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I said it was fun. I was simply backing up my claim, but also modified it because I made a slight numerical error in my first claim. It happens, I corrected it.|
Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim
Who cares? It's fun.
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But, yes. I did say it was fun. I also say "Who cares?" If SF gets a random buff, cool.
If not? I don't care.
Got my staff/elec brute at 46 and here's my thoughts so far.
- Form of the Soul has been a godsend as it has allowed me to run a lot of toggles without ever worrying much about the blue bar. This has made the low-mid level game a breeze. However, I'm concerned there may be a bug because from looking at the numbers in combat attributes, it seems that when it's at 3 stack, it applies the buff twice. When I use Energize and Soul Form, I notice that this double stack scenario does not occur. Really a shame if this is a bug because the other forms seem a bit lacking.
- The buffs on Body/Mind don't really seem too... great. I really like the idea behind it but I just think the numbers should be adjusted a bit higher. 40 dmg, 30 recharge at full stack? Also, the Sky Splitter "buff" on Mind grants an 8% tohit... I dunno, this just seems lousy. Would also be nice to see these buffs last longer. I know I'm calling for a lot of buffs on the Perfection system, but really, outside of the probably bugged Soul Form everything else is kinda blah. StJ combo system seems to be much stronger to me AND you don't need to waste a power pick for it.
- I am willing to accept that maybe numbers are a tad lower on staff because overall its range is higher on attacks, but if that's the case make Eye of the Storm have a larger radius. Standard melee pbaoe is 10 so why does the "higher ranged melee set" follow this standard? I think 15 is reasonable just like Titan Weapons.
- I know knockdown is more desirable than knockback usually, but Serpents Reach really seems like it SHOULD do knockback from the animation alone. Also, I think the damage is respectable but it feels like the set is missing a hard hitting ST aside from Sky Splitter. I know each set can't have everything so this is more of a less serious request.
- Going back to the Perfection system, why isn't this sort of thing just part of the powerset's Inherent? Why do we need to spend a whole power pick on this and lose out on another power (build up) because of this? For no apparent, Stalkers get Body Form for free AND still keep Build Up? Huh? DB, StJ, TW all get their gimmick for free to further complicate the matter. Make this free and give Staff Build Up. Also, do the same for Dual Pistols.
Currently on Virtue:
Jinrazuo - Crab Spider
RWZ All-Pylon Solo Run
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You receive a cookie! |
Originally Posted by DLancer
If all sets are above average, then that kinda defeats the purpose of "average"
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Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
How can people possibly believe PleaseRecycle is serious?!?!?!
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Originally Posted by Party_Kake
Welcome to the club, girl.
Oh, wait, that's not what you meant, was it? |
However... did you miss this one?
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Originally Posted by Black_Assassin
....infact i have a 'thin stick' and the only time i managed to damage it was when i accidentally whacked a brick wall with it....and the wood split slightly.
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@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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Yes, but is it STRONG and PRETTY?
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Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim
I'm finding Staff to be ridiculously fun and powerful.
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@Roderick
I don't know, after seem post like this when Pistols came out, and now staff, I'd rather someone just come out and say what they really want and be done with it. Me personally I like staff, it's a blast on my Brute. Top damage? Don't know yet still in my 20s but I see a ton of 40 and 0 Stalker and Scrappers blowing stuff up.
Even time I see post like this, all I am seeing really is "Hey Dev, come on make us a set that is stronger then Super Strength already, and a ranger set stronger then Fire and Arrows!" I could be wrong but that is what it feels like to me, seems more to save time if someone just out and said it already. I don't know maybe there is some rule or something? Me personally I enjoy the sets we are getting, gives me more things to play with. (cough cough* give us an animal shape shift set! *cough cough)
But really why doesn't someone just up and say it already and get it over with?
I can sum this all up in one complaint and one reply.
Complaint: OMG! THE DPS ISN'T HIGHER AND CRAZIER IN EVERY FREAKIN WAY THAN EVERYTHING ELSE COMBINED, CUBED!
Reply: Well DUH? What made you think the devs, even for a paid powerset, were going to DELIBERATELY put out something with busted, overpowered numbers?
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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Titan Weapons.
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
I can sum this all up in one complaint and one reply.
Complaint: OMG! THE DPS ISN'T HIGHER AND CRAZIER IN EVERY FREAKIN WAY THAN EVERYTHING ELSE COMBINED, CUBED! Reply: Well DUH? What made you think the devs, even for a paid powerset, were going to DELIBERATELY put out something with busted, overpowered numbers? |
My only want for the set, is more models for the staff. Like a none tech spear.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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You are the (redacted) that had the unmitigated arrogance and gall to tell me that I and others like me that are satisfied with fun games and nice aesthetics (average damage and nice visuals) that we are ruining the entire game industry.|
Originally Posted by Reppu
Rude much?
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I have seen few posters over the years here with more rudeness, hyperbole, arrogance and martyrdom than you have. You have no room to even begin to throw that stones at others.
"The side that is unhappy is not the side that the game was intended to make happy, or promised to make happy, or focused on making happy. The side that is unhappy is the side that is unhappy. That's all." - Arcanaville
"Surprised your guys' arteries haven't clogged with all that hatred yet." - Xzero45
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Titan Weapons is probably the game's first and only powerset where a gimmick made it STRONGER. Pretty much all the other sets that come with a gimmick pay an unfair price for it, in such a way that they need to make heavy use of the gimmick just to break even. Titan Weapons, even if it is on the "too strong" side, is the only one where I feel a gimmick ISN'T holding the set back. On the contrary - Momentum makes the set better than it would have been had it been a straightforward no-gimmick melee set.
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Originally Posted by Reppu
Titan Weapons.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I just missed it then. I'm sure in person it would have been obvious. |
Originally Posted by Scythus
...Um... satirical comedy is not lying. Sure, it's not truthful, but lying is usually done with the intent to deceive, which this was not. This was done with the intent to make people laugh.
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Like I said I generally take things at face value. I leave intent deciphering on the interwebs to those with the inclination and experience to do so.
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Fortunately, there's plenty of evidence in this and other threads on Staff.|
Originally Posted by Reppu
Rude much? Assumptions with out evidence are crude. Emphasis on three letters, by the way.
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Originally Posted by MajorPrankster
You are the (redacted) that had the unmitigated arrogance and gall to tell me that I and others like me that are satisfied with fun games and nice aesthetics (average damage and nice visuals) that we are ruining the entire game industry.
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Virtue Server
Avatar art by Daggerpoint
Just tearing through stuff at level 19...can't wait to get Sky Splitter and Serpent's reach. Heck, only Eye of the Storm is slotted (albeit with Scrapper IOs) and I'm still mushing enemeies to bits.
It's not Fire Melee or Street Justice or Shield Charge or...but it does what's needed and that's turning pixelated forums into gruel.
Questions about the game, either side? /t @Neuronia or @Neuronium, with your queries!
168760: A Death in the Gish. 3 missions, 1-14. Easy to solo.
Infinity Villains
Champion, Pinnacle, Virtue Heroes
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
I can sum this all up in one complaint and one reply.
Complaint: OMG! THE DPS ISN'T HIGHER AND CRAZIER IN EVERY FREAKIN WAY THAN EVERYTHING ELSE COMBINED, CUBED! Reply: Well DUH? What made you think the devs, even for a paid powerset, were going to DELIBERATELY put out something with busted, overpowered numbers? |
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Originally Posted by Reppu
Titan Weapons.
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Sorry Charlie, single power set that is on the higher end of the melee set damage doesn't indicate that the devs have decided to instigate a design plan where each new power set is going to be more powerful than the last.
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Heh. Funny.|
Originally Posted by Reppu
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Oh. You were serious?
BWAHAHAHAHA!!!
Sorry, but I find it very hard to classify TW as higher DPS than everything else. It's on the higher end. But it isn't "the" highest.
And, even, somehow, if it were. One release does not a trend make.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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I'd say it wins on burst damage. Someone who can keep momentum rolling good can probably keep it on top in DPS. But, in the hands of most players? It's up there near the top, but probably not THE top. Lose momentum too much and...yesh. That swing time sucks, and with heavy -tohit piling on, you'll find things going downhill in a fight FAST.
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
Heh. Funny.
Oh. You were serious? BWAHAHAHAHA!!! Sorry, but I find it very hard to classify TW as higher DPS than everything else. It's on the higher end. But it isn't "the" highest. And, even, somehow, if it were. One release does not a trend make. |
Virtue Server
Avatar art by Daggerpoint
When you lose Momentum, you're dead equal to Broadsword. You put way too much emphasis on "Oh if you lose Momentum the set is bad".
If you actually MISSED more than once, you have personal build problems. And you're still playing two-handed Broadsword.
And people thinking Titan Weapons is not top-tier probably aren't informed.
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But... you are. You're the reason why a developer can't go into an investor meeting and describe an epic tale, filled with content, wonders, and that feeling of 'magic', with out being awkwardly stared at and being in an empty room a few moments later.|
Originally Posted by MajorPrankster
Snip Rule Shenanigans.
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The only thing investors are interested now is how far you push cutting-edge technology. Not the story. Not the immersiveness. Not the heart and soul put into it.
So... yeah. Reap what you sow, don't get angry that someone pointed it out.
I don't get why people talk about TW "with Momentum" and "without Momentum" as if that were somehow meaningful to what the set actually does. There's no way to actually play Titan Weapons other than sometimes having Momentum, and sometimes not having it. And yes, despite this somewhere-in-between gameplay, it is still an incredibly powerful set. It also has massive endurance issues, suffers abnormally more than most sets against tohit debuffs, and Momentum itself is sometimes a weakness (when you need to move a lot, when you need to interrupt something like a Sky Raider Engineer, etc), so no, it still isn't the best melee set in every way.
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That just sounds a lot like the "issues" you brought up with Titan Weapons lies between the keyboard and seat, and less the set itself.|
Originally Posted by Hopeling
I don't get why people talk about TW "with Momentum" and "without Momentum" as if that were somehow meaningful to what the set actually does. There's no way to actually play Titan Weapons other than sometimes having Momentum, and sometimes not having it. And yes, despite this somewhere-in-between gameplay, it is still an incredibly powerful set. It also has massive endurance issues, suffers abnormally more than most sets against tohit debuffs, and Momentum itself is sometimes a weakness (when you need to move a lot, when you need to interrupt something like a Sky Raider Engineer, etc), so no, it still isn't the best melee set in every way.
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I won't deny Titan Weapons having some ludicrously massive (And warranted) Endurance Costs, but endurance management has been part of the game since the earliest of beta tests, and people know how to adjust that with any build. At the Top Levels of Performance, endurance becomes a very easily managed 'issue'.
Also Ageless.
ToHit debuffs, while painful, affect EVERY set equally. If you're to-hit debuffed to levels where your ability to hit is significantly unreliable, then again, you're just playing two-handed Broadsword while everyone else is also missing as often as you are and are suffering by an equal amount of "No longer doing damage".
That's a baseless argument no Titan Weapons player has taken seriously since it was discovered how 'average' Titan Weapons was WITH OUT Momentum.
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Except that the game doesn't start at 50, nor does everyone who gets TW have access to IOs or Incarnate abilities. And again TW is just ONE set. Even if it were as good as you make it out to be (which it isn't) that DOES NOT assume that staff weapons will be better or worse than it.|
Originally Posted by Reppu
That just sounds a lot like the "issues" you brought up with Titan Weapons lies between the keyboard and seat, and less the set itself.
I won't deny Titan Weapons having some ludicrously massive (And warranted) Endurance Costs, but endurance management has been part of the game since the earliest of beta tests, and people know how to adjust that with any build. At the Top Levels of Performance, endurance becomes a very easily managed 'issue'. Also Ageless. ToHit debuffs, while painful, affect EVERY set equally. If you're to-hit debuffed to levels where your ability to hit is significantly unreliable, then again, you're just playing two-handed Broadsword while everyone else is also missing as often as you are and are suffering by an equal amount of "No longer doing damage". That's a baseless argument no Titan Weapons player has taken seriously since it was discovered how 'average' Titan Weapons was WITH OUT Momentum. |
Nowhere have the devs said to expect that pay sets will be better than everything else.
If they have please quote it.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
Hey, thanks for the insult. I'm not claiming those issues are unsolvable, but they are more of an issue for TW than for other sets. And yes, tohit debuffs are an issue for every set, but they are even more of an issue for TW than other sets, because they limit your ability to hit AND also to gain momentum, which dramatically restricts even your ability to spam attacks and hope one gets through. Yes, there are things you can do to mitigate this - Focused Accuracy/Ageless Radial for debuff resistance, Build Momentum to get around it for 10 seconds at a time, yellow insps, etc. Like I said, not unsolvable, but it's still something you have to solve, which is not automatic.
Much the same for endurance issues. A decent build can overcome those issues, but still has to be mindful of them - Ageless like you said, for example, means you're not using Rebirth or Barrier.
Yes, you can use Brawl/Envenomed Dagger/Build Momentum while running in/damage aura/whatever to interrupt enemies, and there are various other things you can do to mitigate various other situations, but those are again things you have to solve that other sets do not have to deal with at all.
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I never claimed that. Also Street Justice. And IO Dual Blades. But we're getting off the topic more.|
Originally Posted by Aura_Familia
Except that the game doesn't start at 50, nor does everyone who gets TW have access to IOs or Incarnate abilities. And again TW is just ONE set. Even if it were as good as you make it out to be (which it isn't) that DOES NOT assume that staff weapons will be better or worse than it.
Nowhere have the devs said to expect that pay sets will be better than everything else. If they have please quote it. |
I originally wanted Titan Weapons (And Stalker StJ) slightly nerfed because of the massive outlier feeling that was produced by it (them). But I was yelled at for wanting them brought more in line. (Titan Weapons wouldn't be a difficult fix. Much of it's problems lie within Follow Through and Whirling Smash. Adjust them, done. Stalker Crushing Uppercut just needs to do less base, more Combo 3 damage. Fixed. Nerfed with out being nerfed.)
So, I've accepted the Forum Opinion, or at least the Scrapper/Stalker opinion, that everything else needs to be buffed to the outliers, not nerfed to the Average.
APPARENTLY I just ran into the OTHER half of the forums that thinks you need to nerf to the Average, not Buff to the Outliers. I REALLY can't win sometimes.
Personally? I want everything to average out again, be it through global nerfs or global buffs.
That's all.
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Originally Posted by Hopeling
Hey, thanks for the insult. I'm not claiming those issues are unsolvable, but they are more of an issue for TW than for other sets. And yes, tohit debuffs are an issue for every set, but they are even more of an issue for TW than other sets, because they limit your ability to hit AND also to gain momentum, which dramatically restricts even your ability to spam attacks and hope one gets through. Yes, there are things you can do to mitigate this - Focused Accuracy/Ageless Radial for debuff resistance, Build Momentum to get around it for 10 seconds at a time, yellow insps, etc. Like I said, not unsolvable, but it's still something you have to solve, which is not automatic.
Much the same for endurance issues. A decent build can overcome those issues, but still has to be mindful of them - Ageless like you said, for example, means you're not using Rebirth or Barrier. Yes, you can use Brawl/Envenomed Dagger/Build Momentum while running in/damage aura/whatever to interrupt enemies, and there are various other things you can do to mitigate various other situations, but those are again things you have to solve that other sets do not have to deal with at all. |
Also, I highlighted a major part of your argument, then point out every other 'slow animation' set and ask you this: Where's the justice there?
And, you make it sound like Ageless isn't one of the best Destinies in the game, for a "Perma" +10% Recharge, an immediately full Endurance Bar, and massive recovery that solves endurance problems for it's duration. It's a mini Speed Boost. Sure, it's not Barrier (Which isn't that great because Resistance/Defense cap in Teams isn't hard. At least Defense) or Rebirth (Probably the only other amazing one I feel, aside from Specific Clarion Cases).
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Originally Posted by Reppu
ToHit debuffs, while painful, affect EVERY set equally.
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This is not true, especially in the case of Titan Weapons.
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Originally Posted by Draeth Darkstar
Fun is subjective, numbers are objective. They aren't a part of the same discussion.
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I can say with near 100% authority that if either Plant Control or Fire Control were released today, people would be screaming that these are the worst sets ever, based on "the numbers" and those terrible powers, Smoke, Bonfire, Spore Burst and Tree of Life.
Oh, wait, that's not what you meant, was it?
you could have it all
My empire of dirt
I will let you down
I will make you <3