconned by the player as magic, tech, or their own telekinetic mutant powers.
I would tolerate a delay for more variety in Lore pets. I don't want a delay, but I would tolerate it. It would make the game better. I want it now, but I can be patient if the end result is improved.
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New Webcomic -- Genocide Man
Life is funny. Death is funnier. Mass slaughter can be hilarious.
Quote:
1. Still not the point.|
Originally Posted by LISAR
Correct me if I'm wrong but this is two presumptions.
1. That because the game didn't yet have it included that the incarnate being manipulated by the well didn't exist. 2. The origin of the incarnate system. |
2. I remember the actual "Hey can we be awesome like Statesman?" conversations.
Quote:
Stan Lee himself admitting that he was a lazy writer.|
Originally Posted by Lucky666
See this here makes you lose all credibility. lol ya Stan Lee one of the best comic book writers ever lazy that's rich. Who allleged that nonsense? Some nobody would be my guess.
|
So yeah, some nobody.
Statesmonkey Sez: Lighten up! It's a game, for Lincoln's sake!
Also: Six years of casual play begins to look an awful lot like one year of hardcore play.
Maybe the whole point is that the justification given sucks and/or is dumb?
I'm sorry, but if I'm the Silver Surfer, I'm not a fan at all of the power cosmic suddenly giving me Latvian super troopers because somehow Doctor Doom co-opted its power.
I don't really mind the whole "the Well has gone mad and backed Cole" story. I don't think it's great shakes by any means, but I don't have anything like the distaste for it some posters seem to. I still think it's moronic that it give me Praetorean entities as pets.
I'd far, far rather it simply gave out abstract beings directly tied to the Well itself. Think "Manifestation of X" where "X" is thematic of the benefit it applies. This would be far more theme neutral (though I can still see problems for folks based on root origin) and wouldn't require large numbers of different pet visuals.
On this basis, yes, I'd accept a delay in the Lore slot on its own.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA