CoH: a game for Introverts, too
By
Ad Astra,
Posted on: 2012-02-06 24:07 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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That's in Issue 22. The new EULA requires every account to have at least one catgirl.
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Originally Posted by tanstaafl
Where oh where is the talk for enforced RPGing. After all, it's a MMORPG, we should be forcing a level of role play from players to gain end game rewards.
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Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
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Nonsense. "Multiplayer" just means many people are on at the same TIME, not necessarily the same TEAM.
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Originally Posted by TonyV
You are, however, playing an MMORPG, a genre of game that is primarily oriented towards teaming up and interacting with other people. You have to understand that.
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The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
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These points are superb. Raids are the single worst invention in game history, with so many more detriments than positives. I think the only reasons they still exist is because of 1) the power of intermittent rewards and 2) inertia. They reward the wrong behavior and encourage minimal input from most of the members. (And frequently the ones who want to participate are barred from doing so because large groups tend to kick an MMO's performance in the privates.)|
Originally Posted by Seldom
The issue that comes up from forced teaming goes beyond just introversion, and I think that's why more people are speaking up against the trial model is that forced teaming has more problems than just 'you have to be with people.'
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I'm an extreme introvert and yet I like playing in teams, but in teams and at times OF MY CHOOSING. To come to a wall of gated content where you can't advance without having to join a team on their terms? Recipe for unsubscribing to my favorite game of all time.
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
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I'll point out here that "introvert" DOES NOT equal "shy."|
Originally Posted by Rebel_Scum
No offense meant to anyone, but it always amuses me how the supposed introverts are some of the most vocal people on the forums. Or that's how it seems these days.
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I'm an introvert (Myers-Briggs INTJ, and on an INTJ-only mailing list, the others dubbed me an "uber-INTJ") but I'm hardly shy.
Introvert and Extravert are merely where you get your energy. Extraverts feel energized among others; these are the ones who like to go clubbing and other social events. Introverts, on the other hand, derive their energy from within, so solitude is the key to their happiness. I go to any social event and I find it draining. Groups of people exhaust me. They don't let you just observe; if you don't interact, they think you're arrogant and aloof. And that's the same sort of name-calling we see on the forums when introverts express an opinion different from the extraverts.
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
If...
If.....
If I said I was introvert and still found this amazingly whiny, would I get yelled at? :3
Edit: I find the /concept/ amazingly whiny. No personal attacks.
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I do not believe this to be mathematically impossible. I've thought about it myself, actually. I think it starts with a bunch of bots/sonic mastermind fillers getting rebirth powers and triple level shift. That would get expensive because you can't do that with free fillers.|
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
I would love to see you try to solo an eight man Lambda. Feel free to fraps it, might need a RAM upgrade for that. Don't bother booking more than five minutes of space on youtube, though.
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Add in teamwide insps and nukes for everyone, focus on the grenades in the collection phase, and try to focus fire on Marauder. Add some FF in there and toggle in a bunch of repulsion toggles to keep adds away. Team teleport to pull the constellation to Marauder when he leaps.
Oh wait, this isn't the scrapper forum.
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Lambda has been duoed by various combinations, I don't think even soloing it "legit" (just one account being played) is impossible, provided you keep 7 other accounts standing at the entrance as to not get automatically kicked from the not enough players thingy.
You can get 10/10 in the collection phase as a solo player playing one character with high damage alts by smashing 2-3 crates, going back to the other side, smashing 2-3 containment chambers, going back, and so on (milking the extra time efficiently). It's tight, but definitely possible - and this I say from first hand experience, although I've only done it a handful of times and on "direct" damage characters, i.e. melee alts.
That's perhaps the one potential hiccup. You'd obviously want to be a strong debuffer for the final part, and illusion, as often, seems tailor-made for the task between PA and psi damage; but while something like an ill/cold is a potentially extremely high damage alt, much of that damage comes from pets and static debuffs, and a perfect sabotage phase might not be as easy to pull off. You really want to drop those crates in mere seconds as travel time will take quite a lot. Seeing as you get containment on crates and chambers it might be possible to build a nice enough direct damage attack chain.
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Originally Posted by TonyV
Hell, even Hyperstrike I like enough to still want to room with at the spring Pummit. Part of me thinks it would be kind of fun and cathartic to yell at each other in person instead of all of this typing back and forth; at least we could finish the fight by having a beer or something.
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
Like I said. Nerf pistols at 10 paces man.
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Count me with the Intraverts who don't enjoy massive raids - too much going on, it really can be a lot like a noisy party/kegger. And that is exhausting.
OTOH, I regularly team for TFs, and quite enjoy chatting with my team mates.
Altoholic - but a Blaster at Heart!
Originally Posted by SpyralPegacyon
"You gave us a world where we could fly. I can't thank you enough for that."
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I hope the poledance emote will be ready by then.
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Originally Posted by Ironblade
That's in Issue 22. The new EULA requires every account to have at least one catgirl.
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I don't suffer from altitis, I enjoy every minute of it.
Thank you Devs & Community people for a great game.
So sad to be ending ):
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That does not do much good if people keep quoting the person you want to ignore.
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
Here's some more useful advice.
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Please explain what you find whiny about wanting to have fun in a game you pay for.
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Originally Posted by RadDidIt
If...
If..... If I said I was introvert and still found this amazingly whiny, would I get yelled at? :3 Edit: I find the /concept/ amazingly whiny. No personal attacks. |
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so the next step is soloing it with multiple characters, but switch them at each phase - the others hang out by the door.|
Originally Posted by Nihilii
Lambda has been duoed by various combinations, I don't think even soloing it "legit" (just one account being played) is impossible, provided you keep 7 other accounts standing at the entrance as to not get automatically kicked from the not enough players thingy.
You can get 10/10 in the collection phase as a solo player playing one character with high damage alts by smashing 2-3 crates, going back to the other side, smashing 2-3 containment chambers, going back, and so on (milking the extra time efficiently). It's tight, but definitely possible - and this I say from first hand experience, although I've only done it a handful of times and on "direct" damage characters, i.e. melee alts. That's perhaps the one potential hiccup. You'd obviously want to be a strong debuffer for the final part, and illusion, as often, seems tailor-made for the task between PA and psi damage; but while something like an ill/cold is a potentially extremely high damage alt, much of that damage comes from pets and static debuffs, and a perfect sabotage phase might not be as easy to pull off. You really want to drop those crates in mere seconds as travel time will take quite a lot. Seeing as you get containment on crates and chambers it might be possible to build a nice enough direct damage attack chain. |
not full "soloing" but a big step beyond duoing
Wouldn't using extra accounts for attempting to semi-solo a Trial be kinda expensive? 
@Golden Girl
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Lambda has already been duo'd (by an SS/Fire brute an a Cold corr), and it is quite possible that it is soloable also by SS/Fire brutes. It's not that hard.|
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
I would love to see you try to solo an eight man Lambda. Feel free to fraps it, might need a RAM upgrade for that. Don't bother booking more than five minutes of space on youtube, though.
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However they changed it to boot you out of the trial if there were less than X number of players on the map under the minimum(8) after Y duration. So you need fillers now and they have to be VIP fillers, which makes it difficult (I wouldn't ask people to fill then make them sit around for 30-60 mins while I solo'd or duo'd lambda)
I can log in 8 accounts on my computer but I don't have access to 8 VIP accounts nor are my own accounts VIP.
Basically if you were going to "solo an eight man Lambda" you could do it with 1-2 toons and all the extras would just sit there.
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I've heard of people duoing Lambda, but the problem with attempting a single player multibox attempt is that you can only really control one character at a time. Two players controlling two characters tends to be far stronger than one player controlling two or even three characters. So my guess is that the final fight will likely require fillers that can speed up the fight with Marauder without needing much babysitting. I don't think one Ill/Cold will be enough, and I'm not convinced one Ill/Cold can take out the crates and vessels fast enough to interleave. I don't think the pets engage fast enough and I don't think you'd be fast enough on just your own attacks.|
Originally Posted by Nihilii
Lambda has been duoed by various combinations, I don't think even soloing it "legit" (just one account being played) is impossible, provided you keep 7 other accounts standing at the entrance as to not get automatically kicked from the not enough players thingy.
You can get 10/10 in the collection phase as a solo player playing one character with high damage alts by smashing 2-3 crates, going back to the other side, smashing 2-3 containment chambers, going back, and so on (milking the extra time efficiently). It's tight, but definitely possible - and this I say from first hand experience, although I've only done it a handful of times and on "direct" damage characters, i.e. melee alts. That's perhaps the one potential hiccup. You'd obviously want to be a strong debuffer for the final part, and illusion, as often, seems tailor-made for the task between PA and psi damage; but while something like an ill/cold is a potentially extremely high damage alt, much of that damage comes from pets and static debuffs, and a perfect sabotage phase might not be as easy to pull off. You really want to drop those crates in mere seconds as travel time will take quite a lot. Seeing as you get containment on crates and chambers it might be possible to build a nice enough direct damage attack chain. |
Perfectly willing to be proven wrong on that score, though.
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Now I don't have first hand experience with Ill/Cold since I can't stand pets, but looking specifically at Ill/Cold, which can solo Recluse on the STF, I'd mostly compare this fight to that (and this was done before Interface, Destiny, and Lore) I definitely think an Ill/Cold could solo Marauder in Lambda. If the Ill/Cold had a single target chain with a single target epic blast (fire blast, power blast, etc) then I don't think the crates would be too bad since they automatically give a containment boost since they are auto-immobilized. Speaking of containment, this would be even easier when marauder is affected by containment damage.|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
I've heard of people duoing Lambda, but the problem with attempting a single player multibox attempt is that you can only really control one character at a time. Two players controlling two characters tends to be far stronger than one player controlling two or even three characters. So my guess is that the final fight will likely require fillers that can speed up the fight with Marauder without needing much babysitting. I don't think one Ill/Cold will be enough, and I'm not convinced one Ill/Cold can take out the crates and vessels fast enough to interleave. I don't think the pets engage fast enough and I don't think you'd be fast enough on just your own attacks.
Perfectly willing to be proven wrong on that score, though. |
I think an SS/Fire could do it too, however they'd probably need lucks even with 45% S/L defense for marauder which means less space for Red Insps and Ultimate Insps.
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Won't happen from me. Not even sure I got the skillz - I suck at controllers. But really, the main stinker is, as DreadShinobi points out, the need for 8 VIP accounts (even as fillers it's a bother as I doubt this sort of venture would be a success on first go).| Perfectly willing to be proven wrong on that score, though. |
I'm confident the final fight wouldn't be impossible, provided you manage to complete the sabotage phase with all acids and grenades. For a ranged character with level shifts, lambda Marauder is little more than the original weak +1 AV ; the extra HP and time limit are a bother but Ill/Cold with Lore can deal quite a lot of DPS against a (mostly) static target.
The trouble is that this relies on lots of if, no argument. Got to make that sabotage flawless, got to have PA focused on / nades affecting Marauder just right every time so he never 2-hit KOs you, etc.. Definitely lots of thing that can and would likely go wrong.
Perhaps SS/Fire would be a better choice indeed. I kind of ruled it out because I was still stuck in the old uber Unstoppable and heightened S/L res mindset.
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Oh come on, logout bug while sitting on this page writing this post, really? Boo, forum software. Boo.
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Eventually, maybe, but there is a time limit. You will need the PA and the Decoys focused on Marauder, and that means clearing first to prevent distraction. That will burn up time even if you deploy the acids fast. And while Ill/Cold like most debuffing Illusion controllers is tough against one hard target, trying to solo clear the initial adds around Marauder is a different situation entirely. Sometimes five bosses can be more dangerous to Illusion than two Giant Monsters.|
Originally Posted by DreadShinobi
Now I don't have first hand experience with Ill/Cold since I can't stand pets, but looking specifically at Ill/Cold, which can solo Recluse on the STF, I'd mostly compare this fight to that (and this was done before Interface, Destiny, and Lore) I definitely think an Ill/Cold could solo Marauder in Lambda. If the Ill/Cold had a single target chain with a single target epic blast (fire blast, power blast, etc) then I don't think the crates would be too bad since they automatically give a containment boost since they are auto-immobilized. Speaking of containment, this would be even easier when marauder is affected by containment damage.
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Then you have to wear down Marauder, while dealing with the fact that even though Phantasm is an all ranged critter he likes to commit suicide by rushing the target, Marauder has a PBAoE kill-all button, and likes to jump around forcing the fight to reset several times.
Even after all that, if there was no time limit I would not have any doubts an Illusion controller could ultimately be made that could do it, because it becomes a divide and conquer fight. But with a time limit, the tactical situation changes, and I'm less inclined to see how its likely a player could do it all in one go.
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Yeah, your points would definitely be the biggest hurdle to cross.|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Eventually, maybe, but there is a time limit. You will need the PA and the Decoys focused on Marauder, and that means clearing first to prevent distraction. That will burn up time even if you deploy the acids fast. And while Ill/Cold like most debuffing Illusion controllers is tough against one hard target, trying to solo clear the initial adds around Marauder is a different situation entirely. Sometimes five bosses can be more dangerous to Illusion than two Giant Monsters.
Then you have to wear down Marauder, while dealing with the fact that even though Phantasm is an all ranged critter he likes to commit suicide by rushing the target, Marauder has a PBAoE kill-all button, and likes to jump around forcing the fight to reset several times. Even after all that, if there was no time limit I would not have any doubts an Illusion controller could ultimately be made that could do it, because it becomes a divide and conquer fight. But with a time limit, the tactical situation changes, and I'm less inclined to see how its likely a player could do it all in one go. |
Looking back at when Kahlan and I were working on duoing the STF (his rad/sonic and my ill/storm, way before incarnates) the big issue we had was at 25% recluse uses his mass bane summon, which meant the PA and Phantasm couldn't focus fire recluse, which was the majority of our dps due to his resists. The fight is actually quite similar to that of marauder when you take his resists and pet summons into account. Of course later on with incarnates he was able to solo it with his Ill/Cold (which he leveled and IO'd specifically for the task) and I really wish he still played the game to comment on what it would take to do this as I don't think he ever said (or I can't remember) how we was ultimately able to get his pets to stay on recluse through the bane summon, or if it was because of lore pets which are commandable. Granted when he did this he explicitly mentioned the numerous times he died while fighting recluse, so a time limit on Marauder's fight is definitely a hurdle as well. This is one reason why I think an SS/Fire could be better, because it doesn't have the same risks as an ill/cold while transitioning phantom army aggro.
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Wait... Your character? You mean that thing just under the damage numbers, and to the right of the combat logs? When do you find time to look at that? |
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba
I took a screen shot the other night when I was in a BAF. I couldn't even see my character due to all the other effects/players/enemies on the screen.
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Some people call that the chat window.
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Because "wanting to have fun" is being defined as "entertained 100% of the time, never ever ever having to spend a few minutes doing something I don't want to."|
Originally Posted by rsclark
Please explain what you find whiny about wanting to have fun in a game you pay for.
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It's like that spoiled rich kid--you know the one--the brat whose parents spend a fortune on their birthday party, paying for clowns, magicians, inflatable "moon walk" playhouses, and a thousand dollars on gifts, with the kid constantly complaining. "Gross! This sandwich has a pickle on it! I'M NOT EATING IT!!! I wanted the widescreen COLLECTOR'S edition, not this crap! I've seen that trick before, and it's more stupid now than it was then! Waaaaah!!!"
If you're not having fun, the stop paying for the game, duh. Of course, I don't believe for a second that's actually the case. I think its much more likely that the whiners (of whom I'm not necessarily saying the OP is one) are 97% happy, but like the spoiled rich kid, all they can dwell on is that other 3%.
Hope that clears it up.
We've been saving Paragon City for eight and a half years. It's time to do it one more time.
(If you love this game as much as I do, please read that post.)
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I've never heard it explained quite that way before, but that seems to fit my experiences perfectly.
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Originally Posted by Ironik
Introvert and Extravert are merely where you get your energy. Extraverts feel energized among others; these are the ones who like to go clubbing and other social events. Introverts, on the other hand, derive their energy from within, so solitude is the key to their happiness. I go to any social event and I find it draining. Groups of people exhaust me. They don't let you just observe; if you don't interact, they think you're arrogant and aloof. And that's the same sort of name-calling we see on the forums when introverts express an opinion different from the extraverts.
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Goodbye may seem forever
Farewell is like the end
But in my heart's the memory
And there you'll always be
-- The Fox and the Hound
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