PVP Abuse or not, where to draw the line?

_Donna_ · 08-13-2008 06:31 AM

Here's an answer to the original poster...

Read the EULA, it would have saved you a 10 page thread.

Carlsberg don't do Farming,
But if they did..........

Knight_Errant · 08-13-2008 06:41 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Perhaps part of the reason that people have gone along these lines is that they see being attacked in a PVP zone when they're just there for badges or PVE content as "abuse". In other words, "I'm in a PVP zone. I'm not here for PVP, but I'm being PVP'd against my will. This is therefore abuse".

[/ QUOTE ]Isn't that like stepping outside during a monsoon and then demanding to complain to the Almighty because you got wet? Seems rather stupid really.

Anyways aside from abusive chat, I've always been under the impression that anything goes in a PVP zone. Some things may be "bad form" but that's to be expected when there's so few rules beyond the usual "play nice".
Personally I don't go into PVP zones unless there's the rare cry of "Let's go to <PVP zone> and get our butts kicked!!" in our SG channel.

Londoner · 08-13-2008 07:22 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Perhaps part of the reason that people have gone along these lines is that they see being attacked in a PVP zone when they're just there for badges or PVE content as "abuse". In other words, "I'm in a PVP zone. I'm not here for PVP, but I'm being PVP'd against my will. This is therefore abuse".

[/ QUOTE ]

Which would be the wrong way of thinking.

Londoner · 08-13-2008 07:25 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Here's an answer to the original poster...

Read the EULA, it would have saved you a 10 page thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

He wasnt asking for a recital from the EULA, he was asking for opinions.

Ravenswing · 08-13-2008 07:40 AM

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Once again:
This is not about pvp or not pvp in pvp zones. PLEASE return to the topic people:

What do you consider such a bad behaviour even in a pvp zone that it's worth petitioning?

[/ QUOTE ]

That was answered, by PvPers and non-PvPers alike, in the first page. As has been stated, some non-PvPers consider being attacked in a PvP Zone to be abuse. A subset of those are ranting about it. It hasn't exactly got to do with PvP vs non-PvP, since I'm not a PvPer and do not consider that to be abuse.

Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.

MaWomble · 08-13-2008 07:48 AM

I personally don't pvp in games unless I'm playing UT.

At least City of is not like another NcSoft title I could mention that I used to play, where you stepped out of town/starter village only to get the free port back because you had been 1 shot by a perma red thats way above your level.

There is an added thrill to having collect badges in a zone where you could be attacked/killed at any time.

I think the best way to think of it, is that those folks that like to pvp are more like mobs but with a better AI.

Unfortunately I cannot really comment on the pvp in this game, haven't really tried it yet.....will take a look today and comment on it further later.

Oh, the only thing that I really really hate with is passion is the childish smacktalk that you often get in a pvp situations. I roleplay alot (maybe too much) and will rp any death, which usually ends up me getting called a few names I cannot repeat here.

Ma.

SteelRat · 08-13-2008 07:55 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Perhaps part of the reason that people have gone along these lines is that they see being attacked in a PVP zone when they're just there for badges or PVE content as "abuse". In other words, "I'm in a PVP zone. I'm not here for PVP, but I'm being PVP'd against my will. This is therefore abuse".

[/ QUOTE ]

Which would be the wrong way of thinking.

[/ QUOTE ]

Obviously; but you know what people are like *roll eyes*

@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
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SweetChilli · 08-13-2008 10:26 AM

I personally used to enjoy tp'ing other players to mobs and holding them there while the mobs kill them.

However, I don't do it that much these days - unless I'm bored. I considered this bad form but I just can't help myself. I am a bad man!

@Sweet Chilli

FloatingFatMan · 08-13-2008 10:30 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I personally used to enjoy tp'ing other players to mobs and holding them there while the mobs kill them.

However, I don't do it that much these days - unless I'm bored. I considered this bad form but I just can't help myself. I am a bad man!

[/ QUOTE ]

I thought deliberately TPing people in to mobs to cause them debt was officially considered griefing?

@FloatingFatMan

Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Standoff · 08-13-2008 10:34 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I personally used to enjoy tp'ing other players to mobs and holding them there while the mobs kill them.

However, I don't do it that much these days - unless I'm bored. I considered this bad form but I just can't help myself. I am a bad man!

[/ QUOTE ]

I thought deliberately TPing people in to mobs to cause them debt was officially considered griefing?

[/ QUOTE ]
IIRC doing so repeatedly was (in the same way that almost any flavour of repeatedly picking on the same toon was griefing), but as long as you're not going overboard mobs are classed as usable zone features.

SweetChilli · 08-13-2008 11:25 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I personally used to enjoy tp'ing other players to mobs and holding them there while the mobs kill them.

However, I don't do it that much these days - unless I'm bored. I considered this bad form but I just can't help myself. I am a bad man!

[/ QUOTE ]

I thought deliberately TPing people in to mobs to cause them debt was officially considered griefing?

[/ QUOTE ]

With the intention of causing them debt and debt alone, I beleive it is. But if its just with them intention of getting them killed then its fine according to Bridge (Gawd rest his soul).

The difference is purely intentional and can only be proved if it is admitted to.

@Sweet Chilli

Fruit Cocktail · 08-13-2008 11:34 AM

I really think the problem with PVP zones, its just one: Recluse's Victory.

I mean that zone, its good for PVP and for badgers as well, wich generates some confrontation. You can't get your badges because there's PVP and you can't PVP decently cause there's badgers not willing to PVP.

Maybe next time developers could try to separate those clearly diferent targets into diferent zones. Just an opinion

Proud member of Blaze of the Immortals (Heroes) and leader of F.O.E (villains)

Heroes:
Plumber, Ice Desert Girl, Doc Goodheart, Banana Machoman, Pavattone, Penguin Shark, Sting like a Bee

Villains:
Bricklayer, Savage Dentist, Fruit Cocktail, H. Yashida, Shesinellek

_Donna_ · 08-13-2008 11:43 AM

[ QUOTE ]
you can't PVP decently cause there's badgers not willing to PVP

[/ QUOTE ]

No such thing, if i can kill you i will.

Carlsberg don't do Farming,
But if they did..........

Fruit Cocktail · 08-13-2008 11:48 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
you can't PVP decently cause there's badgers not willing to PVP

[/ QUOTE ]

No such thing, if i can kill you i will.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was speaking in general not about you mate

Proud member of Blaze of the Immortals (Heroes) and leader of F.O.E (villains)

Heroes:
Plumber, Ice Desert Girl, Doc Goodheart, Banana Machoman, Pavattone, Penguin Shark, Sting like a Bee

Villains:
Bricklayer, Savage Dentist, Fruit Cocktail, H. Yashida, Shesinellek

CactusBrawler · 08-13-2008 11:54 AM

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[ QUOTE ]
you can't PVP decently cause there's badgers not willing to PVP

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No such thing, if i can kill you i will.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not really player versus player if one of the players isn't fighting back is it?

Edited for Clarification: It'd be like claiming you were 'great' at an FPS 'cus you totally like head shotted this guy, who'd been AFK for twenty minutes

Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.

Fosca · 08-13-2008 11:59 AM

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Fosca, would you mind explaining to me why it's fine for you to state those who attack you again and again in a PvP zone are only out to make yours/others' gaming experience miserable?

As you stated in your first post to this thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry, saw you message right now, couldn't answer sooner. First, like others have said as well, I don't complain about PvP'ing in PvP zones, that's absurd. I'm just saying that I see no point of attacking a non-responsive player. It's Player versus Player, if I'm just staying there, not fighting back, saying I'm not interested, there's no mutual fight, not really a PvP. First time can be understandable, maybe the other player is no reading the chat or whatever. If a second, third, fourth... time same player keeps fighting a non-responsive toon, there's no PvP there, there's no mutual fight. I think that that's PvP about, isn't it? So, if that player is not doing that because the fun of Player *versus* Player fight, what's the reason he/she is doing that? You can give it the name you want, I just used mine.
But, I never said I consider that an abuse, because it's not, it's a legitimate way of play. But it's not sportive playing, either. Then I just leave the zone and return any other time to see if I'm lucky.

Stryker_EU · 08-13-2008 12:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
you can't PVP decently cause there's badgers not willing to PVP

[/ QUOTE ]

No such thing, if i can kill you i will.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not really player versus player if one of the players isn't fighting back is it?

[/ QUOTE ]

They have a choice to fight back, whether they take it or not is up to them.

CactusBrawler · 08-13-2008 12:03 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
you can't PVP decently cause there's badgers not willing to PVP

[/ QUOTE ]

No such thing, if i can kill you i will.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not really player versus player if one of the players isn't fighting back is it?

[/ QUOTE ]

They have a choice to fight back, whether they take it or not is up to them.

[/ QUOTE ]

If on part of the equation of player versus player, isn't competing then its not actually PvP.

I mean if they aren't fighting back whats the point in attacking them?

Bit boring init?

Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.

JDBarker · 08-13-2008 12:05 PM

Not PvP'd myself yet but if your in the arena then your fair game. The only thing i think is a bit harsh is hunting and killing the same people repeatedly but then again given half the chance they might be trying to catch you out so you gotta protect yourself

Stasisesque · 08-13-2008 12:05 PM

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If on part of the equation of player versus player, isn't competing then its not actually PvP.

I mean if they aren't fighting back whats the point in attacking them?

Bit boring init?

[/ QUOTE ]

Awesome. Everytime I'm about to go up against someone with a much higher spec'd build than mine, or an experienced PvPer, or simply someone I think might beat me - I just won't attack.

That way, I'll never lose!

CactusBrawler · 08-13-2008 12:17 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

If on part of the equation of player versus player, isn't competing then its not actually PvP.

I mean if they aren't fighting back whats the point in attacking them?

Bit boring init?

[/ QUOTE ]

Awesome. Everytime I'm about to go up against someone with a much higher spec'd build than mine, or an experienced PvPer, or simply someone I think might beat me - I just won't attack.

That way, I'll never lose!

[/ QUOTE ]

"He who knows when he can fight and when he cannot, will be victorious." - Sun Tzu

AKA

If you not fighting back your not providing the versus part of player versus player, so the whole challenging gameplay and testing of builds part of the PVP experience is gone.

To be repeatedly attacked after showing that your not willing to fight back, just shows poor moral character on the part of the attacker.

Unless of course, your the only target in the zone.

Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.

Leif_Roar · 08-13-2008 12:25 PM

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So, if that player is not doing that because the fun of Player *versus* Player fight, what's the reason he/she is doing that?

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I don't know, why would someone not fight back in PvP? Whatever the reason, it's pretty bad form. Rather like Sunday-driving in the middle of the Monaco Grand Prix or sticking to water during a drinking game.

Slitty · 08-13-2008 12:25 PM

I've seen some pretty creative ways of getting kills. Things like droning don't really bother me since there's usually a way to avoid it. Ranting about unfair play and demanding to be left alone is like a red rag to a bull...

Leif_Roar · 08-13-2008 12:28 PM

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To be repeatedly attacked after showing that your not willing to fight back, just shows poor moral character on the part of the attacker.

[/ QUOTE ]

To repeatedly not fight back, after having been show that you're being attacked, just shows poor moral character on the part of the defender.

It's a zone for fighting. At least pretend to fight when you're (implicitly) asked to. Anything else is poor sportsmanship.

CactusBrawler · 08-13-2008 12:29 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So, if that player is not doing that because the fun of Player *versus* Player fight, what's the reason he/she is doing that?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know, why would someone not fight back in PvP? Whatever the reason, it's pretty bad form. Rather like Sunday-driving in the middle of the Monaco Grand Prix or sticking to water during a drinking game.

[/ QUOTE ]

Because for some pie-faced reason the devs put PVE content in the PVP zones?

To use you examples it would be living in Monaco and trying to get on with your normal life on race day, the drinking competition would be trying to get to the bar to order a soft drink only to have people jump in and try and force alcohol down your throat all the time.

Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.