Martial Combat and Martial Assault
By
Adeon Hawkwood,
Posted on: 2012-08-01 11:32 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Sooo . . . Whip Assult secondary for Dominators by i25 maybe?
See, I don't get the "someone really strong without extra toughness" thing.
This may be a bit...much, but do you have any idea how much muscle mass and bone density it would take to punch through a brick wall? Pick up and support a half-ton car, let alone throw it? Correlation, in this case, does indicate causality. The very nature of a "super strength" (barring like, say, Iron Man) power indicates some sort of physiological adaptation to support it, which would make that person inherently more resistant to damage than a normal human. Even Spidey has an increased healing ability, can take concussive blasts, super-strength punches, etc. and still be slinging witty banter.
As for Invulnerable types who don't hit for much...well, that's a little more difficult to find an example of.
Carl and Sons @Aurora Girl (Pinnacle)
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Originally Posted by EarthWyrm
But I do understand that there is an internet rule that any bad idea must be presented by someone at least twice a year to remind everyone who hasn't already read every previous thread on the topic precisely why the idea is bad.
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Yes its very easy to say how most common superpowers would make you explode/blood boil/grow into a mushy paste/break all your bones/ect but that kinda ruins the fun of it.
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Originally Posted by Aurora_Girl
See, I don't get the "someone really strong without extra toughness" thing.
This may be a bit...much, but do you have any idea how much muscle mass and bone density it would take to punch through a brick wall? Pick up and support a half-ton car, let alone throw it? Correlation, in this case, does indicate causality. The very nature of a "super strength" (barring like, say, Iron Man) power indicates some sort of physiological adaptation to support it, which would make that person inherently more resistant to damage than a normal human. Even Spidey has an increased healing ability, can take concussive blasts, super-strength punches, etc. and still be slinging witty banter. As for Invulnerable types who don't hit for much...well, that's a little more difficult to find an example of. |
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That's not the case. Spider-Man is much tougher than a normal human, and he is certainly capable of avoiding knockback by holding onto something with a superstrong grip.
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Originally Posted by Siolfir
Spider-Man is another example of someone really strong without extra toughness.
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I really should do something about this signature.
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Not to mention the ability to violate the laws of physics, which would make them God.
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Originally Posted by Aurora_Girl
See, I don't get the "someone really strong without extra toughness" thing.
This may be a bit...much, but do you have any idea how much muscle mass and bone density it would take to punch through a brick wall? Pick up and support a half-ton car, let alone throw it? Correlation, in this case, does indicate causality. The very nature of a "super strength" (barring like, say, Iron Man) power indicates some sort of physiological adaptation to support it, which would make that person inherently more resistant to damage than a normal human. |
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I like the idea of using another piece of fictional media as a means to determine what should happen in our fictional media.
Personally, I think Harry Potter should have had more light sabers.
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I agree.
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Originally Posted by Warkupo
I like the idea of using another piece of fictional media as a means to determine what should happen in our fictional media.
Personally, I think Harry Potter should have had more light sabers. |
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If Masterminds didn't suck, they'd be the most powerful AT in the game.
Dugfromearth are you talking about the old Sunspot or the new one?
Even in the beginning Sunspot could still take some mean hits...he couldn't take a bullet but he could take some punishment. Now's he VERY durable.
original sunspot had no special defense.
of course in the comics people took lots of damage all of the time when they supposedly couldn't. The x-men generally have no special defenses - Angel just had his wings. But they could take a punch.
but if your super strength is psionic or some other form, there is no reason why your body would be tougher
I'm honestly quite sad that Martial Assault doesn't get the teleport attack.
It looks to easily be the most fun power out of all the ones shown (IMO), and would be pretty helpful for some Control primaries (Fire, Ice, Dark, Electric).
@Oathbound & @Oathbound Too
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I have a character whose super strength is the result of high tech gauntlets that fuse themselves to her arms. She's super reflexes. If she actually gets shot or punched by someone like Recluse, she'll just die.
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Originally Posted by dugfromthearth
original sunspot had no special defense.
of course in the comics people took lots of damage all of the time when they supposedly couldn't. The x-men generally have no special defenses - Angel just had his wings. But they could take a punch. but if your super strength is psionic or some other form, there is no reason why your body would be tougher |
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I actually thought last night that they should put in alternate animations for Beam Rifle and it would work great as an optical beam set. Yeah, yeah, it's called "Beam Rifle," but they could always rename it. |
Originally Posted by Starsman
Good. Good. Now... where is my Optic Blast set? I need to make my Cyclops clone already!!!
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But who knows. Maybe they want and could come up with some better ideas for an actual Optic Blast set.
*added*
Completely random aside after seeing a bit of that Twitch video. Anyone ever tell Arbiter Hawk that he has a distinct Sabretooth vibe going on? Seriously.
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I wish they had custom animations to allow all the hand blast sets (Fire, Elec, Ice, etc) to fire from a gun, and allow Beam Rifle, Laser rifle from Bots, etc to fire from your hands as well as other emanation points (eyes, chest, etc). And being able to spit bullets from your mouth with Assault Rifle or Dual Pistols too while they're at it.|
Originally Posted by Grey Pilgrim
I actually thought last night that they should put in alternate animations for Beam Rifle and it would work great as an optical beam set. Yeah, yeah, it's called "Beam Rifle," but they could always rename it.
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>.>
I would love an optic blast set...I actually somewhat like Cyclops's Powers *ducks the tomatoes*.
I also wanted a Fireworks Power Set but not happenin' lol.
I guess fire is good enough *sigh*
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well, given that my main character is a dragon, i wouldn't mind an emanation point in the mouth (strangely, sounds dirty) I suppose one issue is that powers animation times would have to match the original animation cast time. for most sets the casts arent too long that shouldn't look too awkward, but a maybe some of the snipes may look silly standing there huffing and puffing. I also wouldnt mind guns, wands, and maybe a guitar. yes, fine, i want to blast hellions with lightning guitar riffs, dont judge me. :P
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Originally Posted by Tater Todd
>.>
I would love an optic blast set...I actually somewhat like Cyclops's Powers *ducks the tomatoes*. I also wanted a Fireworks Power Set but not happenin' lol. I guess fire is good enough *sigh* |
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If we ever get Air Blast, I won't rest until we have alternate air guitar animations.
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Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
well, given that my main character is a dragon, i wouldn't mind an emanation point in the mouth (strangely, sounds dirty) I suppose one issue is that powers animation times would have to match the original animation cast time. for most sets the casts arent too long that shouldn't look too awkward, but a maybe some of the snipes may look silly standing there huffing and puffing. I also wouldnt mind guns, wands, and maybe a guitar. yes, fine, i want to blast hellions with lightning guitar riffs, dont judge me. :P
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It's also occurred to me that, balance issues aside, Rage doesn't make much sense for blasters. If I get angry I can hit harder with my fists, but not with Assault Rifle bullets (angry bullets?).
Here is how I would adapt SS to blasters:
1) Mighty Shove (melee, minor damage, High KB and repel). A throw would be better, but harder to animate.
2) Punch
3) Haymaker
4) Mighty [auto] +10% max HP, +5% DMG, mag 4 Immob protection, resist slow
5) Hand Clap (in addition to KB and stun, this now grants +absorb per target hit)
6) Hurl (ranged stun, KB, -Fly, minor damage)
7) Stand Firm [click, 45s duration, 90s recharge] +15% To Hit, KB protection, To hit debuff resistance
8) Knockout Blow
9) Foot Stomp
I really should do something about this signature.
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I'd take out Haymaker and replace it with Build Up. Also increase Stand Firm duration to 45 seconds so it can be perma on SOs. Other than that, looks pretty good.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
It's also occurred to me that, balance issues aside, Rage doesn't make much sense for blasters. If I get angry I can hit harder with my fists, but not with Assault Rifle bullets (angry bullets?).
Here is how I would adapt SS to blasters: 1) Mighty Shove (High KB and repel). A throw would be better, but harder to animate. 2) Punch 3) Hurl 4) Stand Firm (click, 30s duration, 90s recharge) +15% To Hit, KB protection, To hit debuff resistance 5) Haymaker 6) Tough (auto) +10% max HP, +recovery, mag 4 Immob protection, resist slow 7) Hand Clap 8) Knockout Blow 9) Foot Stomp |
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I've made a few tweeks and edited my original post. Stand Firm is supposed to be the Rage/BU power (and should allow for fast snipes when slotted). I have put a (small) damage buff into the auto power to make up for the loss of BU damage buff.|
Originally Posted by Mad Grim
I'd take out Haymaker and replace it with Build Up. Also increase Stand Firm duration to 45 seconds so it can be perma on SOs. Other than that, looks pretty good.
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I've tried to not change to much from the original powerset, otherwise. It still has more punching than I would want personally.
I really should do something about this signature.
Well you need to replace a melee attack with something. As is it has 7, compared to the normal 3-5. If the animation could be done, something unique like Choke Hold would be neat. Hold an enemy and let an ally beat up on them for bonus damage.
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I pretty much agree. But I'm assuming that the people asking for an unchanged port want to keep all their melee attacks.
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Originally Posted by Mad Grim
Well you need to replace a melee attack with something. As is it has 7, compared to the normal 3-5. If the animation could be done, something unique like Choke Hold would be neat. Hold an enemy and let an ally beat up on them for bonus damage.
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I really should do something about this signature.
Well tough. Blaster secondaries are melee and support, not just melee. That'd be like giving Doms an entire ranged blasting set.
Also, those asking for a port of Super Strength specifically are probably unconcerned with any that aren't the following: Rage, Footstomp, Knockout Blow.
Anything else could be replaced with no complaints whatsoever.
Not that I agree with that view.
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It has 4 support powers, and the damage powers all have good CC. (Mighty Shove does minimal damage)|
Originally Posted by Mad Grim
Well tough. Blaster secondaries are melee and support, not just melee. That'd be like giving Doms an entire ranged blasting set.
Also, those asking for a port of Super Strength specifically are probably unconcerned with any that aren't the following: Rage, Footstomp, Knockout Blow. Anything else could be replaced with no complaints whatsoever. Not that I agree with that view. |
If you really wanted to replace Haymaker (or Hurl) with something, I think I would go for a toggle that grants +recovery per enemy within range.
Your grip (toggle hold, zero damage, -def) is a nice idea, but, like a throw, the animation wouldn't work on non-normal-sized-humanoid targets.
A melee cone stun with minor damage would be a possibility. I would be inclined to add stun to hurl though (reducing damage). Otherwise it's pretty useless to blasters.
I really should do something about this signature.
I may have to start planning a comeback.
The Martial Assault together with Darkness Control (Noob Saibot) sounds like an interesting combo. I don't hold my breath until I can get a look at the final version and numbers, but the envenom and trick shot seem interesting.
There really are more hard-hitters that can't take a hit in comics than there are indestructible characters that don't deal a tremendous amount of damage. Wolverine when he had bone claws would fall in the latter category - he shattered them repeatedly trying to actually do damage to things he was used to cutting through, but he flatlined and got back up on the next panel. I don't have many more recent examples since I stopped following comics over a decade ago when I couldn't get them reliably and reasonably while I was on an aircraft carrier.