Quote:
I wouldn't say it would a first for the Doctor,
|
Originally Posted by Zombie Man
Not at all. They said they should be killed if they were us. Strike one.
The Doctor gave them a chance to surrender. Strike two. The Doctor's game of last chance before you are destroyed only has two strikes. |
My question is, when one of the Silence said "Silence Will Fall" what on earth was it referring to? I can't imagine that it was talking about the future demise of its race at the hands of some hypnotised humans, nor that it was using the phrase in the traditional sense of "small s" silence falling.
Equally, using it as a sort of play on words combination to mean The Silence will occur/come to be/etc doesn't really make sense either because they're already there and have been for thousands of years.
Am I just missing something really obvious?
Omnes relinquite spes, o vos intrantes
My Characters
CoX Chatlog Parser
Last.fm Feed
Quote:
The Doctor just allowed the Silence to bring about their own demise.|
Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
Does it bother anyone else that the Doctor just began the genocide of the Silence?
|
Quote:
| The Doctor I know didn't kill things |
On a smaller scale, since the revival, he's directly or indirectly killed or attempted to kill Casandra, several Slitheen, the Krillitane, the Wire, Satan and a bunch of Angels.
That's just in the new series.
A few things worth mentioning:
Dr Renfrew is clearly based on Renfield (Dracula).
Greystrike Ophanage is apparently a nod to Greystoke Hall (Tarzen), but they get thier signs made by the same people who did Arkham Asylum.
Possibly the most sureal moment of the episode was the disapearing door window, through which we briefly saw Frances Barber with a cybernetic eyepatch. She will be back.
A throught: The Moff is recreating characters from the Dr Who he grew up with. Rory = Harry Sullivan, Canton = the Brigader.
I really should do something about this signature.
Quote:
The Silence may not have been there for 1000s of years prior to the universe being rebooted. They may have engeneered thier own existance in last seasons exploding Tardis. Thus "Silence will fall" can indeed mean "Silence will come to be".
|
Originally Posted by The_Spad_EU
My question is, when one of the Silence said "Silence Will Fall" what on earth was it referring to? I can't imagine that it was talking about the future demise of its race at the hands of some hypnotised humans, nor that it was using the phrase in the traditional sense of "small s" silence falling.
Equally, using it as a sort of play on words combination to mean The Silence will occur/come to be/etc doesn't really make sense either because they're already there and have been for thousands of years. Am I just missing something really obvious? |
I really should do something about this signature.
SPOILER:
River Song to Rory:
"My old man didn't see that did he..."
IIRC "My Old Man/Lady" is an American (Biker?) term for "Other Half".
(Old or Ol')
Nuff Said...
Coolio Wolfus leader of Coolio�s Crusaders on Union.
Tekna Logik leader of Tekna�s Tormentors on Defiant.
Creator of: Coolio's Tech Beacon Replacements
AE arc 402506, 'The Rise and Demise or Otherwise of Tekna Logik...'.
Quote:
Yes.|
Originally Posted by The_Spad_EU
My question is, when one of the Silence said "Silence Will Fall" what on earth was it referring to? I can't imagine that it was talking about the future demise of its race at the hands of some hypnotised humans, nor that it was using the phrase in the traditional sense of "small s" silence falling.
Equally, using it as a sort of play on words combination to mean The Silence will occur/come to be/etc doesn't really make sense either because they're already there and have been for thousands of years. Am I just missing something really obvious? |
Silence Falling = Silence Spreading = Silence Conquering
In other words
The Silence will fall over the whole of the universe is the same as saying Darkness will fall over the whole of the universe...
Where there is light now there will be darkness
Where there once was the roar of the big bang now there will be silence
It's a pretty simple and direct thing to say.
Quote:
She will be back and is probably the little girl. I mean that seemed to be a very tardis type thing to be do. And the Silence obviously wanted a Timelord, probably to work whatever time machine they were cobbling together...|
Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
A few things worth mentioning:
Dr Renfrew is clearly based on Renfield (Dracula). Greystrike Ophanage is apparently a nod to Greystoke Hall (Tarzen), but they get thier signs made by the same people who did Arkham Asylum. Possibly the most sureal moment of the episode was the disapearing door window, through which we briefly saw Frances Barber with a cybernetic eyepatch. She will be back. A throught: The Moff is recreating characters from the Dr Who he grew up with. Rory = Harry Sullivan, Canton = the Brigader. |
There were tonnes of references to old and new movies stuffed in there. Moffat certainly owes Dark City a nod, and I suspect he read The Quantum Thief sometime last year.
Quote:
One thing we did learn about about the Silence is they are parasites. They don't develop thier own technology, they get thier hosts to develop it for them. So, if they are developing a tardis-like time machine, the technology must have come from a previous host species. I.e. The Silence previously parasitised the Time Lords...
| And the Silence obviously wanted a Timelord, probably to work whatever time machine they were cobbling together... |
I really should do something about this signature.
Quote:
It's cockney. But it could refer to either husband or farther.
|
Originally Posted by Coolio
SPOILER:
River Song to Rory: "My old man didn't see that did he..." IIRC "My Old Man/Lady" is an American (Biker?) term for "Other Half". (Old or Ol') |
I really should do something about this signature.
Quote:
That's an interesting point. The reboot came by extrapolating memories. The Silence can't be remembered. These two facts probably go hand in hand, somehow.
|
Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
The Silence may not have been there for 1000s of years prior to the universe being rebooted. They may have engeneered thier own existance in last seasons exploding Tardis. Thus "Silence will fall" can indeed mean "Silence will come to be".
|
Quote:
I agree completely, but the Doctor has always been a better man than I. |
Originally Posted by Lord_Nightblade
Besides, the Silence started it.
|
...
New Webcomic -- Genocide Man
Life is funny. Death is funnier. Mass slaughter can be hilarious.
A bit of a problem here:
<spoliers>
A race that has inherent latent mind-controlling abilities, when talking to one of its slaves, would never, *ever*, use a phrase like "Kill us on sight."; lest the slave he's talking too promptly do so.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
I agree completely, but the Doctor has always been a better man than I.
|
The same Doctor that used the Silver Nemesis to wipe out an entire Cyberfleet? And used the Hand of Omega to destroy Skaro?
Man, I'd hate to meet you in a dark alley
However, it turned out that Smith was not a time-travelling Terminator
Quote:
Well, I think the Silence are pretty used to taunting and playing with humans, knowing that whatever they say will be forgotten. In the context of the longer conversation it was having with it's captor, that line probably didn't come across as a "subliminal nudge" until it was edited down to being the only words said.|
Originally Posted by ThugOne
A race that has inherent latent mind-controlling abilities, when talking to one of its slaves, would never, *ever*, use a phrase like "Kill us on sight."; lest the slave he's talking too promptly do so.
|
Further, it's quite possible that the captive Silent was trying to get Canton to kill him. Being kept prisoner and being SEEN by a human for so long might have stressful to their psychology. And it might have preferred death to being kept alive, and interrogated to reveal all the secrets of the Silence.
I'm a published amateur comic book author: www.ericjohnsoncomics.com
******MA Arcs****
Arc 5909: "Amazon-Avatars"
Arc 6143: "Escalation" (Nominee: Architect Awards, Nominee: Player Awards, and Dev's Choice!)
Well, I am liking the season thus far, and Neil Gaiman's ep is coming up!! Can't wait!!!
"Star Wars is adolescent nonsense; Close Encounters is obscurantist drivel; "Star Trek" can turn your brains to puree of bat guano; and the greatest science fiction series of all time is Dr. Who! "
Harlan Ellison
I thought the two parter was great and good way to introduce a very spooky race and the arc of the series.
I will say one thing about Moffat is that he is good at continuity of his stories so I believe that all the River Song stuff will come to pass (including her marriage to the doctor, giving her the screwdriver, becoming a professor). She also said that she has a spotters guide to the doctors faces so implies that she may be around for quite some time.
Also I find it interesting that they have introduced a new little girl possible timelord when they have Jenny (the doctors daughter) running around the universe. I wonder if Moffat is going to do something with that.
Anyway I can't wait for the rest of the series, even though they are doing the annoying thing of having a break in the middle of it all!!
Member of GGRRR, a SG on Defiant - check out our website - GGRRR
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Zwillinger
Quote:
|
Thoughts and observations after a second viewing:
1) Richard Nixon
- some of his socially awkward moments are actually quite consistent with some real life things I've read about Nixon. He never was the most smoothly charismatic of people, for a politician, let alone a president, and he was aware of it.
- some have noted that this Nixon is shown a bit more sympathetically than most people would expect. My "fridge brilliance" insight on this is: one of the Doctor's strengths is he brings out the best in people. He makes ordinary people aspire to be extraordinary, and reminds exceptional people what they are capable of. He brings out the best in "Tricky Dick", using Nixon's skills at conspiracy and intrigue for a good cause. The most damning indictment of Nixon's character from all this: The Doctor's influence DIDN'T stick for the long term.
- loved that Nixon was taping all Oval Office activity as a counter-measure to the Silence.
- another observation: at one moment, a frantic and active Doctor tells Nixon: "Don't trust anyone, except me." A few words from The Doctor can have a massive impact. ("Doesn't she look tired?"). Look at that line again. Is The Doctor responsible, in part, for Nixon's paranoia later in his tenure?
2) Canton
Hope he shows up again in the series. Tough and competent 1960s FBI agent with a rebellious streak and ability to think outside the box? Sounds like good companion material under different circumstances. And like the commenter above noted, he's a pretty good analogue for the Brigader in many ways.
Love his "welcome to America" moment. These two episodes are wonderful examples of how culturally, Britain and the US are like two long-time friends who can poke fun at each other's quirks. In some ways, the story is a love letter to the homeland of the American fans.
3) upcoming plot points.
Much has already been said about how these two episodes are setting things up, and raise more questions than are answered.
I think it's pretty clear the girl was being kept by The Silence to be the pilot for their proto-TARDIS. Beyond that, Moffat has left us with many plausible options for her origin.
-Since the Silence have that Grey-crossed-with-Men-in-Black vibe, they could have used Amy as an incubator for a child using the Doctor's genetic material somehow.
-Could be the daughter of The Doctor and River Song, and Amy is just holding the girl in the picture as an "auntie".
- could be Jenny (or another person of Time Lord decent. Susan? The Rani?), captured by the Silence and forced to regenerate into a more childlike form?
- maybe Amy's daughter with no Time Lord DNA involved. Maybe just being conceived inside the TARDIS is enough?
4) The Silence.
Interesting villains.
They are trying to back-engineer TARDIS technology, so clearly they've been watching the Time Lords. Or maybe just The Doctor on his many visits to Earth.
Interesting thought: The Silence have a natural ability to make you ignore and forget them. Kinda like Perceptual Filters in Time Lord technology. What if Rassilon or other Time Lord Scientists back-engineered that feature of the TARDIS from The Silence? The two races may have a long history, but only The Silence would remember. (and maybe hold a grudge?)
As to the Doctor's solution to The Silence. Yes, it was a pretty violent solution in some ways. But, really, all he was doing was giving humanity a way to fight back in a war it wasn't aware of. And all The Silence have to do to avoid being killed is stop messing with humanity and avoid them. Little different than ordering Danny-Boy to destroy the Dalek ship or blowing up a Sontaran battle-fleet. Warning was given, The Silence were the aggressors, the Doctor did what he had to in order to protect the innocent, as he has in the past.
Done babbling... for now.
I'm a published amateur comic book author: www.ericjohnsoncomics.com
******MA Arcs****
Arc 5909: "Amazon-Avatars"
Arc 6143: "Escalation" (Nominee: Architect Awards, Nominee: Player Awards, and Dev's Choice!)
Yeah I did like that, "yeah, well, welcome to America" bit
I also wonder if the original Doctor death in the first episode was done by the space suit itself (no one inside of it). As was shown in ep. 2 the suit started to move by itself (at least its fingers)...*shrugs*
Leader of The LEGION/Fallen LEGION on the Liberty server!
SSBB FC: 2062-8881-3944
MKW FC: 4167-4891-5991
I hope they bring back Canton, too. Mark Sheppard is freaking awesome.
Goodbye, I guess.
@Lord_Nightblade in Champions/Star Trek Online
nightblade7295@gmail.com if you want to stay in touch
Quote:
Like how Brits think Americans are all cowboys and Americans think Brits prefer to boil their food until the flavor goes away!| These two episodes are wonderful examples of how culturally, Britain and the US are like two long-time friends who can poke fun at each other's quirks. In some ways, the story is a love letter to the homeland of the American fans. |
Quote:
A Timelord with superhuman strength. Maybe there's a bit of Auton Rory in the mix somehow as well?
|
Originally Posted by Innovator
OMG! Amy gave birth to a Time Lord!
|
99458: The Unbearable Being of Lightness
191775: How the Other Half Lives
My Webcomics
Quote:
The Doctor seemed to recognize who the occupant of the spacesuit was so it could have been someone that he encountered in the 200 years after we last saw him.|
Originally Posted by Energizing_Ion
Yeah I did like that, "yeah, well, welcome to America" bit
I also wonder if the original Doctor death in the first episode was done by the space suit itself (no one inside of it). As was shown in ep. 2 the suit started to move by itself (at least its fingers)...*shrugs* |
As far as the girl goes, I think she is either Amy's mother, Amy, or Amy's daughter. 40 years is enough time for Amy's mother to grow up and have a 20 year old daughter. Amy's grandmother could be a Time Lord that escaped the Time War by leaving before it started or some other method and lived as a human. Which would explain why the girl could regenerate. If the girl is Amy, then the regeneration process could have kept Amy as a little girl and something happened to her before she met the Doctor caused her to lose her memory and powers.
It is episode's like these where I wished I had a temporal TV so I could see all the episodes of this season. Unfortunately, I would have to sign some type of NDA contract for anything I watched that is in the future. Dimensional TVs wouldn't have those problems, but they have the problem of keeping track of which series you are watching. The Original Series of Star Trek could have hundreds of different version and it would be difficult to keep track of them all. For example, Captain Pike being the main character of the series instead of Kirk or Kirk fighting off the Borg.
The first step in being sane is to admit that you are insane.
Was watching the Doctor Who In America special and it seems that the actress that plays River Song knows the entire arc. However, no one else in the cast does. So she really can do, "Spoilers!" and actually mean it.
Considering that BBC "series" (what we call a season) seems to be 13 episodes, I would expect that they have to cram a lot of stufff into each episode.