Hmmmmm..... Good Point hun.
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Exploits??? Getting XP is an Exploit? Completing a mission is farming? What exactly are these Exploits?
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I have yet to see a definition of "exploit" that isn't so vague as to include just about everything a player can possibly do in the game. "Statistical advantage?" Puh-lease. I know how to buff/debuff. You wouldn't believe the "statistical advantage" I enjoy over the non-forumgoing playerbase.
"Exploit" is a spin term, pure and simple, and just plain shouldn't be used. Comm officers are confusing and inconsistent, and that means poor design, pre-this patch and even moreso post-this patch. Maybe laying off the spin might help the devs refocus on improving rather than rationalizing design.
Been playing near 4 years, almost every day since I came back after a 2 month break, namely because I was having no luck making money(no, I dont marketeer, I failed business economics class in school), and came back when Shields hit. Past few weeks, guess what, I was having A BLAST. I was able to level up chars to the range I wanted within A FEW DAYS. I wasnt gonna go 1-50 in one day, hell, I went 1-25 for a couple alts in like 2-3 days, with less stress, and with all the tickets, got a few good rolls to fund them in advance! Making money, leveling chars, even bought a few more char slots to make more concepts I had in mind, and I was HAVING FUN. Now, tickets are nerfed, no one wants to farm, or do anything AE. After near 4 years, they finally did a change that upset me. Plan your stuff in advance folks, dont give people a nice shiny for 3 weeks then smack em in the face figuratively speaking. Past 3 days I've logged on for a few minutes, maybe bought a IO or two, and logged off. And this is with 40+ chars. I love farming, I love PL, I hate grind. Still here after near 4 years, but now, my will is gone. Maybe CO will be better, maybe it'll be crap, but who knows. I played Diablo 2 for 5 years, quit for this game when I was getting desperate enough to debate buying items online. Now im thinking of quitting this game because the enjoyable-ness I had past near month in terms of making/outfitting my chars is gutted down. And no....you can't have my stuff.
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Thread to be locked soon 
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I would bet on it.
AS far as Circuit_Boy's comments I found that it's true playing the same map get old fast. I was trying to help this goofy kid who whined about not have a lvl 50 toon gets one. Well, I got tired of doing the same mission. Plus this person would not play unless he was sk'ed by a 50. Then he creates a new toon and played this one with the same only sk'ed by a 50 mandate when his toon I was helping him with was still a lvl 28. That was the end of any help from me. I was already sick of the constant PL me messages anyway, and like Circuit_Boy says that stuff gets boring, then it's like work, not fun.
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Been playing near 4 years, almost every day since I came back after a 2 month break, namely because I was having no luck making money(no, I dont marketeer, I failed business economics class in school), and came back when Shields hit. Past few weeks, guess what, I was having A BLAST. I was able to level up chars to the range I wanted within A FEW DAYS. I wasnt gonna go 1-50 in one day, hell, I went 1-25 for a couple alts in like 2-3 days, with less stress, and with all the tickets, got a few good rolls to fund them in advance! Making money, leveling chars, even bought a few more char slots to make more concepts I had in mind, and I was HAVING FUN. Now, tickets are nerfed, no one wants to farm, or do anything AE. After near 4 years, they finally did a change that upset me. Plan your stuff in advance folks, dont give people a nice shiny for 3 weeks then smack em in the face figuratively speaking. Past 3 days I've logged on for a few minutes, maybe bought a IO or two, and logged off. And this is with 40+ chars. I love farming, I love PL, I hate grind. Still here after near 4 years, but now, my will is gone. Maybe CO will be better, maybe it'll be crap, but who knows. I played Diablo 2 for 5 years, quit for this game when I was getting desperate enough to debate buying items online. Now im thinking of quitting this game because the enjoyable-ness I had past near month in terms of making/outfitting my chars is gutted down. And no....you can't have my stuff.
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One reason you have trouble with money is you are not in the the friends and family program. The fact that this exists has always bugged me.
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Exploits??? Getting XP is an Exploit? Completing a mission is farming? What exactly are these Exploits?
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I have yet to see a definition of "exploit" that isn't so vague as to include just about everything a player can possibly do in the game. "Statistical advantage?" Puh-lease. I know how to buff/debuff. You wouldn't believe the "statistical advantage" I enjoy over the non-forumgoing playerbase.
"Exploit" is a spin term, pure and simple, and just plain shouldn't be used. Comm officers are confusing and inconsistent, and that means poor design, pre-this patch and even moreso post-this patch. Maybe laying off the spin might help the devs refocus on improving rather than rationalizing design.
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This is specious, RK. It's not "spin", nor is the definition of exploitation particularly "vague".
Is it quantifiable, as the engineers and pseudo-lawyers around here want? No, but that's the very nature of qualitative words like "exploit" and "exploitation".
It's like the definition of "torture". If you want to specify which specific acts constitute "torture", you'll never do anything to stop it, because humanity is inventive and people will just do things that, for whatever reason, haven't been included in the list. That's why the Geneva Conventions and the UN Convention Against Torture don't specifically define it--in fact, their definitions are pretty broad, so as to cover a range of acts.
Bean-counting is often the defense of those who are knowingly violating the rules. How many waterboarding sessions are "torture"? One? Four? Two dozen? 182?
The fact is we all know what "exploit" actually means, just like we all know what "torture" really means. That we're unwilling to come to grips with our own behaviors--on both fronts--speaks more about the psychological mechanisms we use to defend our egos against the idea that we've done something wrong than anything else.
40062: The World's Worst PUG
84008: Jenkins's Guide to Super-Villainy
230187: The Hero of Kings Row
No H8 - 08.04.10
@Circuit Boy - Moderator - Pride global chat channel
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AE officially now sucks. Not only it has been nerfed the mishes with just bosses are so much tougher and no one does normal mishes anymore so the new issue just screwed everything. 
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Well now. I would probabbly find that pretty insulting if I knew you had run my arc. #11529 has a nice little story line and some custom baddies. It may not be the best in the world but people seem to enjoy it.
If your looking for something specific try searching by tags. SFMA=Story Focussed MA HFMA=HUmour Focusees. There is a pinned post at the top of this section. Check it out, perhaps it will help you alleviiate some of your MA dissapointment.
Or you could always just make your own. This is why the system was set up in the first place.
Enjoy your day please.
Well exploit or not, there are not-intended and hindering-what-was-intended behaviours.
MA was, imo, created so people can play and experience lots of different interesting new stories.
Wheter doing the same especially rewarding mission over and over again is an exploit or not, it is clearly not what was intended.
And if such tactics are WAY more rewarding than the intended ways to play the game, and that results in noone playing the intended content anymore, then it is working against the game and it is totally understandanble that something is done against it.
Never been much a friend of such rating systems, but if 5 starts only means you get much XP per time and risk, and the really 'good' as intented arcs are duried deep down in the list instead, that is working against the intended purpose as well.
Personally I'd give the biggest part of the rewards only upon completing a story arc for the first time. 
I dont know how the ids for such arcs are handled though, or how to tell minimal changes apart from a new and enhanced version or totally different story in the same slot.
But not granting any completion XP for own arcs would already help too.
This is a ridiculous fight. I am against some of the more draconian methods they used to stop it, and though I enjoyed getting a few characters leveled that I probably woudln't have otherwise, I was also aware how bad it could get. if I was getting from 10 - 31 in a night,t here were people who got from 1 - 50 in a night simply because I don't have the patience to do the same map for hours on end and other people do. That is certainly violating the leveling metric that the devs use (and don't pretend you didn't know that they used that). That's completely different from normal everyday farming,w hich while devs don't usually approve of they do deal with.
Couple that with EVERYONE was doing it (an oversimplification, but it was really really hard to find a non-farm team at all on Liberty or Virtue, the 2 places I play) and there were a lot of levels gained really fast and probably to the detriment of the game.
Did posi over react in his response? Yes. He shoudln't have threatened to ban people when they did let these mistakes through into AE. But removing the mistakes and making it so that people can't gain rewards faster than their metric? THat's their prerogative and one that I can understand.
"Be a beacon?"
Blue Mourning: lvl. 50 Katana/DA
Bree the Barricade: lvl 50 Stone/Axe
Last Chance for Eden: lvl 50 Fire/Kin
Myra the Grey: lvl 50 Bots/Traps
1 Minute to Midnight lvl 50 Spines/DA
The Market was broken, thanks to AE. The casual player could actually afford to IO set out their toons.(yes, me) not anymore. Back to the 200million inf recipes.
Fortunately in the clarification post, Positron noted that only the most hardcore exploiters are gonna face punishment. Anyone who snuck a few levels in or didn't know the difference should be fine.
If they didn't wave SOME sort of stick, that would set up a mentality of "Look for every day one exploit you can find and hammer it as fast as possible before the devs can patch, and you'll be A-OK because they can't touch you!". That's a dangerous mindset to have, since it effectively neuters the devs ability to punish and encourages even MORE rabid attempts to game the system.
Patch by patch, we're getting AE back to where the devs wanted it to be -- a way for players to create arcs that are equivalent to playing the dev-created arcs. Not a way to make arcs that are twenty times more rewarding.
The AE is not "destroyed", it's being brought in line with the rest of the game. If you dislike the way XP works in the rest of the game, go ahead and petition the devs to rescale XP, or to provide some sort of autolevelling buy, or whatever. I'd be behind that; I'm sick of levels 1-20. But don't think an exploit oversight is the way to go.
Global @Twoflower / MA Creator & Pro Indie Game Developer.
Mission Architect Works: DIY Laser Moonbase (Dev Choice!), An Internship in the Fine Art of Revenge (2009 MA Award Winner!) and many more! Plus Brand New Arcs for Issue 21!
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You truly didn't think it was gonna last forever did you? I mean really.
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Yeah, but it totally [censored] normal teaming and everything people do AE wise blows.
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Please go find another game. If what you want is normal, then I am screwed. Please leave, and take everyone like you with you.
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Here's what would really happen: they'd get their 50, and maybe a second. Possibly a third. Then they'd decide, in their heads, they'd "beat" the game and quit in a month, maybe two. Really, be honest with yourself. How long would you stay in a game, doing the same damn map, fighting the same challenge-less mobs, over and over and over? The answer is, you wouldn't.
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I've been playing the game for bout 3yrs now. I haven't been playing the same map over and over again, but I play about the same 5 maps and fight about the same 5 different enemy types over and over and over and over again.
I personally don't see a huge difference between only eating pb & j and cycling between a handful of meal choices over and over. But some do.
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Some might farm after getting bored of playing all the usual arcs on 20 different toons. It should be their option to do this and play the game without playing the same arcs.
[/ QUOTE ] Which is why they could, instead, play through any of the numerous lower-level story-based arcs that players have created. A lot of them are really quite nifty truth be told ....
Oh wait, they're not really bored with the same-old content, they just want to level ASAP and are using that as an excuse.
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Actually, I was running the borked-rewards mishes for two reasons. A) I really was bored with the low level blueside content and wanted to skip it, as evidenced by the fact that none of my characters PLed over level 30, and B) I wanted to try out a couple powersets that I had never played before and wanted to get to the early 20's to see how they performed after SO's. (End result of that, in case you care, is 2 of the 3 characters I leveled that way I will be keeping, the 3rd is getting deleted.
So, hate to have to tell you this, but some of the people that said they were bored with the low level content were telling the truth. But if you want to continue to believe that everyone is lying about it to make themselves look better, I won't stand in your way.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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You truly didn't think it was gonna last forever did you? I mean really.
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Yeah, but it totally [censored] normal teaming and everything people do AE wise blows.
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Please go find another game. If what you want is normal, then I am screwed. Please leave, and take everyone like you with you.
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I'm actually glad the AE (non farm missions) are drying the regular content teams up. That might be a hint that the devs needs to focus more on CONTENT now that they've got their major systems up (merits, lolpvp, and MA).
Enough systems focused issues please.
Get back to making content folks want to play.
And yay to the two high level tfs coming in issue 15.
Would be nice to get some more lower level content one of these days though.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
so issues 10, 11 and 12 didn't give any new content?
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Would be nice to get some more lower level content one of these days though.
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Absolutely agreed. That's one of the main reasons why it's such a chore to level -- the lower level content is either unsoloable (much of the hollows, several Oakes arcs), in annoying to navigate places like Mercy Island, or just becomes a dull grind since you've done it fifty thousand times. Some new lowbie content would be welcome.
This is one thing I can see the AE used well for -- creating new content focused on lower level characters, so they have something ELSE to do on their way up to the more varied mid and high tier content. Unfortunately custom critters are murder incarnate to a lowbie, so we're stuck with staple critters, but some good writing can work around that and provide something interesting to do.
The answer is never farms. The answer is better content, so you don't feel you HAVE to farm to get anywhere AND experience new things.
Global @Twoflower / MA Creator & Pro Indie Game Developer.
Mission Architect Works: DIY Laser Moonbase (Dev Choice!), An Internship in the Fine Art of Revenge (2009 MA Award Winner!) and many more! Plus Brand New Arcs for Issue 21!
Twoflower
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Patch by patch, we're getting AE back to where the devs wanted it to be -- a way for players to create arcs that are equivalent to playing the dev-created arcs. Not a way to make arcs that are twenty times more rewarding.
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Wow, if this is true why do AE arcs give a 10th of the XP a real mission does. If you use custom baddies that is what you get.
BashfulBanshee
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Well now. I would probabbly find that pretty insulting if I knew you had run my arc. #11529 has a nice little story line and some custom baddies. It may not be the best in the world but people seem to enjoy it.
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If I wanted the kill some time by not getting any xp or influence I'll try your arc. Again, if you use custom characters xp and influence is only a 10th of what real mission will bring.
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If I wanted the kill some time by not getting any xp or influence I'll try your arc. Again, if you use custom characters xp and influence is only a 10th of what real mission will bring.
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It is ?
So if I go into an arc with a 50, instead of 2006 inf for an even con minion, I will get 200 or 201 ?
An custom Lt is worth only 688 inf, and a custom boss 6888 inf ?
That really does not tie with my own running of arcs through to yesterday.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
I haven't experienced 1/10th of the XP gain compared to normal critters. If that was true, why would farms of custom bosses have been so popular? Even with boss XP, they'd have produced far too little XP to be worth it.
Please show your work. Where's the proof for this? Not anecdotal, let's see some numbers.
Global @Twoflower / MA Creator & Pro Indie Game Developer.
Mission Architect Works: DIY Laser Moonbase (Dev Choice!), An Internship in the Fine Art of Revenge (2009 MA Award Winner!) and many more! Plus Brand New Arcs for Issue 21!
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If I wanted the kill some time by not getting any xp or influence I'll try your arc. Again, if you use custom characters xp and influence is only a 10th of what real mission will bring.
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It is ?
So if I go into an arc with a 50, instead of 2006 inf for an even con minion, I will get 200 or 201 ?
An custom Lt is worth only 688 inf, and a custom boss 6888 inf ?
That really does not tie with my own running of arcs through to yesterday.
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Yeah, I don't know what he's talking about, either.
I was runnning MA arcs after the patch and noticed no difference in the XP I was getting there vs normal missions (well, other than the lack of the patrol XP bonus, but I think that it's always been that way).
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Wow, if this is true why do AE arcs give a 10th of the XP a real mission does. If you use custom baddies that is what you get.
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This is total Feldercarb.
http://www.urbandictionary.com/defin...erm=Feldercarb
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
Darth_Khasei
Stern_Verdict
Twoflower
Catwhoorg
Ok you people need to learn how to read ALL the words. I said Custom characters.
In case you missed it Custom characters.
Again Custom characters.
Then again it could be your arcs are fine with Custom toons in them. This only means you are part of the friends and family program. Congratulations for being part of the anointed few.
But if your a regular sap like me pays and is not part of the friends and family program don't make stories with custom characters.
Ok in mid rant I logged in and tried my mish after not doing for since the first week just to quote some numbers. They may have fixed the custom characters = crap XP. Instead of getting 29 XP for killing a yellow with a lvl 37 toon I got several hundred. It was definitely not that way when I made and played the story. It was maybe lvl 5 XP with a lvl 40 toon.
what exactly is the 'friends and family' program supposed to be?
Thread to be locked soon