Feedback: Attention Base Editors! (ISSUE 13)
By
Ad Astra,
Posted on: 2008-11-18 16:47 in Base Construction
Thanks for posting the questions to us Ex.
Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
The repricing will have a big impact on me personally. As our sole base architect, I will be able to expand our base into something that our members will have fun a lot of fun with. That said, it also puts a tremendous burden on me to spend my time farming/gathering necessary IO salvage or influence to buy said salvage in order to craft items. As leader of our group, I would much rather see our members spend their time using salvage to craft IOs for their characters since they will get much more use (and fun) out of them than they ever would our base. I will not be asking any member of our SG to sacrifice salvage for base needs.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
Yes. It is not that I want to, but the design I have come up with will basically require it. Were the editor a little more flexible, I would not have to. Either way, I will be dismantling the existing base.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
At least 8 to 10 hours. We have a lot of prestige to mess with after the pricing changes, so it will take some time to decorate all the new rooms.
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
On the positive side, I am very happy to see these changes. This is something that was discussed at length during CoV BETA and I specifically remember the developers saying they knew pricing was too high. They wanted to err on the high side and come down rather than starting too low and having to raise costs. It is unfortunate it took this long to see that, but it is where it is so hopefully the pricing will lead to more people having fun with bases.
On a negative note, having seen many of the elaborately designed bases around the game, I can see the amount of work that went into them. Asking people to destroy their base in order to get any price benefits was not a good idea.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
In the short term, it is going to cost me quite a bit of influence in order to gather all the salvage we will need from the marketplace. Again, I will not be asking any of our members to sacrifice influence or IO salvage for the base when it is much better spent on their characters.
I can't say what the impact will be long term. It is my hope that IOPs will return (bug free) and that we can get into doing some base raiding. Other than that, I know our members who are into the RP side of things will very much enjoy the new space.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
This is a negative in several ways. First, it is putting a lot of the weight of funding the base in terms of buying necessary salvage on my shoulders as the sole base architect. Yes, this is my choice, but you should also be thinking that players spend more time with their characters than they do bases. Prior to the change, base salvage had no real value to members who were happy to donate it. Now, you are asking them to choose between personal IOs or base construction. I don't believe that is fair to ask of anyone.
IMO the removal of base salvage was totally un-necessary. If the "salvage found" message was confusing (which I highly doubt), then change the message to be less confusing. Removing base salvage to fix it just creates new problems. As a player, I will want to keep IO salvage for my characters, especially with Dual Builds in i13, instead of sacrificing it for base construction.
Second, the required salvage for some of the recipes makes no sense. A teleport pad is a basic base item. One of the recipes should not require rare salvage items. To be honest, that is very silly.
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
To be quite honest, I can not think of anything at this time.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
Not long at all. I'm already familiar with crafting.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
Other than making it much more expensive and more tedious, nothing.
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
With dual builds, new powersets and new IO sets coming in i13 (and future issues), I really can't see anyone wanting to store valuable IO salvage in the base racks for anyone to take. I will bet money that most people who have more open permissions on storage will lock it down now come i13. Our group is most certainly going to have our salvage locked down.
Additional Notes:
1. The 30 salvage limit on the racks is too low. We are a small group and between any IO salvage people are willing to part with, event salvage etc. this will be filled quickly.
2. In the future, please take the time to review the many stickied posts in the bases forum. You are all smart enough to pick out those things which are good and will make bases much more fun and exciting. It also does not give the community that warm fuzzy feeling when people put the time and effort into collating lists for improvements and ideas only to have them ignored.
3. I have no doubt that more items will be added and a better editor built down the road, but please consider that the existing system is very limited currently. Adding in a few dozen new items will go a long way.
4. Please, please keep in mind that while your goal is to get more players into base PvP, there is still a good portion of your playerbase that has no desire to ever engage in PvP. Again, you are all smart enough and talented enough to find a happy medium someplace.
Thanks again for posting the survey Ex. If you need any clarification or further info, please do not hesitate to ask.
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
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1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
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Noticeably. It opens up several nice avenues for my small-to-medium SGs. However, it has a much smaller impact than other changes, such as the revised pathing/stacking restrictions.
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2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
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Yes, but only coincidentally. I'm rebuilding for the sake of rebuilding because of the new options open, not because of cheaper prices.
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3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
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Highly varied. My smallest base, I'm probably going to put in ~5 hours of work-time. The largest, unknown. That one's a team effort, but we're likely to log easily over 100 hours of collective time on it.
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4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
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Positive: The plot reductions are the biggest change. Additionally, the drop for defense-capable rooms (particularly the pure Defense rooms) opens up a lot of possibilities. The ability to use a 1x1 to create an extended hall alone opens up excellent possibilities.
Negative: The jump from Oversight to a more full base is still rather daunting. The price for the Basic Generator remains a very significant chunk of change. The change of the larger decorative rooms from a flat price to a scaling one is a bit uncomfortable, particularly the extreme changes in the largest.
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5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
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Short term: Extra expansion room for decorating.
Long term: It opens up the ability for my smallest SG to hop right into a nearly maximum functioning PvE base. So long term, there's not much need for ANY SG I'm in to gather prestige.
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1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
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Others have said it much better than I. Primarily that it shifts base-related crafting from a painless group activity to a competition between group and self. Previously SG members could contribute freely without harming themselves. Now they have to lose (and sometimes lose significantly), making them more reluctant and placing the weight instead on the base builder's shoulders.
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2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
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None.
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3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
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Already adjusted. It's not a hard change, just somewhat senseless.
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4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
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Salvage storage is now worthless. It's too small to be of any real use. It also means crafting base items is more expensive and that weight is no longer spread among the SG members. It's now a PITA.
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5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
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High. The security controls for base storage is underwhelming and always has been. We've been asking for updates and improvements to it since it came out. We have many threads discussing it already, you should try reading some of them.
Base Repricing
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1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
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It will allow us to buy larger rooms so that some things like storage bins aren't so cramped. We can decorate more. But since we already have all the PvE needs covered, it won't change anything but the visual look of the base. There is no additional functionality that we can gain from the change.
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2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
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Partially. Many rooms will be replaced by larger counterparts, but without destroying any crafted items.
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3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
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I intend to start in the early morning and tell my SG mates to stay out of the base for the rest of the day.
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4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
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The positive - Well, cheaper is always nice.
The negative - Having items crafted under the old system placed at the old cost is very irritating. To be honest, I intend to take the hit and place the Ley Tap I already have crafted rather than chase after the invention salvage to craft a new one.
And the whole 'tear your base apart to get it' issue? Very disappointing.
There is also the irritation that we will have all this nice shiny new prestige and nothing to buy. We have no interest in raiding, so we already have everything we need.
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5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
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Not much either way. As I said, we already have the necessities. This will give us the prestige to place some defense items we were planning on using for decoration, but beyond that, it doesn't accomplish much.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
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1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
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Mine personally? None right away, because I precrafted everything I thought we could possibly need that did not change much in placement cost. If I were starting a new SG or did not follow the boards, I would be howling at the difficulties that scrounging invention salvage is going to create.
But in the future if we decide we want something I didn't think of? I know perfectly well who is going to take it in the shorts to get the invention salvage.
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2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
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None. I'm not being a smart aleck, I simply cannot see an upside to using invention salvage rather than base salvage.
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3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
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Um, what's to learn? Have X items in your possession, hit button. The same as every other crafting mechanic in this game.
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4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
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Some of my SG mates do not do any crafting. One won't even use WW. We give him all our SOs and DOs for him to sell. They will not be happy that they actually have to do something with whatever base salvage they have besides dump it in the bin. I predict I will be explaining things over and over.
The biggest side effect, however, is the loss of a place to keep things like Halloween salvage. Under the old system, one bin was more than enough to hold all the holiday items, base salvage and components. Now we will have a pittance. While I'm thrilled to have invention storage at long last, thirty items is laughably small.
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5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
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None. My SG is a small group of personal friends. To put it bluntly, I know where they live. But for the large SGs the devs seem to want to encourage for raiding, the problems will be massive. Better, more refined security permissions are something we *have* actually been asking for.
Additional Notes:
For our SG, this has put the storage issue front and center. Maybe losing salvage capacity wouldn't sting so much if we could just buy more bins to ease things. But we can't, because we're already at the eighteen bins per base cap. Now more than ever we are discussing splitting off into personal bases coalitioned with the main one so that we can increase our storage.
I have to give this to the devs, straight from the shoulder. Most of us see bases as a place to keep our stuff. My SG didn't bother to start a base until the storage bins were introduced. Raiding will never happen in my base. Storage, however, is needed each and every day.
"Home is where, when you have to go there, they have to let you in."
I am responsible for four bases. One is for POWER, a SG with a fully functional PVE base and a reasonable cushion of Prestige. The others are three very small bases, most running off of Combo units, used by rarely played characters (mostly just mine these days, but there are some characters by others that show up from time to time). So I'll answer based on POWER, and based on the small groups.
POWER -
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
No significant impact, not much more to do for the POWER base.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
I'll definitely rebuy the lot to recover prestige there, and may rebuild a few rooms. But I won't be rebuilding any crafted items, nor most of the rooms.
3) How long would this process take you?
I'm guessing I'll spend half an hour to an hour on it. If I was to do a complete recrafting, my guess would be two or three hours, not including the time involved in the salvage.
4) Positive and negative concerns regarding the repricing.
For the most part, all positive. If POWER wants to get into base raiding at some point in the future, this makes it a lot easier to get into. The only negative is the major price increases of so many decorative rooms...if we want to take advantage of the extra space for fun rooms, the decorative uses get worse.
5. Short term, no big change. Long term, no big change unless there are new PVE opportunities coming with bases to use that prestige.
My small SGs
1) How will the repricing affect you?
It's not really affecting the areas I build those bases in, so little money saved from it. And the change to rent is going to add an annoyance factor. Many of those SGs only have someone log in every few months, so their bases will shut down because of the rent issue.
2) Will you dismantle your base? no reason, no money in this range
3) How long? Not including crafting, maybe an hour, tops
4) Positive for the small groups? If they ever become active again, easier to move up...but doesn't do that much for the big step from combo unit to separate control and energy rooms. Negative? Rent
5) How will this feature affect you? Bases will become shut down, requiring a trip to atlas or port oakes to open it up.
Base Salvage (this applies to all bases, but mostly POWER)
1) Negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
Well, first I'm going to have to spend about three hours or so converting all the base storage to brainstorms, so that I don't have to lock down the storage bins. Then, I'm going to have a lot of brainstorms, and not really sure what to do. I have to make sure that I never delete that character (because there's no way to put the brainstorms back in storage). And should I decide to build something, I'll have a lot of brainstorms and no guarantee that I can get the parts necessary (in a test to create a single teleporter, I converted enough brainstorms into salvage to fill my 80 salvage storage twice over), and the fastest solution is to just hit wentworths and pay whatever the market calls for. In short, it turns base crafting from a straightforward endeavour, to a complex mess. Fortunately, POWER's base is pretty much done, and I've pre-crafted a number of teleporters.
Oh, we also will be selling a number of sets of halloween salvage and candycanes we had in storage, which fit quite nicely with the limits of 2500, but with the limit at 30...no such luck.
2) Positive effect on our base? None.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system? Learn? None at all. Doing the conversions? many exceptionally boring hours. Cursing the devs when I find myself having to go to the market for something I have to build? Unlimited
4) What side effects to this system do you see from transitioning? The biggest is the security issue, but you ask about that second. The next biggest is that the burden of base crafting, by and large, moves from the group to the base architect...it's very easy to tell everyone "dump off your base salvage", and there's no reason either for people to hold their salvage or take it. Invention salvage, everyone wants for their own enhancements, and having them in stacks means people might take them. So instead, the base architects will be having to put their own influence on the line.
And one more thing...on Virtue, I've given a lot of Tech Powers to small starting SGs that don't have the salvage yet to make teleporters. A nice, easy way to help people. With this change, that's over. Every SG will sink or swim on its own.
Security issues: Inspiration storage is only useful if most the base can get it. Doing an eden trial, grab some ambrosia, put what you can back. Hami raid? EoEs are in the third storage. On a SG and had a team wipe? Rez in the base, and pick up some awakens. The problem is the settings for inspiration storage also apply to the salvage bins. Which is normally a good thing for halloween salvage and candy canes...but not invention salvage, much too tempting.
My arcs are constantly shifting, just search for GadgetDon for the latest.
The world beware! I've started a blog
GadgetMania Under Attack: The Digg Lockout
[u]1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?[u]
I'll be taking apart anywhere from 4-8 bases.
[u]2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?[u]
Yes, most of them will stripped down to teleporter bays and workshops to save crafted base items & ios then completely rebuilt
[u]3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?[u]
On the smaller bases 5-6 hours, the larger 25-30 depending on how picky I get.
[u]4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?[u]
More base for less prestige.
[u]5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?[u]
My bases will get larger but i'm not sure if they will have significantly higher functionality.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
[u]1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?[u]
I frequently use empowerments, so depending on on-hand and market availability of salvage I may have to cut back. Bases will carry a higher inf cost to upgrade, base salvage was always available for low cost, invention salvage has not been.
[u]2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?[u]
Less clutter in the storage racks
[u]3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?[u]
I don't have a base on test so I don't know how similar the systems are, I know the old one well enough.
[u]4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?[u]
Inf cost for upgrading bases.
[u]5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?[u]
None. Currently all sg's that I run, I know all of the people in and all have open storage access. Its never been a problem, as I have no plans to AP broadcast recruit or random recruit new member it should continue to be that way.
Additional Notes:
"Nice costume looks just like mine, hey maybe when Issue 9 comes out you can invent yourself some style." - Me
[u]Base Repricing[u]
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
Personally I am overjoyed. It means I don't have to spend a year consistently keeping an active SG. Now my dsut-covered dump has become my own amusement park!
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
Absolutely! I downgraded to the 8x12 plot and removed EVERY room save for a storage room and the largest Decorative room (because it's 150k now and will be 430k odd when i13 hits).
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
It took me less than 20 minutes to delete all my rooms and over 1000 decorative items.
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
I understand the conceptual reason behind making each decorative room cost more, but it hinders the idea that they are intended to be used for decorations. They waste plot space as it is by being pointless and are just further discouraged by being almost equally pricy compared to storage rooms. On a positive note I love the unrestricted item boundaries so that I can place things on top of each other (Arcane floor patterns and then arches and stones, love it). IMO even without repricing I would have loved the base changes.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Short term it means I can get a small base functioning fairly quickly without needing to commit the next few weeks recruiting for shear Prestige. Now I can relax with a few friends in a gigantic fortress sooner rather than years from now.
[u]Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage[u]
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
The strain on tier 3 base salvage had not yet hit me due to only needing tier 2 and 1 but I suppose the change negatively affected me in the low end because now I need to spend sometimes millions just for a simple base item that would've costed me practically nothing.
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
The only positive effect is that I can now store invention salvage so I can share them with my members more readily who may need a certain item. Usually I just NPC all the common junk.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
Hopefully well. I've already written a list of what's currently the cheapest set of salvage for each item, and I pray that the demand for the salvage will be countered somehow (increased drop rates/ANYTHING to the spill).
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
An overflow on the market as people surge to covert their old salvage and get new ones to rebuild (since probably 99% of bases will need to remake some item(s)).
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
Base salvage was practically useless to steal but now that storage is converted into invention salvage it means people with permissions may steal it for themselves because suddenly it's useful to them or they know how much the item sells for.
Additional Notes:
Overall I do not mind the changes, but I know some people will struggle to make basic items like Teleporters for their new bases if they are just starting out in the game. It's a great effort on behalf of the team looking into bases and I applaud them for it, but I do not believe there is such a thing as the perfect 10 the first time. I do hope there will be slight changes in the future to accommodate for as many people as possible.
Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
I see it as a very good decision over all. The lower prices will make larger, more viable bases available to many of my tiny SGs made up of either a single character, or small group of friends.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
Yes, I will, but then I enjoy base building and often spend hours rebuilding bases anyway.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
Hours probably, to take advantage of the repricing without getting bitten by the new salvage reqs will take some tricky arrangements of rooms and plots sizes. Plus I have a lot of little SGs.
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
I don't really have any concerns as far as prices go. Though the new upkeep system is going to take some getting used to.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Short term, many hours spent in the editors. Long term, having to remember to pay upkeep again, but at least it is a small amount. Worth it though for the better access to larger plot sizes.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
I'm not entirely sure yet, but I am worried. It could be minor, it could lead to all sorts of new griefing. The most immediate effect will be the inability to craft as much with the salvage we already have after converting to brainstorms and the inability to store as much non-crafting salvage in the Base storage (Halloween stuff).
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
I suppose it'll be less to keep track of... and being able to share salvage among my own characters in a SG, that's very handy
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
Probably not too long.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
I hope the market doesn't go too nuts over this.
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
Well, with base storage holding things that are more valuable to people than base salvage was, SG leaders will need to limit the availability of storage from new members and since we can't limit access to specific storage items or even types no storage means none at all for new members... and even with a "trial member" period people can still steal things as soon as they get promoted, or if they have a falling out with the leadership... etc.
Personally, these issues won't affect me much as most of my SGs are tiny and made up completely of friends, we don't invite strangers, but in the few SGs I am in that are "Big" SGs it could be trouble eventually, for their leaders.
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Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
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I'm going to lump rent in with base repricing, since it's the ongoing, if not upfront, cost of having a base.
Running a tiny SG base, the lowered costs are great. I'm never going to manage the biggest base sizes, but have a good chance of making a reasonably sized interesting base. I'm happy with the lowered costs overall.
Rent bothers me some, though. While I'm glad to be able to move from an 8x8 to something bigger, I also find that given the income my SG gains, and the use we get from storage items, that storage is no longer going to be a permanent fixture in my base. It'll be used for transferring items from character to character, and then deleted from the base again. I'd love to have permanent storage, but the cost of having to run to the registrar every few weeks (plus the cost of prestige) makes it not worthwhile any longer.
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2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
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Yes
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3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
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Just a few hours. I'm lucky, and didn't start really looking into building bases until rumors of major improvements in I13 were out already, so I've held off on any decorating. Just storage to be cleaned out and rooms to be demolished.
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4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
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Bigger and more interesting bases are good, although I'm minorly concerned about load times. The biggest concerns I have are rent (mentioned above) and there still being some large prestige humps to get over for the small SGs.
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5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
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It'll make bases more interesting to play with, but penalizing storage will lose some important base utility.
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Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
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After playing with it, it seems to be minor effect on my small base for building. I supply everything already, so that's not a concern. The biggest problem is that empowerment stations are now much harder to use, and don't seem to supply buffs worth the cost of collecting and keeping all the appropriate kinds of salvage.
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2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
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None that I really see. Neutral-ish on building things, negative on buffs, no real other changes that I see, unless this change also increases salvage drops.
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3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
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Not long, but it means no more empowerment usage.
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4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
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It's harder to keep the components needed for things. Previously, just a handful of different components needed to be stored. And those could be done in large quantities, independent of what was going to be built. Now things have to be thought out further ahead, saving specific pieces of salvage for specific items.
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5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
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I have none in my SG, but I can see major concerns in larger groups.
Creator of Arcs:
- Discovering Doctor Dabble
- Adventure of the Ghost Generator
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Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
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Currently, it wont really affect me that much, the two main SG Bases that im responsible for are relatively 'finished', in that we have everything we need to cover our interests. For these groups, that means mainly a place to craft and store IOs, and an additional TP hub.
With the reduced prices, I may install some other items, but its not like a really need a super-duper computer that gives me 10x my current control or whatever.
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2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
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I probably will not, being as I mentioned above, my two main bases are relatively complete at the moment, and those groups arent really short on Prestige. I have some smaller "solo SGs" that would love to take advantage of the "lower prices", but they dont really seem to apply to starting items.
The "basic" cost of a "starting SG base" hasnt changed at all, it still costs 360,000 Prestige for what I'd consider a "Bare Bones Crafting Base" with the following: Invention Worktable, Enhancement Storage, Personal Storage Access, Base Salvage Rack, a place to put them, and a Combo Power/Control unit in the OC.
The cost to 'Upgrade' from the Combo unit to standalone ones is 600K on Live, down to 425K with the new pricing. While thats not an insignifigant change, it does still mean that most of my smaller SGs will still need around a year to save up for the upgrade, let alone having the prestige to actually use the room that change frees up.
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3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
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It took me about a day or so to build my current bases- they are small 3x3 grids of the 2x2 rooms on the smallest plot.
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4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
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See feedback above about repricing not really helping small/new SGs
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5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
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Short Term, it probably wont affect me much on my main servers. on alternate servers it may allow me to get functional bases marginally sooner. Long term, I suppose it will allow me to upgrade my exisiting bases somewhat sooner, if I ever decide they need upgrading.
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Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
[/ QUOTE ]
In general not much, although the ridiculous reduction in the capacity of Storage racks will become an issue. While I dont forsee needing to use them to store Invention Salvage much, many of my bases already have storage racks with around 100 pieces of Halloween/Xmas salvage, and not being able to add to those racks will be quite irritating.
Plus, many pieces of Invention Salvage are already at a premium, and forcing Players to choose between donating pieces that they may need for themselves to the SG is undesirable. Instead of the current system where most base salvage is low-priority, as it really only has two uses.
If the system had been properly constructed to use low-priority invention salvage, instead of once again reinforcing demand for high-priority units (Luck Charms,Alchemical Silver, etc- Dont act like you dont know what I mean) I could support it more wholeheartedly.
[ QUOTE ]
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
[/ QUOTE ]
Some small ability to trade Invention Salvage between members. Although the 'unsecurness' of the racks will be an issue in larger SGs, almost all of mine are samll groups of people I know IRL, so its not a problem for me. Just because its not a problem for me doesnt mean a better solution isnt needed.
[ QUOTE ]
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
[/ QUOTE ]
Doesnt seem that complicated, I believe I have it all worked out at this time.
[ QUOTE ]
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
[/ QUOTE ]
Price fluctuations in the Market having a signifigant effect on the ability to outfit a base would be my main concern.
But I really have go go with the "Why are you 'fixing' this, it's not broke?" crowd. There are MANY other base changes that have been clamored for, vs this one pretty much coming out of nowhere.
[ QUOTE ]
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
[/ QUOTE ]
Although the 'unsecurness' of the racks will be an issue in larger SGs, almost all of mine are samll groups of people I know IRL, so its not a problem for me.
Just because its not a problem for me doesnt mean a better solution isnt needed.
[ QUOTE ]
Additional Notes:
[/ QUOTE ]
Although I realize that my new rent will be a palty amount, it is still a signifigant change from my current amount of Free. It truly rubs me the wrong way that I will now have to pay attention and rent after I spent a great deal of time and effort setting up a base that conformed to the old criteria for free rent.
[ QUOTE ]
[*]There is a lack of understanding of the vision to remove base salvage. No one in their right mind has been confused by it, yet this is what we are told. At the same time you remove "Salvage Found" messages, you introduce a new type of "Merits" into the game. Won't that be as confusing? 'What do you mean I can't use Vanguard merits. it says merit!'
Many of us find this reasoning hard to believe and there has been little to no consideration or conversation regarding it.
[*]There have already been numerous threads regarding the lack of storage. There has been quantitative rather than qualitative and subjective data presented. 30 is just insufficient to hold invention, halloween and winter event salvage and any other salvage invented in the near future that can be shared. Suggestions have been made for and against, with some reasonable (and yes unreasonable) numbers. Again no reply or indication that the subject is even open for discussion.
[*]The building community at large, though not in entirety, does feel slighted by the change not matching anything we've asked for save the modified pricing. No base items that already exist, no new tiles, items anything. Granted what Pohsyb has done with the raid pathing has beneficial aspects and will allow for more illusions of things that exist, some things do exist and we've been waiting.
[*] No official notes listed ever on the new rent. asked about again and again with no reply. Please clarify.
[/ QUOTE ]
What she said.
Additional Notes:
Although I realize that my new rent will be a palty amount, it is still a signifigant change from my current amount of Free. It truly rubs me the wrong way that I will now have to pay attention and rent after I spent a great deal of time and effort setting up a base that conformed to the old criteria for free rent.
'Quote' is a funny word. copy/paste it enough times and it starts to look more and more like gibberish...
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
We may outfit our secondary bases differently.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
Not a chance.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
Rebuilding our main base? Probably 20 hrs or more. No net cost on the secondary bases, as we'd held off on modifications waiting for the I13 changes (which are rather disappointing - pretty much nothing off of our wish list was implemented).
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
Positive: It gives us more options for our secondary bases. Negative: None really, but it is disappointing that we won't get any prestige back from our main base unless we are willing to spend many hours rebuilding a very finely detailed base.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Very little short term effect. Long term, if PvP ever gets to the point were we get new SG members who want base raids (pretty much all the ones we had have quit) then we will outfit one of the bases specifically for that. And the repricing makes that a more viable option.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
An increase in the cost to use empowerment stations and a short term problem with storage as we have to spend hours to convert salvage.
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
Simplifies salvage transfers between alts. Though as the storage is apt to be overflowing, perhaps none at all.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
Very little. It depends on what happens with the pathing. If we make one of the secondary bases over for PvP that could take some time.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
A drop in the cost of rare arcane salvage. We may eventually remove salvage racks and replace them with enhancement storage since the small capacity of salvage racks make them a less efficient use of limited base storage resources.
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
Little. We restrict storage access to trusted individuals.
[Note: Thanks to Venture for providing a nicely formatted form to respond with.]
Kosmos
Global: @Calorie
MA Arcs in 4-star purgatory: Four in a Row (#2198) - Hostile Takeover (#69714) - Red Harvest (#268305)
Hmm... Let´s see how i will deal with it...
-
Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
I am really loving it. As I am a base-designing fan, this item alone makes the i13 wondrous. (not that i didnt liked the other things)
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
I will dismantle my base almost 90%... Will keep only a few crafts that had an emotional history to me...
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
Hmm... some 2 to 3 hours... I love working on the little details...
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
Finally it was done. The prices were really high... they had to be changed for greater good...
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Short term: Lots of work to redo the bases... but i will love it!
Long term: I am already loving it...
--
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
The use of really expensive salvages are bad idea. What should have been done was finding the least used salvages AND given then some utility...
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
Besides the pricing discounts on the new crafting, none.
I really do thing that salvages wouldnt need to be involved on base crafting... Influence/Infamy is enough.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
Already did. Tested it a lot on open beta.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
Market distortion as expensive salvages will disappear/became too expensive. What was already expensive will became impossible to get for the average casual player, and i include myself into it (despites having a few 50´s, the most i got on inf on my toons is 20m...).
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
There really should be new security means to protect the salvages. Right now i use the terrible *can deposit, cant get back* setting. I would like to set some *communal* storages...
Additional Notes:
Overall, its a woundrous system. Just stop with the salvage thing...
** Guardian�s Crazy Catgirl **
************* 22 XxX 10 *************
Yes. I can get lost on a straight-line map.
Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
<ul type="square">[*]I'll be able to grab a bit more prestige in the SG I run, simple as that. Though the base is effectively finished, I've considered expanding outwards from our 8x8 plot, but that revolves entirely around the rent system, rather than plot prices or the like.[/list]
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
<ul type="square">[*]Yes. 1 control room, 1 power room, and many of the items therein will be swapped out when I get the chance to do so. Free prestige is free prestige.[/list]
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
<ul type="square">[*]About an hour, give or take. Possibly even longer. I'll have to carefully document how the room is laid out (especially in regards to wall patterns and lighting) first, which will make things a bit more annoying. Thankfully my power and control rooms aren't TOO complex, though.[/list]
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
<ul type="square">[*]+ Bases can grow a bit faster.
- Without a prestige refund script, it's a hassle for existing SGs.
- Rent is now cheaper overall, but all SGs will likely have to deal with it at some point. Rent is not fun regardless of how cheap it is. I myself will only have to pay 200, but that's 200 prestige in addition to the annoyance of having to go pay it at the Registrar, versus not having to do anything at all in I12 with my zero-cost 8x8 plot. I don't appreciate having the rug pulled out from under me in this regard.[/list]
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
<ul type="square">[*]Short term, we'll be getting back in upwards of 300,000 prestige, which honestly won't matter much. Long term, we might finally upgrade, but again, depends on rent.
I have a second, up-and-coming SG which will benefit much more in the long term from the repricing.[/list]
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
<ul type="square">[*]None that I can immediately say. I haven't done much base-related crafting outside of building teleporters. There MAY be an issue in the future with the low amount of storage in the new racks, as it will force me to find room for multiples an will also bump my rent up further.[/list]
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
<ul type="square">[*]None that I can immediately say.[/list]
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
<ul type="square">[*]Not very long, as there's not really much to learn.[/list]
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
<ul type="square">[*]I see a lot of potential problems with "old" storage racks versus "new" storage racks. It also raises the basic cost of base crafting.[/list]
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
<ul type="square">[*]Group invention salvage storage means a greater motivation for thieves. Prior to this, nobody would bother stealing SG salvage, but now much like the enhancement bins these are a target. I myself have a fairly easy way of preventing theft, but the risk still exists on some level (like say, a previously trusted member making off into the night with the salvage after a disagreement).[/list]
Additional Notes:
<ul type="square">[*]Please take further looks at rent (with aims of removing it entirely, or at least allowing a group to auto-pay it), and more importantly, please provide the players at large with a design document of some kind outlining ALL of the base changes in detail. For instance, in closed beta we had to figure out how the new rent system worked, rather than being told in the patch notes that there was even a change in the first place. While we now have Plasmastream's guide to the changes, non-forumgoers will likely be VERY confused, especially on the rent changes.[/list]
Never surrender! Never give up!
Help keep Paragon City alive with the unofficial City of Heroes Tabletop Role Playing Game!
Base Repricing
[ QUOTE ]
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
[/ QUOTE ]
In more or less positive way. The repricing will allow me a greater range of items, and the chance to upgrade my very smal SG base plot. But the change in the rent system will make start to pay some rent. Stoppable? Not at all very easily manageable for us.
[ QUOTE ]
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
[/ QUOTE ]
Probably yes. It will be needed.
[ QUOTE ]
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
[/ QUOTE ]
A couple of nights. But that ain't really an issue. I mean, the editor needs some SERIOUS work, and I hope some comes with I14, because it is too cluttered and hard to use. But since selling to get the prestige back is an option and not mandatory, I see no problem with it.
[ QUOTE ]
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
[/ QUOTE ]
A small concern that the change to rent on the basic plot will affect some small SGs. IF possible, a nice thing would be to keep the basic plot rent-free until a certain limit (let's say 3 storage bins), after that you start to pay normal rent.
[ QUOTE ]
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
[/ QUOTE ]
Only in good ways. Basically better bases.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
[ QUOTE ]
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
[/ QUOTE ]
As a small SG, juggling the balance between saving the salvage for items, or using on the base will need to be factored in. Not a big problem I think, and a good change to have to have to choose.
[ QUOTE ]
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
[/ QUOTE ]
None big positive effect. The repricing will have much more impact.
[ QUOTE ]
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
[/ QUOTE ]
0. I think the new system is far easier than the older one. And easier to learn for the new player that already knows about IOs and inventions, but hadn't a contact with the base system. The old system was too cumbersome with too many recipes for each component.
[ QUOTE ]
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
[/ QUOTE ]
There is a worry with the invention salvage price on the market. Although we saw a drop on prices due to the surge of Halloween acquired salvage, the new demand will probably see it go up again.
This concern is more exacerbated due to the salvage requirement on some items, which are quite expensive. As others pointed on the base builder forum, rare salvage for Tier 1 items are too much.
[ QUOTE ]
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
[/ QUOTE ]
In small close-tied SG there won't be any. On big SGs though, salvage bins will be a big of a problem now. And security measures to avoid theft will need to be more throughly enacted.
[ QUOTE ]
Additional Notes:
[/ QUOTE ]
I understand why the salvage space was changed as it is, so people wouldn't gouge price in markets by buying every single one of a given salvage type, and hoarding it to sell at abuse prices later (as it is done right now, but on a MUCH bigger scale).
Specially on rare salvages this can pose a very problematic issue. With that in mind, what I would suggest (and other suggested some similar things).
<ul type="square">[*]Create 4 different Salvage Racks [*]First one will only take Common Salvage, and can hold up to 75 items.[*]Second one can take only Uncommon Salvage and can hold up to 50 items[*]Third one can take only Rare Salvage and can hold up to 25 items (or maybe even 20)[*]Last one can take 1000 as it is live. And only can be fueled with Special and Event salvage [*]You can't have more than 2 of each type on your base, maybe except the last one.[*]Change the costs based on the type. Maybe 5k, 7.5k and 10k.[*]More important, allow us to set the permission on the item and not on the storage type as a total.[/list]
About the limit on storage amount. For all purposes I see that would be more than enough for a huge SG to keep all the salvage they needed, without making too easy to the market gougers to pile on everything they find. Maybe even put less space on the common rack.
Another thing is revisit all the recipes. Making a new formula close to what we have for IO (example, tier 1 items cost 3 commons and 1 uncommon. tier 2 - 2 commons, 2 uncommons and 1 rare. tier 3 - 2 of each). That would spread the use of salvage and not been such a huge barrier on the entrance level.
Another thing, our friend, the Dataminer could get into scene, to check what time of salvages are less used for IOs and focus on THOSE for the base system (with nice overlaps on big items). That should alleviate any possible impact.
Overall I really like this change, because it should flex more the use of the markets and make people have to make some big choices. But I know I'm on the minority here.
"When you gotta do something wrong, you gotta do it right." - Fighter, 8-bit theatre.
Base Re-pricing
1) How will the re-pricing of bases affect you personally?
Lost man hours and angry SG members (who will need to use base features while the base is "remodeled").
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the re-pricing?
If there are no other options for getting the difference in price then what choice would I have. Why should I keep a base built on old pricing where another SG could build the exact base for less prestige? This will affect how my SG recruits as now we have to compete with smaller SGs that will offer the same basics (TP to each zone, med bay, work benches, empowerment stations, etc). While this is good for the starter SGs, it will not be good for those that are more established.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
To get the base back to current, I would estimate 1 - 2 weeks. This estimate includes gathering invention salvage for making the equipment in the base.
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding re-pricing?
Positives: Gives new SGs a break on getting the essentials much like the combo unit and control/power room (name escapes me) did before.
Cons: Established SGs must dismantle their base to get the price difference. Might be harder to recruit as smaller SGs will have the basics without having too much time invested as the established SGs.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Short term: Chaos as we scrap the base and build again.
Long term: We can use the savings to keep paying rent or add more items to the base.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
Since all of the items that are crafted with base salvage will have to be removed when we redo the base, we will need invention salvage readily available to make the basics. Also, now SG members will have to choose to donate their invention salvage, sell it, or use it. When it was just base salvage, it was always given to the SG.
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
I can't think of any positives on this.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
I would say 1 week as a base builder but I can't predict how long it will take the player base to understand that they need to "donate" their salvage to the SG.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
As mentioned before, SG members will have to choose to donate their invention salvage, sell it, or use it. When it was just base salvage, it was always given to the SG.
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
Again, SG members will have to choose to donate their invention salvage, sell it, or use it. When it was just base salvage, it was always given to the SG.
Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
Quite a bit. My personal SG base has 20 million prestige, and with the repricing I will be able to expand considerably.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
No. I will only "upgrade" the plot to the same size (reclaiming the prestige spent in the plot) and upgrade items in rooms. Main reason why I won't be dismantling rooms is that I would lose the double doorways those rooms have; the current Test build has completely disabled the ability to place double doorways in a SG base.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
Several days, maybe a couple of weeks if I wanted the base to look just perfect.
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
Positive: bases will be able to expand a lot. Rent will be negligible. Negative: well... there's no new items to expand WITH. Now more than ever it's time to add some stuff to the editor. Item intersection helps a bit, but there's only so much it can do.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Long term, I will be able to expand my base a lot more quickly and much more than I expected to. Short term, not much. It's not the base feature that will affect me most; the removal of pathing rules is the main feature for bases this issue.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
Salvage storage racks hold way too little. Just 30 pieces per rack is too low. Allowing base salvage to be turned into invention salvage has resulted in way too many people draining the market from base salvage in order to convert it to rare invention salvage when Issue 13 goes live. The conversion is also a very lengthy and boring process, especially when you have thousands of pieces in storage.
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
Major ease of crafting. The old crafting system required hundreds of pieces refined into dozens of components for just an item; under the new system I just need four pieces to craft anything.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
I already did, it's not that different from what we currently have.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
Social: taking all the base salvage that the group contributed and converting it to invention salvage that can be sold to make a big profit for the individual in charge of base editing will create a lot of tension between supergroups where the base designer is seen as a greedy <bleep!>.
Salvage storage is too low, we won't be able to store Candy Canes or Halloween salvage as we used to.
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
This is also a social problem; I trust every single person in my supergroup and I have bins full of IOs that I know nobody will touch. Supergroups that have an "open door" policy regarding storage will find themselves raided, but they knew it could happen, it shouldn't come as a surprise. Once i13 goes live, the ability to place base storage within walls provides added security, as only someone with edit permissions will be able to access those particular bins.
Additional Notes:
Please schedule time to re-enable the double doorway functionality as soon as possible. It's a feature that we currently have on Live and we're losing in i13.
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Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
I have a solo SG with a base on a 8x8 plot. I use it mainly for zone to zone movement via teleporters and to store inspirations. With the new rules for rent, I expect having to pay roughly 2000 prestige for upkeep (2 empowerment stations, 8 inspiration bins, 2 enhancement bins, 2 salvage bins plus additional salvage bins I'll add because of the new very limited holding space). Sure, it won't take long to earn those 2000 prestige. It's not a burden, but it is a nuisance.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
For two reasons this is not likely. Some parts of my base needed a LOT of time to get ready. And without a tool in the base editor that makes vertical item movement easy, it would take lots of time to rebuild that (try to build and decorate a 2nd level inside a 2x2 room and you know what I mean). The other reason (with much lesser impact, though) is, that crafted items will have indirect influence costs (because of the salvage requirements). And that means I might have to choose between buying a new item for my base or a new IO for one of my toons.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
I believe I would need 80-100 hours if I have to rebuild everything from scratch (you need time if you want to float lots of items).
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
All in all repricing is very positive. The smaller SGs are now able to afford larger bases and build them faster.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Short term: I'll have to pay upkeep for the first time soon.
Long term: Eventually I will build a larger base and add more decorative items.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
There will be a competition between base items and IOs, because both need invention salvage to be created.
Crafting base items will take more time, because you need to plan ahead and get the right salvage.
Deleting crafted items is no longer trivial, because there's no refund for potentially valuable rare salvage components.
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
I see none.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
Instanteneous.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
It will take a lot of time to convert base salvage one by one ... at least the people who are working on the crafting badges are probably happy about it.
The base designers in larger SGs will need a noticeable sum of influence to buy salvage for items.
The act of item crafting will require more time than before (it will take time to get the needed salvage - currently all you need is in the salvage bins)
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
There might be an increased danger of virtual theft.
Additional Notes:
n/t
Greetings Ex Libris,
BASE PRICING
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
My base will go from a 12x12 Plot to a 20x24 Plot. I will be able to add items and rooms I previously had no room for, (much less enough Prestige). The actual size of my base will double, and I will still have expansion room available on the 20x24 Plot. With the larger Plots in easier reach when needed.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
Absolutely. All the way to the Entry Portal.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
Approximately 24-72 hours, depending on how much I want to Decorate and Detail.
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
Positive: I think it puts everything in easier reach for those who do not have a hugely active Roster. It allows me to offer my members more funcionallity, and Decor.
Negative: I have no negative concerns. The existing prices were not attainable for many groups.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Short Term: As stated, my base is about to double in size, and have functionallity I presently can not accomplish. (In the Short term).
Long Term: Larger Plots, and crafted Items that we unlock from here on out will be affordable. It will allow me to actually have a "Maxed out" Base one day.
BASE SALVAGE EXCHANGE TO INVENTION SALVAGE
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
No one will want to store Invention Salvage in Base Storage because;
a) They have no guarantee that it will be there when they return for it.
b) Members will be using more Invention Salvage to complete their Dual-Build, and be selling the rest for the spiked prices that are very likely to occur at the BM due to Triple Demand for Invention Salvage.
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
Alot of the Salvage I used to just sell may be of use to improving my Base.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
Not long at all.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new salvage?
As stated before, The BM prices on Invention Salvage are going to be raised drastically due to Triple Demand.
Members are not going to feel comfortable leaving salvage they want to hang onto in "Public" Base Storage.
Members may jump to the conclusion that the Base Architect took all the Base Salvage they had donated, and was in Storage when the change occured and sold it at the BM for a Profit for His/Herself.
Base Architects will be torn between using Rare Salvage for Base Items, or for Recipes they need to craft for their builds. (The personal salvage they themselves would donate to the cause).
5) What security concerns do you have regarging this change?
There is no way of restricting access on Invention Storage to the person who put it in. Meaning, that whatever someone puts in will possibly not be there when they return for it.
The Base Architect will have to use his Personal Salvage Vault Space to store Invention Salvage for Base Recipes he is working on, to insure that all the items he is gathering will still be there when he has the recipe complete.
ADDITIONAL NOTES:
The limit of 18 Storage devices per base, and the Cap of 30 on the Invention Salvage Storage Racks does not allow adequate storage for Invention Salvage.
All in all, I agree with all of the Base Changes except as noted above. I am eager for the Issue to Hit, so I can expand my Base!
Black-Strike: lvl 50 AR/Dark Corruptor
Brutally Beautiful: lvl 50 BA/Inv Brute
Seared Earth: lvl 50 EC/EA Dominator
Yashi Onuku: lvl 50 Ninja Blade/Ninjitsu Stalker
Death-Widow: lvl 50 Night Widow
Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
Not dramatically - we have sufficient prestige for our current base. If we wanted, we could use the new pricing structure to make a larger one.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
Parts of it, perhaps. Certainly nothing that takes salvage to build will be dismantled. And the large, complex decorative rooms would be a lot of work to rebuild.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
tens of hours.
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
The huge time-sink involved in rebuilding a base to extract the prestige is (and will remain) a constant, nagging reminder that we're "wasting prestige" by not starting over. The positives are that future additions will be less costly.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Long-term, it'll lead to a larger base. Short term, not so much. I'm inclined to ignore it, to be truthful.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
Base salvage had little or no personal value - the same cannot be said of invention salvage, particularly expensive salvage (which may or may not be rare) - this will (in some cases vastly) increase the cost of base items, and I would expect will increase the cost of salvage overall, as demand will rise with no increase in supply.
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
None whatsoever. It's an unmitigated negative, as far as I can see.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
Not long - the current system involves hunting down the right table to make what you want, finding it's requirements, and then amassing them to build the item. Same steps, different stuff.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
Salvage bins now contain things that players can personally use - this means it's not "safe" to put valuable things there unless you trust everyone in the SG, or highly restrict access.
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
The aforementioned change to using invention salvage.
Additional Notes:
The pricing issue is more annoying than anything else. It requires us to spend real time we could be spending playing the game, or expanding the base, just to get things back to where they are - it feels like a waste of time, and it feels like there ought to have been a way to determine the savings, and just grant the prestige (I'm not saying that there is an easy way to do that, but that is seems like there ought to have been).
Adding account-wide storage would allow people to move salvage (and recipes? and enhancements?) between their characters without requiring open-access SG level storage. Then it wouldn't be as limiting to "lock down" the SG storage. Barring that, I think the base salvage change is going to cause a lot of trouble, for no benefit whatsoever.
Synchrotron, level 50 Radiation/Radiation Defender
Fighting crime on Champion since 2004
BTW, I want to add one additional note on Invention Salvage...everyone I've known who got the field crafter, did much of their crafting in part involving base salvage...converting base salvage to components, converting invention salvage to components, burning components on empowerment stations or personal items. It's already a very boring, long process. Well, the process of converting base salvage to brainstorm will temporarily give that a kick. But once that's gone...have you datamined how people earn the fabricator badges?
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I'm going to respond to this in two posts. This one will address the Difference Engineers, a 14 character Villaingroup with 1.4 million Prestige earned total.
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Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
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Difference Engineers current base:
Hidden Plot 8x8 - 0 Prestige
Rooms: Oversight Center (50,000 P), 2 Workshops (100,000 P each), Entrance (0 P).
Total room cost: 250,000 Prestige.
Items:
Combo Control+ Power Unit (25,000 P) 5 Inspiration Storage (75,000 P each), Personal Storage Vault (100,000 P), Invention Worktable (25,000 P), Salvage Storage (15,000 P), Enhancement Table (95,000 P)
Total item cost: 635,000 Prestige.
We still have approximately 500,000 Prestige available on Live. Every single room and item that we currently have remains unchanged in pricing for this base.
Projected desire for base construction:
Hidden Plot 8x12 (1,653,861/84,500 P)
Rooms: 2 Workshop 2x2 (100,000 P Each), 1 Control Room (100,000 P), 1 Energy Room (150,000/100,000 P), 1 Teleport Room 3x3 (150,000/162,500 P), 1 Medbay (50,000 P)
Total room costs Live: 2,303,861 Prestige
Total room costs I13: 697,000 Prestige
Desired Base items:
Mainframe (150,000/50,000 P), Basic Generator (225,000/200,000 P), 5 Inspiration Storage (75,000 P each), Personal Storage Vault (100,000 P), Invention Worktable (25,000 P), Salvage Storage (15,000 P), Enhancement Table (95,000 P), 2 Telepads (15,000 P each), 4 Beacons (10,000 P each), Basic Reclaimator (10,000 P)
Total item costs Live: 1,635,000
Total item costs I13: 860,000
Total base costs for desired base on Live: 3,938,861 Prestige
Total base costs for desired base I13: 1,557,000 Prestige
I'd say that needing about 250,000 Prestige for the base I want is a LOT better than needing about 2.6 million prestige. This is a very net positive effect in terms of prestige costs for my smaller VG.
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2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
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In this case I definitely will be rebuilding the Difference Engineers base. I will be rebuilding the base due to the availability/affordability of a larger plot and more rooms, and will not recieve any prestige refund from this rebuild.
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3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
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I estimate it will take me approximately 8-10 hours to rebuild/build the Difference Engineers base with suitable decoration.
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4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
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I will need to purchase the salvage required to make my two Telepads. Based on rough pricing estimates, this will cost me approximately 200,000 Infamy as prices *currently* stand on the Live servers. This infamy will be coming out of my level 37 Brute's pocket, with possible contributions from two other members of the VG. This cost is affordable for a level 37 character. We have not saved Base salvage, so I can't make the telepads in advance.
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5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
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There will be a short term expenditure of effort and time in building the base, but in *this* case I consider that a good thing. I'm able to build a base our VG wouldn't be able to afford for a long time, as a change from the very minimal three-room storage base we currently have. In the long term, there will be infamy and prestige costs, but given the slow earning nature of prestige I don't expect there to be any upgrades to the base for another year, possibly more. We're not a very active VG at present.
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Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
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We will have room for a single Base Salvage storage item at first, given the Inspiration storage that we presently have in our base. This will give us 30 storage pieces, which means we will still need to go to the market for any significant amount of IO crafting.
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2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
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I'm still not really seeing any postive effect on my VG. We'll still have to go back and forth from the Market to the crafting tables in order to make any significant amount of IOs, which makes the Base Salvage relatively useless for anything other than temporary or transfer storage in our case.
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3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
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About 15 minutes. I.E. I've already adjusted.
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4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
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I forsee the pricing of Invention salvage to skyrocket due to multiple small VGs, such as this one, being able to make larger, much more functional bases. This will put a burden of demand on the specific salvage most commonly needed for base construction. Many of those items are also commonly needed in IOs and speciality recipes. Dual builds will also be increasing the demand for Invention salvage, as people create Inventions for both of their builds.
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5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
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I am still unable to make Inspiration storage accessible to different ranks than Salvage storage is. This means that I still cannot allow new members to access the Inspiration storage without risking loss of any storage salvage or enhancements. This is a big security and quality of life concern.
Next up: How my *other* Supergroup is going to be effected by these changes...BIG difference there.
@SithRose and @Sith Rose
Permanent resident of Virtue
"Mommy, I need Cthulhu. He keeps the bad dreams away."
Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
It won't. My SG has done well for ourselves. However, with the vanishing of group salvage to personal salvage, more will come out of my own coffers for future additions.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
I'll do only what is easy or will provide the most gain.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
A couple hours
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
It's hard to say without knowing what the plan for base raids are. I'd hate to see small SGs get sucked into raiding from it's low cost only to get their behinds handed to them.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Long time: Hard to say. Short term: not much.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
I think the salvage limitations stink. 30 is too low. Especially if anyone is trying to get fabricator and wants to share the IOs
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
Probably not long.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
I think it's going to adversely affect the market. It will make things more expensive to craft, especially for new players/new SGs
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
My concern is still that we don't have seperate settings for each type of rack.
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(NOTE: All statements are made based on prices and such quoted at the start of open beta.)
Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
My supergroup consists of eight characters belonging to two players, most of them mine. The quarter million unspent prestige I have, plus what I've already invested into my base, will go a lot further in Issue 13.
I'm also going to have rent for the first time, but the numbers I saw were miniscule, and so I'm not too worried about that.
Also, see below.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
You bet I will. In fact, I've ceased building my base in anticipation of dismantling most of what I currently have and rebuilding come Issue 13.
And because I'm paranoid, just prior to launch, I'm going to strip my base as bare as possible.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
Probably 10-15 minutes at most. It's a small base.
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
No comment, other than my opinions noted above and below.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Short Term: Before launch, I'm stripping my base down to the barest roots, keeping my already-crafted items, then upon launch, rebuild everything.
Long Term: Additions to the base will come more quickly, until I reach my intended goal, after which point I'll probably only play in SG mode to earn prestige for rent.
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
Right now, I can keep all the event salvage I picked up during Halloween in a single table. From what I understand, this will no longer be possible with the changes to salvage tables. My little workshop is barely big enough for all the stuff in there already, and needing multiple salvage tables is just going to make matters worse (although upgrading to a larger room is now going to be more affordable). And personally, I don't care about being able to store invention salvage in a communal object.
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
None that I can see.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
Not long. I barely know the current system, and the new system sounds similar enough to the current Invention system that it won't take long to grasp.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
I'm concerned about the effect of making all base recipes require invention salvage on the market prices of that invention salvage; if the drop rate is increased to compensate, I'm also, but less, concerned about players' inventory size not also increasing to match.
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
None.
Additional Notes:
In anticipation of the coming base changes, I crafted approximately 15 teleporters. Looking at the fact that rare salvage is going to be required to create most (all even?) base items, I panicked and decided to get them now while they're still cheap.
While I personally am not a huge fan of base salvage, I prefer having it to competing with base builders for invention salvage. Especially rare invention salvage.
Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
I won't feel the compulsion to constantly be in SG mode anymore, so I'll make better progress on the epic Influence badges!
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
I'll probably dismantle several rooms, but others I might leave alone. This gives me an excuse to take a fresh stab at redecorating some rooms I'm not totally happy with.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
Probably two or three nights of tinkering around, plus a lot more experimentation with the awesome new pathing rules.
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
I like how smaller SGs will be able to afford bigger bases sooner, but after three years of collecting prestige our SG doesn't really NEED to grow much anymore, so I'm not going to expand as much as the little guys.
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Long term: The SG as a whole can relax on the prestige grinding to keep us at the status quo. Short term: I'll be playing around a lot more with the editor!
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
It'll be much more difficult to store holiday event salvage for use by alts throughout the year. I'd be fine with the lower Invention salvage limit if it didn't also include event salvage. Could we have a separate bin for candy canes and costumes?
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
I'll get the 10k crafting badge! I'm also planning to stockpile a lot of random rare invention salvage for use by the SG.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
No time at all. It's fairly clear, except for rent calculation.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
Let's say I have 40 Hamidon Costumes in storage right now. Someone in the SG accidentally double-clicks on them when they meant to just single click. Now THEY'VE got all 40 pieces of event salvage, and they can't put all of them back for other people because that'd put the bin over the limit.
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
No concerns. We don't recruit, so everyone in the SG is trustworthy.
Additional Notes:
Please consider giving us a new higher-limit storage bin solely for event salvage. I understand you want to limit hording of the Invention stuff, but Events only come around once a year, so please don't make us deal with the Wentworth's inflation we'll no doubt see in a month or two.
Base Repricing
1) How will the repricing of bases affect you personally?
I think the repricing is great. It could lead to a great base after I dismatle and rebuild.
2) Will you dismantle your base to gain the additional prestige from the repricing?
Most defintely, yes. I am a Supergroup of two people, so the more prestige the merrier.
3) How long would this process take you if you were to engage in this practice?
For me, it would take about the same time it took for me to build the first base - about a month total.
4) What are the positive and negative concerns regarding repricing?
Positive: Cheaper 
Negative: Rebuilding 
5) How will this feature affect you long term and short term?
Long term it will be much appreciated. Short term, it will be a complete pain in the [censored]!
Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
Having to compete for my base salvage on the market. I don't play enough to be able to afford the salvage I will need for my teleporters right away. I will have to wait a while. Plus, the limit on storage will be a huge downer.
2) What is the positive effect on your base for this feature implementation?
None really.
3) How long will it take you to adjust to learning this new system?
I don't forsee any adjustment period. Just a long wait until I can "craft" my base goodies.
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
Honestly, I see more of an influence sink from players purchasing their salvage from the market. I guess that's the idea, but for the independent heroes out here - it really sucks.
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
I really don't have any concerns about the security. I trust my fellow gamers (at least my regular teaming buds).
Additional Notes:
I hope the idea of charging rent for the free plot is reversed. I really enjoyed not having to worry about paying rent. The new rent system is way better overall, but this part bugs me.
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Base Salvage Exchange to Invention Salvage
1) What is the negative effect on your base for this feature implementation?
4) What side effects to this system do you currently see from transitioning the old to new system?
5) What security concerns do you have regarding this change?
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I just thought of a horrifying scenario I can see happening. Let's say I'm the base builder and I want to add teleporters. Oh wait, I need rare invention salvage to make it. That means influence/infamy. So I need to keep track of my real costs to make those teleporters, getting all of the salvage on the market. It could cost millions to make 4 teleporters (needed for all of the villain zones). Let's say 10 million total. So I take that 10 million and divide it by the 5 people in our small SG.
Now I need to take up a collection of a 2 million "special assessment" per person to get that functionality. And I can really only do it because I know there are 5 people behind those 50 alts in the SG.
Larger SGs aren't going to have that luxury. Won't they need to create SG "influence dues" in order to create craftable items in the case? It's crazy, but it could happen. Players not only need to run in SG mode to create prestige, but they also need to pay into the coffers to buy invention salvage to create craftable items.
I don't like where this is going.