Stone Armor - Granite Armor
By
Afterimage,
Posted on: 2009-09-12 02:14 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
I have a 50 Stone Brute, and I wouldn't mind seeing it go, per se. I actually think you did a pretty nice job with the current one, and I don't dislike it - but if there was something that was also good, and had other benefits (a la customizability), I'd be glad to use that instead.
I like it as it is. if anything add an option in power customisation.
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I agree with most of this. Granite is also a state that can *not* be replicated|
Originally Posted by Goldbrick
I have a granite tank and a granite brute, both at 50. Thematically, I like that these characters turn entirely into a huge rocky monster. Nope, I don't care about seeing their skivvies, the granite armor is their costume.
My only very slight dissatisfaction, almost not worth mentioning, is that the granite form is the same form as the NPC rocky monsters (and it's just the one form for men and women). How about a unique player-only granite form, or half a dozen from which to choose? My vote would be to please let things stay the way they are, if the alternative you have in mind is patches or slabs of gray rock here and there. |
by buying the science booster(and you shouldn't have to, even if it could.) The
slow, lumbering movement; the heavy footfalls; those are also a big part of
the transformation, and would not be kept by merely changing the height slider.
If Granite is to be/needs to be changed, please either:
A) Make sure the old version is available as an option.
and/or
B) Make sure any new versions replicate these effects, to keep the "feel" of
granite intact through any changes.
My preference would be a series of unique models to choose from, along
*with* a less-obscuring version for those who must see their costume. If
this is not feasible, then I'd say keep it as is/add new unique models, as
the feel is more important than costume visibility.
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It would? There are epic ATs with far more than 9 powers per set, and they were able to add more powers to epic sets after i13 beta had already started.|
Originally Posted by SpittingTrashcan
The problem with making Stone a ten-power set is that BaB cannot do it. Not even if Castle helps. It'd require heavy engine changes, and that means much, much more effort than is likely to occur between now and I16 release.
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It COULD require such engine work but there is no evidence that it would. There is even a precedent of doing this to follow the cottage rule.
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| Well, that's one problem. The other problem is that everyone who isn't Stone Armor would immediately scream "Where's MY tenth power?!" |
A game is not supposed to be some kind of... place where people enjoy themselves!
Perfectly happy with any changes to Granite Form if if gets back the ability to use claws with Stone Armor.
Thank you.
With whatever you do to Granite, would it be possible to have female tanks maintain their female voices? It annoys me to no end that my female tank suddenly has a male voice when she activates her granite armor.
As for the armor itself..... I'm not sure if I want it the way it is, or have it like was suggested, with granite covering up parts of the body so that the costume still shows. If it stays the same, I think I'd like it if there were different models to choose from, so that even though you're in granite form and only granite is visible, there'd be different "styles" to help you look a little more unique.
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Out with the old, in with the new. I'd gladly welcome a change to the looks of granite.
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What he said....
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Originally Posted by Starcloud
Frankly, and in my opinion...
Granite is the only power in Stone Armor that *looks good*. Why? Because the other powers have gfx that are asymmetric and don't actually look at all protective. So if Granite were to be changed to look more like the other stone armors, it would look horrible. Ideally, I like the idea of each armor toggle adding "pieces" of *symmetric* protective plating, and when you hit Granite, it finishes the look and adds bulk. The current Stone Armors, with their randomly placed lumps of dirt and crystal, do not look good. |
I'm more than fine replacing it. I look forward to seeing what you guys come up with.
My friend refused to make stone armor brutes in the past solely because you lose all customization in the only form that matters.
oh and BaB, a scrap/metal option for earth powers would be awesome too, though if added would seem like earth gets all the customization while others gain none.
edit: yeah and I also agree with what was said above, in fact I had the same idea a while back for earth as well as ice armor, ill see if i can dig around and find my diagrams.
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as long as it doesn't look all clunky, I would be fine with it
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Originally Posted by BackAlleyBrawler
For those of you with Stone Armor characters, how attached are you to the current appearance of "Granite Armor"? There are a number of issues with Granite Armor that could be elegantly solved by changing the VFX of the power into something more akin to the other armor toggles in the set. IE, your player model and costume wouldn't go away, there would just be a new set of 'Granite' armor pieces overlaid.
I haven't made any decision to do this, it's just one of the options for dealing with the multiple issues we have with Granite Armor and I wanted to get a sense of how many of you guys wouldn't be able to adapt to a change like this. Before anyone asks, no...we couldn't have it both ways. |
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I don't care what i look like in Granite Armor, just as long as i'm still soft capped in smashing/lethal/energy/negative/fire/cold defense, and hard capped in smashing/lethal damage resistance >.>
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I think people are missing something very very important here. |
Originally Posted by Goldbrick
How about a unique player-only granite form, or half a dozen from which to choose?
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BaBs is saying "I can't do this." It's not because he hates Granite Armor or he thinks it's a laugh to make everyone go, "Why can't I customize Granite!" It's not because of an oversight or they didn't have time to do it. It's because he can't do it. He has tried every concievable method he can come up with to change allow the Granite model to be changed, and while he's come up with some ideas that have come close, not a one of them has ever worked.
So you have two choices:
1) Change Granite to blocks of stone that appear on the character's body, which can be customized for different colors and themes.
2) Leave Granite the way it is now, unable to be customized, forever.
There is no "Don't do that, I want to have a different model that makes me bigger, but make it so I can customize it." And there is no "Make it so I can customize it, but I want to be able to select the original model if I want." BaBs said that was impossible in his first post.
Personally, I think there are three choices:
1) Leave it as it is. Try to come up with a better solution, but if you can't, leave it so it can't be customized. We'd rather not be able to customize it than lose the change in costume.
2) Go ahead and change it. Try and make it as much like the original option as possible, make sure you get the same sound effects and effect on movement speed.
3) Keep trying to come up with a better solution. If you can't come up with a better solution within a given amount of time, say by Going Rogue, use this one.
Personally, I think that if they do implement this solution, and some method can be come up with to let you change your costume when you activate a power, then you've got the best solution. Just give us the ability to assign a costume to Granite. Let us set the base costume however we want, as a person or rock creature, and then select what additional bits we want to add as unique power effects. This could work the same way for Kheldians, and would work the same as the SoA starting costumes.
The only part of this idea that's currently missing is the tying the costume change to the power. And if this is developed as a QoL thing for Granite, I think it'll be useful to other powers as well, and can be forced for Kheldians, or any other form that isn't the normal human model. I personally would rather wait and see if my idea could be made to work by the time of Going Rogue, instead of using the interim solution and adding the ability to set costume later, but that's just me. My thought is that you can keep the Granite model as a unique costume, again like the SoA. But heck, I suppose that could be added later and just using your normal form as the "frame" for now would work.
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I agree, I have a shapeshifter concept who is supposed to be able to form metal as well as stone. I implemented him as Stone because it was closest, but I was going to try the Lava theme to see if I put a white or silver color as the lava, if it would look like ore bearing rock.
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Originally Posted by Taserak
oh and BaB, a scrap/metal option for earth powers would be awesome too, though if added would seem like earth gets all the customization while others gain none.
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I very much like the look of Granite Armor, and I would be for this change if the new armor looked good. If not, leave it unchanged.
I didn't read all of the post above me.
But here are my two cents: I love the fact that when I change into granite, I become this huge monstrosity and that I make this lumbering/pounding sound when I walk. Yeah, I suppose the fact that I can't distinguish my granite from the next person's granite is a bit annoyning.
But bottom line: Whatever change you make (if any), please keep the effect of "omg, that's one big (blank) dude." Even if it means that all granites continue to look alike. That's a small price to pay IMO.
I mean Granite Armor has a ton of negatives (and a ton of positives) (no pun intended) so I always felt that one of the rewards for dealing with being super slow is that at least we "look the part." Like "that's one big guy."
If I was a skinny looking character (in granite) and I moved really slowly, it would just serve to tick me off. As a big guy, it's like "you just wait till I get over there, you're gonna get it."
Keep the mountain of destruction coming at you look.
While I like the feel of Granite being an "ultimate" armor, I would love to (a) not look like a DE and (b) not look exactly like everyone else in Granite Armor. So I would be in favor of the change. I would love to see a new set, however, that still gave you that "ultimate" feeling.
And yeah, I'd like to see the Rock Armor changed to be more symetric and less ugly. It is hard to make a character look good while Rock Armor is on. Especially on Controllers -- I purposefully do not choose the Earth APP on some controllers because of how it makes the character look bad. Some kind of stone plates would be better . . . and maybe a lot more stone plates for Granite.
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Haven't read all the posts.
For the sake of the comic book in my head, Granite armor has looked more like your toon turning into a statue version of itself. Much like the statues that we find around Paragon.
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I would love the ability to customize granite armor.
I'm not sure if it's possible to use different geometry as options for an armor toggle -- we've only seen different textures on the same stuff so far -- but if it's possible, I'd imagine there will be a bunch of really awesome options for granite.
I'd be all over that.
Lose the current Granite mode.
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Look at that. A full-grown woman pulling off pigtails. Her crazy is off the charts.
As previously stated while I'm all for changing the look of Granite and trust that you guys would come up with something really cool looking, perhaps the best solution to the lack of uniqueness some feel with the set is to allow Stone tankers more variety in the powers they select instead of their appearance? Maybe it could work like a minor version of what Kheldians or VEATS have in that they could unlock branching powers which would allow for wider diversity among the hulking big lugs?
The change sounds good to me , I am not fond of the current granite form.
I don't have my heart set on either the way it is currently or the change proposed, but I have to say, BABs: THANKS for askin! 
I would favor a change to Granite, but I think my vote should count for less as I don't play the set.
I might if Granite was changed, but not a sure thing.
I haven't made any decision to do this, it's just one of the options for dealing with the multiple issues we have with Granite Armor and I wanted to get a sense of how many of you guys wouldn't be able to adapt to a change like this.
Before anyone asks, no...we couldn't have it both ways.
My only very slight dissatisfaction, almost not worth mentioning, is that the granite form is the same form as the NPC rocky monsters (and it's just the one form for men and women). How about a unique player-only granite form, or half a dozen from which to choose?
My vote would be to please let things stay the way they are, if the alternative you have in mind is patches or slabs of gray rock here and there.
One thing to consider is that the non-granite rock armors are already patchy and give some view of the costume underneath. If granite is also like that, won't you diminish even further the desire to take the non-granite armors post-32?
Thanks for I16, by the way. Really great work.
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