Massively Antisocial-player Online RPG?
By
Afterimage,
Posted on: 2010-12-12 13:48 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Quote:
Your reply is fail for many reasons. OP was not whining. He was telling people to swallow their pride and accept some freaking assistance when they can't solo with their ubermegasoloer.|
Originally Posted by Afterimage
Could you please whine a little harder? Add some tears too.
I had no trouble beating trapdoor, weakened honoree, minotaur etc. solo. Five times with scrapper, tanker, dominator, blaster, stalker. I don't generally care if content is solo or team oriented. If teaming is required, I generally don't do it. Plenty of other things to do. But if teaming is required, then I shouldn't be allowed to take the mission. Task forces require teams, to start at least. I don't hate teaming. I'm not opposed to teaming, I'm just terrible at teaming. I have been trying to make myself team since I19 came out, because I would like to actually see these task forces that I cannot do solo. I don't need to do the task forces for Alpha slot boosts, I've gotten the first boost already on a scrapper playing solo. But I hoped that incarnate shards would be a good carrot to get me to try teaming. I can't bring myself to ask. Maybe I'm shy like Mirai. Maybe it is something else. But when I try to make myself ask for a team, I start getting physical stress indicators. My chest tightens up and I start to sweat. I play games to relax, stress I got plenty of elsewhere. I'm not incapable of teaming. Sometimes I'm asked. Sometimes I say yes. But when I do, I'm more stressed than when I play solo. It is always a relief when it breaks up. So no, it isn't always OK to ask for help. No it really isn't. Not for everyone. Get a large enough population and you get all kinds. People like you and people like me. We don't have to understand each other or agree on anything. The developers don't have to build content around my limitations or yours. But if they make content that includes rather than content that excludes, then maybe they retain more customers. Those are my reasons, they probably don't apply to most of the people who are trying to solo this stuff. |
To GuyPerfect: Please tell me you play on Virtue, sir. I would like to shake your hand.
My guides:Dark Melee/Dark Armor/Soul Mastery, Illusion Control/Kinetics/Primal Forces Mastery, Electric Armor
"Dark Armor is a complete waste as a tanking set."
Quote:
There are a ton of interesting folk playing this game. I'm rarely able to team myself, but I find idiots and jerkwads to be a rare exception rather than the rule.|
Originally Posted by Afterimage
On the few teams that I've been on over the years, I've never met anyone interesting, but I've met more than a few annoying people.
|
And this is from pure PUGing, accepting whatever blind invites come my way while I'm checking my traps at the market.
Team or don't, play the game however you like.
But don't try and justify it by playing up 'annoying people'.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
Quote:
If I can't get through a standard mission with my ubermegasoloer, then there's a nasty bug that needs to get fixed. And once we point out the bug, the devs usually get that fixed before long.
|
Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim
He was telling people to swallow their pride and accept some freaking assistance when they can't solo with their ubermegasoloer.
|
Quote:
Just because you're a sundae driver and failed to negotiate the banana split in the road....
|
Originally Posted by GuyPerfect
I mean, if your car breaks down on the interstate in the middle of the dessert...
|
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
Quote:
He was belittling the preferred playstyle of his fellow players, which for some reason raised hackles. Since that's your condescending tactic as well, I'm not surprised you approve of such dismissive behavior.
|
Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim
Your reply is fail for many reasons. OP was not whining. He was telling people to swallow their pride and accept some freaking assistance when they can't solo with their ubermegasoloer.
|
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
Quote:
He wasn't belittling anything. His post is very civil. Some stuff is just simply too hard for some people. This is true in quite a few games. He's just saying people shouldn't get all angsty over difficult content and should consider swallowing their pride once and a while.
|
Originally Posted by Ironik
He was belittling the preferred playstyle of his fellow players, which for some reason raised hackles. Since that's your condescending tactic as well, I'm not surprised you approve of such dismissive behavior.
|
Quote:
LGTF earlier today, 7 players could not take down the Honoree. If we hadn't had an Amy and a Shivan we'd still be in there. |
Originally Posted by GuyPerfect
Some enemies are, by design, so hard that you can't take them down by yourself, and no matter what server you play on, there are always hundreds of other players online who can help you...
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by GuyPerfect
is it really something the devs have done wrong and they are for some reason at fault for making a terrible game? Be honest, now: is it?
|
Quote:
I disagree.|
Originally Posted by Scythus
He wasn't belittling anything. His post is very civil. Some stuff is just simply too hard for some people. This is true in quite a few games. He's just saying people shouldn't get all angsty over difficult content and should consider swallowing their pride once and a while.
|
Anti-fellow-player belittling sarcasm in yellow.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by GuyPerfect
My response in these situations, at least from my perspective, was quite reasonable: I acknowledged that some foes or missions are too difficult to solo, so I asked for help. Apparently what I was supposed to do was come to the forums and complain about how the entire game isn't easy for all my characters... or something?
Look, I know people like to be able to accomplish things on their own, but let's think about this realistically for a moment. Some enemies are, by design, so hard that you can't take them down by yourself, and no matter what server you play on, there are always hundreds of other players online who can help you... |
Quote:
| I mean, not to put two and two together or anything, but doesn't it seem a bit unreasonable to refuse to ask for help? |
You wonder why people took umbrage? That's why.
Is it an over-the-top flame? Of course not, but the sense of superiority is still there nonetheless. Just because it has the polite-sounding words doesn't make it a polite post, and many people saw right through it.
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
Quote:
No it really doesn't mean soloing. It means actually spending like 90 seconds finding a couple of people to help with a "Hey I'm struggling on X mission, can you help please?" - if you've got a server channel even easier.|
Originally Posted by Nethergoat
Plenty of players like to play on their own schedule and at their own convenience, which generally means soloing. Yeah, generally speaking it isn't *that* difficult to find a team, but there are plenty of exceptions- small servers, players with off-kilter schedules, etc. It behooves the game to be mostly soloable to a greater or lesser extent.
|
Small servers mean tigher communities that will be happy to help cuz they either have or will have that mission you want to do.
You talk out of your tightest orifice plus you said "behooves"
Thelonious Monk
Quote:
Nothing you highlighted was what you said it was. I frankly think you're being oversensitive.
|
Originally Posted by Ironik
I disagree.
Anti-fellow-player belittling sarcasm in yellow. Any linguist will tell you that "look" is a word people use when they are talking down to you. It's what parents say to children, what people who feel innately superior to others say to their "inferiors." Take a listen to any politician being interviewed and you'll hear this word a lot. Then pay attention to what people who have respect for others say. The word they use is "see." "Look" is a command while "see" is an invitation. Using "look" sets a certain tone of superiority. "Not to put two and two together." Condescension, plain and simple. You wonder why people took umbrage? That's why. Is it an over-the-top flame? Of course not, but the sense of superiority is still there nonetheless. Just because it has the polite-sounding words doesn't make it a polite post, and many people saw right through it. |
Quote:
It's awesome that works for you.|
Originally Posted by Scarlet Shocker
No it really doesn't mean soloing. It means actually spending like 90 seconds finding a couple of people to help with a "Hey I'm struggling on X mission, can you help please?" - if you've got a server channel even easier.
|
The situation isn't black/white and your solution does not apply to all players in all circumstances.
For example I have to go afk often, at totally random intervals for random amounts of time. Sometimes I can team with the expectation of being to finish a couple of missions or a short TF, but most of the time i can't.
Rounding up the A-Team doesn't do you any good if you have to skip out at the mission door.
I've run into plenty of others who're in the same situation as myself.
Quote:
| Small servers mean tigher communities that will be happy to help cuz they either have or will have that mission you want to do. |
More players > tighter communities when it comes to finding a team at 4am.
Quote:
| You talk out of your tightest orifice plus you said "behooves" |
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
Quote:
Yeah?|
Originally Posted by Scythus
Nothing you highlighted was what you said it was. I frankly think you're being oversensitive.
|
::: points to thread title :::
"Antisocial-player."
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
What would you prefer? "Socially challenged?"
Quote:
I'm one of those. A couple of my friends are, too. In their cases it's because they have young children. Kids are demanding of time, turns out, even when you've organized your day so that they are now theoretically with the spouse or "asleep." Me, I have dogs. Lots of dogs. Plus foster dogs. 2010 marks my 30th year in animal rescue, my 15th in Pug rescue. I only adopt dogs that most other people wouldn't even look at, which means both behavioral and medical issues, often at the same time. Teams I'm on will often see me type "dog emergency" and go afk.|
Originally Posted by Nethergoat
It's awesome that works for you.
The situation isn't black/white and your solution does not apply to all players in all circumstances. For example I have to go afk often, at totally random intervals for random amounts of time. Sometimes I can team with the expectation of being to finish a couple of missions or a short TF, but most of the time i can't. Rounding up the A-Team doesn't do you any good if you have to skip out at the mission door. I've run into plenty of others who're in the same situation as myself. |
Quote:
| I'd rather fart poetry than speak the lifeless platitudes you deal in. |
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
Quote:
*pauses, realizes this means there's a chance of encountering GG on a team*|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Teaming is where it's at
 |
*runs around flailing like a muppet*
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
Quote:
IMO, the Honoree has some issues. He's literally invulnerable to several damage types when he pops his version of Unstoppable, and (like many "signature" AVs) he has an incredibly low recharge time on the power once he reaches the HP threshold to use it. |
Originally Posted by Flarstux
LGTF earlier today, 7 players could not take down the Honoree. If we hadn't had an Amy and a Shivan we'd still be in there.
|
As a result, you can be unable to defeat him unless you've brought the "correct" damage types. But there's nothing to warn of this except experience with the encounter, and you don't find out about it until the very end of the very last mission of the TF.
Honestly, I'm not fond at all of him getting true 100% DR against any damage type, because it makes me feel worthless bringing something on the TF that primarily contributes damage of that type to the encounter. But there's probably nothing inherently broken about it given that external tools do exist for overcoming it. Shivans are a decent example. The problem IMO is that it's not really communicated at all, and lots of players are still being surprised by it after all this time. It's also fairly non-typical in this particular game to have to worry quite so about what sort of damage type is dealt by the characters you invite to a team. Sure, it can matter, but it's rarely a make-or-break the way it can be with the Honoroee.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
I love how this thread started as "You should team if you have problems, people who are having problems" and devolved into "I AM ENTITLED TO SOLO EVERYTHING, DON'T TELL ME WHAT TO DO, I AM DESERVING OF ALL THINGS I REQUEST!"
Sad. I'm going to go back to smashing apart Malta.
My guides:Dark Melee/Dark Armor/Soul Mastery, Illusion Control/Kinetics/Primal Forces Mastery, Electric Armor
"Dark Armor is a complete waste as a tanking set."
Soloing used to be an option, simply less efficient and isolated to special things...
Even if you were super strong, your missions wouldn't spawn a huge mass for you to run through alone... you HAD to be in a group to get big spawns (or street sweep).
That, and people simply became so much stronger. Anyone can get soft capped defenses now, or HUGE enhanced damage through IO procs.
And the way missions are set up. In order to go through an arc... the game pretty much forces you to solo. If you join a group an they are 1 mission ahead of you on the arc, well, too bad for you.
In praetoria, it is either do the storyline alone... OR play in a group. Even keep running into key points which FORCE you to leave whatever group you are in!
Then, out in the big world... the chance that a group you find will have the same contact as you and actually be on the same stage is nill.
The only thing that players can work towards together are the farmable things like tips or newspaper missions :P
Yea, i think a re-thinking of the quest system would be a big step towards helping out grouping.
Mew
I enjoy teaming with people when I am in the mood for teaming.
I do not enjoy having to ask for help when I am soloing because that means that my friends are either not on or playing on other servers. I don't like having to ask for help because there's no guarantee that I will be able to find that help when I need it.
So long as they make every mish that needs a team auto completable I would have no problems with some enemies being too tough to solo.
That being said, I was pretty annoyed earlier today when I was soloing my Patron Arc on my Crab Soldier and could neither take down Lord Recluse or auto complete the mission. 
My COX Fanfiction:
Blue's Assembled Story Links
Quote:
Well, that is meant to be a very climactic battle. I now skip the patron arcs because each of the four arcs for each of the four patrons ends in a mission with an EB fight that can't be auto-completed. If everything except the Recluse mission could be auto-completed, I wouldn't mind so much.|
Originally Posted by BlueBattler
That being said, I was pretty annoyed earlier today when I was soloing my Patron Arc on my Crab Soldier and could neither take down Lord Recluse or auto complete the mission.
|
Both times I took the Recluse mission, I took it at level 48 and didn't actually do it until level 50. That's mainly because I was very annoyed by the previous patron content and wanted to easily grind Recluse into the dirt.
Quote:
I've run into a similar problem with the final mission of the VEAT mission chain where you have to take down Statesman. My Night Widow didn't pick up the mission until she was level 50, and every time I've tried it I just haven't been able to do enough damage to knock out States. Either he KOs me or I run out of end.
|
Originally Posted by Mirai
Well, that is meant to be a very climactic battle. I now skip the patron arcs because each of the four arcs for each of the four patrons ends in a mission with an EB fight that can't be auto-completed. If everything except the Recluse mission could be auto-completed, I wouldn't mind so much.
Both times I took the Recluse mission, I took it at level 48 and didn't actually do it until level 50. That's mainly because I was very annoyed by the previous patron content and wanted to easily grind Recluse into the dirt. |
Goodbye, I guess.
@Lord_Nightblade in Champions/Star Trek Online
nightblade7295@gmail.com if you want to stay in touch
Quote:
This. They give Solo players opportunities, they never said it would be easy.
|
Originally Posted by TrueMetal
Did you tell the devs about this? They quite clearly indicate you should get a team for the Honoree mission.
 |
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
Quote:
Say, I haven't encountered that yet. My Night Widow got clobbered by Back Alley Brawler some time back (after a long and valiant struggle), but I was able to auto-complete that mission. I'll have to look into that Statesman mission.
|
Originally Posted by Lord_Nightblade
I've run into a similar problem with the final mission of the VEAT mission chain where you have to take down Statesman. My Night Widow didn't pick up the mission until she was level 50, and every time I've tried it I just haven't been able to do enough damage to knock out States. Either he KOs me or I run out of end.
|
As for me, I find it easier to deal with hard stuff than it is to deal with people.
On the few teams that I've been on over the years, I've never met anyone interesting, but I've met more than a few annoying people.