So what do you think of the new Trials?

I personally have enjoyed them and yet they have also sometimes left me feeling very... um... I am not sure /e facepalm?

The first few days I really enjoyed running the Lambda Sector, it was very fun and the fast pace seemed to fit right into my typical play style of running past mobs and trying to find the glowies. The only two issues that ever seem to pop up both deal with the temp powers. Molecular Acid/Pacification Grenades temps and either not realizing it or not knowing how to use it. There has been some issues where people from one team accidentally go to the wrong 'zone' which can lead to people on the "acid team" getting grenades or vice versa.

After Wednesday I pretty much switched to all BAFs. The first one I ran on Victory was run by Hyperkinetic Hippy and I learned a lot from his method of running it. I ran a few more with various people who had some great ideas including: Elegost's plan of camping the north and south walkways instead of doors. DC's plan of gathering on the tennis courts and pulling the AVs to the wall to prevent people from intercepting them early. Farming the ixp was the way to go for the BAFs as we were able to get between 30-50% of judgement unlocked on each run. Each day there were people who had suggestions and criticisms of the new ideas and strategies, but I think each run is getting smoother as the days progress (yes this is partially due to people being level shifted and having slots unlocked and slotted).

After almost a week of running these I was wondering what people's perceptions about these trials are. I am reminded of MG's comment about the CoP, I think he said something like, after all that time spent planing and setting up teams it was over in 20 minutes and he felt like it was huge let down. I haven't been on too many of these trials were I wasn't involved with setting up the teams or league but for those who just join one does it feel that way? Because for me its been a lot of fun, and at times stressful (but in a fun way) like "omg we actually might fail this" or "20 secs left and no prisoners escaped...gogogo!"

I do have to commend anyone who leads one of these trials especially a BAF, trying to communicate to *that* many people can be difficult and often frustrating. I know I have gotten a little short with people who question the plan we lay out for that run (the best was when one guy was telling me we were doing it wrong because I wasn't doing it the the way someone else lead it the previously... when that person was .... me).

The only other frustrating thing about this league system is formation of the teams. Prior to starting we might have someone crash and then you are left wondering how long do I hold their spot. Also someone may ask if they can join and you invite them and suddenly their whole team of 4-8 people pop up on your league window when you were expecting one person.

------So quick recap----

Do you like the new trials?

If you aren't leading do they seem brainless/too easy like the CoP?

How long should we hold spots for people who disappear when forming?

And, don't get too upset if someone leading gets short with you about something you are doing because often times they are trying to send tells/messages to 4 other people as well.

I love 'em. I've tried not to be tempted when once is forming, but I can't help but join. I really love the need for coordination, but it's not overly complicated.

Coming from FFXI, Aion, and other MMOs I've played, this end game "raid" is *nothing* in terms of frustation/time investment. I hope they give us some more trials soon, so I can play the poop outta them too.

As for waiting on people, I'd usually give 'em 5 minutes to come back. Not really fair that 16+ people have to wait for 1 or 2 people. (I do understand crashes happen, though)

I enjoy them both. I actually like the Lambda Trial better than the BAF. It can get tricky if your team doesn't get enough acid and I think one reason some players dislike it is because part two pretty much requires you to ignore a TON of potential iXP to gather weapons for part three. And once you find all of the acid and grenades you don't even get whatever time may be left over to try and earn some because that spawns Maurader and the beginning of Part three.

Both definately require team work and players that LISTEN to instructions. Earlier I was on a BAF and we were into the final part where you need to defeat Siege and Nightstar within 10 second of each other. I don't know how many times I saw in League chat someone shouting out the health totals "Siege 55/ NIghtstar 21 STOP attacking her till we catch up." Of course Scrapper and Blaster Lock prevailed and we got the delightful task of having to defeat them both twice. To the credit of leadership we were so fast and so good we acomplished this and still had time left on the counter.

This is not a Sister Psyche where you can power your way through stuff and even stealth and tp around fights. Here you better come ready to battle and if you are still trying to open up a power the last hing you want to do is find a way to SPEED through things. The more IDF you defeat the more iXP you earn and the faster you open those powers and eventually become a 50(+3).

Its different and its been a lot of fun so far. I look forward to more trials in the future. Lets see so far we have defeated Battle Maiden [mission two of Apex], Nueron and Bobcat, [mission three of Tin Mage], Siege and Nightstar [BAF] and Maurader {Lambda]. That makes 6 of Coles Praetors down and quite a few to go. Is a confrontation with Mother Mayhem on the horizon? Heaven help us that will probably involve Seers.. I sire hope we get some form of PSI protection in the bext few power slots.

Siege, Nightstar, Battle Maiden, and Bobcat are not Preators. Only 2 Preators defeated. Neuron and Maurader. Mother's plan was thwarted. So that may count as a defeat.

The trials were great the 1st 10 -15 times I ran them. Now... Little burned out. I've been focusing on just one 50 for this and still have a slot to unlock and don't even have teir 4 on the others. Think this may be a little to grindy for me to get them done with the majority of people.

I suggest every one try the new TF's as well. Ran Sutter 3 times and it's a nice little TF. Haven't run Kai yet but very much want to.

I am so far liking them trials.

Favorite so far is the Lambda, like how it relies on temp powers that you have to get until of course most people are ready to try a Master of Lambda (although for some strange reason, it NEVER feels like we get all 10 temp powers as we always need to kill one of those containers).

BAF isn't bad, just I seriously dislike how it does not explain how Siege became a red warwork. If you do MJ's new arc you see Sieges old costume still (unless if they changed this when they launched i20), but it does explain why Siege could use Warwork missile launching technique on you.

Sadly most runs of BAF I have done have been 'farm runs' where people just kill reindeers for 40 minutes, yes we eventually kill them but during that time period I start to hate farming. It just isn't my thing, I have Demons Farm on that incarnate toon but at most I can only run it twice before getting bored, and I don't want to get bored of the trial because I don't have all 5 T4s yet, 2/5 of the way there.. and I need more Very Rares to drop. NAO!

Then again, people who aren't only incarnating one character like myself need to iXP and I do not and chances are if I just want to do "Speed" runs I would need to bulk up and run them myself..

When not leading, yes they seem extremely easy. But that just means good leading. Then again, I am +3 so this could be why I find it easier than most :3

I would say hold spots for 5 - 10 minutes, same length as a PUG-team when I run them. I base that time on how long it takes me to reboot and open CoH, zone in and stuff because I have an old computer.

... and when I get my [Void Partial Radial Judgement] with MAGNITUDE TEN KNOCKBACK (and -50% damage) I am spamming the crap out of it when people piss me off. Oh? You wanted those mobs.... ::blaaarrrrrgggghhhhh:: and they fly away. Muahahaahaa!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wavicle CoH players are stupid and incompetent compared to WoW players.

Something has got to be up with the Acid temps; every single run, all 10 gotten, and magically everyone is claiming they used one or don't have any with at least 3 portals still up. Every time. After repeated requests in team and bcast to check the temp power window regardless of what team you should have been going after, we've had to still hit the new containment pod spawns to get rid of the last few portals. Very easy to blame human error, not paying attention, incompetence, etc.....but I really think something else is going on.

They need to be put somewhere else or accessed more easily; having to scroll through the whole window (and by god I have a lot of stuff in the power window) is inefficient. They do not always go into an empty spot in the default power tray automatically and I don't believe they will go into any extra power trays automatically whatsoever.

Other than that aspect, I'm loving both trials. Lambda is a cake walk now (other than the temp power issue), and the easiest part of BAF seems to be the part where it breaks down more often than not (escapees); I think too many runs are putting too many eggs in one basket for taking care of runners. Some other issues with BAF, but I'm attributing it to it still being new. People will calm down in another week or so.

I've already forgotten about most of you

So far, I like them. New mobs and ways of playing. The leadership has been awesome. Can't wait to see what the next challenges are.

Now to the other items:
1 - I believe a few minutes to wait would be the "polite" thing to do. But the speed at which these are moving, a few minutes could mean it is over if the DC is late. This is a touchy because people are getting good at keeping the teams filled. I could see frustration building up in players over time hitting LFG flag and never getting in a league. Not all are in the globals and there appears to be new players every so often. I just don't see an easy way to answer this currently. I guess having a few extra or extra team every so often would be a way to get more involved in our community.

2 - I am concerned on the future trials. People have dissected these two already and they are practically routine now. I don't want to see people get bored running the same two things over and over. And will the devs have to add more extreme things so that we don't burn through them in the first week?

Eh, I am jus rambling now. Need coffee. Glad to see such great teams on the runs I have been on. Has really forced to polish up my buffing and healin skills with my emp def. I wonder what it will be like on over toons.

The Negative:

Lore wise, B.A.F. is rather disappointing. The Incarnate trial should be where we bring our most powerful heroes to thwart and extra ordinary threat. Apex, Tin Mage, and Lamda achieve this, IMHO. The whole 'prisoner escape' segment really diminishes that feel. Never mind that I've hated this game mechanic since it's introduction in Croatoa. With B.A.F, the whole thing seems overly silly. Seems like the entire escape segment should have been settled by a tossing a WarHulk corpse on the door...or having a blaster melt the door shut...or call the janitor and have him just lock the door...

So after attaining all this power of the Well stuff, we've become glorified maintenance managers?

For the immediate future, these trials are the only means of advancing our Incarnate slots. I hope and expect this will change in a future issue. Having to run the same two trials repeatedly at nauseum is very annoying. I applaud and appreciate those who kept running things, and the experimentation that went along to makes get the most bang for our time. I got my main to T4, T3, T3, T3, T3; basically in just 3 days. Now, I have the joy of repeating the process on all my other alts...

The Positive:

The trials are actually fun and challenging. Even with level shifting +3, you need to be on your toes. Things move quickly and the timers keep a sense of urgency; which keeps things exciting. The level of coordination required is not insurmountable and the trials reward you for higher levels of team work without punishing you too severely for miscommunications...and those who can't read...or only check chat window every third mob kill...OK OK OK I look every third spawn.

The Incarnate abilities really are cool and worth the effort in attaining them. With the exception of the Lore pets, I'm actually impressed with the Lore abilities.

Overall, I am very pleased with Issue 20. I am eager to see future trials. More variety in our options for advancing Incarnate abilities will be a pleasant change.

I like the trials, Lambda more so than the BAF. I do think both trials have segments that drag on longer than necessary simply to give players a way to earn incarnate XP. For Lambda, it's the clearing phase before the infiltration; for the BAF, it's the AV farm phase. I realize clearing beyond the kill quota in Lambda and farming in the BAF is a player's choice, but it is encouraged by iXP design.

(Don't misunderstand me: I'm ragging on the iXP system, not the players. It takes competent leadership to pull BAF farming off, and you've done a great job coordinating these trials, Masque.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Masque How long should we hold spots for people who disappear when forming?

Speaking as someone who missed a trial with an untimely disconnection, a minute or two seems fair for those with a connection hiccup. C'est la vie, the needs of many, and it's not that difficult to find another or form your own.

The Good :

Leadership for the most part has been awesome on the organized trials.

The Bad :

The LFG system seems all but useless for this. I sat for an hour while fiddling around at WW in queue for either of the new trials and nothing. Never once even a false start at a load into one of them. (and I know trials were being run and organized as I could see messages for them in private global chat) For those with globals these trials are findable easy enough, but I can see alot of backlash and frustration coming for those that aren't using the globals. Everyone forms up a max size group manually instead of just using the LFG system. I perfectly understand that as it makes sure you have a competant group, but it is an epic fail for a new grouping system IMHO.

Don't forget: At least two more iTrials are in the pipeline. If you're getting burned out. Take a break and wait for the other iTrials especially if you have other 50s to deify.

I think it was Wednesday and by the time I logged on, enough trials were running that I missed the boat. I used the LFG as a lark; the time never changes that I've seen and I do not know if the search feature, while already on a league and in the trial, shows who is LFG. Anyway, I was pulled into a Lambda fairly shortly (again the timer never changed) and 9 of us ran around and did what we could. Otherwise, I don't think it's working correctly for most of the time. I only tried it again once, maybe twice more, but only for a couple of mintues before I just joined one being announced.

When using the LFG, it's recommended to do "first available" and "willing to join in progress". If either setting works or matters is anyone's guess.

Regarding globals, and I know there is a lot going on, but it sure seems damned quiet when a bunch of iTrials are going on. I personally have used globals to ask/answer questions *while* having Raid star and otherwise participating and have used Globals to announce a time when the iTrial I'm on is close to finishing to allow others to switch/zone in for another run. Hopefully when people aren't feeling "overwhelmed"?, they'll do the same. *shrug* Though I'm sure there is still traffic on the seclusive channels, but that doesn't really do much as a whole.

I've already forgotten about most of you

Interesting question.

Overall, I'd say I've enjoyed the new Incarnate trials. Personally I prefer the BAF, as I find the mad scramble for temp powers in the Lambda trial to be at odds to the methodical way I normally like to play the game. I understand that the whole point is to rush from point to point, I just don't like being forced by the design of the trial to rush headlong into a mess that on my squishier characters is probably going to result in lots of death. This is mitigated somewhat if you have a +3 shift and a good leader, but even so.

The only other negative I have is the design of the Master of Lambda badges, which given how vital the temp powers are for many teams at this stage, strikes me as a bad design decision which could have negative repercussions for hardcore badges with the community at large. Hopefully once a critical mass of players reaches +3 shift and tier 4 powers this won't really be a big issue, but the design concerns me. I don't want "those damn badgers" to get a reputation for griefing trials. But that may be overstating the issue at this early juncture.

That said, otherwise I'm enjoying the Trials very much. I like the way the story is being advanced and I find the Marauder battle in particular very enjoyable.

TLDR: They suck, axe it all. I keed, I keed!

I like them a lot, both. I've faceplanted more recently than in a long time, I think. (Don't anyone come correcting me, 'cause I'll deny it!) I think there is definitely a lot more thinking to do on the last L50 TFs/Trials to be released (Apex/Tin Mage/Lambda/BAF), and I think that's a good thing, both for my fun level and for the game in general.

A few things, however, I have seen that may contribute to a negative experience for some.

One, I've found that since I, as many people, want the Strong, Pretty Shinies ASAP, many people are running the Sweet BeJeebus outta these things. As it is our right, of course.
But there are a few negative impacts:

One, it quickly goes from, "Neat, we succeeded! Phew, that was a tough fight, way to go team!" to "OMG, You ****ing slacker ***** ***** let one through! Now I don't get Mah Badgeration! I hate you alls! Whah don't you all suck an egg or sumthin!" This is natural with so much repetition, because people hone their skills, but it's not constructive, imo. One BAF run I was on actually got the "No escapees" badge one time mostly by accident, and it was pretty damned exciting (to me, easily amused), and I feel the accidental achievement is much cooler in the moment than the meticulously planned one.)

Another, is, the problem of people who play once or twice a week vs people who have permanent buttprints in their gaming chair, and chronic carpal tunnel. (Fortunately, I certainly don't fall into this camp. <.<. >.>.) [what? what?? ] We/They often fall into the trap of considering people who aren't current on the latest strategies as 'uninformed noobs,' when they're just trying to have some fun, maybe hang with friends and/or make some new ones... I too find myself falling victim to this attitude sometimes, and it takes effort to restrain myself. It helps to keep a good perspective.

(Corollaries to this problem: 'Don't take that tank, tanks suck on this.' 'Don't take that guy, he has no IOs.' Not saying I've seen this problem yet too much, but I can see it becoming a problem as people insist on making only 'perfect' teams. And I'm not saying that people don't have the right to do this, if they're intent on creating a team specifically to achieve a certain goal, but it could become a bad habit rather than a special case.)

I'm hoping the repeated running won't make doing these less popular in the future - though I think it's inevitable. Because right now, this is my favorite content in the game. But I'll likely burn out on it, like anything and like everyone else, and need a recharge, especially when I complete getting the slots on most of my characters.

I continue to appreciate the leaders of these TFs, as I am content to follow instead of lead, and I can try to take a position of leadership when needed. And I appreciate the flexibility/empathy/patience/adaptability/civility that they have shown for the vast majority of cases, and I have already forgotten the lapses that may or may not have occurred.

Also, Masque, 2 min max wait on peope who drop unless you know specifics about their case, imo. Being on the Vent server really helps, as 'droppers' can safely rageVent (Ventrage?) about how awful this internet thing can sometimes be. And teammates waiting can berate the 'droppers' mercilessly with extreme prejudice while their sucky internet fixes.

Now git meh some more iXPees!!

Also I do find the mad scramble to explain how the temp powers work in Lambda a bit tedious after so many runs, but I like the mechanic for the most part.

It's great when it works well, but it is frustrating when people on the team forget/don't read the instructions/etc. But again, the genius in 'partial credit' is at work here, and it works to great effect, imo.

Thumbs up for the new trials! Thumbs up for the new incarnate powers!

Seems that everything that can be said, has been said in this thread already.

The temp power issue in the Lambda annoys me, ect ect ect.

If someone DCs, wait a few and fill the spot. Not fair to make 15-23 ppl wait around too long for one person.

One thing I wanna add is BIG UPS to Masque, MP, Hippy and a few others for leading these from the start, learning what works and what doesnt. Thanks for laying the ground work and giving us a good idea on how to run these smoothly, effectively, and timely. Leading ppl while at the same time trying to figure out what works best, while instructing 16-23 ppl, not easy and yall deserve your just props.

Thanks again!

Of the little I've done, I don't hate the trials. At the same time, I find the lag an exercise in frustration especially since there's no other reasonable option for the unlocks. I have gotten a chance to discover part of the how/why certain things lag me out but I'm pretty sure I'm screwed as far as actually fixing it until I get a high end computer.

The trials are AWESOME and I can't wait to keep running them later tonight.

Been pretty lucky to be with Nites/Jagged Legion on Pinnacle, been breezing them in 25-30 minutes, both BAF/Lambda. Our only fly in the ointment has been a bugged Lambda run last night that kicked in the timer on start and disallowed us from getting any temps from inside the area. Even then, we did put a dent in Marauder but simply weren't able to overcome the dozen or so War Walkers in the courtyard.

I haven't led one yet, but our leaders have all been great.

Advice sought:

What's the best way to get the Uncommon/Rare Shards? So far I've been converting Astral/Empyrial Merits into Threads and into Salvage, but this seems kinda clunky...is there a more efficient way of getting the Uncommon/Rare?

1. I like the new Trials, but I am annoyed that if I want the new goodies I have to run them over and over and over again. The "alternate path" is prohibitively expensive.

2. The Trials seems fairly straightforward but what I don't like is the general lack of communication I'm seeing. Sometimes the leader doesn't give any explanation of what's going on beside "go here, do this". I guess the assumption is everyone has done this before, but I was experiencing this just a few days after I20 launched. I've seen some people just post a link to a map for the BAF, and barely say anything else. On the other hand, I have seen some people explain what exactly is going on.

3. Haven't seen this too much but I'd say five minutes.

Hai Masque.

There are new trials? Hmmmm I need to log in the game some time soon. Text me when you get ready to run another one and I will see if I can squeeze in some time to game.

I'm enjoying the BAF thus far. Haven't been on a Lambda yet.

The best way to get Uncommon/Rare for me has been...well, the loot table.
I think I've got 1 x Common, 2 x Uncommon, 1 x Rare, 1 x Very Rare from them. Created the Commons I needed from Threads (via Astral Merits mostly) and easily crafted up to a Rare Judgement power as soon as I'd got it unlocked from iXP.