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While I haven't done any intensive research on Ticket drops, I recently took a level 4 toon through a single mission in AE and got decent ticket drops throughout (about same I got before I16) and end of mission netted me 90 tickets. All told, about 178 tickets? Don't recall exactly, not at home, so can't check. This was against Custom Critters, to boot.
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Originally Posted by Johnny_Velocity
I've been lurking in these discussions, but not contributing since I don't have a lot to offer in terms of hard data collection (my opinion based on play: something ain't right).
However, I have noticed that no one is complaining about the ticket drop rates having changed. Since tickets substitute for other drops like recipe drops, this could be a clue as to where a possible bug may be lurking. If the hypothetical bug affects regular missions but not MA ticket drops, that factoid should limit the search parameters in some respect. Has anyone tested Developer's Choice missions specifically? That's a hybrid animal that could be different enough to offer some insight. (Sorry to offer advice and not help, but I simply don't have the time right now.) |
I believe it is a bug at this juncture, but in 6 months or so if a lot of people are raking in rewards such a change might not be a bug.
On the other hand this is vaguely reminiscent of the pvp IO's.
They stopped dropping altogether - "definitely a bug"
Then they came back at a drastically reduced drop rate.
I'm slightly paranoid that they have a lower reward system in the works and this has just slipped through ahead of schedule and in bad format.
I dunno the ability to spawn a map for 8 and -1 just seems a little too good to be true for people looking specifically for rewards.
I really hope they are being straightforward with us, the fallout will be sad if they aren't.
I wondered if something was up...
I duo with a friend of mine. We haven't made any changes to team level/size/difficulty- we're totally vanilla here at this point. We're level 15, and he's never gotten a single recipe, and I've gotten one (rocket boots). Quite a few regular missions, and some papers equals *one* recipe for the two of us, ever. Salvage is fine, but we'd wondered where the heck the recipes went.
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You and Synapse have that in common. He should do a comparison of your account and his to all the accounts (like mine) that are seeing decreased drops to try and isolate what it is that differentiates people who are seeing "business as usual" from those of us who have produced mountains of data showing that for us, at least, something is not working right.
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Originally Posted by PuceNonagon
I have no hard data, but I still find nothing amiss with the drop rates. Before i16, it took me (usually) two runs set at 8-man to fill up with salvage and recipes. It still takes two runs. Sure, I have a run every now and then when I get nothing, I also get runs where I get 15 recipes.
If there is a difference, I can't see it. |
My postings to this forum are not to be used as data in any research study without my express written consent.
I had no position on this issue, until the other day, at around level 16 or 17, having done the sewers, missions, and radio missions to get there... I got the pop up message "You have just received your first piece of invention salvage..."
As to the general problem, it would be nice if Synapse were to provide more details about the character he used to test the drop rates. We know the mission he used, and others have collected data contrary to his results from that mission, so maybe it's something about the character used. Maybe it's related to using/not using pets, or something even weirder.
In fact, just on the basis of a bizarre notion, are those of you seeing the reduced drop rates collecting your data on characters with customized powers? Synapse, was your character stock or customized? I know there's no logical connection between the two, but that is the other big thing that changed besides the difficulty scaling. If it's not because the drop code changed, and it's not tied to difficulty scaling, then there has to be something really odd and unexpected affecting it.
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That's pretty odd, but it doesn't seem to be the same thing the others here are talking about. Most of the data collected seems to point to salvage drop rates being normal, but recipe drop rates being significantly lower than they should be. It could be something peculiar to that character--how many recipes drops did you get, and are your other characters coming up short on salvage?
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Originally Posted by Paladin_Musashi
I had no position on this issue, until the other day, at around level 16 or 17, having done the sewers, missions, and radio missions to get there... I got the pop up message "You have just received your first piece of invention salvage..."
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The Way of the Corruptor (Arc ID 49834): Hey villains! Do something for yourself for a change--like twisting the elements to your will. All that's standing in your way are a few secret societies...and Champions of the four elements.
I'm no number jocky (kudos to those with the chops for doing it), but something seems wrong to me. After 6 radios mishes tonight on a full team I only had 2 recipe drops. I know it's only ancedotal, but it jives with others' experiences.
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On my brute I've used for 95% of my testing, everything is stock. In fact, the costume he's in hasn't changed since I added an aura at level 30, and he hit 50 in summer 2006.|
Originally Posted by Balanced
In fact, just on the basis of a bizarre notion, are those of you seeing the reduced drop rates collecting your data on characters with customized powers?
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My Dom got cruddy drop rates over a few hundred kills today, and has customized powers.
My postings to this forum are not to be used as data in any research study without my express written consent.
I think if anyone is going to convince the developers of a bug, or decreased drop rate then we are going to need alot more hard data, and not the ancedotal type.
We need to start posting our evidence that supports the decrease in drop rates that people are experiencing. If the devs can't find what is broken, then they can't fix it.
Please start posting your data. You should probably include Server, Time, Character, what mission(s), your difficulty, the amount of kills and the amount of recipe drops (sets and commons should be separated). And any other info that might be helpful.
Forgive me, but wasn't there a similar thread in the open beta forums, with BOATLOADS of data already collected for just this purpose about this same problem?
I'll be happy to contribute, if it takes even more data to shine the light on this problem. But I have to admit to being just a little frustrated already...
A buttload? No. Some? Yes. But obviously it didn't help since Synapse ran his own tests and found nothing out of place.
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People have been posting their defeats and settings and recipe and salvage drops since it was in beta and since it has gone live. There is a very long thread in the Market forum where Synapse told us it was a perception issue as well as the long thread people have put in the I16 testing forum.
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Originally Posted by Clouded
I think if anyone is going to convince the developers of a bug, or decreased drop rate then we are going to need alot more hard data, and not the ancedotal type.
We need to start posting our evidence that supports the decrease in drop rates that people are experiencing. If the devs can't find what is broken, then they can't fix it. Please start posting your data. You should probably include Server, Time, Character, what mission(s), your difficulty, the amount of kills and the amount of recipe drops (sets and commons should be separated). And any other info that might be helpful. |
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
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Did you read his post on the tests he ran versus all the posts from the players?|
Originally Posted by Clouded
A buttload? No. Some? Yes. But obviously it didn't help since Synapse ran his own tests and found nothing out of place.
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As a software developer I'd be embarrassed to dismiss all the player posts with what he posted.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
I was only trying to be constructive since people keep complaining and providing ancedotal evidence in this thread. I meant no harm. I saw Synapse's post via the digest but people are still not satisfied.
Thanks for pointing out there is a thread in the market forum SwellGuy.
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Theres at least 30,000 recorded kills in...| A buttload? No. Some? Yes. But obviously it didn't help since Synapse ran his own tests and found nothing out of place. |
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=188370
that thread
Thats a pretty substantial number
Things wrong with Synapse's tests:
-- He ran them on an internal server
-- ++ On test
(We need the results on live, as thats where the problems are, although there were already problems on Beta)
-- He didn't state how he was killing the mobs, he may of been using the [I win] button to simply wipe the maps
-- Internal servers are VASTLY different to the live servers
-- He didn't post how he did the runs, no statistics etc...
-- He passed off thousands upon thousands of professionally recorded data statistics as 'perception' rather than a real issue
Global: @NR
POHSYB: We've been in this meeting for six hours. Can I go back to my box?
BLUE STEEL: No.
Pohsyb sighs.
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That's not the thread the poster was referring to. He mentioned Beta, not the market forums. I didn't realize there was another thread and it seems I'll be told this repeatly today. :/
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Originally Posted by Raccoon_
[color=yellow]Theres at least 30,000 recorded kills in...
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=188370 that thread |
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Just view each one as Bruce Willis' character in "Die Hard" saying "Welcome to the party, pal!" |
Originally Posted by Clouded
That's not the thread the poster was referring to. He mentioned Beta, not the market forums. I didn't realize there was another thread and it seems I'll be told this repeatly today. :/
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total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
Drop rates have been better than ever for my roommate and me.
I've had a weird week.
Very very few recipie drops...
...but 3 purple recipies were included in that low number. That takes the edge off my complaint.
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Originally Posted by Raccoon_
Despite the overwhelming evidence of a broken droprate system, the Devs response was pretty much 'It's all in your head'
Looks like at the end of this month, my CoH sub money is going to remain all in my pocket as there is little involvement from the developers on this pretty serious issue Perhaps they have some sort of under-the-table deal with Cryptic to get players leaving CoH and start playing CO... |
Your tinfoil hat is slipping.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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There were several and one that i started there as well. Bill also had evidence (quite a bit if I remember correctly) and several others as well. |
Originally Posted by Partsman
Forgive me, but wasn't there a similar thread in the open beta forums, with BOATLOADS of data already collected for just this purpose about this same problem?
I'll be happy to contribute, if it takes even more data to shine the light on this problem. But I have to admit to being just a little frustrated already... |
I know we need the hard data but I dont run herostats or other logs so I have been a bit weak on hard data. I can only report the mission, the settings, and the results.
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This IS the thread to which I was referring that started in the beta forums and then got moved to the market forum, unknown to me. Thanks; I've been looking for this thread for a while now (I had forgotten to subscribe to it.)|
Originally Posted by Clouded
That's not the thread the poster was referring to. He mentioned Beta, not the market forums. I didn't realize there was another thread and it seems I'll be told this repeatly today. :/
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Lots of hard data there already to back up the players' claims...
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I think "buttload" is a pretty good descriptor. |
Originally Posted by Clouded
A buttload? No. Some? Yes. But obviously it didn't help since Synapse ran his own tests and found nothing out of place.
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I just wasn't interested in re-posting all my data in more than one thread.Synapse's test didn't show that there's no problem with drops; his observed drop rates were actually TOO HIGH for the map he was using. If there's an issue with drop distribution (note: Not "drop rates," as those are fixed numbers internal to the system that have not, based on what Synapse said, been modified - the problem seems to be somewhere in how drops are distributed, which is odd given that almost all the testing has been solo, so where the drops are being distributed to is quite beyond me), and if it's consistent within an account, then sometimes a player will experience and complain about too-few drops. There will also, however, be players who obtain too many drops - and Synapse DID. The expected number on that map is 11.2 recipes. His lowest number over 15 runs was 14 recipes. Over 5000 mob kills (about what he had), that is extremely unlikely (but not impossible) to happen by chance.
I'm glad for the people who either aren't affected or who are getting higher-than-intended drop rates. If there really is a bug in drop distribution (which I believe to be the case), then within a month people are going to figure out how to locate the maps/situations that will give themselves the best drops and use the bug to exploit the reward system. But hey, at least we know that if it happens, we can't get banned for doing that - since we're only "perceiving" that we get more drops under those circumstances.
I've been testing this since Beta. My results have been consistent enough, and documented on the forums in various places, that when Synapse declared this was all a "perception issue" I almost went and cancelled my accounts. I'm still here and still trying to figure this out because I love the game and want to see the problem fixed.
My postings to this forum are not to be used as data in any research study without my express written consent.
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Doing my best Kanye West voice|
Originally Posted by PuceNonagon
I have no hard data, but I still find nothing amiss with the drop rates. Before i16, it took me (usually) two runs set at 8-man to fill up with salvage and recipes. It still takes two runs. Sure, I have a run every now and then when I get nothing, I also get runs where I get 15 recipes.
If there is a difference, I can't see it. If you guys tell me it's borked, I'll believe you, but I won't believe that it has changed that much because nothing has changed for me, even a little bit, since i16. |
Yo PunceNonagon; I'm really happy for you, I'm gonna let you finish, but most of us have been having the worst drop rates of all time...
Too soon?
Who do I have to *&^% around here to get more Targeted AoE recipes added?
Arc Name: Tsoo In Love
Arc ID: 413575
Leaving the rates alone would mean that people could be alone in a mission and come out with an ungodly amount of recipes anyways. This of course would be an "exploit."
So to prevent "exploits," recipe drop rate was greatly reduced - and I seem to be seeing less salvage these days as well, although I may be wrong on that one. What people never seem to remember is that anytime we get a new ability such as this, something else will be "adjusted" in the name of "balance." Therefore be careful what you wish for, you may just end up paying for it in some unexpected way.