Anime and CoX

I'm going to jump into the discussion sort of mid-way since I've been obsessing over Darksiders II recently and haven't kept up with the forums. Apologies if I repeat everything, but the thread is too large for me to read up on it with the time I have at my disposal.

I don't "get" the abject hatred for anime that I myself have had to fight against many times on these forums. Experience has taught me that it mostly stems from people who don't actually know much about anime aside from the meme clips you'd see on YouTube, like "It's over 9000!" and the tropes they've read up on, assuming "anime-inspired characters" must always spiky hair, giant eyes and ridiculous costumes. I CAN see how this could be a problem of clashing styles, especially when you get into the weirdly specific looks, like Lulu's skirt made up entirely of belts or the many weird outfits from Blade and Soul that have one pant leg missing and suchforth. I can sort of get why THAT would set some people off, but I don't get why these people can rarely be argued with that that's really not what people are asking for when they bring up anime-inspired costumes.

That said, asking for "anime-inspired" costumes is kind of like asking for "live-action-movie-inspired" costumes. What genre are you looking to draw from? See, anime is not a film genre. It's a film medium. A film style, if you will. It's Japanese animation that really isn't limited to any one style or genre, even if it IS more heavily weighted towards the weird and fantastical more often. But anime dramas like Jin-Roh: The Wolf Brigade or Grave of the Fireflies, which use ostensibly realistic and conventional character designs, exist right alongside acid trips like Dead Leaves and fanservice like Girls Bravo. What I'm saying is that anime isn't a "thing" so much as it's a loose descriptor of a monstrously large body of starkly divergent works. Both because of the biassed hatred it brings and because it's largely unfocused, I find asking for "anime costumes" to be less productive than being specific about exactly what you want in particular.

But is there room for anime in City of Heroes at all? Yes. Yes there is. The funny thing is that there's room for everything in City of Heroes, and I feel it's unique like that. The game is inspired by Western super heroes from around the Silver Age, yes, but both from its cast of signature characters and from how the fictional world is styled, much everything makes sense. Now, obviously, not everything works stylistically. I mean, certain over-exaggerated styles like chibi artwork or the crap Craig McCracken became famous for work best in worlds that are built to handle a little boy wider than he is tall, with feet longer than his legs are long that still somehow have knees. Putting actual anime in the game would, obviously, not work, just because most of the anime drawing styles would clash with City of Heroes' pseudo-realistic look. But that doesn't mean concepts from anime can't be drawn on to create amazing new looks.

Years ago, I posted this screenshot of Darksiders' War as a suggestion for how larger weapons could look good (the sword here looks a lot bigger than it is thanks to perspective) and I was called names for, with people saying how it would never work and it would never fit in with the game's style. A couple of years down the line. I can do just that and the world didn't break up around me. What I'm saying is there's room for stuff in this game that isn't drawn from Silver Age American comic books, and there's room for ambitious, over-the-top stuff, if it's done with style.

There's nothing evil about anime. It's a source of inspiration like any other. It just needs us to be more specific about what we want, and it needs to artists to put in some work to fit it within the broader definition of this game's art style.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arcanaville Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

As an American my experience and exposure to Anime has been limited. My first anime I ever watched was Akira. I've watched many of the same imported anime series, such as Dragonball and it's ilk, a little of Bleach, Naruto, Sailor Moon, Bubblegum Crisis and so-on. The major issues I have with it, in comparison to Western comics, is the majority of the protagonists are Blessed Idiots. People, almost invariably male, who are dumb as a bag of hammers, but granted Fantastic Powers. They never develop past that stage of cluelessness, until they come to accept their role... at which point the series ends, or they become Dark Avengers, or Brooding Lone Wolves.
The bright, shiny, positive shows are mostly played up for either comedy, or blatantly aimed at young girls (Sailor Moon being a prime example). Women are nearly unviersally portrayed as either weak victims, clueless fangirls, shrill harpies or seduction machines. Strong heroines are usually "put in their place" by being mauled/beaten down by the antagonist, giving the male hero that extra push to defeat him. Strong, intelligent female characters are made counterparts of the Blessed Idiot, and their ideas and plans are shown to be silly/unnecessary when the Blessed Idiot proves through brute force, blind luck or writer fiat they knew what they were doing all along. I haven't heard of a Wonder Woman or Power Girl-style strong leading female character in Anime that wasn't either a Dark Avenger or Naive Schoolgirl. And what series/movies I have seen with a singular female protagonist invariably has a male character to provide her with convenient saves, while pointing out how silly she was for being solo in the first place.

Normal people are either ignored, are set dressing, or are an annoyance. The series focus on the protagonist fighting a specific set of enemies, and nothing else. Collateral damage (in series where it occurs) is considered part of the Wow Factor of how powerful said person is, without regard to the hundreds or, in some case of shows such as Dragonball Z and Advent Children, millions of casualties. The protagonists are considered above normal people, and thus normal people are considered inconsequential.
The idea of using their powers to save people from a burning building, stopping a mundane bank robbery, or any of the dozens of Western comics scenarios never seem to play out. Further, those scenarios never seem to occur to Anime protagonists.

The idea of power inflation comes into play when the protagonist encounters an problem/opponent he can't confront directly. In Western comics it's team-up time. In Anime they go off, train/find a weakness/get the magic sword upgrade, and come back to fight them solo. Sure, sometimes they will have a small team, but said team is almost invariably easily dismissed and defeated by the Big Bad, leaving it to the new and improved protagonist to solo him.

All that said, Anime stylings in gear, costumes and weapons I'm all for. They look good. Anime style writing in missions or theme in CoX I'm opposed to due to, in my opinion, complete incompatibility with a Western style super-hero setting.

Honestly, a lot of people hasn't seen much anime.

Heck, there's even a genuinely superhero (in the western sense) anime: Tiger & Bunny. (It's good! And surprisingly idealistic for the rather cynical premise)

I think a lot of people have, as some people have stated, seen very little anime, and what anime they have been exposed to may not have been representative of the entire genre (what part can be, is an obvious question).

There are a number of costume sets already in the game that evoke anime style for some, but just general japanese style for others, or something entirely different. Mecha Armor, the Samurai costume pieces, ninja costume pieces, etc.

The style of Dragonball Z is very different from the style of Ghost in the Shell, or Yokohama Shopping Trip. There's a big range of what you can do with "anime style" and I would be hesitant to dismiss the whole thing or accept the whole thing too quickly.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. Some interesting discussion here.

~Freitag

FPAK!

~Freitag

would that make this FPARNAKARN ?

I like how it's taken eight pages for someone, a redname no less, to point out that 'anime style' is such a broad brush you might as well be saying 'cartoon style'.

'Anime' is just 'animation' in Japanese. You're actually just saying 'Japanese animation style'. Which is as completely meaningless as saying 'Western animation style'. You can end up with Perry the Platypus or Bruce Timms Superman.

Though if you add some anime styled from Legend of the Overfiend, we'll probably never see Golden Girl ever again.

With the whole "Reed Richards vs Luffy" thing... Richards is less rubber and more clay. He stretches his body around without having to apply force. He also doesn't seem to be very elastic, unlike Luffy he doesn't rubberband his fist in order to hit something much harder than normal.

Luffy is much more Rubbery. He has to apply force to stretch himself, and takes advantage of his elasticity in amazing ways. He cannot however morph his hand into a hammer. He can increase the size of various body parts by sucking in air, but he doesn't actually "morph". Unlike Richards who can turn into a ball, or change his body around.

In short: Reed is clay (maybe putty), Luffy is rubber.

Actualy the only hate I see is when people try to copy established Characters and of course do a horrible job of being that character not to mention....they are not very original at all.

The actual game already has plenty of costume options that can be made to look like a Magical Girl or what ever....I have done it a few times...but for me i try to make every costume different and every character is different as well....i dont duplicate...i might take something and use it as a base...but the character and name and even their background have their own flavor....that explain why they look like what they do and why they have their powers.


Its funny but The only things i want from Animes really are some of the power effects...like the video clips shown....or from a few other Animes I have watched....but then i also want some of the effects from some of the Video Arcade Games i have played too....
I mean is it too much to ask for a neat attack that looks like WAR Machine's Finishing Move from Marvel vs. Capcom?

I think that would extra neat to see......and i dont want a complete copy i want something similar but different....
By the way....there really needs to be some more titan and staff weapon types...and also some unlockables for titan and staff weapons.

I dont think i am the only one that sort of wants to have some giant blade with an eyeball on it...so wanted to be able to unlock a rularuu titan blade.....oh well.