Call to Action: Contact NCsoft Directory
By
2short2care,
Posted on: 2012-09-14 23:19 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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And you don't even have any clue what involvement he had with the killing of CoX. You simple assume. Your entire opinion is shaped upon assumptions without any evidence to back any of them up. You've decided that he must be like X, so anything you see you twist in such a way to try to make it evidence of him being like X.|
Originally Posted by Ashe T'Dust
Its not the only reason, but it does fit my narrow and shrinking view of the person.
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If you want to be a crazy conspiracy theorist (and labeled as such), such a mindset works perfectly fine. But not so much if you want to actually get anything done... which I'm doubting more and more.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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All evidence to date shows that the positive, well spoken members of this community outnumber the naysayers by nearly 10 to 1, and the trolls by even more.|
Originally Posted by jeanngray
Not to sound like a negative Nancy but I agree completely with this. It's like giving the trolls the keys to the castle or worse.
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Like it or not, the information is out there now. The trolls will be trolling. Our choice now becomes whether to drown out that unhelpful signal with something better, or stand still wringing our hands worrying about it and doing nothing.
We can't afford to do nothing anymore.
I'll say this: putting these emails out there "for the world to see" (essentially) would not have been the course of action I would have recommended. That said, the deed is done, and as others have said, what more is there left to lose?
I will email them at some point over this weekend I suppose.
@Winter. Because I'm Winter. Period.
I am a blaster first, and an alt-oholic second.
I would have waited at least until mid November to do this, the way I see it is, if any company were to take over the game they would need at least a month to come up with a bid after they already worked out the budget they would put to this game, then they would need to work out staffing, servers etc. Then of course there is the slow negotiation stage of coming up with the right money with NCsoft.
Too many 50's to list here's a few you may know.
Slazenger, Area51, Area53, Area54, Erruption, Mind Plague, Thresher, Sheath, Broadside, Debt
I don't see it as spamming them. What I do see it as is passionate customers contacting them in a civil manner telling them why CoH is important to them etc.
If I was a CEO of a game and closed it down and received a couple emails - to me that is indicative of the population - a couple passionate people. Now if I received 20,000 emails of a product...that sends me more of a message. I do think it is important that the emails are courteous and professional. And I do NOT think it should be a scripted email that is simply cut and pasted...that has no meaning behind it. I think people should be encouraged to simply tell their stories about CoH, why it is important to them, asking them to reconsider shutting it down, and thanking them for taking the time to read their thoughts.
No threats of a boycott
No Demands
Focus on the community
Focus on what the game means to you
Ask for them to please reconsider their initial choice and be open to other options
To me THAT is the format each email should take...personal, professional, and focused.
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Originally Posted by Paladiamors
I love you, I Burnt the Toast!
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First: Funny how some of the posts are sparring about one liners... *rolleyes*
Now then...
>Cross posted from Titan<
I waffled a little on this. I truly did. On the one hand, sure, it's rude, and they'll be getting a ton of crap from some seriously angry people, and that is the damn shame of it all right there.
And as such I on the face of it wanted no part of it. Because I don't want to be part of those who would threaten and shout at the people who did, in fact, keep this game going for 8 years. Let us not forget that.
And I thought... I had other things to do... still do, they're delayed now... but I thought... and decided... if I don't do it now, I won't get an opportunity later.
So I sent a letter to the three of them. It took me an hour to write, and I'm sure it's completely inadequate and wrong of me to have done so. But I did it anyway, because time is short, they're not talking, so I'm going to speak up, and directly. Frack it.
Here is what I sent them, for better or worse. And if you guys/gals have a problem with it, well... I'm sorry I disappointed in some way, but It Is Done.
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Mike
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Dear Sirs and Madam: I am hoping that I may somehow get in before the deluge of emails that are probably coming your way. I am hopeful you will understand the passion for which some of the people who are going to email you, since your addresses have become public. But it is my belief that not speaking now is a mistake. Time is short, and any effort needs to be swift, and as such, I am writing to you directly. --- The unexpected decision to close Paragon Studios and sunset City of Heroes was a shock two weeks ago. It still is. Many would (and have done so, sad to say) decry this decision, simply because their 'toy' is being taken away. I do not believe I am one of those people. I would not fight for just the game, that is self-serving of an individual at best, and is not the only reason why I'm writing you. I personally can understand business decisions regarding product. If the product isn't selling, or more to the point, isn't generating profit, then it is something that cannot sustain itself, and it needs to be taken off the market. To read what I have, this was not the case for City of Heroes. There appear to be other titles in your library that would have been a better choice in this respect, to read the reports. This sows confusion among the customers. Then there is this: That Blade and Soul is now being offered just after, and that Guild Wars 2 was released just before, the announcement of the closure of City of Heroes simply reeks of a push to get us to play something else in your library rather than carry on with our preferred game of choice. That there was also more content (and that content was to be, as is said in the community, "HUGE") on the cusp of being released 'Live' in City of Heroes just about drives the stake in on this theory. Further, the complete silence about the closure from NCSoft, apart from Paragon Studios posting it on the main website for City of Heroes, and the following PR statement from your company just after.. more confusion. "Why is NCSoft treating us this way?" people are wondering, myself among them. To be quite frank, your continued silence, and your corporate management of these three titles (as well as the five titles in five years being shut down, including City of Heroes) has many in the community of City of Heroes.. if not an extended community of MMOs.. asking these questions: 1) Why would anyone play anything to do with NCSoft if the end result is a 'lightswitch' end to the game, and not talk about why that is happening? 2) Why would anyone play antything that they can create characters in, make relationships in, only to have it killed unexpectedly by a board meeting? As an example, Tablua Rasa was not 'making it'. It's closure was expected. There was no doubt. But City of Heroes? Nothing so far as can be seen proves it wasn't fine and profitable as it was. This closure puts confusion and doubt about all MMOs, and damages the reputation of the entire industry. In my opinion, NCSoft would be very ill advised, from that particular standpoint, to let City of Heroes or any other property be closed down, and not just for the well being of your company, but ALL of the online gaming industry. --- From a personal standpoint.. As long as this action continues to its inevitable conclusion, I have no choice but to do what I think is right for myself. Which is, namely, never play any MMO again. Never play anything where I might create something that is under the control of another entity. Because I will simply not pour any money or time into anything of this nature to have it ripped away unemotionally, unexpectedly. Not going to happen. It may extend to most of the online gaming industry, to be honest. And definitely, NCSoft's reputation is tarnished by the way this closure was/is being done, and as such.. I cannot support your company's efforts beyond November 30, 2012, I am sorry to have to say. Barring something saving City of Heroes and your company is widely known to have helped that cause, in which case.. perhaps I will try GW2 or Blood and Soul.... In City of Heroes, I made characters I care about. They are being taken away. This is not trivial. Without the work of Paragon Studios and your company, I would not have had that experience, nor that creativity.. that continues today. I make other characters still, more costumes.. But even that pales into the sudden requirement of the entirety of Paragon Studios being told to go work elsewhere, your profitable game, the hard work and effort into the art, the community they've helped generate.. all that means nothing anymore.. that had to hurt them worse than anything in the City of Heroes community can express. I do not know if you saw the news about the community buying the entire staff of Paragon a dinner, in a window of around 3 hours to generate the monies. I myself was unable to donate to that particular idea, as it was done and over before I could hit [Donate!], and hope (as do others) that there will be other opportunities to do similar acts for the fantastic people who made and worked on City of Heroes. I do not believe there is any precedent in the history of MMOs or online gaming like it. This is how much we care about the fantastic people who made this work of art. This is part of what you are closing, a fantastic community of players, developers and moderators of the forums and the game, and the like of which one would be hard pressed to find elsewhere. I must say this: I would pay double the subscription fee... perhaps more... if it would have helped. As it was, once I subscribed all those years ago, I never stopped paying.. even if I wasn't playing for whatever personal reasons, the subscription kept on, waiting for my return, and return I did. Often. And with new ideas to try. The game still has so many years of play left for a lot of us, because we haven't done it all yet. There is nothing like City of Heroes out there. Not. One. Thing. Please, somehow, let this work of art be saved. Somewhere. In it's 'final form' if that is how it is to be, even, would be a better fate than burying this fantastic machine of creativity and expression. Do not let your hard work, Cryptic/Paragon Studios hard work, and frankly, all the players hard work in their characters be lost. There simply has to be some way other than complete closure. --- There is one thing I'd like to say before I close. I appreciate your part in allowing City of Heroes to be alive for the time it was. I am fully aware that without your help over the years, Paragon, and before it, Cryptic, would not have had City of Heroes see the light of day. We would not have had the expansions, the new content, get the opportunity to play the 'other side' in City of Villains, get to be in between a Hero and a Villain in Going Rogue, nor had the artistic abilities that are possible in the Mission Architect system. We would not have gotten to know and discuss things with the Developers and Moderators. We would not have gotten to know and talk with people from all over the world. So sincerely, and honestly: Thank you for the grand ride. Thank you very much indeed. I truly wish it didn't have to end. @houtex in City of Heroes houtex in the City of Heroes Forums. |
August 31, 2012. A Day that will Live in Infamy. Or Information. Possibly Influence. Well, Inf, anyway. Thank you, Paragon Studios, for what you did, and the enjoyment and camaraderie you brought.
This is houtex, aka Mike, signing off the forums. G'night all. - 10/26/2012
Well... perhaps I was premature about that whole 'signing off' thing... - 11-9-2012
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Originally Posted by Codewalker
All evidence to date shows that the positive, well spoken members of this community outnumber the naysayers by nearly 10 to 1, and the trolls by even more.
Like it or not, the information is out there now. The trolls will be trolling. Our choice now becomes whether to drown out that unhelpful signal with something better, or stand still wringing our hands worrying about it and doing nothing. We can't afford to do nothing anymore. |
Oh I have been following and know we have the numbers and will not be "doing nothing" as I have been active so far. Doesn't change the fact that I don't feel good about this move is all. Nothing wrong with voicing concern, figure it's fair. If I thought what was done could be undone with regards to posting the e-mails...well, I'd then be delusional. Preparing for the worst and hoping for the best sums it up nicely for my views on this one.
Liberty!
Black Dawn/Shattered Dawn
Chaos Legion
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You forget.... Moderation. While I think most of us are civil there are enough left to there own ends that are enough and it doesn't take much negitivity to turn some one off the whole thing. |
Originally Posted by Codewalker
All evidence to date shows that the positive, well spoken members of this community outnumber the naysayers by nearly 10 to 1, and the trolls by even more.
Like it or not, the information is out there now. The trolls will be trolling. Our choice now becomes whether to drown out that unhelpful signal with something better, or stand still wringing our hands worrying about it and doing nothing. We can't afford to do nothing anymore. |
Also note they are examples in this very thread that shows not every one is planning on being civil. How many people haven't posted and send out less than nice emails?
Something witty and profound
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What's important is how THEY see it.
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Originally Posted by I Burnt The Toast
I don't see it as spamming them. What I do see it as is passionate customers contacting them in a civil manner telling them why CoH is important to them etc....
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Something witty and profound
I understand why some people don't agree with this decision, but I also understand why Tony made it.
More to the point, every troll that read this post already sent some very angry sounding emails. Maybe several.
If you want our community to be well represented, the good emails have to outnumber the troll emails. Even if you would not have made the decision Tony did, it's important that you still send an email.
@Rorn ---- Blue Baron ---- Guardian
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Not really.|
Originally Posted by Fista
What's important is how THEY see it.
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If there is any deal in the offing, however unlikely, then it's not going to be sunk because Mr Kim receives a few emails from angry and upset players. Regardless, I'm starting to feel that that's not the issue.
For the most part the CoH community has been walking on eggshells to avoid 'offending' NCsoft. That's laudable, but they have done nothing whatsoever to earn that. From a customer service point of view NCsoft's response, or lack thereof, is nothing short of disgraceful.
'Cultural differences' be damned. They do business in the west and it's absurd to think that they don't know how their silence is being viewed. That they don't care - that I can believe, though it says awful things about how they do business. Some languages are universal, and right now NCsoft are speaking fluently in the language of 'we don't give a damn about our customers.'
Some of these letters are very well written. It's going to take me some time to come up with what I want to say.. Either way, hopefully we see some evidence of listening soon.
"Don't you know dead is spelled m-e-n-t-a-l in CoH? - SapphireShot
I feel ill.
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
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Imagine a world where Monday is too late...|
Originally Posted by Jack_NoMind
But I'm going to wait until Monday before doing this [...]
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...
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It's also important to note that those addresses are not the personal addresses of the people indicated. We're not bothering them at home. They are @ncsoft.com, so even though they may be obfuscated, they are still business addresses. They are there to be used for things relating to NCSoft business, and that's exactly what this effort is.|
Originally Posted by NightshadeLegree
For the most part the CoH community has been walking on eggshells to avoid 'offending' NCsoft. That's laudable, but they have done nothing whatsoever to earn that. From a customer service point of view NCsoft's response, or lack thereof, is nothing short of disgraceful.
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I don't think the line that many people think is being crossed is actually one at all.
houtex....I salute you. Your letter made me cry. If we all can send in letters, half as good as yours, our point will get across, loud and clear. NC Soft needs to understand that this community of gamers is different than the others. Nasty, poorly worded letters will get us nowhere. No one hears the person who is loud, and says nothing of value, but everyone hears those who are vocal, and offer a positive message. Again, houtex, I salute you. An inspiring letter. And to Tony V...you, sir, get a standing ovation from me, and all my alts. We are lucky to have you!
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You do realize that NCSoft is in the position of power here, right? They literally own City of Heroes. The best we can hope for is to slightly steer them into a direction we want. We can't force their hand.|
Originally Posted by NightshadeLegree
For the most part the CoH community has been walking on eggshells to avoid 'offending' NCsoft. That's laudable, but they have done nothing whatsoever to earn that. From a customer service point of view NCsoft's response, or lack thereof, is nothing short of disgraceful.
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It doesn't matter if they've made mistakes or have treated us poorly, being ******* won't get us results we want. If we want to be heard, we have to persuade them.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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Sending emails to these addresses is no worse (and possibly no better) than sending physical letters (or packages of capes and masks) or emails to publicly listed addresses.
I'm not a follower (hah, that is quite the understatement, but how do you express such things via text to strangers... it just comes off as arrogant blah-blah-blah-ing, but I put it here just in case you choose to believe me), believe me I tend to lead my own initiatives through most everything I do (no doubt, sometimes to a fault).
However, in this case, I trust in TonyV's judgment call here. He could certainly be wrong. He may not know a thing more than I do... But I am 1) figuring that he has more of an inside track, regarding the people of Paragon Studios (again, I could be wrong, but I have no belief that TonyV would or should out any such information he may have gained through such contacts) 2) following his lead on this, because I am in with him and this movement.
If he makes this move without our full support, it'll pale in comparison to the move with our support.
So, he's called for this... and I'm backing him, because I believe it's in our best interest for what we want.
Again, I do not tend to follow another at all, but I understand the concept of sticking together and I am sticking with TonyV on this.
Oh, if I have an issue, I will question, I will voice my opinions and I may balk... But, for me, this is not one of those times where I feel any need to do as such.
Was I surprised to see this step now? Yep!
Do I recognize TonyV's own uncertainty and displeasure at taking this step now? Yeah, I think he expressed himself very well in this message.
We're all just humans (out of game) and I'm willing to move forward and go along with the informed decision that a guy (who I have been trusting, relying upon, and benefiting from through all of this so far) has made.
I'd never ask anyone to step beyond what they truly believe is right. However, this is just a case of sending emails to another address. It's not really that large of a deal.
It may have a beneficial impact. If this company is really going to sell things and/or play ball, any potential "spam" is not going to stop that or make them look less favorably upon us and/or the business aspects of allowing CoH to continue (legally).
At best, in my opinion, this (just as the cape and mask initiative) may lend a result something like the trial in the movie "A Miracle on 34th Street". An clear outpouring of support, unmistakable in size and intent.
It could impact the person behind the screen.
It could make a difference.
It very well may not help at all, but the lack of doing saves nothing but your time and energy to be spent on something else.
Such a direct showing could connect with them and that could add the human element that may be necessary to make them interested in allowing CoH to continue.
No matter how negatively such a showing could be taken by these people, that type of negativity would not counter a business move that they believe would be smart and/or are taking action towards or are contemplating.
While the likelihood may be small, the positive impact could be a spark that kindles something more... but I cannot see the impact of this being a negative that extinguishes the flame.
Please, let's stand together and not splinter, leaving our efforts far more feeble than they would be otherwise. Together, we are more than we are apart.
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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I'm looking at this as two separate issues - connected, but separate nonetheless.|
Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
You do realize that NCSoft is in the position of power here, right? They literally own City of Heroes. The best we can hope for is to slightly steer them into a direction we want. We can't force their hand.
It doesn't matter if they've made mistakes or have treated us poorly, being ******* won't get us results we want. If we want to be heard, we have to persuade them. |
The first issue is the selling of the game and IP. IF there's anything going on regarding that I don't expect to hear anything about that until it's a done deal. It would be nice if we got some indication of course, but I'm not expecting it - though I think it'd be good business as well, at least for a prospective investor/buyer, given that the wider community will slowly bleed out over the next three months, and once people are entirely resigned to the loss of the game it'll be that much harder to win them back.
(Not everyone - there are people here who will be here until the bitter end and beyond, but the wider playerbase is already looking elsewhere. In terms of player retention, the game is losing value every day that passes.)
That aside, the second issue is what I was referring to in this thread - that is NCsoft's handling of this. Indifference is the best word I can use to describe it. They're dropping an 8+ year title as casually as they'd shelve an unannounced pre-alpha project, and that is no way to treat your customers.
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No, but it is easier and requires substantially less effort, which makes it easier for rude people and trolls in general to send their less-than-helpful messages. And like Tony said, these e-mail addresses were not made publicly available...until now.|
Originally Posted by Electric-Knight
Sending emails to these addresses is no worse (and possibly no better) than sending physical letters (or packages of capes and masks) or emails to publicly listed addresses.
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This worries me for many reasons, not the least of which is the fact that it shows how desperate the Save CoH movement has gotten, which isn't a good sign at all.
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
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I'm fully behind taking this step, but I certainly would have advised against pasting the emails in a public forum.|
Originally Posted by DarkGob
No, but it is easier and requires substantially less effort, which makes it easier for rude people and trolls in general to send their less-than-helpful messages. And like Tony said, these e-mail addresses were not made publicly available...until now.
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It's all done now, so this is pointless criticism from me here (and I don't hold anything against TonyV for the way he handled this), but I would have suggested announcing that I had those emails and then set up some sort of process of giving those emails to all who contacted me for them (either through PMs or via signing up on a website).
Then again... That's great in theory, but there is only so much time and energy that a person has (And so much of that has been being spent on these efforts already, beyond everything else he has to do in life) and this was the most expedient manner of handling it. *shrugs*
I just think that the obligation falls on the more reasonable people here to greatly outnumber any such trolls and simply do what we can.
No one is perfect and no manner of doing anything that gets done will ever be perfect.
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Originally Posted by DarkGob
This worries me for many reasons, not the least of which is the fact that it shows how desperate the Save CoH movement has gotten, which isn't a good sign at all.
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I understand people not liking to appear desperate, but sometimes you have to recognize and admit the truth.
Being desperate does not mean being incapable. And I don't think that this step is any greater sign of failure than the lack of announcements that we've succeeded. It just is the way it is and this is a good step to take right now, because time is running out for some of the better potential results.
By the time that the time is right... the time is usually gone.
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
Note I did not read this thread entirely I read replies on the Titan site and wanted to cross post what I said there.
Just a few things I would like to say:
First to address something I saw earlier, the e-mail campaign is definitely different then a postal mail campaign. You can easily fill someones inbox and stop business critical e-mails from getting through. This will not garner favor and will most likely end with having keyword filters or addresses being blocked. It may also be seen as a malicious action, rather than one to get their attention. A postal campaign sends a tangible message and may put stress on a mail room but business critical messages will still get through.
Secondly, I already stated this on Facebook, Silence does not mean anything. It is early yet and if negotiations are happening they will be confidential. Also we are consumers not business partners, if and when they decide to make a statement it will most likely come via Z or one of the other OCR reps since that's why they pay them. It's a common business practice to have no announcements during negotiations. The reason I state this is because people will get frustrated with the silence and stop fighting/trying, or will get desperate and possibly more negative. If you expect the silence (as I do) then you can just keep fighting at a consistent pace. A consistent pace will show solidarity and meaning, as opposed to a short fast and furious pace that dies from attrition.
Now saying silence means nothing, I do have a minor experience with Paragon/NC Soft regarding this statement. Back during the AE account bans I was, lets say, rather persistent in my efforts to make Paragon see my ways. So much as to start contacting NC Soft Public relations among other places. I also figured out paragon's e-mail scheme so that as long as I knew the name I knew their e-mail address. Now I got ZERO replies, but that doesn't mean they didn't hear me. I was told by Ghost Falcon (see sig) that I was brought up at some rather high level meetings. So while I heard nothing from them, I wasn't being ignored. Oddly enough, I found out later that I was mistaken about the numbers of people banned because I was basing it off Justice #'s and my server was *cough* rather hard hit by the bans. Had they just put that info out there the reactions would have been much better. This is a company that likes to stay silent on certain business aspects though.
"Play Nice and BEHAVE! I don't want to hear about any more of your shenanigans brought up in our meetings at Paragon"-Ghost Falcon @Tritonfree @Philly's 2nd Convenient CIGAL BoBC/INOANN Arts&Crafts Sporks
Average Joes FAP THE MENTOR PROJECT Justice Events
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Yes. Really. If they perceive this as a breach of etiquette (and since it is, there is no reason to think they wont) the mere fact that they got these e-mails is shooting ourselves in the foot. Not to mention the number of emails that are from trolls and I promise you there are more than a few.
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Originally Posted by NightshadeLegree
Not really.
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Something witty and profound
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Where have you been? We have been desperately looking for a way to save the game since August 31, 2012.|
Originally Posted by DarkGob
No, but it is easier and requires substantially less effort, which makes it easier for rude people and trolls in general to send their less-than-helpful messages. And like Tony said, these e-mail addresses were not made publicly available...until now.
This worries me for many reasons, not the least of which is the fact that it shows how desperate the Save CoH movement has gotten, which isn't a good sign at all. |
Blogs, Twitter, and the occasional article on some gaming site are easy to ignore and truly do not show the amount of people affected by this.
We can choose to do nothing or very little and see the outcome...or we can fight with every method we have at our disposal...I am a hero I choose to fight to save Paragon City. I will not stand by and whisper in a small corner of the internet...I will make sure my voice can be heard by many; especially those who need to hear it! I will continue to fight to save Paragon City until there is nothing left to fight for, because in the end I do not want to be sitting here thinking "What if...I had said something?" "What if I had done more?" I will do it now.. I will do more today... and hope tomorrow the sun rises on Paragon City.
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Originally Posted by Paladiamors
I love you, I Burnt the Toast!
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Liberty!
Black Dawn/Shattered Dawn
Chaos Legion