City of Heroes: Live Forum Archive

Genericed character in 5 . . . 4 . . . 3 . . . 2 .

Ad Astra

By Ad Astra,
Posted on: 2009-06-25 12:34 in Player Questions

 

Posted

I agree to abide by the rules, but I don't remember agreeing to be a policer of homage violations.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
I agree to abide by the rules, but I don't remember agreeing to be a policer of homage violations.

[/ QUOTE ]

The devs specifically asked the players to help with the finding and reporting of trademark/copyright infringement.

If you choose not to, no one is forcing you to.

Wow, this thread got nasty. It was fun yesterday until it turned into personal attacks.

My stance, repeated:

If I have reason to believe someone with a trademark violation character is unaware of the rules, I will warn them of exactly what the rules are, and why they exist. If they are polite in return I will let it go and give them the chance to make a correction themselves. I see no reason to put someone through the generic/rename process if they really don't know about the rule. Then, if I see them again later at a higher level, I take it as indication that they ignored my warning. Then I petition

If they are a jerk to me in response, I petition immediately. I do not tell them I am petitioning them, because it serves no purpose. Their attitude in response to my polite warning is an indicator that, if left alone they will NOT make a correction of their own volition.

If I have reason to believe that they are aware of the rules (number of vet badges, displaying game knowledge new players wouold not have, etc.) I petition immediately with no exchange of words. If you've been playing that long you should know you're risking genericing.

Now, on to the "Why I do this" part of the post.

Do I really care that someone is unoriginal enough to rip off a character? Not really, I think it's kind of funny actually.

Do I derive pleasure out of getting someone's character genericed? Nope. But I don't feel bad about it either, especially seeing as it wasn't their character in the first place.

I petition people because the developers of the game asked the players (of which I am one, obviously) to assist them with a task they cannot handle by themselves. Namely, the finding and reporting of EULA violations.

I'm operating on a hunch that the policing and enforcing of trademark infringement is a condition of Marvel dropping their lawsuit. NCSoft did not win or lose that lawsuit, it was dropped, probably as part of an agreement between the two companies in the interest of not wasting any more money on a long drawn out series of litigation.

If that is indeed the situation, and the suit was dropped rather than resolved, then it can be reopened at any time

I'd rather not see that happen.

Note the use of the word hunch in the above paragraph. That is indicating that, no, I do not know any of that as fact, it is just the logical conclusion I came to with the information I have available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
I agree to abide by the rules, but I don't remember agreeing to be a policer of homage violations.

[/ QUOTE ]

Then don't. But leave those who choose to help out to it.



Virtue Server
Avatar art by Daggerpoint

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I agree to abide by the rules, but I don't remember agreeing to be a policer of homage violations.

[/ QUOTE ]

The devs specifically asked the players to help with the finding and reporting of trademark/copyright infringement.

If you choose not to, no one is forcing you to.

[/ QUOTE ]

No one is forcing you to petition people. I chose not to, for the only reason that it just doesn't bother me and I'd rather play the game.

You do what you like, and I'll do what I like.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I agree to abide by the rules, but I don't remember agreeing to be a policer of homage violations.

[/ QUOTE ]

Then don't. But leave those who choose to help out to it.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're jumping to conclusions as usual.

I weighed in with my opinion, like others, and I never said my opinion was better or the right one.

Sooooo...

[ QUOTE ]
But leave those who choose to not help out, to it.

[/ QUOTE ]

 

Posted

I don't think they were really replying to you with those comments, but more people like Not Rhino, who likened people reporting petitionable characters to blackmail and extortion.


I honestly have no problem with people who don't want to petition other people. That's fine. So you're good. The people I do have a problem with are the ones who call people tattletales and the like because the person informed a GM that they were breaking a rule.

Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson

"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
I think using petitions as a means of extracting revenge or for laughs, or against people you simply don't like, is scummy. I don't agree with those who feel they're bettering the game by reporting costumes, but as long as they're doing it without double standards, I'll respect them for it since they believe are trying to better the game and its community, whether I agree with it or not. I also especially can't stand those that try to enforce their morals upon everyone, or think that there's some moral dilemma regarding what happens in a video game.

[/ QUOTE ]Now, see, if you'd said something like that to begin with, you wouldn't have gotten flamed so badly.

But the first thing you said was "I don't petition people because I'm not a [censored]." Clearly implying that anyone who does, is.

[u]This[u] statement is a reasonable stand. Some of us feel that if no one reports the violations, it could end up hurting the game. So we do. You disagree, and you don't. That's fine.

 

Posted

I remember a certain dark defenderr player sending me a tell about reporting me for copyright violation because I made a toon named HALO.

My toon didn't have anything to do with the halo game. My toon's name was Halo, her secret ID was Angela Winger. She was an angelic-themed character. I've never even played the Halo game. I couldn't tell ya the first thing about it...other than I am pretty sure it was a FPS.

So I deleted the toon, but I've NEVER, EVER forgotten that player did that to me, nor have I forgiven them. Forever, in my book, they are jerks. That character was originally a champions character I made back in 1989, way before the Halo game came out.

I might re-make the toon some day...but, heck, it wasn't all that great a champions character to begin with.

But as a rule, I NEVER, EVER report ANYONE for potential copyright infringement. Why? Because it doesn't give me xp or insp or IOs or influence. I have better things to do in-game than inspecting other players toons. I'm not a rat, I don't rat out people.

So, if you have had a toon generiched...believe me...it was NOT me that turned you in...I'm not a rat!

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think they were really replying to you with those comments, but more people like Not Rhino, who likened people reporting petitionable characters to blackmail and extortion.


I honestly have no problem with people who don't want to petition other people. That's fine. So you're good. The people I do have a problem with are the ones who call people tattletales and the like because the person informed a GM that they were breaking a rule.

[/ QUOTE ]

A rat is a rat.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
I remember a certain dark defenderr player sending me a tell about reporting me for copyright violation because I made a toon named HALO.

My toon didn't have anything to do with the halo game. My toon's name was Halo, her secret ID was Angela Winger. She was an angelic-themed character. I've never even played the Halo game. I couldn't tell ya the first thing about it...other than I am pretty sure it was a FPS.

So I deleted the toon, but I've NEVER, EVER forgotten that player did that to me, nor have I forgiven them. Forever, in my book, they are jerks. That character was originally a champions character I made back in 1989, way before the Halo game came out.

I might re-make the toon some day...but, heck, it wasn't all that great a champions character to begin with.

But as a rule, I NEVER, EVER report ANYONE for potential copyright infringement. Why? Because it doesn't give me xp or insp or IOs or influence. I have better things to do in-game than inspecting other players toons. I'm not a rat, I don't rat out people.

So, if you have had a toon generiched...believe me...it was NOT me that turned you in...I'm not a rat!

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the kind of thing I'm talking about. This person would likely have petitioned you, and then come on here and talked about it in some thread how they found you and reported you, so they could get E-high fives and back pats from the group.

And of course I know not all of you self appointed cops are like this, but for every rule breaker, there's someone like this out there, trust me.

Learn modesty, if you desire knowledge. A highland would never be irrigated by river." (Kanz ol-Haghayegh)

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I remember a certain dark defenderr player sending me a tell about reporting me for copyright violation because I made a toon named HALO.

My toon didn't have anything to do with the halo game. My toon's name was Halo, her secret ID was Angela Winger. She was an angelic-themed character. I've never even played the Halo game. I couldn't tell ya the first thing about it...other than I am pretty sure it was a FPS.

So I deleted the toon, but I've NEVER, EVER forgotten that player did that to me, nor have I forgiven them. Forever, in my book, they are jerks. That character was originally a champions character I made back in 1989, way before the Halo game came out.

I might re-make the toon some day...but, heck, it wasn't all that great a champions character to begin with.

But as a rule, I NEVER, EVER report ANYONE for potential copyright infringement. Why? Because it doesn't give me xp or insp or IOs or influence. I have better things to do in-game than inspecting other players toons. I'm not a rat, I don't rat out people.

So, if you have had a toon generiched...believe me...it was NOT me that turned you in...I'm not a rat!

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the kind of thing I'm talking about. This person would likely have petitioned you, and then come on here and talked about it in some thread how they found you and reported you, so they could get E-high fives and back pats from the group.

And of course I know not all of you self appointed cops are like this, but for every rule breaker, there's someone like this out there, trust me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Seriously, if that person had told the story, and then said that they had reported the Reactor's character for copyright infringement, we would have laughed at them. A lot.

The Reactor's character did not need to be deleted. It was fine. It had no relation to the video game of that name. The GM would have dismissed the complaint.



There's a difference between petitioning actual copyright infringement characters, and characters with a name of something completely different.

Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson

"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
But as a rule, I NEVER, EVER report ANYONE for potential copyright infringement.

[/ QUOTE ]

Me neither. I report them for ACTUAL copyright/trademark infringement.

Your character you described would have been fine. You let some dillhole bully you into deleting a character that couldn't have been genericed in the first place.

Had I seen that character I would have said: "Heh, nice, surprised you got that name."

[ QUOTE ]
So, if you have had a toon generiched...believe me...it was NOT me that turned you in...I'm not a rat!

[/ QUOTE ]

No one accused you of being one. This isn't the mafia or a street gang where reporting something is a punishable offense.

But, your stance here implies that anyone who DOES report things is a rat/tattltale/snitch/whatever.

So, feel free to not report people. It doesn't matter to me in the slightest if you do or not. But please refrain from insulting people who do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
This person would likely have petitioned you, and then come on here and talked about it in some thread how they found you and reported you, so they could get E-high fives and back pats from the group.

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay, let's ignore that "not all of you self appointed cops are like this", and there's actually a "group" he could get high fives and back pats from. In the scenario described, the ignorant child made a claim to someone who believed him, and then nothing happened. Really, the person made a stupid claim. And if that person bothered to post this "adventure" themselves, in the real world here, they would have been mocked.

Seriously. They were stupid. Flat out wrong. Just plain dumb.

Maybe you've missed the posts where someone actually does what you described, thinking they'll get back pats for "doing good", and instead got told how silly they are. Heck, you could probably let this fiasco die down, wait a week or two, and post the same story from the "petitioners'" side, and see what people say about it.


On a side note, and unrelated to the rest of the thread, I personally think The_Reactor needs to let it go. It's not that big of a deal. Heck, I'm thinking about seeing if the name's taken on Champion server and I'll be borrowing it for a bit.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
A rat is a rat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yup, and "rats" have done great things toward helping out our community. In games like these and in the real world.



Virtue Server
Avatar art by Daggerpoint

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But as a rule, I NEVER, EVER report ANYONE for potential copyright infringement.

[/ QUOTE ]

Me neither. I report them for ACTUAL copyright/trademark infringement.

Your character you described would have been fine. You let some dillhole bully you into deleting a character that couldn't have been genericed in the first place.

Had I seen that character I would have said: "Heh, nice, surprised you got that name."

[ QUOTE ]
So, if you have had a toon generiched...believe me...it was NOT me that turned you in...I'm not a rat!

[/ QUOTE ]

No one accused you of being one. This isn't the mafia or a street gang where reporting something is a punishable offense.

But, your stance here implies that anyone who DOES report things is a rat/tattltale/snitch/whatever.

So, feel free to not report people. It doesn't matter to me in the slightest if you do or not. But please refrain from insulting people who do.

[/ QUOTE ]

A rat is a rat.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I remember a certain dark defenderr player sending me a tell about reporting me for copyright violation because I made a toon named HALO.

My toon didn't have anything to do with the halo game. My toon's name was Halo, her secret ID was Angela Winger. She was an angelic-themed character. I've never even played the Halo game. I couldn't tell ya the first thing about it...other than I am pretty sure it was a FPS.

So I deleted the toon, but I've NEVER, EVER forgotten that player did that to me, nor have I forgiven them. Forever, in my book, they are jerks. That character was originally a champions character I made back in 1989, way before the Halo game came out.

I might re-make the toon some day...but, heck, it wasn't all that great a champions character to begin with.

But as a rule, I NEVER, EVER report ANYONE for potential copyright infringement. Why? Because it doesn't give me xp or insp or IOs or influence. I have better things to do in-game than inspecting other players toons. I'm not a rat, I don't rat out people.

So, if you have had a toon generiched...believe me...it was NOT me that turned you in...I'm not a rat!

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the kind of thing I'm talking about. This person would likely have petitioned you, and then come on here and talked about it in some thread how they found you and reported you, so they could get E-high fives and back pats from the group.

And of course I know not all of you self appointed cops are like this, but for every rule breaker, there's someone like this out there, trust me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Seriously, if that person had told the story, and then said that they had reported the Reactor's character for copyright infringement, we would have laughed at them. A lot.

The Reactor's character did not need to be deleted. It was fine. It had no relation to the video game of that name. The GM would have dismissed the complaint.



There's a difference between petitioning actual copyright infringement characters, and characters with a name of something completely different.

[/ QUOTE ]

This.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
A rat is a rat.

[/ QUOTE ]

And a troll is a troll.



Virtue Server
Avatar art by Daggerpoint

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
A rat is a rat.

[/ QUOTE ]

And a troll is a troll.

[/ QUOTE ]

This!

So Galactor... if you were being a normal punk who spray paints on houses and whatever and I called the cops on you, even though you being the punk doing wrong, I call the cops on you... I'm a rat? Or you rob a bank and I see or know you and call a cop... I'm a rat? hrmmm...

EULA violations are EULA violations. Know em. You click ok thinking it's ok, even thought you don't know what it says. Someone already put it up on this thread.

Yes, I'm a police in the game also. Deal!!

"every defender needs to fight. I don't care if you have to use BRAWL!"

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I remember a certain dark defenderr player sending me a tell about reporting me for copyright violation because I made a toon named HALO.

My toon didn't have anything to do with the halo game. My toon's name was Halo, her secret ID was Angela Winger. She was an angelic-themed character. I've never even played the Halo game. I couldn't tell ya the first thing about it...other than I am pretty sure it was a FPS.

So I deleted the toon, but I've NEVER, EVER forgotten that player did that to me, nor have I forgiven them. Forever, in my book, they are jerks. That character was originally a champions character I made back in 1989, way before the Halo game came out.

I might re-make the toon some day...but, heck, it wasn't all that great a champions character to begin with.

But as a rule, I NEVER, EVER report ANYONE for potential copyright infringement. Why? Because it doesn't give me xp or insp or IOs or influence. I have better things to do in-game than inspecting other players toons. I'm not a rat, I don't rat out people.

So, if you have had a toon generiched...believe me...it was NOT me that turned you in...I'm not a rat!

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the kind of thing I'm talking about. This person would likely have petitioned you, and then come on here and talked about it in some thread how they found you and reported you, so they could get E-high fives and back pats from the group.

And of course I know not all of you self appointed cops are like this, but for every rule breaker, there's someone like this out there, trust me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Seriously, if that person had told the story, and then said that they had reported the Reactor's character for copyright infringement, we would have laughed at them. A lot.

The Reactor's character did not need to be deleted. It was fine. It had no relation to the video game of that name. The GM would have dismissed the complaint.



There's a difference between petitioning actual copyright infringement characters, and characters with a name of something completely different.

[/ QUOTE ]

This.

[/ QUOTE ]

And remember, a petition is a requestion for action, not an ordered result. If that person did make that petition, it would (should) have been reviewed by the game staff, and then no action taken (assuming the situation is represented accurately here).

Even if the character was in the wrong, you would have been just fine leaving it as it was and continuing, since the other player has no authority to make any changes. If someone on the game staff decided to take action, you would have been able to change the offenses and continue along (although, with some fairly minor actions on your part).

And, if that idiot had posted a gloat, corrections, chastizements, and ridicule would have been leveled, as deemed appropriate by the peers.


| Issue 9 Fly poses | IO's and ED
| Cycling the Combat Monitor | Load Macros from a Text File |

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
A rat is a rat.

[/ QUOTE ]

And a troll is a troll.

[/ QUOTE ]

[...] And if we don't get no tolls, then we don't eat no rolls.

Er, wait, what?

Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
www.repeat-offenders.net

Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.

 

Posted

Wow. Even I would petition that one. Come up with your own stuff. lol Shouldn't take long for the generic though.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
A rat is a rat.

[/ QUOTE ]

And a troll is a troll.

[/ QUOTE ]

[...] And if we don't get no tolls, then we don't eat no rolls.

Er, wait, what?

[/ QUOTE ]

You make that up?

 

Posted

Hellguard wrote: "Whether or not some people's forum avatars violate US copyright laws, that's beside the point. The question that's relevant to this discussion is: does it violate NCSoft's rules?"


For the simple fact that a law supercedes a rule, it is extremely relevant if something violates US copyright laws.


Hellguard wrote: "To apply the above to the game (and thus, the main topic of this thread): Those of us who report violations such as the one shown in the OP don't do it because it's against US copyright law. We do it because it's against the EULA that EVERYONE who plays the game agrees to."


I am fairly certain that a team of lawyers drafted the EULA to comply with U.S. copyright laws; therefore your statement is rendered moot.


Now please allow me to clarify my position. I am in support of full enforcement of U.S. copyright laws, these laws protect peoples ability to make money. I happen to be one of these people so perhaps I take this a bit to seriously. However my original premise still holds: Many of the people reporting copyright violations are themselves guilty of copyright violations through the use of copyrighted images in there forum avatars.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
However my original premise still holds: Many of the people reporting copyright violations are themselves guilty of copyright violations through the use of copyrighted images in there forum avatars.

[/ QUOTE ]

Before you make statements like that you better be able to back it up with proof.

Provide links or pics that prove those people have violated someone elses copyright/trademark.

I know where I got my stuff from and it's all legal.