I feel bad for Statesman...

Is this thread really ready for Fuswanette?

I guess I must be! Sorry!

I really like the sound of the Statesman you're talking about there, and a while ago now I wrote some fiction myself called ironically enough 'Pandora' in which a young Kheldian meets Statesman and wonders why he is the way he is.

I mention this because I was struck by the parallel between that Statesman and one of my other great favorite fictional characters in The Doctor from Doctor Who. He's in very much a similar situation and has no direct peers anymore, and despite all his connection to humanity, is also substantially removed and just...not human. There's a wonderfully deep self-sacrificing heroism to the character and yet on the flipside, and sometimes it doesn't take much, there's a cold razor edge to him. I remember vividly an episode in which upon confronting an alien warlord, he specifically tells him he has one chance to walk away. After a fight above a trapdoor, he wins but doesn't kill the alien. Walking away, the alien rises to kill him and he says something along the lines of:

'Do you want to know what kind of man I am?' He springs the trapdoor, sending the warlord to his death. 'No second chances. I'm that kind of man, too.' And I thought that was so Statesman now. Don't pull that stuff with him. He knows better.


Oh, I totally and utterly agree with you about what's happened to Silver Age heroes and how they're being rewritten with modern sensibilities but this Silver Age nostalgia...and it really honestly doesn't work. I started a thread on the Hero/Villain Culture board about how many problems I had with the Infinite Crisis and Superboy-Prime in particular and I still do.

I'd really like to see Statesman 'cleaned up' as it were and his heroic qualities to shine through again more than the mess that I agree with you he is. Just before writing this reply I'd had a thought for an AE story called 'The Origin of Wisdom' as a sequel to the 'Origin of Power' arc....I may yet write it. I guess when it comes to these kinds of characters, I agree with Hickman's quote there; it just feels wrong when you try and make one sort of character another and I've tended to shunt aside the more asnine representations of Statesman.

I think the Incarnates story is underrated in a lot of ways because as you say we're seeing some of the more annoying or 'pompous' Incarnates dealing with the consequences of what they are and I really hope the game writers do more of that as the Incarnate trees open up for people. That first battle where you wipe out every single of one of the heavy hitters in the game bar Hamidon is a really salient reminder of that possibly being Statesman himself in that role...

So yeah. 'shipping aside, I'm still gonna stick up for the big guy. I kinda like that we have our own Superman and he's at his best something all heroes should aspire to be.


S.

What about relative dimensions in space?

Really? You think so? Hmmm...let me take a look...




Looks fine to me. I have no idea what you're talking about. No derailing here. Move along now.

I'm not stepping on the sexuality landmine this thread seems to want to become.

Regarding retconning characters, I think there are OK ways to make changes, even retroactively, as long as it doesn't slap longtime readers in the face (say, the way Alan Moore transformed Swamp Thing into an elemental, which didn't alienate anyone. Now if he only understood Rorschach/The Question/Mr. A). But some writers just say "ah, it was never that way, and even if it was, it sucked!" The first example that always comes to mind with this for me is the Adam Strange mini-series from the early 90s or so, where Strange cheats on his pregnant wife, as I recall. I always thought Strange was a very heroic type, and given that he went through hell every month to catch a zeta-beam just to BE with his girlfriend/wife, he seems like one of the last characters I would expect to go out and get some...er...strange (and as a guy who's been catching the United Airlines "zeta-beam" just to have a few brief moments with my g/f for seven years now, I relate to the guy). But no, the writer apparently wanted the shock value of making it an established character, and the name recognition that OTHER writers had earned for Adam Strange. Yeah, maybe I'm a "moldy fig," as they say, but it just seems to me that some things shouldn't be tinkered with on a whim.

I touch on this just a bit with the forthcoming Twilight Guardian #3 (hey, if I'm writing from all the way in Vancouver, I deserve at least one cheap plug).

Anyway, that was the only moment I saw of him that interested me. Edit: The core of a character is in the details. Unless you're dealing with extremely high fantasy (Lord of the Rings, for example), a character needs to be deep and rounded, like a Bon Bon of infinite nom-iness. What do they like? What don't like they? What are there flaws? What's Statesman's favorite book? A real character has answers to these questions.

Maybe it's because I don't play Heroes that much, but I don't ever see much besides "He's perfect; now go away."

Dark_Respite's Farewell Video: "One Last Day"
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)

I swear that I earnestly read this as "Manticore with States". It's seeped into my subconscious.


Either way, I updated my post with the exact description of the wine. I trust your knowledge of CoH lore that this is an awesome gift.

It cannot be unseen. Cue warren with another set of images...

--NT

Maybe he got ahold of one of Cupid's arrows.

You've been stood too close to GG one too many times Marcian

Now, though, I'm tempted to write an AE arc for States...hmm.

Originally Posted by Zwillinger GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.

Originally Posted by Captain_Photon NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

I get the impression Statesman doesn't read much, certainly not books. He's more of a doer than a thinker. My dad hasn't read a book since college and I think my brother has read maybe 5 since he put down the textbooks, so it's not like that would be unusual.

Edit: I'm ignoring the pictures because I like to sleep without bad dreams.

Marcian, were you able to catch the "Smoke and Mirrors" arc in the CoH comics, authored by Troy Hickman? Troy not only provided excellent takes on the Freedom Phalanx in general and Statesman in particular, but he told a ripping good yarn and provided the background for the statue that ultimately appeared in Kings Row. (The CoH comics are all downloadable; the arc is issues 4-6.)

Point being that Troy gives needed nuance to Statesman. Your perception of "He's perfect; no go away" certainly was not followed by any of the other comic authors, who made him a very arrogant, petty tyrant; Troy's depiction provided some depth and certainly a balance to that depiction.

And by gum, how is it you "don't play Heroes that much"? Hopefully you mean your DVD collection of the TV show and not CoH!

I'm going to try and go three pages without mentioning their passionate and secret affair. Let's see if I can do it.

Good man! I thought I was the only one. My Warshade did manage to get to 26 or so before going full villain though (not counting the throwaway hero that allowed me to play said Warshade, cause he was discarded two days after being created).

Some of my characters

You should come over to the blue side long enough to get a feel for Statesman and Faultline. Not in the way they feel each other, but ya know.

*positions earplugs to protect against deafening deluge of Fanbois screaming, "ME! ME! MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!"*

Mother Mayhem. Dominatrix is taken lol

By Ms. Liberty?