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It's highly unlikely you're alone.|
Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
I speak a point of view that is rarely expressed on the forums. It's (highly) likely that I speak for a minority. Trying to make me feel like I am alone, however, will never make me cease to speak.
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Being not alone doesn't make your position not irrational.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Softcapping an Invuln is fantastic. Softcapping a Willpower is amazing. Softcapping SR is kissing your sister.
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That's the way it is with tiny minorities |
Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
I speak a point of view that is rarely expressed on the forums.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Well spotted |
Originally Posted by Void_Huntress
Being not alone doesn't make your position not irrational.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Positron said he's very pleased with the reaction of the player base to the Incarnate system, and how it's working exactly the way they hoped it would, so that sounds like they're comfortable with the drop rate for Shards.
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Originally Posted by Zombie Man
At this point, only datamining showing an actual and significant horrific drop rate for soloers will change the rate. I doubt that's the case.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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A very, very, very little bit. Its mostly what Positron wants it to be. At the moment, my influence over the end game is probably somewhat lower than the average closed beta tester.|
Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
Oh, I don't know, sometimes I suspect it is at least a little bit about what Arcanaville wants it to be.
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Most of my content-advocacy is on the public forums anyway: I rarely make content requests or suggestions in private. Powers and critter design on the other hand, I tend to be, shall we say, more vocal on both publicly and privately.
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Quote:
My fault:|
Originally Posted by Void_Huntress
You know, you're absolutely right. It's TOTALLY Arcana's fault that Martial Arts is less useless than it was before.
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Eagle's Claw's crit booster
CAK's defense debuff
CAK's increased damage
Cobra's damage/recharge point
Total single target damage no longer sad
Not my fault:
Eagle's Claw's glitchy implementation (hopefully going to get that fixed)
CAK's defense debuff not slottable
Thunder Kick still worthless
Eagle's Claw stun still stand up comedy material
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
(Please support the best webcomic about a cosmic universal realignment by impaired angelic interference resulting in identity crisis angst. Or I release the pigmy water thieves.)
Quote:
I almost regret telling Castle that Super Stunners seemed out of place without a heal or rez. He went "They need a rez? Is that what you want?! FINE!" and gave them the painful, autohitting, end-draining, damage-dealing 100% rez. |
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
At the moment, my influence over the end game is probably somewhat lower than the average closed beta tester.
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But it's about time Freaks had a unit people cared about. I enjoy singling them out on my Scrapper and taking them out.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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Like when I said I'm introverted, too?|
Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
Trying to make me feel like I am alone, however, will never make me cease to speak.
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Does that make you feel alone?
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I think you are taking out your life frustrations on this game and on the other forumites who try to help you. Not that there isn't anything inherently wrong with that, but you do seem quite loquacious for an introvert. |
Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
I've been "sucking it up and dealing with it" for twenty years (as a gamer) or forty years (personally), whichever way you meant this. I "suck it up and deal with" living in an extroverted world every single day. I've "sucked it up and dealt" with games becoming more and more focused on "challenge" (as well as "realism" and "shooting") for the past twenty years.
And frankly, I'm sick of having to bow to extroverts and challenge seekers. There's worlds and worlds of things out there for extroverts and challenge seekers already. One of the main points (not the main point, not the only main point, but one of a handful) that draws me to this game and keeps me with this game is the fact that it was unlike the rest, that it actually catered to ease and solo-play (solo play doesn't have to be easy, and easy doesn't have to be solo; these are separate things). I've seen franchises, companies, and genres I love morph, "evolve", and die many, many times, and of late the trend in the video game world has been towards conformity, towards making everything the same. City of isn't there yet, but the steps they've taken in development of the Incarnate system have, thus far, seemed quite clearly to be steps towards that. I'm open to being pleasantly surprised by i20 content, and I'll be the first to praise Paragon if I'm wrong about it, but what I've heard and seen so far has not given me cause for hope. I do not want to see this game's end-game be like every other game's end-game, where the idea is "tactics", "challenge", and "teams/raids". City of has, thus far, avoided that path, and I will not "suck it up and deal with" yet another game I love going down that same old path everyone else has trod before. I've had quite enough of having to "suck it up and deal with it", thank you. |
While you do have a voice and are definitely allowed to participate in the discussion, overlaying your discussions about how others have treated you in another game or IRL isn't really germane to this discussion. I know there have been people here who have tried to help you in ways that they can, but your rebuffs to them aren't exactly engendering of a returned warmth.
You also refer to this game as 'yours', and ascribe ownership of this game to people who are casuals only. While it may be scarce in terms of the selection of the games that you desire versus the people who want an escalating challenge, CoX has always had a progression within its development and it has not always/solely catered to the (casual) soloist. The original Task Force design and AVs never were casual or for the soloist, although they softened some of the aspects to make them more casual friendly.
There have been many people who have been here as long as you and have requested content that is more challenging. It isn't 'their game' anymore than it is yours, but I feel that the devs have threaded a fine line in keeping the game and story going. And like any good story, it should come to a climax, lest the story become static and thusly stale.
I think that you brought up some good points about the mechanics of the game in previous posts but I don't really feel that this post is one of your best.
The dearth of challenge in this game has been a long standing hole in CoX and I'm glad that the devs are beginning to address it now. I just hope that they continue to look after the casuals, the soloists and the introverts as well. And I suppose the PvPers, wherever they may be.
Up front, I'm also a serious introvert. I disdain PuG's outright, and am perfectly content to run solo all night long.
That said, I haven't seen anything that has been done so far, or has been hinted at in the future that is in the least bit concerning to me. The new Incarnate system is very much solable. I've managed to solo my way through Ramiel on both a Scrapper and a Dom for instance.
I will agree, that it would be good to have more Incarnate class content, and will hugely agree we need more incarnate class content that is outside of TF's and Events. I have no idea what I20 is going to offer, but I'd love to see 2-4 fully new Arcs from a contact(s) who gets in touch with you when you finish Ramiel. In fact, if I were a Dev (oh, those words of doom) that would be a high priority. Then, each issue after that should have that many new arcs again. (For that matter, give the Mission Architect the tools to create Incarnate Arcs).
That said, I think it is rather apalling to declare that CoH is to be the "introverts" game and that any steps down the road to having more team-oriented content is "robbing us of our game". When you say that, you're essentially saying "My fun is more important than yours." Yes, Eiko, that's what you are saying. You are putting your own enjoyment above that of others.
What we need, and should be calling for is a balanced design. One that has more than enough room for someone who wants to solo, including incarnate level... as well as major challenges that are team focused. A game that doesn't declare the game is for "this group" or "that group" but a game that has stuff for both groups. Frankly, I think that this game has generally done a good job of that. To that end, I'd like to see our Devs stay the course, and frankly, I've not seen anything that really indicates they were planning otherwise.
(All on Virtue)
Guidestar: lvl50 Grav/FF Controller
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Astrolabe Lvl 50 Grav/Eng Dom
Too many others to consider.
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Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
I've been "sucking it up and dealing with it" for twenty years (as a gamer) or forty years (personally), whichever way you meant this. I "suck it up and deal with" living in an extroverted world every single day. I've "sucked it up and dealt" with games becoming more and more focused on "challenge" (as well as "realism" and "shooting") for the past twenty years.
And frankly, I'm sick of having to bow to extroverts and challenge seekers. There's worlds and worlds of things out there for extroverts and challenge seekers already. One of the main points (not the main point, not the only main point, but one of a handful) that draws me to this game and keeps me with this game is the fact that it was unlike the rest, that it actually catered to ease and solo-play (solo play doesn't have to be easy, and easy doesn't have to be solo; these are separate things). I've seen franchises, companies, and genres I love morph, "evolve", and die many, many times, and of late the trend in the video game world has been towards conformity, towards making everything the same. City of isn't there yet, but the steps they've taken in development of the Incarnate system have, thus far, seemed quite clearly to be steps towards that. I'm open to being pleasantly surprised by i20 content, and I'll be the first to praise Paragon if I'm wrong about it, but what I've heard and seen so far has not given me cause for hope. I do not want to see this game's end-game be like every other game's end-game, where the idea is "tactics", "challenge", and "teams/raids". City of has, thus far, avoided that path, and I will not "suck it up and deal with" yet another game I love going down that same old path everyone else has trod before. I've had quite enough of having to "suck it up and deal with it", thank you. |
I'm just curious why play an MMO? I mean if your and introvert who doesn't like teaming why not just play single player games?
"Play Nice and BEHAVE! I don't want to hear about any more of your shenanigans brought up in our meetings at Paragon"-Ghost Falcon @Tritonfree @Philly's 2nd Convenient CIGAL BoBC/INOANN Arts&Crafts Sporks
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At a guess, because sometimes I just like soloing for hours on end... there isn't a single player game out there as cool as this one. |
Originally Posted by Phillygirl
I'm just curious why play an MMO? I mean if your and introvert who doesn't like teaming why not just play single player games?
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City of Heroes was my first MMO, & my favorite computer game.
R.I.P.
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I'd agree. It's hard to be at your best when responding to being told to "suck it up and deal with it".|
Originally Posted by PumBumbler
I don't really feel that this post is one of your best.
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You might also notice that I tend to be more combative as the frequency of replies and threading goes on. That's the introversion coming out; as the thread continues without chances for me to break away (or if the breaks are for work, which aren't very restful either), my tolerance for stress decreases and it starts to come out more.
Whereas now, I have just returned from my lunch break, and am feeling quite a bit more rested.
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Originally Posted by Phillygirl
I mean if your and introvert who doesn't like teaming why not just play single player games?
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But even when I solo, I still enjoy chatting, especially helping people with issues or discussing random topics on the Help channel. Can't do that in a solo game - and I legitimately enjoy answering people's questions and helping them with problems. It's a large part of why I do the work I do; I might be expending myself a bit, but it's a good sort of tiring, like after a good workout.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Powers and critter design on the other hand, I tend to be, shall we say, more vocal on both publicly and privately.
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You have every chance to break away. Nobody's holding you here forcing you to post.|
Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
as the thread continues without chances for me to break away
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Mind, I'm not telling you to go away, but this is representative of the rhetoric you've been using. You've decided to make yourself a martyr for a cause of which you seem to be the only proponent so far.
Casual players can ignore the Incarnate system, others can participate in it to any depth they desire. This is a win-win. I don't think it can necessarily be said that 100% of development time is going toward the Incarnate stuff, either; while it certainly is getting the focus right now, there are always additions made to the standard game, as Arcanaville so excellently put it.
De minimis non curat Lex Luthor.
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I can point out at least one other prominent poster that is very much in favour of solo Incarnate content. He's not posting here, but he has been very vocal about his desire elsewhere. And there was a post right above one of mine with a poster espousing a "this was my game and you're ruining it" sentiment, expressed before I ever began to. |
Originally Posted by Bosstone
a cause of which you seem to be the only proponent so far.
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So claims that I'm the only one are patently and provably false. Please desist with them.
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Sure. That doesn't really make the rest of my post wrong.
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Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
So claims that I'm the only one are patently and provably false. Please desist with them.
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De minimis non curat Lex Luthor.
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That'd be why I only quoted part of it. I can't really refute your opinion of how the system works or will work, so I didn't.
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Originally Posted by Bosstone
Sure. That doesn't really make the rest of my post wrong.
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So you have an army of two then |
Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
I can point out at least one other prominent poster that is very much in favour of solo Incarnate content.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Actually, neither of these statements is true. She's just relying on her usual forum tactic of refusing to believe that any opinion but hers is correct, and padding her post count. Being helpful to you is the last thing on her mind. And it's also amazingly hypocritical that she's arguing with anyone saying they don't have a right to say how things should be...
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Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
GG, I know you think you're being helpful,
I know you mean well, but seriously: stop it. You're not helping. |
Arc 180901: Flight of the Dreadnought
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Honey, I'm an Army of Me, and have the badge to prove it.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
So you have an army of two then
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I see where you're coming from but honestly, without trying to be rude, I hope the Devs don't tailor all the future content to the skill level of a team of coordinated players that know eachother but routinely fail things like the ITF ... |
Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
I have two Incarnates (and another two waiting for me to care to play them enough to get the shards to fill their unlocked slots) already, that I got through soloing and light TFing.
"Challenge" is the issue here; my VG still fails the occasional ITF/LRSF/BSF. Not everyone I play with can solo x8 content or AVs (like I can). "Challenges" that require not only a team, but a team of Incarnates each capable to tackling challenges above and beyond the standard +0x1 difficulty themselves are going to be content I cannot access. Thus far, the only such content in the game is the Hamidon raid (thus only because I have no desire to ever be in the same place and working with 50 people simultaneously; as an introvert, that level of interaction would simply be far too tiring and stressful to be something I'm going to do in my spare time) which was added so long ago as to belong to a different era altogether (the Mothership raid requires less coordination and less interaction. Being a large scale war, you actually can just charge in and bash things (once the shield is down) enough to still rank as "participating".) Nothing else in this game requires a team of highly skilled and coordinated players - nothing requiring even a fraction of such needed by the monster MMO that I quit playing because its endgame required such five years ago - to complete (though some of the content already exists at a level that it is by no small means a surety that it will be completed by any team that tackles it, as the highly casual players I team with can attest.) The addition of such content is not something I welcome, relish, or desire. If nothing in the game ever existed beyond the "difficulty" of the Barracuda Strike Force (or the Lord Recluse Strike Force, or the Imperious Task Force, whichever you wish to view as the capstone content), I would be overjoyed. The direction shown in i19 for end game content - something I'm not just going to ignore, because there is no reason I should have to ignore any content in this game; I haven't had to for six years, why should I have to start now? - is not one I welcome. Tin Mage is ... okay, if you take out Director 11, who is just patently ridiculous. Apex is ... meh. The hydra pylons require specific builds or strategies, something mostly unprecedented and greatly unwelcome, and Battle Maiden is just a gimmicky "phased" fight of the sort that drove me away from other MMOs. Neither is an ideal direction I would like to see the game travel in. More content along the lines of the ITF/LRSF (Barracuda would be okay if Reichsman had about a third the health he does; the ambushes and the temp powers to deal with them are actually pretty interesting, but beating down Reichsman is less so) would be welcome. More content along the lines of the Apex or Tin Mage Task Forces, however, would not. |
I don't see Tin Mage as a bigger challenge than the LRSF. Nothing in there is harder than the final mission against the Phalanx. And once you get into the ritm of avoiding Battle Maiden's Nanite attacks, there's not *that* much challenge in Apex either. As far as the hydra pylons are concerned, I've never used another 'tactic' than charging the things and hitting em till they go down.
I'm far from a power gamer. Of my seven lvl 50's three are on SO's/White IO's and the other four have modest set IO builds (no purples/PVP). Add to that that all my builds are for concept first and performance second. With the exception of my brute (and my dark/dark corr, but she doesn't kill fast enough for it to be practical) none can solo at x8+0, and none of them can solo an AV.
I really like both Incarnate TFs, and I personally hope that there's plenty more where they came from. If the future TFs are of the same level of difficulty and nothing more I wont complain, but I wont complain if they do get harder either.
@True Metal
Co-leader of Callous Crew SG. Based on Union server.
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Although I agree with the point that I think you are trying to make, as an introvert person, I can't help but feel slightly insulted by this ...|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Just think of it as a kind of therapy to help you come out of your shell
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Being introvert is a character trait, just like being extravert. It's not some sort of mental condition that can be fixed, or needs fixing.
@True Metal
Co-leader of Callous Crew SG. Based on Union server.
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Technically, I count as a prominent poster that is in favor of soloable Incarnate content. I just believe its perfectly reasonable that the teamed task force and raid content have development priority at the moment.|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
So you have an army of two then
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I believe that over the long haul, soloable Incarnate content will be important to the long-term health of the end game. But it has to be an interesting adjunct to the main task force and trial content, without either replacing it or diluting it. It cannot simply be the solo versions of the teamed content, nor can it simply be scaled down versions of the trial content. It has to be something uniquely designed to be soloed, without being a separate end game targeted solely at soloers. And that will be tricky to strike a balance for.
Until the devs figure out how to do that properly, I would rather they focus on the Incarnate task forces first. I would revoke their iterative design privileges if I could: they have to start getting things right the first time, on the assumption the market place isn't going to give them a second swing at the plate for free every time.
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Quote:
Very nicely put.
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Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
GG, I know you think you're being helpful, but you're clearly an extrovert. Introverts can actually empathise with extroverts because the culture forces your point of view on us, so we have no choice but to do so. But you clearly simply do not understand what introversion is.
It's not a defect, it's not a deficiency. It's simply a difference. We are not inherently inept at dealing with people (many introverts that are are so largely due to lack of practice), we are not incapable of dealing with people (I work a help desk. I get paid to deal with people, and am surpassingly good at it, if my performance reviews of the past five years can be believed), we simply are drained by doing so. Extroverts are recharged by going out and mingling with people; interacting with groups, friends and strangers all get an extrovert pumped and relaxed, making them able to continue on with whatever tasks they need to expend their mental energy on. Introverts are the reverse; dealing with people drains us, and we have to recharge by withdrawing. That difference doesn't cripple us - it's just a difference. Just like some people train for marathons for fun, play sports for fun, or engage in any other tiring activity for fun, an introvert can interact with people for fun as well (I do it all the time). But just like no one can run a marathon constantly, an introvert cannot interact with others constantly. With as much as modern American society enforces the idea that extroversion is the only norm and introverts are somehow broken, we are often forced into that interaction even when our reserves are already drained. Forcing us into that is a lot like forcing an exhausted marathon runner to run another mile - you're not helping any one, and are very likely to be doing active harm. I know you mean well, but seriously: stop it. You're not helping. |
@True Metal
Co-leader of Callous Crew SG. Based on Union server.
Doesn't keep me from being really pleased with the direction of the incarnate system.