The game is tedious

I wonder what happened to Ultimo_?

*huff puff*

Sorry guys, just got here.

*gasp wheeze*

Build Better.

Apologies for the apparent disappearing act. I've been working the last few days, and haven't been able to check in often.

I'll read all the replies and respond more fully when I have a chance.

No apology is necessary.

whole point of builds bro

If you're FF/Elec, you still can aggro people through PFF (with slight damage.)

PFF has a ...umm... detaunt field?

I remember a team with a couple of tankers- WITH FORCE FIELDS ON THEM- being prima donnas about running in and starting the fight. I used Voltaic Sentinel/PFF/F key as nonverbal communication. Worked real well.

Ok, back at it.

To restate my position since there seems to be some slight confusion. My feeling is that endurance use during combat is excessive. It affects all the ATs and power sets, though some suffer worse than others. I'd like to see a slight recalibration of endurance use so it's more even for all ATs and power sets, and somewhat less disruptive to gameplay overall. This is a problem because the tools that currently exist in the game to improve endurance efficiency are insufficient to this task, though they do help somewhat. I should also note that the problem is largely notable when solo, since teams can cover for each other, and often have powers that can negate endurance use, almost entirely.

I started this thread to see if there were others who had the same sort of feeling (though not necessarily exactly the same). I've seen that some people do. It's not an exhaustive research project, it was meant only to see if there was some support for my feeling.



There are indeed examples of ATs doing amazing things, but this ability is hardly equal. That is, the tools to affect endurance use are more or less useful depending on the AT and power sets in use. Also, in the exceptional examples mentioned, players are undoubtedly taking drastic measures to ensure they don't run out of endurance while fighting (such as stopping attacking so they can recover, mid-fight).


I've seen small samples like this thread provides in many professional journals. Granted, peer review is indeed the measure of a research project, but this is not a research project, it's just a discussion thread on a public forum.


"My game" would be designed around the notion that everyone be roughly equal in capability. This is even more vital if you're going to have PvP, because placing anyone at a disadvantage isn't fair. It's largely why I don't PvP here, the ATs and powers aren't on even footing. I think if you were to see a more detailed description of how I'd design it, you might have a different view, but that is a whole other thread, as I said.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UberGuy This is pretty important. There's a lot of flexibility for the devs in saying that this power (or powerset) does less X and more Y. For example, they can decide that a powerset deals less "raw" damage because it applies powerful debuffs, or provides its users some kind of strong mitigation when it attacks. This doesn't always make sense to players, because they may think that Y isn't important, but that X is. If the powerset in question has the lowest X of all the alternatives, those players are likely to complain that the powerset is "gimp". But that doesn't always hold. Y may have great utility in certain situations. Is the balance between X and Y right? That's a tough question to answer. The devs seem to measure things like that, at least in one way, by looking at the speed that certain ATs or powersets level. Either they're capable enough to level "fast enough" when solo and/or desirable enough that they get on teams that can help them along. Is this a perfect window into balance? Definitely not, but it does show things that aren't likely apparent to any one player.

Some great observations here. My point has been that the combination of X+Y should always use the same endurance. It shouldn't matter how much of either you have. Consider Blasters and Defenders (since they use the same power sets). The blaster does more damage (X), and the Defender does more of the secondary effect (Y), so if the sum value of X+Y is the same, then equality is maintained. I'm suggesting that this sum is not remaining equal. I have no numbers to support this, of course, it's just a subjective feeling, but it's a feeling others seem to share, to some degree. I should also point out that, in the end, the only thing that matters in this game is damage (since that's the only way the game resolves things). If you can't do the damage to defeat the enemy, it is pretty much irrelevant that you have more of whatever "Y" is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SinisterDirge Pretty sure he is in game testing, and putting together the math to prove that the game is indeed, not fun. Probably also thinking of a balanced, and fair way to keep leveling speed the same, but include fun in the actual game. Like it says on the box!

I wish I could do this. I'm just not mathy enough to do it effectively. If I do come up with something that would accomplish it, I'll post it.


I appreciate the thoughtful posts, and I've certainly been given lots to think about. I think I'm about done with the thread, however. I think my point is fairly clear, and I think the objections are too. If anything new comes to mind, I'll post again, but for now, I feel I'm repeating myself too often.

If I've not replied to you directly, I apologize. Chances are it's because the reply to your comments have already been discussed. If you absolutely must have a response, let me know and I'll provide one.

Do feel free to carry on the discussion, and I thank you all.

I think Ultimo is amazing since he can make people rage for 20+ pages just by posting.