Champions Online: just doesn't cut it.
By
Ael Rhiana,
Posted on: 2012-10-06 24:47 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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Sounds like the entire MMO market right now.
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Originally Posted by Chase_Arcanum
In some ways, it "tried to be different" so hard that it took strategies that were inferior to its big sister just so it COULD BE different.
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I actually feel the exact opposite is true.|
Originally Posted by Dz131
DCUO has the best combat system, where reactions and decisions actually matter. COH and CO are just spam spam to your hearts content
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The main thing I remember from when I played DCUO at launch was mashing my mouse buttons, and hoping the combo I wanted to fire actually fired because the difference between a "Hold Mouse Button", and "Tap Mouse Button" seemed to be 1/100th of a second.
If I wanted to use the simple TAP+HOLD attack twice, it would fire the TAP+HOLD+TAP+HOLD attack once, or vice versa.
That along with the non-chat system, no-cursor to interact with the environment, and the limited costume, and power options made me stop playing after the free month.
My main is an invulnerable super strength tank. Why am I forced to take ice powers?
CO is miles better IMO. Yes, it is like COH-lite, or COH for kids, but it is a nice change of pace from CoH, and I would play it when I got burnt out from playing CoH too much.
I actually like the bold outlines. It makes it look more like a comic book. The game does have a more cartoony feel than CoH, though.
I will say that I still like CoH's graphics better even if it's an old engine. I've been paying much more attention to the details since Aug. 31st, and realized I took alot of this game for granted, especially after taking some time off to play other games like DDO, CO, STO, DCUO, WoW, AoC, and GW2 for a week.
I also like how you can tap, or charge up powers in CO, pick up stuff and throw them, and lunge attacks are great. Having almost no cooldown on attacks is nice, but it also means you really only need 1 single target, and 1 AoE attack, which can be a bit boring.
I will miss the toggles in CoH. Being able to select an attack, and have it queued to fire when it recharges is great. This is more directed at WoW, since I find I spend way too much time staring at my power bar, waiting to see which attack is ready, or if one of them procs. Luckily, you don't have to move around too much in combat there.
There always seems to be a trade-off for design decisions. Like being able to choose any Role(Tank,support,damage), and the free-form system in CO is nice because it gives you freedom of options, but it also may be one of the reasons teaming isn't as robust as in CoH. Most people will gravitate to a jack-of-all trades build, and cover any weaknesses they have, so teaming isn't as desirable, and when a team is formed there is no real synergy. I'm not for a strict Holy Trinity-type game, but somewhere in the middle like CoH really balanced it well.
Another factor that seems to hurt teaming in the other MMOs I've played is Open world vs. Instanced.
I've never had much luck getting teams to do open world stuff. Instances seem to be custom made for teams, and most games only use instances for major dungeons/lairs. Having most missions instanced really promoted teaming in CoH IMO, although it would be nice if there was more diversity of maps. Adding new zones would be great for CoH, but I think I'd rather have them make tons of different maps for instances.
Anyways, everybody has there own opinion. I'll be dividing my time between CO, WoW, and maybe STO when the apocalypse happens. If I see ya, I see ya. If not, god speed.
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well, I cant read the mind of the op, but in defense of apologetics, its a word that has kind of drifted in meaning. an apologist is someone in the greek legal system who defends any position. as opposed to the katagoria, who takes the offensive position. so if you like co, then technically you, and i, are an apologist, because you are in some way defending the game. if nothing else, you are keeping company with Plato.|
Originally Posted by GreenLantern68
Toast,
I take exception to your term "CO apologist". My wife and I have been part of Paragon City for over six years...nearly seven...and I'm playing CO because it's giving me the best superheroic bang for my buck now that CoX is shutting down. I'm not going to apologize for that. Nor would I expect anyone who wants to be part of DCUO to apologize for their choice, or you to apologize for the fact that you don't like CO. Some people drive Fords, others drive Chevys. Doesn't make one better than the other, and I doubt anyone apologizes for their choice. |
Well, just to give another perspective. CoH was the first and only MMO I ever played because I'm a comix nerd, not a "gamer". I played for over almost 8 years and my son literally grew up playing the game. We still have the first hero he made when he was 8 years old. I'm a realist, so WHILE I've been supporting and participating in all of Titan's efforts to save CoH, I've also been making up my mains on CO just in case and to keep them alive.
CO is not welcoming or inviting at first (I don't mean the community, they're less mature but not bad 
, I mean the game itself). You have to push through and stay with it. But after a significant amount of time spent acclimating to and learning the game, last weekend my son (who is now 16!) and I had a frikkin awesome time being chased around by giant Destroids and swimming through flooded sewers fighting sharks to get to the pumps to drain the sewers so we could escape, and playing a really creepy arc that felt like John Carpenters "The Thing".
I mean we had a ball. Laughing and jaws dropping at some of the cool &#% that happened.
And, if you look up Pencil and Paper Champions lore, it's rich and brilliant.
CO is not CoX. But, while it has it's bad points, it's got some amazing good points. It's better and worse than CoX in a lot of ways, which makes it more of an uneven game, but ultimately a good game if you stick with it.
It's a more lethal game and, just take my advice, EMBRACE blocking, don't fight it.
And if we can connect to the devs over there and get a relationship like we had at CoX, the potential is exciting.
Uhmm APOLOGIST
In other words...people who will defend CO over and over...and have no problem telling others that their opinion is wrong because CO is "awesome."
I am not ANTI CO... I just don't like it. I wanted to like it because I have a couple friends who play it now. Kinda like I wanted to like TSW because I have friends who play that, but neither of them interests me in the slightest. I am not a gamer. I am a COHer. CoH is the ONLY MMO I have tried and liked.
Just because CO is a super hero game doesn't elevate it's play-ability for me.
This whole thing with NCSoft has turned me off A LOT form MMOs.... I do not see the point in becoming invested in something when the virtual rug can be pulled in an instant without notice. EVEN if I liked CO remotely...I doubt I would play/sub...simply not worth spending the time in something that will more than likely be gone in a few years.
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Originally Posted by GreenLantern68
Toast,
I take exception to your term "CO apologist". My wife and I have been part of Paragon City for over six years...nearly seven...and I'm playing CO because it's giving me the best superheroic bang for my buck now that CoX is shutting down. I'm not going to apologize for that. Nor would I expect anyone who wants to be part of DCUO to apologize for their choice, or you to apologize for the fact that you don't like CO. Some people drive Fords, others drive Chevys. Doesn't make one better than the other, and I doubt anyone apologizes for their choice. |
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Originally Posted by Paladiamors
I love you, I Burnt the Toast!
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But Plato was a dick.
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Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
well, I cant read the mind of the op, but in defense of apologetics, its a word that has kind of drifted in meaning. an apologist is someone in the greek legal system who defends any position. as opposed to the katagoria, who takes the offensive position. so if you like co, then technically you, and i, are an apologist, because you are in some way defending the game. if nothing else, you are keeping company with Plato.
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Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
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This just makes you ignorable.
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Originally Posted by I Burnt The Toast
Uhmm APOLOGIST
In other words...people who will defend CO over and over...and have no problem telling others that their opinion is wrong because CO is "awesome." |
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
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If you look deeply enough from a culture different enough, I suspect many respected people would not look particularly good. that's the good thing about our forefathers, they are too long dead for us to remember what they did to get where they were.
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Originally Posted by BellaStrega
But Plato was a dick.
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I have no real point there, I just like linking that page.
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Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
If you look deeply enough from a culture different enough, I suspect many respected people would not look particularly good. that's the good thing about our forefathers, they are too long dead for us to remember what they did to get where they were.
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Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
its all good, neither did I really.
completely off topic, but given your seeming affection for computer rpgs, have you been following project eternity? Obsidian going for a more classic styled iso rpg, with some venerable names a the helm, might be up your alley. It has monks as a class, so i'm in already
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You have my attention.|
Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
its all good, neither did I really.
completely off topic, but given your seeming affection for computer rpgs, have you been following project eternity? Obsidian going for a more classic styled iso rpg, with some venerable names a the helm, might be up your alley. It has monks as a class, so i'm in already |
I did not know about it, but now I must have it.
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
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Monks, eh? I like me some monk fu. I'll have to look that up when I get a chance.
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Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
its all good, neither did I really.
completely off topic, but given your seeming affection for computer rpgs, have you been following project eternity? Obsidian going for a more classic styled iso rpg, with some venerable names a the helm, might be up your alley. It has monks as a class, so i'm in already |
Goodbye may seem forever
Farewell is like the end
But in my heart's the memory
And there you'll always be
-- The Fox and the Hound
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I totally agree|
Originally Posted by I Burnt The Toast
This whole thing with NCSoft has turned me off A LOT form MMOs.... I do not see the point in becoming invested in something when the virtual rug can be pulled in an instant without notice. |
While I am liking CO so far (though its animation and story writing need work) , and I have enjoyed playing STO on and off since It came out (more so lately for obvious reasons), I will never invest in them the way I did with CoH.
Infact, it would have to be nothing short of amazing for me to ever put up the cash the way I did with CoH. Look, im not even a huge comic book fan. The only comic I ever read (and own actually) is a couple of old, Rocko's Modern Life comics.
I always played First person shooters or stratergy games, but a friend introduced me to CoH and both my wife and I picked up on it. It was fun, easy to learn, rewarding, both my wife and I have yet to find a game as easy to team in as CoH. Plus CoH was vibrant! We had real communication and understanding with our devs, something you'll never see in another video game. Even with all the time we've spent in STO, trying to communicate with anyone higher up is next to impossible, and i've been told by a few to 'forget it' when it comes to CO.
But yes, to sum it up, I will be playing CO and STO. We have friends in both, but you'll never see me put as much into them as our City of Heroes.
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Combat Kangaroo Rifle/Energy/Mace/Spiritual Blaster
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Tribal Arc Shield/Elec/Mu/Spiritual Tanker
As the communications with the devs. Kinda yes and kinda no.
I was fiddling last night in the Whiteout missions (currently referred to as "The bug-fest from hell!")
I happened to see one of the GMs making an announcement, introduced myself and asked how long should I expect to wait for a GM. He actually replied almost instantly and was quite nice. But apparently all the GMs go home for the day. So no shift work. Meaning if you get stuck or there's a problem overnight, you're boned.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
From I Burnt the Toast-This whole thing with NCSoft has turned me off A LOT form MMOs.... I do not see the point in becoming invested in something when the virtual rug can be pulled in an instant without notice. EVEN if I liked CO remotely...I doubt I would play/sub...simply not worth spending the time in something that will more than likely be gone in a few years.
I feel the same- NCSoft has damaged the whole MMO market to me. I tried Champs . I wanted to like it as I am a PNP Champions player and gamemaster sinse 1984. I hated the tutorial, limiter power choices and costume choices. Of course I could pay but look how that turned out in COH.
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Well. The way I have it figured.|
Originally Posted by Optimus_Dex
From I Burnt the Toast-This whole thing with NCSoft has turned me off A LOT form MMOs.... I do not see the point in becoming invested in something when the virtual rug can be pulled in an instant without notice. EVEN if I liked CO remotely...I doubt I would play/sub...simply not worth spending the time in something that will more than likely be gone in a few years.
I feel the same- NCSoft has damaged the whole MMO market to me. I tried Champs . I wanted to like it as I am a PNP Champions player and gamemaster sinse 1984. I hated the tutorial, limiter power choices and costume choices. Of course I could pay but look how that turned out in COH. |
1: Play the game on F2P for a month or two to see if you can hack the general gameplay without wanting defenestrate your computer.
2: Pay for a month or two of sub time to try out some of the other classes and freeform.
3: Figure out if you think game has approximately 2-3 years left. Buy an LTS (if available). You're essentially covered for any and everything.
That's not just for CO. That's kinda for any game you're looking at.
I just got lucky that I was comped for mine.
It's not precisely my cup of tea. But, hey. I can't argue with "free".
That and all the legacy stuff I've racked up is freaking incredible.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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No need to be insulting about it. Like you say, it's not for everyone. Doesn't mean the ones who it IS "for" are wrong.
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Originally Posted by I Burnt The Toast
Tried it again...still don't like it. Three strikes you are out.
I get that there are CO apologists on these forums, but it's not for everyone...kinda like CoH wasn't for everyone. |
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I have been playing Champions Online and enjoying it for the most part but I had a mission last night that I almost pulled my hair out over.
I have noticed this in both CO and DC Online, so perhaps it's a standard MMO feature that COH did not adopt, but in those games if you leave the instance all the enemies you fought respawn. And in CO, at least, when you die the enemies regain full health.
Can make for a LONG night... o.0
My COX Fanfiction:
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yeah but kind of understand the reason that enemy gain full health in CO. There is no debt and the pentalty for dying is less than slapping a wrist with a feather otherwise and anything would be easy if you threw yourself at it enough and wittle down the health. When you die, the enemy regaining health causes you to change your approach or else you will stay in the same boat over and over. I think without it then all content would basically be cae walk and one tactic "Just keep throwing yourself over there take out 10 hp and repeat process for the next hundred times until it dies." Now that tactic is out the window, after a couple of deaths or even one, it's more like, "Hmm what do I need to do to fight this guy or shall I call it a day because I'm clearly over my head with this guy?" |
Originally Posted by BlueBattler
I have been playing Champions Online and enjoying it for the most part but I had a mission last night that I almost pulled my hair out over.
I have noticed this in both CO and DC Online, so perhaps it's a standard MMO feature that COH did not adopt, but in those games if you leave the instance all the enemies you fought respawn. And in CO, at least, when you die the enemies regain full health. Can make for a LONG night... o.0 |
And the respawn thing means you have to be prepared before you go in. On one hand it can be annoying but it makes resetting missions easy for the stray bug I heard that can happen. Compared to here where it's at the mercy of the GM getting there in a timely manner or else having to restart anyways and hopping that you have a another mission to pick and or having to log out.
-Female Player-
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Originally Posted by mauk2
Evil_Legacy became one of my favorite posters with two words.
"Kick Rocks." I laffed so hard. Never change, E_L! |
Im going to miss the hell out my Titan Weapons character...
Its been a long time without playing as suscriber for CO, so I havent tried Earth, Wind, revamp for Martial arts and the Heavy Weapons...
So I got a question for CO players in this forums:
Are Heavy Weapons fun in CO? Like having nice combos and similar powers as Titan Weapons in CoH?
Not sure if I should give it a try as a VIP, feels clunky compared to fluid combat and animations in DCUO.
Thanks!
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It's fun to me in CO. I kind of like it better over there. It does nice damage but doesnt feel endurance heavy and thus allows more attacks. It's over all about the same speed as titan weapons, a little slower than with momentum but hell of a lot faster than the initial COX attack but just as fluid, to me.
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Originally Posted by Angelxman81
Im going to miss the hell out my Titan Weapons character...
Its been a long time without playing as suscriber for CO, so I havent tried Earth, Wind, revamp for Martial arts and the Heavy Weapons... So I got a question for CO players in this forums: Are Heavy Weapons fun in CO? Like having nice combos and similar powers as Titan Weapons in CoH? Not sure if I should give it a try as a VIP, feels clunky compared to fluid combat and animations in DCUO. Thanks! |
-Female Player-
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Originally Posted by mauk2
Evil_Legacy became one of my favorite posters with two words.
"Kick Rocks." I laffed so hard. Never change, E_L! |
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TY so much!|
Originally Posted by Evil_Legacy
It's fun to me in CO. I kind of like it better over there. It does nice damage but doesnt feel endurance heavy and thus allows more attacks. It's over all about the same speed as titan weapons, a little slower than with momentum but hell of a lot faster than the initial COX attack but just as fluid, to me.
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Im enjoying doing crazy fun combos in DCUO at the moment, but only playing early stages of that game.
But maybe I will try a VIP month for CO too.
Dont want to get too deep into any MMO game again... Its so painful right now to see CoH fade away after 6 years playing
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Heavy Weapons are probably the coolest set in Champions on a purely visual level. They're all one-handed as far as I can tell, but the animations are VERY good for all of them, in stark contrast to... Practically all the other animations across the whole of the game. The weapons FEEL heavy and cumbersome and really really powerful, especially on the auto-attack, bizarrely enough.|
Originally Posted by Angelxman81
Are Heavy Weapons fun in CO? Like having nice combos and similar powers as Titan Weapons in CoH?
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Overall, I think presentation is what's killing Champions for me. The game plays well enough, but nearly everything in it just looks stiff and stilted, from running to jumping to attacking with all but a select few skills. I could barely play City of Heroes with a weapon I didn't like or a powerset with crappy animations (Dark Melee, I mean you!), but Champions is seemingly a WHOLE GAME of this.
I don't know, maybe I just haven't found the good ones.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Well I been playing CO now for the last couple weeks (picked up my sub from 2009) been playing my freeform char. (Kobolt) from when I was a subber. But I for one love the comic book feel (big comic book geek) and the corny play of the game, it is and does feel clunky...but Im not gonna compare CO to the most awesome game ever made (CoH) 'cause thats not fair but that being said CO will do for my super-hero fix for now!
p.s. tried DCUO no likey...hmmm thats about it.
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Except I don't hate it, I just find it disappointing.
alternate universe tag line:
Champions Online: Not Sucky Enough to Hate!
Same end result though, too many games in the world to spend time and energy on one that disappoints.
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