Good character names are running out, huh?
By
Ad Astra,
Posted on: 2010-01-20 08:53 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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I quoted you, Johnny but there have been quite a few posters in this thread that have made the "keep a unique name=selfishness" while "must have someone else's name≠selfishness" claim. While some have omitted the second part, their statement that "keep a unique name=selfishness" paint them in the "I want your name, but I'm not selfish" camp as far as I'm concerned.|
Originally Posted by Johnny_Velocity
To answer your first question: I was responding specifically to the POV of Samuel Tow, who appears to not only agree that his is a selfish desire, but actually embraces the notion.
I've made no claims that my POV isn't selfish, but since Sam took the point of view that he does not want global names since, essentially, there was nothing it it for him, I attempted to show that there was in fact something in it for him - making the game more accessible may prolong the game's life via more subscribers. (To which he responded, in essence, (1) that he didn't think that would be the result and (2) even if it were so, he'd rather find a different way to draw subscribers that did not impact him.) |
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But I can assure you my motivation is not covetousness - I have no desire to have any specific person's specific name. As for the rest, we'll simply count you as another vote in favour of Going Rogue: Thesaurus Edition. |
Oh, and by the way, where did you get your revenue information? Because NCsoft recorded record sales.
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I'm a little confused by the question. I believe you are saying NCSoft overall reported a record level of sales (I read that as "record sales" the first time - wait, they don't sell records....) That may be true. But the NCSoft webpage I linked to in post #279 in this thread includes a downloadable spreadsheet with NCSoft's quarterly report, which has individual sales for each game. Reported in Won, of course. As an individual game, CoX trended downwards. Aion and, of all things, Lineage I were the games that helped NCSoft set record sales. (Incidentally, the fact that Lineage I, launched in 1998!, had a surprising upturn is something CoX fans can take heart in.) I'm requoting my sources for convenience.|
Originally Posted by Red Valkyrja
Oh, and by the way, where did you get your revenue information? Because NCsoft recorded record sales.
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Originally Posted by Johnny_Velocity
It is an extrapolation similar to and extending from the discussion in TonyV's thread last month based on NCSoft's Q4 2009 earning release from a couple of weeks ago based on a $45/customer (per quarter) average, which has been the eyeball average for a couple of years now. However, UnSub does a more detailed look here. At the end of the day, however, NCSoft no longer provides subscriber numbers, so this is only an estimate, and is probably best considered a subscriber-equivalent anyway since some sales are based on RMT transactions like booster packs.
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Thanks for the links, Johnny.
I've always been one that found the "unique name" idea an annoying artifact- something that made very little sense in ANY game, but was a somewhat necessary artifact of the technology. Because of that, I've never considered someone to have a "right" to park a name and claim it as his own.
It's one reason why I found it refreshing that developers have shown some effort at breaking this barrier. I didn't like the "shared lastname" solution in TR, and only tolerated Champions' after the global was hidden by default (no hide? I prefer my alts to have some anonymity sometimes!)... but I've heard several other techniques that all held some merit, as well as drawbacks:
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One Idea I heard was fairly simple and transparent to the user. Essentially:
Allow as many instances of a name you wish. No global, nothing tying them to another character. Everything's transparent. You do see, either by icon or color, whether this person is in your friend / guild / team list.
Now, for the specifics, which can be more-or-less transparent:
- I can send a tell to a specific person by specifying whichever list(samuel_tow.guild will go to the samuel_tow in my guild list, samuel_tow.team will always go to my current team's samuel_tow, samuel_tow.lbx would send it to the most recent samuel_tow active on the lbx chat channel). Note that this sometimes may be the same person (the samuel_tow of my guild is posting on LBX). That doesn't matter. The designation is just used so the client can match the (hidden) unique ID of the user. The same person gets the message either way.
- There's always the chance that you'll have more than one of the same name on your friends' list or guild, so every player can give an alias to any character they want. if I knew two "atomic angels" (trust me, one's enough) I could nickname one as "aa" or "double a" or "wftdidyoudowithyourcostumenow" so I could then easily tell them apart.
- If I don't specify a category, if I just send to "samuel_tow" the game decides who gets it based on a simple logical priority of order. You might even have the ability to customize it, but lets assume it does so by "alias/team/friend/guild/proximity/recentchatactivity."
In other words, if I don't specify which "samuel_tow," but I have a "samuel_tow" as an alias, and he's online, he gets it. If he isn't, it goes down the list, first checking if sam's on my team (and online) or a friend (and online) or a guild (and online) or there's a samuel_tow nearby... or in a chat channel I subscribe to... until it finds one. All this is transparent to the user (though it could, if needed, add the actual designation used as a mouse-over in chat, so if I think there may be a mistake, I could find out where the message went).
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While all the details might sound complicated, this is essentially what we do everyday in real life. When I worked in a place with several "Daves" sometimes we used aliases ( "jean's dave" (his wife worked with us) or the lastname, or a nickname ). Sometimes we used proximity for the same person (if we were working directly with Dave, it was easy enough to assume that it's THAT Dave we were addressing... or if there was only one Dave in the office that day). Sometimes, we used abstract categorization to refer to someone (Dave in Network Services).
It's how we naturally manage it. Maybe we can emulate that well enough today in the tech we have...
...and besides, I'd get a not-so-guilty pleasure out of assigning (and sharing) derogatory aliases to every "wolverine" clone I'd encounter.
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I'd go so far as to say that I'm opposed to new endgame content, not merely indifferent. |
Originally Posted by Johnny_Velocity
Conversely, I'd love more end game content (loosely defined), and I'm shocked that almost any long-time player would be indifferent towards it.
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I mean, there are some additions to the game, like animated tails, that don't detract from gameplay if you don't want them (other than, in theory, a use of developer resources). However, an endgame system totally screws me over. I admit its because I have a specific set of preferences and pet peeves, but its a radical change for me, even based on what we can only guess at as being true (in all likelihood).
I like playing heroes to level 50 and then having them in my "collection." Currently, any level 50 in my collection can be taken off the shelf and taken for a spin on ANY content in the game. I can have SOs, or a low recharge / cheap build of IOs, or a mega super uber build, but in each case I'm welcome and helpful on all content. I'm also eligible for all content on a whim when I'm in the mood to play anything in my collection of 50s. A new endgame system will change all that. It WILL make players more powerful.
A dev commented that the benefits (of improving through the new endgame system) wouldn't apply to the normal game scenarios because they didnt want people who'd benefitted from the new system to be able to buzzsaw Monster Island solo. Any content that requires characters on that level (capable of soloing GMs) is likely going to be hard enough or competitive enough that my huge list of collected characters will be useless on such a team. That INSTANTLY makes all my level 50s useless / wasted effort. The whole purpose is to get them to the point where I can say to a team "Oh, you wanted an Earth/Storm controller? I have that exact build at 50. Oh, you'd rather have a softcapped Katana/SR? Got one of them too." This level of new content is likely to make all my level 50 heroes OBSOLETE.
At the very least, I'll have to play my 50s through a lot of the endgame system to have them useful on endgame content. The devs wont make it trivial to max out whatever this new endgame content is. Otherwise, whats the point. So anyone with LOTS of level 50 characters is kinda boned *IF* (like me) its important to you to be able to do any content on ANY of them with welcome smiles from teammates.
So catgirl tails and a new naming scheme with global suffixes doesnt hurt people at all (IMO) whereas a new endgame system makes my previous efforts (of making a stable of alts I can take out on a whim for endgame content) null and void. 5.5 years of wasted "pretties" being collected. At least that's my fear, that this new endgame system will undermine all my previous time. It'd be different if I had only 1, 2, or even 5 characters at level 50.
Still, I can't begrudge them putting it in. I'm in the minority, so I'll have to swallow my complaints.
If the new system affects me as I fear it will, I may have to pick 1 character per account to be my UBER character, and plink with endgame content when I'm in the mood, but I'll mostly be working on my other not-50-yet fun projects. I'll just have to hope that a smile and a nod on the global channel of my choice will still get my non-uber characters in for an ITF, and I'll just have to regret that the hundred or more hours on that character didn't get me into the new endgame.
Lewis
/paranoid
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
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I'm very close to that sentiment, though I don't play characters to 50.... refuse to see 50 as any sort of achievement. My characters often stall out when they feel sufficiently "fleshed out" and further power-development actually detracts from my characters' concepts.|
Originally Posted by UnicyclePeon
I'd go so far as to say that I'm opposed to new endgame content, not merely indifferent.
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See, I personally enjoy the narrative of heroes that aren't so... well, cosmic-powered, I guess, is the term. When you get so damn powerful that you're hopping dimensions, battling giant world-devourers, and singlehandedly stopping alien invaders... well, that's beyond where I want my characters to be.
Long before I get to level 50, most of my characters feel pretty darn well-established for how I see them, and it almost seems like they start to lose their identity when I try to force them farther on and into stories that really don't fit their concept at all
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I agree, for some of my characters it wouldn't feel right. For those characters, I just keep doing radio missions or AE missions against non-cosmic type plots. You can fight CoT and Council all the way up to 50 (assuming the character is still fun to play).|
Originally Posted by Chase_Arcanum
Long before I get to level 50, most of my characters feel pretty darn well-established for how I see them, and it almost seems like they start to lose their identity when I try to force them farther on and into stories that really don't fit their concept at all
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Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
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I doubt CoH's end-game will lead to the kind of widespread elitism that runs wild on other games. My impression is that a lot of players take a kind of pride in disregarding the "we need a tank, we need a healer" approach to team building and they won't be shouting in broadcast for gearscore and linked achievements (or the equivalent.)|
Originally Posted by UnicyclePeon
If the new system affects me as I fear it will, I may have to pick 1 character per account to be my UBER character, and plink with endgame content when I'm in the mood, but I'll mostly be working on my other not-50-yet fun projects. I'll just have to hope that a smile and a nod on the global channel of my choice will still get my non-uber characters in for an ITF, and I'll just have to regret that the hundred or more hours on that character didn't get me into the new endgame.
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In fact I suspect that if the devs ever did devise a TF that they said required a specific set up of ATs or a certain level of enhancements, some people would take it as a personal challenge to try and complete the TF with an all-Defender PUG slotted with SOs.
The great thing is... they'd probably succeed.
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blah blah blah. It always ends up with this: anyone who disagrees is motivated by selfishness. How nice that you're the only one concerned about the welfare of the game while all those who disagree are self-centered vermin.|
Originally Posted by Johnny_Velocity
Thank you, THANK YOU, for the admission that, at the end of the day, it comes down to selfishness.
And for the vocal vets who always chime in against this idea, I strongly suspect the same motivation. |
Sorry, Pollyanna, your world-view is a bit off. I think the idea honestly and truly stinks and would be harmful to the game.
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
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It goes way beyond the Angel and Demon Wings you get at 15 months:|
Originally Posted by BrandX
I can see the vet rewards being a problem for new users...and I'm pretty much against any costume option being a future reward for VETS. As the new players may never get to use them (as it is now...I think it tops out at 15 months to have every costume option).
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18 Months: Samurai Armor (one of my favorite sets)
21 Months: Shoulder Capes
27 Months: Tech Sleek set
30 Months: Signature group logos for chest pieces (Freedom Phalanx, Vindicators, Vanguard, Arachnos, PPD, Cage Consortium, CoT, Council)
39 Months: Boxing Set
51 Months: Crab Spider, Blood Widow, Mu Mystic, Wolf Spider Helmets
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Wow...Tech Sleek set was a vet reward! I didn't realize that!|
Originally Posted by Willowpaw
It goes way beyond the Angel and Demon Wings you get at 15 months:
18 Months: Samurai Armor (one of my favorite sets) 21 Months: Shoulder Capes 27 Months: Tech Sleek set 30 Months: Signature group logos for chest pieces (Freedom Phalanx, Vindicators, Vanguard, Arachnos, PPD, Cage Consortium, CoT, Council) 39 Months: Boxing Set 51 Months: Crab Spider, Blood Widow, Mu Mystic, Wolf Spider Helmets |
30 month vet reward. Meh. I used the Vindicators logo, for the stylized V once. The toon got genericed :P Haven't used any of that since.
Samuria Armor. Never used it.
Okay, I use the Shoulder cape, untill I reach lvl 20.
Yup. The rest I don't use at all either! Looks like those rewards mean nothing to me (but possibly more to others. of course.
)So all in all...I HAVE MY BELLY TEES! I AM HAPPY! *huggles belly tees*
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
Im very sorry that I grabbed the name Myopia. Though I wasn't looking for a name that meant blindness, it fit my character concept of a near sighted hero with a bow.
I continue to be surprised by names that are available. I was making a technology defender, a real brainiac nerdy sort of guy and assumed my first choice of name would be taken. Shockingly, Numbers Guy was available.
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
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Originally Posted by Chase_Arcanum
I'm very close to that sentiment, though I don't play characters to 50.... refuse to see 50 as any sort of achievement. My characters often stall out when they feel sufficiently "fleshed out" and further power-development actually detracts from my characters' concepts.
See, I personally enjoy the narrative of heroes that aren't so... well, cosmic-powered, I guess, is the term. When you get so damn powerful that you're hopping dimensions, battling giant world-devourers, and singlehandedly stopping alien invaders... well, that's beyond where I want my characters to be. Long before I get to level 50, most of my characters feel pretty darn well-established for how I see them, and it almost seems like they start to lose their identity when I try to force them farther on and into stories that really don't fit their concept at all |
No offense here but when you say things like
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| I personally enjoy the narrative of heroes that aren't so... well, cosmic-powered, |
That is why I think they are putting this end game system to challenge us that need/want it.
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Did'nt Realize Batman,Spider-man,Daredevil,Beast,Nightcrawler,BLack Canary, hawkman, and anybody who's not Superman was'nt a superhero...
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Originally Posted by Lucky666
It sounds like your playing a sidekick and not a super hero at all and well this is City of heroes not City of sidekicks.
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Anyone Who wants to argue about my usual foolishness can find me here.
https://twitter.com/Premmytwit
I'll miss you all.
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But they're level 50! |
Originally Posted by Premonitions
Did'nt Realize Batman,Spider-man,Daredevil,Beast,Nightcrawler,BLack Canary, hawkman, and anybody who's not Superman was'nt a superhero...
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BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
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Nope, they aren't... didn't you get the memo? |
Originally Posted by Premonitions
Did'nt Realize Batman,Spider-man,Daredevil,Beast,Nightcrawler,BLack Canary, hawkman, and anybody who's not Superman was'nt a superhero...
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That's what we in the business call "personal preference," and it tends to not be subject to debate. I know from experience that it's very hard to convince a person that he misinterpreted his own opinion.
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Originally Posted by Lucky666
It sounds like your playing a sidekick and not a super hero at all and well this is City of heroes not City of sidekicks. Alot of people I *think* do want to be this cosmic powered super being myself included.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Sammy, you're obviously wrong about what you think, let me tell you what you REALLY feel.
Anyone Who wants to argue about my usual foolishness can find me here.
https://twitter.com/Premmytwit
I'll miss you all.
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How does one "misinterpreted his own opinion"?
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
That's what we in the business call "personal preference," and it tends to not be subject to debate. I know from experience that it's very hard to convince a person that he misinterpreted his own opinion.
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I often draw inspiration for a name from various sources:
The internet is obviously going to be a first choice for most. But don't limit yourself
to only one version or spelling. John could be spelled Jon, Johnn, Jonn and so on and
such. Since my wife and I are expecting, baby name books are also a good research
tool. Also consider searching though history for notable names that can be used.
Also try the same name in a different language if it fits with your character description
and backstory. Keep in mind, some players may assume that you actually speak the
lanaguage of your character's name (It happened to me yesterday when I chose a
Japanese Name) but on the plus side, it was an great way to meet a new player and
chat for a bit.
A good name is only half the story regardless. A well written description will further
distinguish your chracter from the rest. So whether you and your buddy are both
named John Smith and Jonn Smith, your backstory will set the tone and actually
define the name.
Cheers!
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Originally Posted by Premonitions
Did'nt Realize Batman,Spider-man,Daredevil,Beast,Nightcrawler,BLack Canary, hawkman, and anybody who's not Superman was'nt a superhero...
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all those guys have faced cosmic level battles though I provide examples
Batman JLA:The tower of Babel<>
This compelling story examines the depths of Batman's paranoia, but also shows admiration for his forethought. Even the JLA, embittered by this betrayal, recognize that perhaps someone should have a contingency plan in case the League becomes mind-controlled or are otherwise in need of incapacitation. But that still doesn't forgive Batman's deception. And here you thought Identity Crisis was the beginning of the end for the JLA.
Spider-man The venom Saga<>
Venom is a threat from outher space and fuses with other being if that isn't cosmic I don't know what is.
Daredevil <> He fights hitler while not cosmic defiantly not anything even close to SK stuff
Beast is part of the X-men and took part in the phonix saga pretty epic/cosmic if you ask me
Nightcrawler same story as Beast see above picture
Black Canary I can't say I have ever heard of.
Hawkman well if you know his story nuff said their are many incantion of him, but him and his lover will be togther threw all eternit pretty cosmic I think.
Good enough?
If you don't want to get your hero too powerful you can always turn of EXP because you've reached the characters end line. Then you can keep playing with your finished character and still enjoy the game.
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"Cosmic-Powered" doesn't have to mean originating from space- it's more a "Level of power" that's encountered than an origin. The term, among comic-users, usually refers to the stories & characters that rise to levels that bring the rest of humanity to insignificance- Galactus, the Watcher, the Phoenix Force, events that deal with the fates of metaverses or whole alternat dimensions, and the types of characters that regularly interact with them.|
Originally Posted by Lucky666
all those guys have faced cosmic level battles though I provide examples
Batman JLA:The tower of Babel<> This compelling story examines the depths of Batman's paranoia, but also shows admiration for his forethought. Even the JLA, embittered by this betrayal, recognize that perhaps someone should have a contingency plan in case the League becomes mind-controlled or are otherwise in need of incapacitation. But that still doesn't forgive Batman's deception. And here you thought Identity Crisis was the beginning of the end for the JLA. Spider-man The venom Saga<> Venom is a threat from outher space and fuses with other being if that isn't cosmic I don't know what is. Daredevil <> He fights hitler while not cosmic defiantly not anything even close to SK stuff Beast is part of the X-men and took part in the phonix saga pretty epic/cosmic if you ask me Nightcrawler same story as Beast see above picture Black Canary I can't say I have ever heard of. Hawkman well if you know his story nuff said their are many incantion of him, but him and his lover will be togther threw all eternit pretty cosmic I think. Good enough? |
There's a big difference between occasional cosmic-level encounters and being cosmic-centric. Virtually every Marvel hero, for better or worse, seems to have faced Galactus at least once, it seems. Doesn't mean they're "cosmic powered"...
...Also doesn't mean that the crossover was a particularly good idea.
In fact, in most cases the stories eventually REVERT back to the core theme of the comic. This suggests that the authors knew it wasn't sustainable at that level. The X-men come back to earth and for the next 30 issues the writers to their best to make virtually no reference to that battle... after every DC "Crisis Infinitum" we see most heroes at a granular street level that seems to take pains NOT to mention the multiverse...
There are many heroes that are defined by their setting- the extended "Batman" family that's well-defined in fighting the threats of Gotham, for example. They may occasionally be yanked into the cosmic theme (often painfully and poorly done) but they inevitably go back to the character-defining settings they came from.
That's very different from characters that, at their core, are very "cosmic" in nature and are established with a cosmic environment surrounding them.
That's what CoH can't easily capture. A good comic character is defined as much by his setting as by his powers. You can occasionally pull him out of that setting for an interesting character piece (and to sell more comics), but the iconic character is defined best in that iconic setting, and almost always returns to it and the stories it fosters. Here, we seem to progress through all these settings, eventually putting them behind us, never to return.
Now, I'm perfectly fine with being selective in which of my characters' stories are "canon" with what *I* see my character doing. Heck, to be honest, very few of the game's stories have any relevance to how I see my characters' narratives, but the overall gameplay experience does establish a theme, and at some point, too many of the stories become TOO "cosmic" to me.... too different from the world that defines my character.
Fortunately, for me, Alts and AE can help fill the gap for me.
What would make the game more accessible to new players is a name generator at the ID screen. We were all new players once. I do not consider myself a veteran player. When I create a new character, I'm in the same boat as someone on a trial account as far as naming is concerned.
It took me a month to find these forums, I didn't come on here complaining that the name I wanted was "In use" or "Unavailable." Why? Because there are countless tools out there to help anyone find a unique name. I just so happen to have about five or six sitting on my desk, plus bookmarked websites none of which are name generators.
If people are dead set on having that name and only that one name, then what do they do with the next character they create? You know, because that mythical 'best name' has already been taken.
If me wanting to keep my names to myself is selfish, then so be it. But don't come on here claiming that your POV is any less selfish.
Oh, and another reason I like having unique names? If even one other person has that name on the same server, then it's too common for me, I don't want it.
I've made no claims that my POV isn't selfish, but since Sam took the point of view that he does not want global names since, essentially, there was nothing it it for him, I attempted to show that there was in fact something in it for him - making the game more accessible may prolong the game's life via more subscribers. (To which he responded, in essence, (1) that he didn't think that would be the result and (2) even if it were so, he'd rather find a different way to draw subscribers that did not impact him.)
But I can assure you my motivation is not covetousness - I have no desire to have any specific person's specific name.
As for the rest, we'll simply count you as another vote in favor of Going Rogue: Thesaurus Edition.