Don't go Free to Play(F2P), COH
By
33253,
Posted on: 2010-10-27 07:26 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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I'm almost certain they told Cryptic.
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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
They didn't even tell anyone they were going to buy the game from Cryptic.
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F2P will happen its just a matter of time hopefully not till CoH2. If they do I hope they give them different servers.
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I think this game should go F2P. It would make me smile.
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Originally Posted by KnG
F2P will happen its just a matter of time hopefully not till CoH2. If they do I hope they give them different servers.
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Note it's a straw man so your command of the English language would seem to be in question. Validly so.|
Originally Posted by Disappearing Girl
More rubbish. A straw horse, that confirms to me you are more interested in belittling people than understanding what they are saying.
I also never said it was confusing - it must be easier to 'win points' when you put words into my mouth. I'm not complaining about the free month or auras and what not. And never have complained about that. The difference between the complete edition and the prepurchase was clear. Its not buyers remorse - lol - it's not having all the information presented. Anyhow, if one sentence got me dogplied this much I'm dreading the follow up. I think I'll just ignore the posts with fingers in thier ears shouting "me so right - you so silly head' from now. So if I dont bother to reply to you, dont take it as how wonderful your debating skills were, and how well yor insults shut me up, but rather, you're not worth the time to reply to. Afterall, this has been bounced around in the discussion thread for it months ago. In short, the fact that the phrase Nor are there any incentives for preording it means no incentives for preordering. This got changed. This, most people in my experience would call deceptive. Its not brain science, and it seems all people who claim otherwise can only present do is use insults and call fact rants, or post in total disacoiation to reallty claiming all the information was there from day one! I dont understand how people within one post can say 'it was all clearly laid out' and in the same post then talk about how the gamestop was annoucned afterwards. |
As for what I bolded, that would sum up how I feel about your posts now and in the future.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
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I remember farming 'cuda AV in Sharkhead (Shaper Cult mission?) for SOs back in the day when CoV first launched.
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Originally Posted by Nethergoat
It was a long while back and I try to forget the 'Dark Times', but I remember having a bit of surplus inf in the mid to late 30's, and by the time I hit 50 there was enough on hand that I could afford to play 'sugar daddy' for some of my friends.
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Topic drift appears to have set in, so I guess I might as well play along.
What are these special IO's that are being mentioned? I pre-ordered the electronic version of GR, and I purchased the item pack. I don't recall being handed a bunch of special IO's.
ObF2P:
From what I can see, CoH is already halfway to being a freemium game. Look at all of the things you can already buy that would show up in a NC Coin store:
Extra character slots
Ten different add-on packs
Three different major content areas (Paragon City, Rogue Isles, Praetoria)
Server transfers
Now, look at all of the existing content that could be easily ported to a NC Coin store:
Arena/PvP Zones access
Temporary powers
Mission Architect
Veteran's rewards
Pool Powers
Inherent Powers
Patron/Ancillary Power Pools
Basic Archetypes
Epic Archetypes
Incarnate slot
Powersets
Power Customization
Invention System
Market
Costume Sets
Capes
Auras
And then there's the possibility of apportioning the existing city zones into a set of F2P zones and an ancillary set of "pay to play" zones.
I could imagine a world where they could shut down subscriptions entirely and simply sell access to the current game content ala carte and potentially make as much money as they currently do while still offering a compelling F2P experience.
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and heroes did the same thing with Katie Hannon.|
Originally Posted by PumBumbler
I remember farming 'cuda AV in Sharkhead (Shaper Cult mission?) for SOs back in the day when CoV first launched.
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It's crazy to think how miserable and poor we all used to be!
=P
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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Touche'|
Originally Posted by Flarstux
I'm almost certain they told Cryptic.
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The Gamestop "IO"s: every new character gets 5: Damage/Recharge/minor Smash damage proc 12% of the time, Damage/Recharge/minor Lethal damage proc 12%, Damage/Recharge/minor Energy damage proc 10%, Damage/Recharge/minor Psionic damage proc 10%, Damage/Recharge/Knockdown proc 10%. The Damage and Recharge each are at 16.7%, the procs end when you reach SECURITY level 21 (they kept happening at level 21 until I trained to level 21). I keep these enhancements until I'm ready to replace with an IO set somewhere in the mid 20s.
When I first read the details of the two options, and it was within days of them posted on the forums, I knew I wanted the Complete edition so I waited (I don't care for DP or DS anyway). The Gamestop option came later but that's where I was going to get the game anyway.
Oh, well, the low level game is already so fast at this point that it hardly seems like a desirable thing to speed it up even more.
Maybe they'll just eventually have an option to start as level 22.
Because that's when you get access to SO's and SO strength Common IOs. (Barring unusual methods, like SKing up to join AV fights, or purchasing Yin-O's)
@Roderick
Theres an interesting article over at Eurogamer.net. It details another studio's decision to go F2P.
Linky.
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Wow, I guess I can go back to That Giant Game then. Apparently only games as good as that can charge a sub fee, and it's the best game around.|
Originally Posted by Mothers_Love
Theres an interesting article over at Eurogamer.net. It details another studio's decision to go F2P.
Linky. |
SERIOUSLY, Jack??
I don't even know what to say about that article other than... what.
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Originally Posted by Feycat
Wow, I guess I can go back to That Giant Game then. Apparently only games as good as that can charge a sub fee, and it's the best game around.
SERIOUSLY, Jack?? I don't even know what to say about that article other than... what. |
Actually he's spot on in several areas.
A new game launching has to have more content than its competition and its years of development and change and all its expansions else it will be slated and word of mouth will doom it.
It doesn't have to be the best game around, people just have to believe it is and tell all their friends it is, tell all who will listen it is, and down play other games when they launch.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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I think it's another one of his visions - we'll need to wait for one of his prophets to interpret it for us - although we might have to wait a while, as his company is rather short of profits.
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Originally Posted by Feycat
SERIOUSLY, Jack??
I don't even know what to say about that article other than... what. |
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
The probelm is that releasing light in the MMO market today is quite a bit different from when CoH and WoW were released - now, there's simply not the same amount of time available for titles to breathe and grow - if a studio can't capture players between launch and the end of the first free month, then they're pretty much done for - they can still make a profit, but their game won't be a major or long-lasting success.
Players now just aren't patient or forgiving enough for the light release strategy to work anymore.
CoH and WoW were positioned right near the start of the MMO boom - just look at how many people there are who say that we or WoW were their first MMO, and then compare that to how many people will have AoC or WAR as their first MMO.
The problem for modern MMOs is that they're having to rely on taking players from other MMOs, rather than getting players who have never player an MMO before - they're having to attract people who already have a standard that they're going to measure a fun and stable MMO against, and they're being unfairly judged against other games that have several years of content and bug fixes in place.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
Another problem is that, for some reason, companies think they can get away with being not merely content-light but system-light, only including the bare skeletons of promised features, while hyping them up as if they're in and completed, and then basically abandoning further work on them.
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i think that's only really true of developer studios whose business model is based on developing and releasing new MMOs constantly.|
Originally Posted by SquidheadJax
Another problem is that, for some reason, companies think they can get away with being not merely content-light but system-light, only including the bare skeletons of promised features, while hyping them up as if they're in and completed, and then basically abandoning further work on them. |
Get funding and licensing from IP owner, build them a game and leave it with a skeleton crew to maintain it, and move on to the next. Previously most developers had a vested interest in making sure the game continued to attract players beyond the release month since the title was intended as an ongoing revenue source.
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
I definitely agree with Emmert on this one.
When you're creating a new game you've got great games to compete against, with massive amounts of constant revenue that you just don't have, yet, and may never get. It's up to you to drag players from those other games where they've got friends and characters at high levels doing the end game content.
So having the Free to Play with Subscription Option and In Game Store method gives players the ability to come over, and even if they never drop a single penny into your pocket, they add to the population of the game, making it easier to team and find friends, making the game more attractive on a social level.
If you've got good, inventive, and interesting content you're going to lock in a lot of those players who may opt to finally leave the game they've been playing for years, potentially bringing their playgroups and guilds along with them to "At Least Try It"
So yes. A Free to Play with Subscription Option and in-game store is a fantastic way to handle a new game, or a game which is looking for new players.
-Rachel-
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This I can agree with.|
Originally Posted by SquidheadJax
Another problem is that, for some reason, companies think they can get away with being not merely content-light but system-light, only including the bare skeletons of promised features, while hyping them up as if they're in and completed, and then basically abandoning further work on them.
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I first experienced City atfer the launch of CoV (just before I7, IIRC). So by that point the most basic gameplay and functionality was in place. I can't say the same for the Space IP game being mentioned.
I will agree that the expectations for a MMO now are a lot higher than 6 years ago. Certain systems and content need to be in place at launch:
- Reasonably deep Avatar Creation
- Solid and Fun Gameplay
- Some kind of "End game" system (yes, system, not content. Got to love the constantly moving max level cap...)
- Enough progressive Content for all Factions at game launch to get to the initial max level (regardless if can be played through in a weeks time by more hardcore players...)
- Functional PvP (if the game plans on it in some way. Doesn't mean it has to be the game's focus)
- A functioning market system
- A functional and worth-while Crafting system
- The ability to PuG with any Level Character and not feel useless
This, in full respect, may not seem like a lot, but I think what I mention above is the bare minimum to be expected out of any MMORPG to be released nowadays. If these things can't be achieved, then why play?
Thank you for the time...
@Travlr (Main) / @Tymers Realm (Test) 
I just wonder what kind of enormous ego it took for Jack to say "when I launched City of Heroes."
"I"?
Is he getting nuttier than when he was here?
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
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I don't think that's actually a change from before.
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Originally Posted by SwellGuy
I just wonder what kind of enormous ego it took for Jack to say "when I launched City of Heroes."
"I"? Is he getting nuttier than when he was here? |
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It did take a huge set of cajones to pitch the concept, hire people and develop the game for years before launch. While there were a lot of people around him, the CoH game was his baby and he saw it to launch.|
Originally Posted by SwellGuy
I just wonder what kind of enormous ego it took for Jack to say "when I launched City of Heroes."
"I"? Is he getting nuttier than when he was here? |
I think it is appropriate that he used "I", since using "We" would be a bit confusing since Cryptic no longer owns the game and the staff at Cryptic currently aren't substantially the same staff who launched the game.
A Rant? You call one sentence a rant? You know, just because someone disagrees with you, doesnt make it a rant. Though really I think you call it a rant as that makes it easy for you to avoid facts
But as your post agrees, the facts are
1) NCSoft said "Nor are there any benefits for preording"
2) NCSoft offered incentives for preordering. (the special IOs plus gamer bling)
I think I can see where the deception is.
I have no idea why you would put screen shots of FAQs for after NCSoft changed the incentives excepts its smoke and mirrors to avoid facing the facts - much like calling my post a rant.
Thats just rubbish, and an example of people who would rather insult in passive/aggressive manner than discuss.
Wanting Paragon to describe the purchasing options and not change than months after people spend thier money is so not the same as your fantasy of having them come to house to explain.
Clearly you have no facts to support your case, or you wouldnt need to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_ridicule
They annoucend what you could get with your type of order for the game. Months later they changed that. Really I dont get how people dont understand that. Or post that that wasn't true.
Not the benefits of costumes and aura, that was upfront as I wish it all the purchase options were. But getting special IO procs was not mentioned until months afterwards.
Those options were not laid out side by side. How can you say that they were with a straight face?
I'm amazed that you had those options of preordering to gain special IOs plus bling when you were making your purchasing choice. It wasn't there when I was making my desicon.Did you time travel or just pretend you had the facts from the start?
Sooooo dont agree with me, must be slow in the head.
Still its not like you actually had a point or fact to offer. Insults are easier than demostarting if you are right, especially when the facts show you are not.
Again with insults over facts.
So, you really can say that on the day it came out people were debating whether to prepurchase to get early access to ATs or to wait and preorder and get the special IO's.
No wait - your options didnt even include all the options that anyone who can read simple English understands. Does that mean you dont understand simple English?
You clearly laid out options missed that choice 3, that there would be incentives for preordering. The Special IO's. No surprise you miss out the information.
More rubbish. A straw horse, that confirms to me you are more interested in belittling people than understanding what they are saying.
I also never said it was confusing - it must be easier to 'win points' when you put words into my mouth.
I'm not complaining about the free month or auras and what not. And never have complained about that. The difference between the complete edition and the prepurchase was clear.
Its not buyers remorse - lol - it's not having all the information presented.
Anyhow, if one sentence got me dogplied this much I'm dreading the follow up. I think I'll just ignore the posts with fingers in thier ears shouting "me so right - you so silly head' from now. So if I dont bother to reply to you, dont take it as how wonderful your debating skills were, and how well yor insults shut me up, but rather, you're not worth the time to reply to.
Afterall, this has been bounced around in the discussion thread for it months ago.
In short, the fact that the phrase Nor are there any incentives for preording it means no incentives for preordering.
This got changed.
This, most people in my experience would call deceptive.
Its not brain science, and it seems all people who claim otherwise can only present do is use insults and call fact rants, or post in total disacoiation to reallty claiming all the information was there from day one!
I dont understand how people within one post can say 'it was all clearly laid out' and in the same post then talk about how the gamestop was annoucned afterwards.
And there's the rant as predicted.
I wonder if she's also mad that the people who chose not to buy the Cyborg and Magic Boosters when they came out were able to get one for free when they bought the Mission Architect Edition. Cuz y'know NCSoft didn't tell anyone they were going to offer that when the Boosters were first released.
Oh and NCSoft also didn't tell anyone who bought CoV when it was released that they'd be combining the two games. They didn't even tell anyone they were going to buy the game from Cryptic.