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Amusing GW2 review - light profanity

afocks

By afocks,
Posted on: 2012-09-07 13:18 in CoH and CoV General Discussions

 

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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
Hell, you can't team on the story quests, what's the deal with that?
If you haven't been able to team for story quests, it's a bug. You should be able to. The functionality was there in the beta weekends and worked fine then.

 

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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
Top it off with one of the grindiest endgames I've personally ever seen . . .
You must be a leveling fool if you've already seen the endgame. Is the leveling curve really that fast? (They had it turned up a notch or three in the last beta weekends, so it's hard to conceive of hitting level cap that fast.)

 

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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
So far in GW2 I haven't been forced to interact with anyone. I have soloed every mission given to me. The other players in the game are no more irritating than any other background NPC, and unlike this game NPC's can't push you out of the way like you're a bag of feathers.

The only time I've socialized with anyone was on my terms when I feel the need to chat, or be helpful and answer questions.

I don't have to worry about someone stealing my loot cuz just like here everyone gets their own drops.
I'm not worried about kill-stealing, I'm worried about having a sense of accomplishment. There's no sense of accomplishment in a task that loops itself if I don't leave the area quickly enough which visibly has more to do about it by the time I'm finished with it. Say I need to break up a poacher camp and free all the cubs they've taken. I CAN'T. I can kill some of the poachers, but they just keep spawning on top of me too fast to even get all of them off-screen. I can free some of the cubs, but the cages reset faster than I can release them. I can never "complete" these quests. I can just do enough to tick the numbers on my time sheet and move on.

This is a problem I have with Champions Online, as well. An NPC tells me that civilians are trapped in the streets with the aliens so defence forces can't use their heaviest weapons. I'm tasked with saving three people. I save three people and go to head back. Before turning the corner to speak with my contact, I turn around and see around five or six people more trapped by aliens. I speak with him, and he says defence forces "can't see any more civilians." I guess they aren't looking very hard and those poor sods I left behind will be carpet-bombed.

I don't like overwold activities, because they can never be "completed" on account of all those other people that the activities have to be available for. It's Aaron Thiery chastising me for not stopping to punch every purse-puller when there are an infinite number of those and they will always respawn as soon as my back is turned. It's why I don't give a toss about fighting street crime - because it never gives any indication that I'm accomplishing anything. And at least City of Heroes events are infrequent. A fire starts, I put it out, and the zone is fire-free for another half hour. In Guild Wars 2, I stop the rampaging minotaurs, am congratulated for it and then I run into another set of rampaging minotaurs for a repeat of the even before I can turn around to leave.

And the fact that if I go to do a "quest" but I'm not quick enough on my reading and question, then other people will complete it for me. I didn't care for door-sitting in City of Heroes, and I don't care for going to a quest that's already half-way done, only to see it finished before I'm done reading the contact dialogue and figuring out what to do. I don't like playing to other people's schedules, I don't like depending on other people and I don't like objectives from my quests being completed with no input from me. I logged into the game to play, not have it played for me.

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Originally Posted by JayboH View Post
It's true: MMOs are a horrible place to be if you are super-inclined to practice anti-social behavior, the kind that Sam wants. I have never actually teamed with anyone in GW2 yet, although I have been in the same area that other players happened to be with all of us helping each other with zero consequences of doing so. I like that there is no such thing as kill stealing in GW2.
And there we go again. Thank you, Dr. Armchair, for psychoanalysing me. I assure you, the last time people did this to me, it was very productive and helpful. But let me share with you a simple, basic fact:

City of Heroes played just fine with that mentality of mine and it never bothered me until Incarnates came out and forced teaming was forced down my throat. If City of Heroes can do it, other MMOs can do it.

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Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
I'm not worried about kill-stealing, I'm worried about having a sense of accomplishment. There's no sense of accomplishment in a task that loops itself if I don't leave the area quickly enough which visibly has more to do about it by the time I'm finished with it. Say I need to break up a poacher camp and free all the cubs they've taken. I CAN'T. I can kill some of the poachers, but they just keep spawning on top of me too fast to even get all of them off-screen. I can free some of the cubs, but the cages reset faster than I can release them. I can never "complete" these quests. I can just do enough to tick the numbers on my time sheet and move on.

This is a problem I have with Champions Online, as well. An NPC tells me that civilians are trapped in the streets with the aliens so defence forces can't use their heaviest weapons. I'm tasked with saving three people. I save three people and go to head back. Before turning the corner to speak with my contact, I turn around and see around five or six people more trapped by aliens. I speak with him, and he says defence forces "can't see any more civilians." I guess they aren't looking very hard and those poor sods I left behind will be carpet-bombed.

I don't like overwold activities, because they can never be "completed" on account of all those other people that the activities have to be available for...
Sure you can complete the overworld quests! From the videos I've watched (I haven't actually played or bought this game), the quests don't 'wait' for anyone. If you're tasked with stopping a group of pirates from sieging some villager's house or fend off a hoard of bears, the quest action takes place until that part is completed (i.e. pirates or bears will stop spawning) to which then the quest immediately moves on to the next part.

The quest doesn't hold your hand and wait for others to 'complete' it, if you miss it you miss it...but it will start over again later. If you're talking about the fact the quests start over later, well that's usually why there's other stuff in the area, so you don't have to stand around and get caught in the chain again when it does.

IMO, that's no different than flying about Paragon City and seeing a purse snatcher taking a woman's belongings and swooping in to rescue her only to see another purse snatcher half a block away...but it seems a bit more spread out in GW2.

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It's Aaron Thiery chastising me for not stopping to punch every purse-puller when there are an infinite number of those and they will always respawn as soon as my back is turned. It's why I don't give a toss about fighting street crime - because it never gives any indication that I'm accomplishing anything. And at least City of Heroes events are infrequent. A fire starts, I put it out, and the zone is fire-free for another half hour. In Guild Wars 2, I stop the rampaging minotaurs, am congratulated for it and then I run into another set of rampaging minotaurs for a repeat of the even before I can turn around to leave.
Again, from my observations, if there's a quest about rampaging minotaurs, it's within a chain of quests. You don't stop the minotaurs and immediately another rampage starts. You start at the *beginning*, most likely involving why the minotaurs are rampaging in the first place...or if that isn't the end of the quest, you're then told to go and speak with the minotaur leader to talk him down from another series of attacks or something. You shouldn't be getting the same task over and over unless in the gap you spent after finishing the task, someone else came along and set the event in motion again.

 

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I read all four pages of this and I must admit to scratching my head a bit at the vehement treatment of an exceptionally fine game (at least in my opinion).

I have zero contempt for NCSoft or ArenaNet, simply because it is and has been standard practice for these businesses to do these things. And isn't it just mildly hypocritical to boycott or otherwise demonise NCSoft for their practices because it affects this game, but not boycott when they've done similar things in the past, up to and including the very nasty situation with Richard Garriot?

The business is not a person. I'm very sad for Paragon Studios, the community of the game and the game itself, but I can't in good conscience demonise ArenaNet for doing business with NCSoft. That's guilt by association, and ArenaNet are bending over backwards to provide a compelling, funny, thrilling and overall fun experience.

I'm playing the game (and happily so, I won't be boycotting NCSoft; that's like saying I'll boycott my local hospital because the administration (who I'd never meet) makes bad decisions their employees have to abide by) and find it's doing things that are specifically not grindy.

I get experience for everything, and I mean everything. I get XP for fighting monsters. I get XP if I join in an area quest (which aren't mandatory); I get XP for gathering materials. I get XP for exploring. I get XP for healing other characters. So very grindy, how could I cope?

I don't have to pay to train to use my abilities; I pick up what's at hand and I can use it. Only if I get properly beaten do I have to repair my stuff, and even then the cost is minimal. And when I do get defeated, I not only can come back from the brink with emergency abilities, but other people can help me! Not even City of Heroes does that, and I bet we wish it could!

Honestly, I could go on....but there's a lot of hyperbole being thrown around about what this game is supposedly not and very precious little about what it is. If you don't like fantasy, if you don't like public questing and you do like the style of City of Heroes, fine. Noone here on these forums is going to demonise you for that.

But please don't take your personal bias, your personal prefences and most importantly, your personal hatreds or peeves out on a game that's just started. Because I bet this game got that and more. GW2 is doing a lot of stuff right that games before it did wrong. And it's even borrowed from this game and ensured that the journey is something you can enjoy with your friends at any point during it. Remember that. They didn't pluck that out of nowhere.

Respect it on its own merits, not some other games'.



S.

Part of Sister Flame's Clickey-Clack Posse

 

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
I'm not worried about kill-stealing,
Whose talking about kill-stealing. I'm talking about how in both GW2 and here how reward drops aren't fought over by teammates. You don't have to put up with some jacktard claiming greed on every treasure drop. Your rewards are yours and yours alone.

But since you mentioned Kill-Stealing, I have yet to encounter any. From what I've seen someone jumping in on your fight doesn't affect your drops. Each players rewards are determined individually and don't affect what another person does or doesn't get.

There seems to be three tiers of rewards. Bronze, Silver, and Gold. Some fool that hangs back and tries kill-stealing only earns a bronze reward, while the people that apply themselves earn Silver and Gold rewards.

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I'm worried about having a sense of accomplishment.
Every mission has a sense of accomplishment. You are given a completion bar that shows exactly how much you've done and it doesn't reset if you leave to do something else. I've found that I can leave and come back later to find I don't have to start over from scratch. Furthermore the maps clearly show which missions I've completed and which ones I still need to finish.

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I don't like overwold activities, because they can never be "completed" on account of all those other people that the activities have to be available for.
You can't complete instanced missions either Sam. I've done every instanced mission, TF, and trial in CoH (except Incarnate content) dozens of times on each character.

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And the fact that if I go to do a "quest" but I'm not quick enough on my reading and question, then other people will complete it for me. I didn't care for door-sitting in City of Heroes, and I don't care for going to a quest that's already half-way done, only to see it finished before I'm done reading the contact dialogue and figuring out what to do. I don't like playing to other people's schedules, I don't like depending on other people and I don't like objectives from my quests being completed with no input from me. I logged into the game to play, not have it played for me.
No one can complete your missions for you Sam. You have your own completion bar for each mission and another players activities has no effect on it unless you are teaming, and as you have made it clear, you prefer soloing.

You don't have to depend on anyone nor can anyone complete your objectives while you are reading the contact dialogue.

The only content where everyone contributes to completeing mission objectives is when their version of a GM event spawns, like Lusca, or Rikti Raid, etc.

 

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Originally Posted by JayboH View Post
He shows the negatives.
Negatives?? I'll get the meat hooks!

Uh, I mean: Good review! (at least the part I saw. 31 minutes??)

Thought for the day:

"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment."

=][=

 

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Originally Posted by JayboH View Post
Here ya go.

This guy really shows what this title is like, and explains why it's different. It's pretty entertaining and more importantly, realistic. He shows the negatives.
7 minutes in... and almost everything he loves CoH had.

City of Heroes was my first MMO, & my favorite computer game.

R.I.P.
Chyll - Bydand - Violynce - Enyrgos - Rylle - Nephryte - Solyd - Fettyr - Hyposhock - Styrling - Beryllos - Rosyc
Horryd - Myriam - Dysquiet - Ghyr
Vanysh - Eldrytch
Inflyct - Mysron - Orphyn - Dysmay - Reapyr - - Wyldeman - Hydeous

 

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
the Broken Sword trilogy
That's a really good series of games. Enjoy!

Thought for the day:

"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment."

=][=

 

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Originally Posted by Chyll View Post
7 minutes in... and almost everything he loves CoH had.
Pssst . . . Don't point that out to the haters. Facts have no place in their arguments.

 

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Joe is a great reviewer. When my girlfriend and I were looking for videos of GW2 I was hoping he had made one. He hadn't released one at the time but we did watch this yesterday. Always liked Joe, and am a fan of Blistered Thumbs (my best online friend is a reviewer there too).

At any rate, he does a good job of explaining most of the pros of this game. It's real easy to get into and it has MOST of the things that I like about CoH, including things that I thought no other MMO was ever going to do.

Some things I love that he didn't mention:

It's SO easy to get distracted in this game. Which is a good thing. There are ALWAYS quests and tasks going on all around you. Just last night I went to mine and gather collectibles so I could try out the crafting system. I repeatedly got distracted as missions popped up and ran to do those before returning to my task. In my experience the gameplay is ALWAYS like this. You don't go pick a specific task and then do that thing all the time. It's real easy to just wander off in a random direction and find things to do. I never feel like it's a chore to find or do missions, and if I don't like the sound of one I just wander off, no harm done.

The classes are really great. There are no dedicated roles, similar to CoH. Anyone can do some degree of DPS, tank, or support depending on how you build them. All classes have the ability to heal and support themselves. Teams just seem to flow together, regardless of who you take. I hate to say it but they handle that particular attribute better than CoH. You literally can just take anyone and succeed.

It's very new and underutilized right now but they have a setup for RPers. You have "town clothes" you can switch to and you can change the appearance of your gear with items. It also has /e and the posting limit is pretty long. There's already an unofficial RP server (Tarnished Coast).

Don't get me wrong, it's not the perfect game and it's not a smooth replacement for CoH. I love the fluid movement but I liked not being earthbound in CoH. I miss bios. And it doesn't have a fraction of the character customization options (I think those will come with time). But the above and what Joe said make it an amazingly fun game that's real easy to just get lost in and enjoy.

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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU View Post
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.

 

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It looks like a good game. I might have to try it out when my rage subsides.

 

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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
You can't complete instanced missions either Sam. I've done every instanced mission, TF, and trial in CoH (except Incarnate content) dozens of times on each character.
You could if you went out of your way to time-travel to that content. In however many years it's been since Ouroboros was introduced, the first time I ever used it was a month ago when it became apparent the Incarnate system would revolve around repeating the same arc. Furthermore, missions and TFs take place indoors so their results (or lack thereof) aren't immediately evident. I can't go back to Dr. Vahzilok's lair on an unrelated "quest" and see him still there, with a conga line of player waiting their turn to kill him. Guild Wars 2's "heart" quests never end. They may have ended for me, but every time I run by the location, there are still people queuing up to do them again.

It probably doesn't help that "Heart" quests in that game are some of the most boring, menial busywork I've seen since delivering pies. I don't want to feed bear cubs or wash cows or watch paint dry. I want a story with some meaning. I don't want work, I want an adventure. And no "go into cave to kick over lanterns and wipe away graffiti" is neither an adventure nor a story. It's busywork. People complain that City of Heroes missions are all the same, and they are, but the game manages to put a decent story behind all of them, a story I care to see through the end, because I want to know how it ends. Because I care about the plot. There is no plot in "Turn into a lion and hunt prey to see their ways."

It's busywork that never ends. I don't care how good the "system" may be, when what the system is being used for bores me to tears. I went as far as I could in that game, chasing heart and hoping I'd reach one that was actually interesting on a narrative level, and gave up after about six of the same.

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Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

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Originally Posted by Sureshot_Liberty View Post
You must be a leveling fool if you've already seen the endgame. Is the leveling curve really that fast? (They had it turned up a notch or three in the last beta weekends, so it's hard to conceive of hitting level cap that fast.)
Fortunately when I said "seen" I meant only that. You don't have to be level 80 to look into what it's going to take to advance at level 80. Did you know that to craft a legendary weapon, apart from having maxed out at least one crafting skill, one of the components you must purchase costs two hundred skill points? That's not a typo. You get extra skill points by re-earning level 80 once you've already reached it. Getting that much experience is basically going to involve repeating the top level dungeons over and over and over because dungeons are the only things that I'm aware of so far that are repeatable and award you with a significant chunk of experience at the end. They're also super not-fun but that's my opinion, and yes I have completed several, thanks for asking.

Compare that to the process of purpling a build. Is it easy? Of course not. Is the only realistic way to do it by running the alpha incarnate component task forces ad nauseam? Not at all.

 

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
City of Heroes played just fine with that mentality of mine and it never bothered me until Incarnates came out and forced teaming was forced down my throat. If City of Heroes can do it, other MMOs can do it.
I do team with my friends but I also do a lot of soloing in GW2. And I can tell you, you don't need to worry about this type of thing.

When you're doing a heart quest, other people doing things doesn't impact your progress. If your task is to fix traps and kill boar, other people doing these things does not increase your progress bar. You have to do them yourself. When you're doing an escort mission or any other type of task, other people being there doesn't really impact anything. They don't have to join your team and they blend in with the NPCs a lot of the time. I've done missions before where after I finish I look up and say "Oh there were a couple other people here. Huh." You can really play by yourself. Other people being there can be completely ignored.

I'm a heavily solo player. I always hated trials and wanted solo options for everything. I really only want to hang out with a couple people, usually just my girlfriend or online friends. I'm very satisfied with how GW2 handles all this.

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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU View Post
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.

 

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
They may have ended for me, but every time I run by the location, there are still people queuing up to do them again.
I don't really see this as any different than any time you go to Cim there are people forming for an ITF.

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
It's busywork that never ends. I don't care how good the "system" may be, when what the system is being used for bores me to tears.
I suppose it comes down to flavor and taste, but I like the heart missions. From an MMO standpoint, all missions in games are busywork. There's a hell of a lot less of it than CoH though. There's no returning to contacts or zoning for no reason. There's no "stop and kill 50 gray guys that won't give any experience" or "go talk to so and so for no experience." If it's busywork it just doesn't FEEL like busywork.

I've never played an MMO where grinding didn't feel like grinding, and I can gain experience from doing basically anything I want at any time (I gained 2 levels just walking around gathering resources and doing whatever quest popped up). Where I can just find missions by wandering off in a random direction, and then completing them in the way I want. My friends were even making fun of me, when we ran into a mission and I wasn't making much progress with my usual "kill all the things" approach. My girlfriend said "Not everything is solved with stabbing." I said "I know dear, some things are solved with shooting." I do like how I have the option of doing one of the 2-5 other tasks associated with a mission, in case I don't feel like killing things at that particular moment.

The missions and variety of tasks is also fun for me, and I expect most people. Maybe you don't find picking apples to be entertaining but I found most of the CoH stories were just as boring. And they didn't even have fun mechanics to go with them. CoH for a long time was "kill all the things" or "click all the things" and THAT WAS IT. True we've gotten some extra objectives and they managed to throw in a few things that make it feel less repetitive, but I quit reading CoH text long ago and just found the zen of stabbing things. And that mindset bleeds over into GW2 and is my default mode, and it's nice when I stop and realize I can repair fish traps or revive downed divers instead. At least the tasks are varied enough and you can do different ones of your choosing so that it doesn't feel like as repetitive.

Like I said, it's not a perfect substitute for CoH but nothing's going to be. There's just so much stuff they got RIGHT though that it's hard to not enjoy.

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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU View Post
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.

 

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GW2 is a great game and I find myself enjoying it a lot. I understand we're all hurt over the CoH fiasco, but you can't fault the good people at ArenaNet for that. Eventhough CoH will always be dear to me, honestly, it was getting pretty stale and I just wasn't finding myself excited for it in these past few months. I continued subbing mainly because I just felt so invested in it, but not a whole lot of motivation beyond that.

GW2 is a refreshing change to the MMO and leaves you scratching your head as to why it's taken so long to get things right. The combat requires a more twitchy approach as opposed to just standing there cycling the same power chain over and over. The questing is seamless and not annoying. Exploring areas actually serve a purpose unlike something like Shadow Shard where you have giant zones of nothing for no real reason. The world itself actually feels immersive as you travel through towns and listen to all the city banter which sometimes even leads to events. As much as I love CoH I've just never really felt that level of immersion to the actual world and lore as I feel in something like GW2.

Anyway, kinda feel like I'm just rambling now as I approach the end of my graveyard shift, but bottom line is that GW2 is a fun game and you're doing yourself a disservice by avoiding it because of CoH's unfortunate demise.

Currently on Virtue:
Jinrazuo - Crab Spider

RWZ All-Pylon Solo Run

 

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Originally Posted by Sureshot_Liberty View Post
You must be a leveling fool if you've already seen the endgame. Is the leveling curve really that fast? (They had it turned up a notch or three in the last beta weekends, so it's hard to conceive of hitting level cap that fast.)
It's not unless you push.

It's like all the idiots in every other game that take their WoW-trained endgame brains, push themselves as high as they can as fast as they can, and then complain that there's no content for them and that the whole game was too easy.

Then, of course, they make up stuff that isn't true about the game they missed, to pretend it's the game's fault and not theirs.

Just like this guy.

 

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Originally Posted by Chyll View Post
7 minutes in... and almost everything he loves CoH had.
No it did not. Especially not at launch. GW2 just launch and your comparing the QoL stuff from CoH (and 8 year old game) to GW2 (just launched) and saying "CoH did it first and did it better!" No **** the game is old as my mothers britches.

Lets not forget the Sub fee CoH launched with, something GW2 doesnt have.

Lets not forget backtracking missioned such as the "Traverse large zones and click on multiple phone booths" missions CoH launched with, GW2 does not have backtracking like this during open world quest OR instanced.

or the "You are currently in Brickstown and need to backtrack to AP" oh BTW this was before Trains went to every zone so you had to run through all of Steel Canyon and back. Instead GW2 HAS multple Wavepoints in everyzone which you can Teleport to at any moment as long as you have already discovered it. This is at launch people not 6 years later they added Trains to AP.

Lets also not forget the horrible zone crossing in Hollows, you are level 8 now dredge across this lvl15 zone to complete this mission chain for a lvl8 OH BTW their is no Hosp in this zone so if you die its all the way back to AP. Not only does GW2 not have this but it auto exemps higher lvl players in zones they out leveled so they dont just farm lowbie quest or Power Level noobs.





You guys are seriously overlooking some major flaws CoH had and may still have while GW2 does pretty much every CoH does but better AND at launch. PLUS MORE

Now of course GW2 has its problems but dont come in here saying some **** like "CoH has everything GW2 has and they did it first" Thats ******* a flat out lie.



You may enjoy CoH more than GW2 or prefer it better but please for the love of god don't compare the features and say anything like the quote above it's not true at all. It's not even close.

 

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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
If the game actually operated the way you claim then after you defeated Dr. Vahzilok, then I would never encounter him on any of my characters because he had already been defeated.
Every character has his own timeline, I would actually be rather pissed if the game locked my alts from being able to do the content I did with my main.

I don't think you can see the point, though, thats why you see no difference. In a normal MMO, after I stop the Marrowsnap (for example) I just have to stand in the same spot and wait for him to respawn, then see a line of people killing him. For me that kills immersion drastically. Even walking by that area again a few days later, if I see Marrowsnap again standing in the corner, I will feel I never achieved anything.

With instances, that is hidden. Others get to kill Marrowsnap, and unless I'm venturing on some one else's mission, or I time travel, I wont be seeing Marrowsnap again unless he escapes and is in a new mission with a new goal and story behind him.

You don't see a difference, thats cool. It means it does not bother you. But it bothers me and it's one of the reasons I personally dislike world-missions. CoH has a few bits along those lines but they tend to be the exception, not the rule.

Also, with newer phasing tech, I was also able to permanently (from my character's perspective) change Atlas Park! Mission after mission I was able to put a stop to outdoor activities.

Think WoW does something like that since the last expansion but have not tried it to see how far they take it.

Again: Its cool if for you it makes no difference. I am only explaining so you see why for me (and a few others) it IS significant.

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You also wouldn't have seen people whining for years about how sick and tired they were of running the same content over and over again.
There is a difference between running the same content over and over again with the same character, to having every single alt run the same content due to lack of options. The later was what people complained about in this game.

Well... there is also grinding Trials and TFs, but I never bothered with that stuff.

 

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I don't think anyone said CoH has everything GW2 has, or that CoH does everything better.

What they are saying is that a lot of the supposedly "new" innovations in GW2 were done in CoH. Now, just because CoH did it first does not detract from the fact that GW2 did it as well, and without a monthly subscription fee.

GW2 is a great game that does a lot of things right, but they didn't necessarily do all those things first. In fact, that's a good thing. It means they have looked at other great games (like CoH) and learned from them. And because CoH has been around so long, they can see the mistakes that were made as well and learn from those.

 

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Originally Posted by Feycat View Post
It's not unless you push.

It's like all the idiots in every other game that take their WoW-trained endgame brains, push themselves as high as they can as fast as they can, and then complain that there's no content for them and that the whole game was too easy.

Then, of course, they make up stuff that isn't true about the game they missed, to pretend it's the game's fault and not theirs.

Just like this guy.
You seem a little angry. Maybe you should calm down.

 

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Originally Posted by Mad Grim View Post
I don't think anyone said CoH has everything GW2 has, or that CoH does everything better.

What they are saying is that a lot of the supposedly "new" innovations in GW2 were done in CoH. Now, just because CoH did it first does not detract from the fact that GW2 did it as well, and without a monthly subscription fee.

GW2 is a great game that does a lot of things right, but they didn't necessarily do all those things first. In fact, that's a good thing. It means they have looked at other great games (like CoH) and learned from them. And because CoH has been around so long, they can see the mistakes that were made as well and learn from those.
Could you list some of those things? I'm not trolling, I'm serious. Aside from downleveling (and they do it by zone and not by team) I'm wracking my brains for stuff from GW2 that COH did first.

Someone said "in the first 7 minutes, it's all stuff COH did first." Really? I am literally and honestly confused by people saying this.

* He points out there's no sub fee - COH had a sub fee for 7 years and other games went f2p long before, including GW1, so COH gets no credit for that.

* Eliminated fetch quests and backtracking. COH did this... eventually... by letting you call your contact and say "done!" BUT that's not the way GW2 does it at all, so I don't think COH gets to call dibs on this. COH STILL makes you talk to the contact first, then do missions for him until he gives you his number, THEN you can start calling in. With GW2, the mobs you fight/glowies you click on your WAY to the guy quite frequently count for the task he's going to give you. You get quest credit BEFORE YOU TAKE THE QUEST. COH has never done that. If I go to RWZ and kill 20 monkies, and THEN go talk to Borea... she's still going to make me go kill 20 monkies.

* The same NPC gives you multiple options to complete the same quest. Nope, COH never did that.

* Lots of non-combat activities you can engage in, in order to fulfil your quests. Nope. At one point we were promised that, but it just ended up being handwaved into Day Jobs.

* Other people can't kill-steal from you, and everyone gets xp/loot credit for every mob you help damage. Um, no. COH still works on the MMO standard of "if they're in your party, they share credit, if not, first person to hit the mob taps it - and other people helping you REDUCES your xp."

* Everyone gets their own loot and experience. Again, no. If you're all on the same team, you get your own loot, but the RNG is still sharing it between players and you still have to be teamed. In GW2, if a stranger and I cooperate to kill a mob, while unteamed, we BOTH get to loot the corpse, and we BOTH get full xp. COH does not do this.

* Events/mobs "level up" depending on how many people are around. Okay, yes. When teamed, your missions get harder as you add players. When not teamed, things like the Rikti Invasions spawn more guy if there's more folks clustered around Portal Corp to fight them. However - and here's an important point - if 20 people have the "kill 10 Lost in King's Row" quest, the game does NOT spawn 20 people's worth of Lost, OR make them harder because there's 20 people there. GW2 does. Also, Rikti/Halloween type events are rare and random. For GW2, overland events are how the game functions, it had no missions.

* Game rewards you for reviving each other. Nope. Not even those of us who have rezzes (and most of my characters were Defenders and Corruptors) got anything for rezzing other people. I get xp for killing people in GW2, not to mention more hands to help kill stuff, which in GW2 you actually WANT.

That's 7 minutes into the review. Let's go to 10? Because I've only found ONE thing so far in the review that COH "did first," and it's pretty much in a completely different way.

* Random world events chain together and lead to different things if you complete them. Um, no. In COH, if no one fights the Rikti, THEY STILL LEAVE. You don't have to fight them. In GW2, if centaurs come try to take over a warcamp... if you don't fight them off? THEY TAKE THE CAMP. And then all the soldier NPCs move to another part of the zone, and you have to talk to them, tell them you'll help them take the camp back, and then TAKE IT BACK. Or the centaurs get to keep it. Can you imagine how fun it would be if, when no one gave a crap that the Rikti were invading KR... they got to KEEP KR until a bunch of heroes showed up to take it back?? So you actually DO change the world, even if it's only a wee bit.

* Rewarded for exploring in GW2. COH? You get badges, and some of those badges can lead to accolades, but for most of the badges in the game, they're just candy for rabid collectors (like me!) In COH, you get xp for exploring each point of the map, you open up waypoints that let you travel the map faster, you find events and heart NPCs, and when you explore the ENTIRE map, the game gives you a chunk of xp and loot for doing it.

* Your skills are tied to the weapon your character is using, you can swap weapons in combat, and use environmental weapons like broken bottles or dropped sticks to fight off mobs. Um, no.

Seriously, I love COH with all my heart and had no intention to quit playing... but WHERE are people getting this "COH did the good stuff in GW2 first!!" I seriously do not get it. Especially if they're using this review as their basis of comparison!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Starsman View Post
Again: Its cool if for you it makes no difference. I am only explaining so you see why for me (and a few others) it IS significant.

There is a difference between running the same content over and over again with the same character, to having every single alt run the same content due to lack of options. The later was what people complained about in this game.

Well... there is also grinding Trials and TFs, but I never bothered with that stuff.
Um, you realize your last line kinda invalidates your point, right? For a LOT of people, running TFs and Trials was an important activity in the game, and it involved beating the same guys over and over. I killed Praetor White like 100 times on one character. And yet he was always there when I went back.

Also, I assume you never did a radio mission? Because I rescued the same guys and fought the same named bosses in those things over and over and over.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
You seem a little angry. Maybe you should calm down.
Maybe you should stop lying? Just a thought. You've made so many outright untrue claims about what the game does and doesn't do, it's hilarious. Maybe go back and address that?

 

Posted

Are you this vile to people you disagree with in real life, as well?

If they fixed the story quest teaming, they fixed the story quest teaming. I stopped trying because apparently I didn't get the memo. Since that was a small part of my litany of issues with the game, I remain confident in my stance.