Discussion - Going Rogue Goodies!
By
Altoholic_Monkey,
Posted on: 2010-01-22 09:18 in News, Events and Announcement Discussion
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You misunderstand. If say, in our reality, there is a guy called Joe Bloggs. This guy is the guy who Blue Steel found, invented/powers the Clockwork and gets his head smashed in then installed to a Clockwork body. Basically, in our reality the Clockwork King is Joe Bloggs. Whatever happens, Joe Bloggs is Joe Bloggs, an extremely powerful psychic, because that's something inherent.|
Originally Posted by JDub
Dude....it's an alternate reality. Not only could the clockwork king not be a psychic, he could be a women, a different race, or not exist at all.
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If Joe Bloggs exists in Praetoria, he is an extremely powerful psychic. Otherwise he isn't Joe Bloggs. He's someone else. And the chances of there being a Clockwork King but it not being Joe Bloggs in Praetoria are slim to nil. There is a strong chance however that there is no Joe Bloggs in Praetoria, I would just assume, seeing as these creatures are called Clockwork, that the Clockwork King is involved and consequently...
Bad Voodoo by @Beyond Reach. Arc ID #373659. Level 20-24. Mr. Bocor has fallen victim to a group of hooded vigilantes who have been plaguing Port Oakes, interfering with illegal operations and pacifying villain's powers. He demands that revenge is taken on these miscreants and his powers are returned! You look like just the villain for the job. Challenging.
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Yeah - it's an alternative universe, not a mirror one - the same people with the same names are born at the same time to the same aprents - but some react in different ways to their doubles on Primal Earth.
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Originally Posted by BeyondReach
You misunderstand. If say, in our reality, there is a guy called Joe Bloggs. This guy is the guy who Blue Steel found, invented/powers the Clockwork and gets his head smashed in then installed to a Clockwork body. Basically, in our reality the Clockwork King is Joe Bloggs. Whatever happens, Joe Bloggs is Joe Bloggs, an extremely powerful psychic, because that's something inherent.
If Joe Bloggs exists in Praetoria, he is an extremely powerful psychic. Otherwise he isn't Joe Bloggs. He's someone else. And the chances of there being a Clockwork King but it not being Joe Bloggs in Praetoria are slim to nil. There is a strong chance however that there is no Joe Bloggs in Praetoria, I would just assume, seeing as these creatures are called Clockwork, that the Clockwork King is involved and consequently... |
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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hmmm?|
Originally Posted by EU_Damz
WW's first headache
 Welcome to the job   |
War Witch has been around for a while.
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You mean... like those praetorian arcs from 40-50 that mention "blue clockwork" and "silver clockwork," and send us out to find out where they're from, stop them from speeding up time and the like? |
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
The name 'Praetorian Clockwork' is, I would guess, either the name given to them by Prime Earth people (In the same way we gave Tyrant his ncik-name) or a place-holder for their actual name.
But, as ever, until we get actual redname confirmation on any of this; We Don't Know. |
For he who protests the name - Seems like either (a) Primal Earth gave them the name, or (b) they were given the name "purely out of coincidence" on Praetorian Earth for keeping things, oh, "running like clockwork," perhaps. A shared name is NOT a shared origin. Besides, the Clockwork *did* serve a vaguely similar function in Paragon just after the Rikti war, helping with cleanup - until people noticed them taking all the metal.
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Yeah, but not in a position where people can blame her for everything. |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
hmmm?
War Witch has been around for a while. |
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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Essentially I would like to think that it, "would be cool", if;
- In Praetoria, the counterpart to the individual who becomes CK on Primal Earth, is still alive and psychic.
- Even though Praetoria is an alternate, not mirror, world, it is very easy to imagine the origin story (what's been crucially different in Tyrant's/Statesman's bio's is all about the origin story) for Praetoria's counterpart where Blue Steel doesn't lose control, and so that individual doesn't become the CK as we know him.
- That still leaves a powerful psychic out there. From what was revealed at HeroCon about the Psychic Friends Network it's concievable he'll either have to join them or avoid them.
- So, good stories might be that he is held prisoner and made to 'power' the Praetorian Clockwork - but their claimed creator is a scientist, and they look like robots with circuits and everything, so how could they be psychically controlled?
- The Supers programme in Praetoria has a disturbing inability to return 90% of it's mandatory applicants to their families. If their families enquire, they too go missing.
- It would be very inefficient to simply kill off 90% of your Supers when you have a very powerful psychic lackey and a genius scientist working with you. Now if only Tyrant could find a way to harness this power....for good!
- Two divergent options occur at this point; either Mother Mayhem and the Psychic Friends Network control the minds of these failed Supers and they all get crammed into Anti-Matter created Clockwork-suits. With this option the man-who-would-have-been-CK is aware of the situation and joins the Resistance, convenient if you need to hide from psychics.
- Option two would be that our CK-counterpart is captured and made to control the grotesque previously-people automatons.
Yes, this is all speculation based on only the scant information we have at present. All or some of these details may be wrong, but that there was no comment made on the CK, rather than the released response about Nemesis at HeroCon, makes me think the character hasn't been completely written out.
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In The Darkness Creeping, ArcID: 347709, When Dimensions Collide, ArcID: 412416.
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Who are you and what have you done with GG?|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
So the Praetorian version of the CK would be a guy...
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Except that peoples' choices would lead to different outcomes with every divergence. They have a Hamidon that was already monstrous when our Hamidon would have probably been a child, given what we learn in the Terra Conspiracy arc, or maybe not even born yet. Imagine now that the analogue to our Clockwork King's father happened to die during the Korean War, being that it played out differently on Praetorian Earth. In that case, there would likely be no Praetorian Clockwork King equivalent.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Yeah - it's an alternative universe, not a mirror one - the same people with the same names are born at the same time to the same aprents - but some react in different ways to their doubles on Primal Earth.
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"I wish my life was a non-stop Hollywood movie show,
A fantasy world of celluloid villains and heroes."
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No. It is an alternate universe, which mean the same people don't have to be born at the same time to the same parents.|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Yeah - it's an alternative universe, not a mirror one - the same people with the same names are born at the same time to the same aprents - but some react in different ways to their doubles on Primal Earth.
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In fact the devs said at hero con, some people who exist in Primal Earth, won't have to exist in Praetorian earth.
Further more, their is no reason that Joe Bloggs or the Clockwork King has to be psychic in Praetorian earth. The factors that made him psychic in Primal earth, genetics, random chance, what ever, don't have to have existed the same way in Praetorian earth.
An Alternate universe does not have to bare any similarity to other universe's. Further more, even if their were some similarities, at the time when paths start diverging, new possibilities open up and new impossibilities form. At the point that Praetorian Marcus Cole, Kills his brother in law, it is no longer possible for him to become lord recluse and take control of arachnos.
Their might be another guy who takes control of Arachnos and calls himself lord recluse, but it won't be Cole's brother in law.
In an alternate universe, their is no reason to believe anything has to be the same or even similar to this universe. And Joe Bloggs may have had an inherent psychic ability in Primal Earth, but he doesn't have to have it in Praeotorian earth, he could just be a nobody.
Also, the clockwork in praetorian earth, we already know were built by the Praetorians as a work force so that people didn't have to do menial jobs, they said as much at Hero Con, this would indicate they don't have the same origin as clockwork on primal earth.
"Where does he get those wonderful toys?" - The Joker
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Except the entire Freedom Phalanx and their SKs happening to be identical to the Primal Earth ones in looks and powers? |
Originally Posted by Ice_Wall
In an alternate universe, their is no reason to believe anything has to be the same or even similar to this universe.
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As for Arachnos, my guess is that they either bcame absorbed into the Praetroian police, as some of the concept art for their uniforms looks rather Arachnos-ish - or that they evovled into the Resistance - and that screenshot of the NPC in the glowie armor is a heroic Praetorian version of a Crabspider
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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The fact that some things are exactly identical and others are totally different is a hallmark of fictional alternate universes, and given the level of divergence we already know there appears to be no default assumption that everything we don't know is likely to be identical. This isn't a universe with a single counterfactual divergence. Its a universe that parallels the Primal one in many ways, but appears unpredictably different in others.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Except the entire Freedom Phalanx and their SKs happening to be identical to the Primal Earth ones in looks and powers?
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My thoughts on the matter is that the solders that were drawn to Arachnos on primal earth became Praetorian cops. Also, Mother Mayheim's seers reminds me of the fortunatas, in look and basic function.
Conversely, Primal Earth Freakshow an Anarchists heck they use the anarchy symbol as their logo. Anti establishment...in a world ruled by Marcus Cole who's to say the the leaders of the resistance aren't the Praetorian version of Freakshow. they have the look.
oh and while I'm on the subject...Having recently read the Freedom Phalanx Book. Based on the written description of Dr. Null. Black armor etc. etc. etc. Kinda describes how Anti-Matter looks in game. I believe that Preatorian Raymond Keyes was the one who first put on the First Prototype Armor with out the safeties installed thus trapping himself inside the armor. much Like Dr. Null did according to the book.
I'd imagine that either Arachnos eventually tore itself apart without Recluse's eventual guiding influence, or it was destroyed during the Nuclear/Devouring Earth attacks. Becaue of that, I'd certainly say that those who were drawn to Arachnos would certainly be drawn to the meritocracy of Praetoria rather than the anarchists of the Resistance. And the Fortunatas can expect death or joining the Psychic Friends Network as I imagine those are the only two options afforded to psychics in Praetoria.
We have seen two Resistance member as far as I understand, and they are very steampunk. However, the Freakshow are a lot like Arachnos, they believe in survival of the fittest, and because of that I can't really see Freakshow joining the resistance, unless they were a faction that were basically just blind terrorists. And seeing as the Resistance are actually still around, I doubt that any major part of it would be made up of Freakshow.
Bad Voodoo by @Beyond Reach. Arc ID #373659. Level 20-24. Mr. Bocor has fallen victim to a group of hooded vigilantes who have been plaguing Port Oakes, interfering with illegal operations and pacifying villain's powers. He demands that revenge is taken on these miscreants and his powers are returned! You look like just the villain for the job. Challenging.
I hope GR or I17 has new hairstyles.
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huh, am i the only person who knew that was an npc and wasn't expecting that as costume pieces.|
Originally Posted by JLove
Oh God, how can I say this without turning up as an unrecognizable charred corpse along some dusty highway ditch wearing a diaper full of Texas sized fire ants with my eyes replaced with screwdrivers?
Remember way back in the day when this thread got started and everyone was like “WOW those are great resistance costume pieces, I can’t wait to wear them, splat, splat, splat,” and “Oh super keen, first I changed my desktop to a lolz cat and now my crippling depression doesn’t seem so bad anymore, because I have a reason to live again, I get to wear glowing stuff.” Well, get out a mop and find something sharp. That picture is of a NPC, not a new costume set. Me so sorry about that there wasn’t a clearer explanation of what was going on in the screenshot, I really am. But when you get down it and think about this rationally, this is really your fault, you jumped to a conclusion. You know I told you a thousand times not to do that, but I guess I need to teach you another lesson in the silence of the basement, next to the treadmill you don’t use anymore. Looks like you and I won’t be going over to your mothers for dinner like you planned. Canceled! The writing is on the wall baby, you are going to just have to tell the neighbors how clumsy you are, and just deal with it. Let the guilt of your wrong doings lead you on a path to righteousness. You’re welcome. See how I turned that around, take a note kids. |
Although it would be cool to have them unlockable with an accolade you get for joining and completing a resistance story arc. but then again, if it's not in going rogue, there's nothing that says it wont be in a future issue =)
Ps: How come the praetorian Hamidon is remarkably like the hydra??? could it be that the hydra are rikti earths devouring earth?? and the praetorian counterpart is a mix of the two??
Also with the hamidon being the source of praetorias beauty we better be able to go and look at it without it killing us and stuff. Cos that would be sooo awesome =D
Pps: Emperor Cole is actually awesome =D
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So because some people have no sense of humor nobody else on the Interweb is allowed to? Screw that! Full steam ahead on the U.S.S. SexyJ! Torpedos away baby!
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Originally Posted by Hallowed
I (and many others) love your bat-[WARNING EXPLICIT LYRICS]-crazy, random-[WARNING EXPLICIT LYRICS] posts, but please refrain from anything that, no matter how jokingly, casts any aspersions on the players.
Because it will create unnecessary drama, and we have enough of that as is. |
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Everyone has their own taste as far as humor is concerned. We are all allowed voice our opinions as well. You liked Jay's post while others did not (I thought it was in poor taste). He is also a representative of this game and may want to consider this and try not to tick off the paying customer. That is how service oriented industry tends to work.|
Originally Posted by Irresponsible
So because some people have no sense of humor nobody else on the Interweb is allowed to? Screw that! Full steam ahead on the U.S.S. SexyJ! Torpedos away baby!
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Honestly, I could care less what he says or spews. His opinion/point/comments don't effect me (and I am sure most of us). However, we all have the right to comment on it.
So, moving on, when's the next GR info going to be released!
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There's something called "good sense" when it comes to jokes, and if not exercised, it WILL come back to bite the joker. Repeatedly. There's nothing wrong with humour, questionable humour, provocative humour or indeed mostly any kind, but some sense of context and situation needs to be exercise. Throwing around randomness randomly does often tend to be funny, but is just as often a complete crapshot because it's just as often not.|
Originally Posted by Irresponsible
So because some people have no sense of humor nobody else on the Interweb is allowed to? Screw that! Full steam ahead on the U.S.S. SexyJ! Torpedos away baby!
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I respect Jay's tendency to joke around and act informal, but I'm not always confident in his judgement in doing so.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Originally Posted by Hallowed
I (and many others) love your bat-[WARNING EXPLICIT LYRICS]-crazy, random-[WARNING EXPLICIT LYRICS] posts, but please refrain from anything that, no matter how jokingly, casts any aspersions on the players.
Because it will create unnecessary drama, and we have enough of that as is. |
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Originally Posted by Irresponsible
So because some people have no sense of humor nobody else on the Interweb is allowed to? Screw that! Full steam ahead on the U.S.S. SexyJ! Torpedos away baby!
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Here's the deal: Jay is not just some random poster. He represents the company, and as such, he should think a bit more carefully about what he posts. Any post by any dev criticizing the player-base, (or seeming to) should be given some serious consideration before the submit button is hit.
I didn't say he shoudn't post. I didn't say he shouldn't have fun with his posts. As a matter of fact, I said I enjoy his crazy, random posts. I specifically pointed out that a post that (even jokingly) points fingers at the players is probably a bad idea. If you can't understand why... <shrug>
YAY it is feb now where is my info/beta on GR :P
(NOTE: this is a joke for some people who might not get it that i need to spell it out well 90% of a joke anyways)
Hmm my simile is broke
sincerly yours:
Bzald of TopTen
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I speculated as much on the first page. Got completely ignored. |
Originally Posted by NeonPower
huh, am i the only person who knew that was an npc and wasn't expecting that as costume pieces.
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Originally Posted by Perfect_Pain
I hope GR or I17 has new hairstyles.
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Where to find me after the end:
The Secret World - Arcadia - Shinzo
Rift - Faeblight - Bloodspeaker
LotRO - Gladden - Aranelion
STO - Holodeck - @Captain_Thiraas
Obviously, I don't care about NCSoft's forum rules, now.
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If we could divorce ourselves of the current focus of that (our game, our Devs and our players) and move to a more generalist focus:|
Originally Posted by TheJazMan
He is also a representative of this game and may want to consider this and try not to tick off the paying customer. That is how service oriented industry tends to work.
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And it is also a failing in the service industry. Sometimes your customer is a moron and expects too much. Sometimes, IMO, it is okay to tell them they are an idiot, and there is no way in heck that you, or anyone else, is going to accomodate them.
I know of TONS of examples from the restaurant industry in which a manager was forced to give-in to some ridiculous situation due to not upsetting the customer. Well, as far as I see it, some customers are okay to lose... especially if it costs you almost as much to keep them happy as they bring in to the business.
I recall the lady who upon being asked what she wanted to drink stated she only wanted a water. And a couple of lemons. The server, thinking she meant a couple slices, brought her that. No, what she wanted, was literally a few lemons so that she could use the complimentary sugar to make herself a glass of lemonade: for free, using products intended as free items going along with expensive bar drinks and the occassional soda drinker (who is paying huge markup on that soda).
The sad part? The manager was forced to not charge her, because there is no "button" for lemons, they are given away for free, afterall. But me, I would say that for all intents and purposes she was abusing the system and thusly should get charged for a glass of lemonade. But that's me.
Ahem. Sorry for the tangent, but talk of "customer service" the service industry and references to "the customer is always right" kinda get me peaved.
I now return you to your regularly scheduled thread, already in progress.
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You need to use a lowercase P. Like this: |
Originally Posted by bzald
:P
Hmm my simile is broke |
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In the abstract, I completely agree. I will say that in the case of the situation under discussion here, what you are talking about doesn't really apply. |
Originally Posted by Thirty-Seven
And it is also a failing in the service industry. Sometimes your customer is a moron and expects too much. Sometimes, IMO, it is okay to tell them they are an idiot, and there is no way in heck that you, or anyone else, is going to accomodate them.
I know of TONS of examples from the restaurant industry in which a manager was forced to give-in to some ridiculous situation due to not upsetting the customer. Well, as far as I see it, some customers are okay to lose... especially if it costs you almost as much to keep them happy as they bring in to the business. |
Most customers are not familiar with the full saying. The saying is "The customer is always right... except when they're not." At least that's how I know the phrase...
Of course, you did try to seperate yourself from this particular discussion and just seemed to want to vent.
Feel better now?
So the Praetorian version of the CK would be a guy, and if our CK is a natural psychic from birth, then so would the Praetorian be a natural psychic from birth - but the way their lives play out wouldn't be the same.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork