why are you not playing a crab SoA?
By
Agent White,
Posted on: 2012-04-26 17:04 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
For me, I hate the backpack. I made one, got it to 50 and deleted and rerolled as wolfspider {aka huntsman} because I hated the thing so much. As long as that backpack is there I'll never look... well, back.
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Originally Posted by bpphantom
I've got a S/L softcap build you might be interested in
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Originally Posted by SinisterDirge
Why are you not playing a Fire/Traps Corruptor?
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He's Tier 3rd and waiting for something to do...
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I made my SoA with the intention of making him a Crab. However, I enjoyed the "Huntsman" path so much that I couldn't keep him as a Crab and respeced back into the Huntsman.
When I'm in the mood to deal damage from afar, I grab my ranged Crab. And on really fast teams, I find hoverblasting to be less stressful than playing a melee toon that's forced to constantly switch targets because everything's dying so quickly. And the prisoner escape phase during BAF itrials are also good times. Just pick a door, summon pets, and go crazy with AoEs. Muhaha!
Winteriel Ice/Fire/Soul Tanker | @TBoxer Global | City of Heroes R.I.P. (2004-2012)
Because altitis. 
I made one when they came out, took the Widow further, and right now he's still sitting at something like 13th level. Like all my other low-and-abandoned alts, I do keep meaning to get back to him, but... oh look, dark dom! Shiny staff!
They are ugly. I can't stand that backpack. I prefer my Fortunata. He's a defense build but he has everything I've wanted in a psi blaster: high defense, status protection, and boomgasms and no arms sticking out the back.
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You must think I'm referring to an AE fire farm. In normal content, crab aoe blast chain is more efficient than a brute jumping in, waiting for everyone to circle around, then start burn/foot stomp. This is why people make these type of characters as AE farmers. If you're steamrolling group to group you're better off with quick ranged aoe blasts. No one's going to be waiting around for brute herding in to burn patches. |
Originally Posted by Mr. DJ
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If the gripe is theme/aesthetics then I completely understand, but to call their performance average is an understatement.
Currently on Virtue:
Jinrazuo - Crab Spider
RWZ All-Pylon Solo Run
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I respect your analysis and agree that without the pets, these low pylon times wouldn't be possible. I would be the insane one to ever argue that. |
Originally Posted by Reppu
The moments you pets explode or don't focus, your DPS tanks. That's pretty much why they aren't 'holy grail' in the least. And their personal attacks are largely lackluster.
Crab damage is almost entirely their pets. Uncontrollable, derpy pets. But I'll see if I can't convince some nerfs at the Pummit. Probably need the Pets HP and Damage cut in Half. And for Crabs to lose their self heal, and half of their resistance. And their mez protection. Yeah. Need to scale them back. TL;DR - Your All Pylon Solo Run pretty much meant Nothing. That was your pets being in their absolute best case scenario - impossible to receive damage and focusing on a single target. This isn't remotely as easy to duplicate in a Trial, unless it's a Tank and Spank AV that nobody cares about. But one wild AoE and your DPS tanks! Although, I can admit they're good. Very much so. But there's some 'out of REAL control' quirks to their supreme STDPS, which is why when I look at your Pylon run, I go "Cool, but that's beyond optimal circumstances and really is worth nothing for data." |
However, if we're talking trial AVs, even without the pets, direct single target can be 'okay'. At that point though, the crab can be contributing double assault/double maneuvers/double tactics, -20 res from Venom Grenade, another -20 if you're taking Shatter from PPP, another -20 from slotting Achilles (yes, i know this isn't exclusive as others may be slotting this also), -dmg from SoA proc, and some -def. We all realize how much this game revolves around buffs/debuffs, right?
Really though, if the trial AV does turn in to tank and spank (and most of them are), just drop down pets on top of that and you're golden. There's so much +team def flying around from leaguemates that pet durability isn't a big liability. So, throw the Pylon runs out of the window if you'd like, but the results are still similar on 90ish % of the hard targets in this game... if you actually go out of the way to heavily slot and invest in to the pets, which to my understanding, most Crabs do not.
Currently on Virtue:
Jinrazuo - Crab Spider
RWZ All-Pylon Solo Run
I just couldn't come up with a good idea for one, character-wise...
That, and I already have a the cutest little chibi Bane in the entire history of cute and chibi evilness.
@Brightfires - @Talisander
That chick what plays the bird-things...
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In line of this, I prefer Huntsmen if only because not only do they have comparable, if not arguably superior Ranged AoE Damage, but they definitely do have the superior Ranged Single Target Attack Chain (Due to the old Single Shot/Burst Buffs), if we're talking about not including the pets in the math here.|
Originally Posted by blueruckus
I respect your analysis and agree that without the pets, these low pylon times wouldn't be possible. I would be the insane one to ever argue that.
However, if we're talking trial AVs, even without the pets, direct single target can be 'okay'. At that point though, the crab can be contributing double assault/double maneuvers/double tactics, -20 res from Venom Grenade, another -20 if you're taking Shatter from PPP, another -20 from slotting Achilles (yes, i know this isn't exclusive as others may be slotting this also), -dmg from SoA proc, and some -def. We all realize how much this game revolves around buffs/debuffs, right? Really though, if the trial AV does turn in to tank and spank (and most of them are), just drop down pets on top of that and you're golden. There's so much +team def flying around from leaguemates that pet durability isn't a big liability. So, throw the Pylon runs out of the window if you'd like, but the results are still similar on 90ish % of the hard targets in this game... if you actually go out of the way to heavily slot and invest in to the pets, which to my understanding, most Crabs do not. |
With the full pet arsenal, a crab will pull ahead, no doubt. But Huntsman are still hilariously underestimated. If my old calculations hold true, Huntsman beat Bane ST damage by a small margin (with Gloom). And Crabs were below Banes with out the pet swarm.
I think, in the end, the SoA AT as a whole is very solidly designed (although I loathe Banes). If the Backpack didn't exist or I could just get the Crab Support Set + the pets and not get the backpack if I were to forego all Crab Primary powers? I'd play them in a heartbeat.
Since the Crab Pack is a no-sale to me on female models, yeah. That is why I don't play a Crab: aesthetics.
That, and Huntsmen are just so much more aesthetically awesome.
The Man With the Machine Gun~!
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Herding isn't necessary. Jump in. Smash. Both will have stragglers to mop up in any event. Mobs won't always be in a nice spot for Crab AoE's either and Frag Grenade can make it worse with its knockback (doesn't stop me from enjoying my Huntsman, just saying).
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Originally Posted by blueruckus
You must think I'm referring to an AE fire farm. In normal content, crab aoe blast chain is more efficient than a brute jumping in, waiting for everyone to circle around, then start burn/foot stomp. This is why people make these type of characters as AE farmers. If you're steamrolling group to group you're better off with quick ranged aoe blasts. No one's going to be waiting around for brute herding in to burn patches.
If the gripe is theme/aesthetics then I completely understand, but to call their performance average is an understatement. |
Im not a huge fan of the crab ranged attacks because they're slower than the huntsman gun attacks. Aesthetics aside, there's no reason why you can't make a crab with huntsman gun attacks though. Basically the best of both worlds, like Hannah Montana.
Currently on Virtue:
Jinrazuo - Crab Spider
RWZ All-Pylon Solo Run
My main reason for why I create or don't create any type of character: concept.
At least a basic background, motivation for the character, and an idea which alignment it'll eventually adhere to. Then at least the first 2 costumes.
With the VEATs, I can't create my own costume right off the bat and that's been very off putting and I found it too limiting to my creativeness. Sometimes limits are good and can even be inspiring, this one just didn't seem to give me that kind of spark.
Then I read this thread and came up with Belisana. Named after a type of daddy-long leg spider, but the name felt particularly female. Then I read up on the daddy-long leg and it likes to feed on hunstman and red backed spiders.
So now I have a vague concept brewing of a SoA that ends up being betrayed by Arachnos and eventually turns on them. Or she'll stay red side but act as an internal executioner, removing "troublesome" personel within arachnos and anyone along the way that interfere's with the organization's plans. Either way, I've got my concept, first costume colors to give her at least a little distinction.
Now I'll need to hopefully get on a DFB so as to level up a bit to get a decent attack chain, which has held me back from levelling one before.
because 1 crab isn't a big deal and so many folks due to IOs have capped defense at level 50.
Now at lower levels, if you have a team of 4 Veats and and people build to abuse the double leadership, then yeah its pretty darn nice. However, I still see selfish Crabs who have no leadership at all. 
H: Blaster 50, Defender 50, Tank 50, Scrapper 50, Controller 50, PB 50, WS 50
V: Brute 50, Corruptor 50, MM 50, Dominator 50, Stalker 50, AW 50, AS 50
Top 4: Controller, Brute, Scrapper, Corruptor
Bottom 4: (Peacebringer) way below everything else, Mastermind, Dominator, Blaster
CoH in WQHD
I'd argue that PB's are better.
My pb can stomp on any crab out there with ease actually.
Seriously.
Fight The Power
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You're probably right.
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Originally Posted by Wolf_Reign
I'd argue that PB's are better.
My pb can stomp on any crab out there with ease actually. Seriously. |
Currently on Virtue:
Jinrazuo - Crab Spider
RWZ All-Pylon Solo Run
I've never gotten one out of the mid-20s, because I dislike the animations, they fill up the screen so I can't click through them to pick targets.
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Crabs aren't sacks of hp on legs.
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Originally Posted by Wolf_Reign
I'd argue that PB's are better.
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the aesthetic reason would be the backpack, the gaming reason is that I prefer Build Up over Aim.
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Originally Posted by blueruckus
Im not a huge fan of the crab ranged attacks because they're slower than the huntsman gun attacks. Aesthetics aside, there's no reason why you can't make a crab with huntsman gun attacks though. Basically the best of both worlds, like Hannah Montana.
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Originally Posted by DreadShinobi
Crabs aren't sacks of hp on legs.
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I get SoA look cool, but the punch is not there.
Fight The Power
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Originally Posted by Goliath Bird Eater
I don't know why people don't play Crabs.
I like being able to do a little bit of everything. Sure, other ATs can do one thing or another much better than I can. But who cares? I'm having fun! |
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Originally Posted by IolitePhoenix
Of all the characters I have though, my crab is my favorite to play.
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Jack of all trades, master of nothing.. Still my best toon.
Dark Energon, Founder of the Freedom Legion SG on Guardian server.
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The "master of none" half of the saying wasn't added until the 18th century. Being a "Jack of All Trades" just means that you aren't specialized in one particular area. Granted, this does go against the typical MMO mentality of "you do this thing, I do that thing, and Bob does this other thing". But the way I see it, my presence on a team is not to bring something otherwise nonexistent to the table, but to further enhance that which other members bring. I add melee, ranged, and AoE damage. I buff my allies. I can debuff enemies with certain attacks. I can bring pets. And I can even Tank some (especially with my softcap defense/50% damage resistance build).|
Originally Posted by Dark Energon
This
And this. Jack of all trades, master of nothing.. Still my best toon. |
So I'm stuck with the backpack -- that's a purely mechanical conceit.
Jack of all trades, master of none. But oftentimes better than the master of one. - Adam Savage
Positron: "There are no bugs [in City of Heroes], just varying degrees of features."
Oh but I am playing my crab. Got him to lvl 50 incarnate. Chose to upgrade his Lore pet to a toxic tarantula(that gives my SOA, 7 pets). Now I'm taking my SOA to rip up MOT and DA.
Very nice AT, and I am a little of everything and can steam roll through most enemies.
NCSOFT may take away our servers and beloved dev team, but they can't break our spirit and community. with all your power, NCSOFT, your victory will be bitter-sweet. I, personally will be there to laugh at you when you face-plant into the ground.
Crab's are not the best AT. The best AT is subjective.
What crabs do have, though, is the tools to pick and choose what they want to be.
SoA's can be
Tanker crabs.
Crabterminds. (6 pets)
Huntercrabs. (Blueruckus)
Banes. (Banes)
Huntsmen. (AKA Wolf spiders)
Fortunas (Psi damage buffing machines)
FortWidows (Melee fortunas)
Night Widows.
They are all diffrent play styles, using very few power sets. SoA's power is what you want to do with them.
But I do personally love my SoA. She is built to tank and I've dropped a fair bit of time and inf into her. +4x8 DA <3
Love~ Lea the Spider Girl.
simply put: crabs are tank mages, in theory the holy grail of characters
in the old days they were restricted to redside. But now you can get to 20 and switch to blueside.
but there are very few crabs out there on either side.
so why are you not playing a crab SoA?
And have you tried one?
Virtue: @Santorican
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