Discussion: Poll for Power Set Feedback!
By
2Negative,
Posted on: 2007-05-22 14:02 in News, Events and Announcement Discussion
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Posi, how are you going to account for the skewedness of the poll?
What I mean is that we have no idea what your intentions were behind some of the sets. Like, how is Vibration different than Fore Fields? How is either of those different than current armors?
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I believe Fore Fields are found on golf courses? 
Anyway. My guess is that the poll was not so much about the mechanics of the incoming sets but the sound of them. It's possible that we'd get basically the same power set game-wise whether Vibration or Force Fields gets implemented and only the look would be different. Just guessing, you know, wildly here.
Thanks for not only keeping the time on the poll under 24 hours... but keeping it so vague we literally have to judge a book by its cover.
Give us informed choices for us to make decisions (and the time to do so) and not something we have to kneejerk to in under a days time.
And I'm with what a few others stated before... judging by the choices, what you think is "cool" and etc... it looks like you guys are take a huge step back in some regards.
I was more interested in the paid box back when... and with all the new free content, I'm still more interested in what would have been with the paid box.
EC
when i hear force field for tanks/scrappers i automatically think of wizard's Magic Guard skill
BTW, here is my handy-dandy chart of ATs v. Powersets that I use for easy reference:
ATs, Powerset Classes, & Powersets
Click on the chart once to make it slightly expand so that everything is legible.
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so will O Street Fighting
O Electric Hammer
O Energy Blade
O Psionic Weaponry
O Dual Blades
O Ball and Chain *
O Shield Fighting *
be available for scrappers?
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so you believe that none of the existing powersets would work to fill those gaps? that extensive powerset sharing should be limited to classes like defender, blaster, etc?
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Quote me where I said that. Quote me where I said anything even remotely resembling that.
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you didn't say those exact words, but the jist of your post...
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The "jist" of my post is nothing even remotely close to what you imply. The "jist" of my post is simply that Tankers are the singly least diverse Archetype out there.
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and i like how you skewed your numbers to support your view.
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I stated my personal beliefs, and was clear and up front that I was weighting the values of the first table accordingly.
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tankers have more combinations available than stalkers, doms and MMs, but they need more combos, and if the 3 diff 25-28 ISN'T a big deal, then the 1 diff of scrappers 24-25 is even less of a deal.
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There may be more permutations for Tankers - but the majority of them come from Secondaries. I am of the opinion that a character's strongest, most defining characteristic is their primary. Therefor, a dearth of primaries is somewhat more significant than an abundance of secondaries.
When you describe a character, for most if not all archetypes, when you give only a single powerset ...? It's the primary. You don't typically say "I'm going to make a /Devices Blaster", you instead say "I'm going to make a Fire/ Blaster" or "I'm going to make an AR/ Blaster".
Obviously, in some circumstances, this does not hold absolutely true. But generally speaking, it's the Primary which most defines any particular character, within their Archetype.
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why not do as someone else suggested (and is even on the list in the form of Force Fields) and just re-use a couple of powersets here and there?
HOW hard is that?
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I never suggested NOT doing this. You, being such a devout proponent, are merely assuming that I oppose your desires, based on nothing more than a lack of overt support.
I do think each Archetype should have one or more Primaries unique to itself, rather than just being tweaked versions of otherwise existing powersets.
Booyah! They put the polls back up. Our voice was heard.
wowser, where to start?? (staff set!!)
MELEE
-street fighting, depends on what this is actually, but may be kool
-elec hammer, hmmm, i can see stuns at work here, shooting elec bolts would be sweet, but they wont give range to a tank. -Maybe a short arc, yes could work....
-energy blade, afraid it would be too much like fire/ice swords
-psi weaponry, has potential, but animation would prob be like sets in use currently, so....
-dual blades, these would really rock in the hands of a scrapper, but they already have 2 sets of sword. if you're gonna have dual weapons how about dual pistols, like gunslinger, or knives, maybe scyes (sp?)
ball & chain, to those of us married it means something altogether different, jk honey! this one has potential, new weapon, new animation. leaning that way..
shields, i feel it belongs on the defensive side of things, sorry Cap! (rip)
DEFENSE-
-density control, no clue, could be meat, could be cake, we'll call it meatcake! (ty George)
-force field, unless it is vastly different from bubblers, i'd say we have this covered already
-willpower, how to animate this?? (multiple slaps to head as enters melee?!)
-vibration, great now all the ladies will only want to solo!!! this set could be kool, phasing..maybe?
-growth, nice if they could make it work, but indoors/ underground??
-shield def., this one would be my pick, but how do you reconcile animation with handheld weaponry??
my vote then
if you still care cause i have rambled on soooo long)
(STAFF set) ball & chain, electric hammer.
shield, vibration
new weapons, ahem staff, dual tomahawks, knives, good old tried and man-killing tested spear or lance.
Warlord: You are looking at a man that can run you through with this sword without batting an eye.
Monk: You are looking at a man who can be run through with that sword without batting an eye.
--old Korean folk tale
Edit: Thank you for putting the polls back up so that we all can have our say.
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Part of the problem in choosing just two is that I can't decide between "this will be so cool" and "this isn't as cool as the other choice, but it does seem more feasible (and thus may possibly see the light of day)".
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I haven't read the whole thread but I agree with what he said.
Anyways I don't really see how shield fighting could become a whole primary fighting set, that's not really practical. I don't really see how you could make a whole defensive set based on "willpower". Growth seems cool but yeah I don't really see how you could make a whole defensive set based on this, sounds more like a single power. I really like the idea of a lightning hammer, it's almost like electric melee but it's a badass hammer, pardon my french. Electric hammer could go really well with shield defense, but that might be a bit hard to make into a complete set as well. but you could have a power that's a toggle that just brings out your shield and adds +res to lethal/smash as well as defensive stun attacks, and shields made of different elements like fire and water that tend to resist energy and negative energy. Street fighting would be cool , kind of like a wrestling style or something. Energy blade could produce jedi-like characters or something , might be cool. Ball and chain really doesn't sound very different from mace. Density might be a cool defensive set, again sounds like a single power or something. That' my 2 cents, sorry for not reading the whole thread.
Heck they are all good! It's difficult to choose! Though I guess I'd like to See Ball and Chain, Shield Melee, Shield Defense, and Force Field as my favorites to be choosen. (ESPECIALLY Ball and chain! That sounds sooo sweet!!!
Especially, also, if it's a "Ranged" Melee)
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In regards to the poll being up for less than 24 hours:
We amassed a ton of votes in that short amount of time. In addition, a large percentage of those votes came from people who signed up for the forums just yesterday, so it's not just the "vocal minority" having their say. A lot of new-to-the-boards players got their voice in this.
In addition, there is a weirdness in the forum software that would force us to re-put up the polls (again) allowing you all a chance to vote twice, and that would have a far greater impact on the poll results than the data we received.
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Meanwhile a 2 year player like myself didn't even get a chance to vote and therefore won't have his voice heard either.
Dominators don't need mitigation from their secondaries. Even if they did, there's ice (slows), psi (-recharge), and fire and elec (death).
-Talen_Lee commenting on Energy Assault's Utility
Why put up a poll then hide the results? How long was the pull up anyhow, just saw it yesterday.
Zombie, man, how hard is it to come to the conclusion that after three years of getting nothing new, that we might want some actual attention?
Just porting over Dark Armor to tankers might make up the disparity, but doesn't really make us feel that the Devs care about the AT. It feels more like a cop out.
We have 4 primaries, that's it. Yes, adding a fifth even just porting one over would add to that, but we WANT something new. I think after 3 years that's not an unreasonable request.
Who do you really feel needs new sets? MMs? They got 5 brand new spanking sets with the release of CoV and issue 7. Stalkers? Brand new AT with some new powersets at the release of CoV, plus got Dark Melee ported to them with Issue 7. Tankers haven't gotten ANYTHING new, not even a ported set, since CoH was released. Certainly, it is not an unreasonable request for us to want something new, and some actual Dev time that isn't nerfs.
Just porting sets over will not really solve the problem at all. We've been asking for something new since Defenders got new powersets. I do not think it's unreasonable at all to be asking for at least some new primary set.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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In regards to the poll being up for less than 24 hours:
We amassed a ton of votes in that short amount of time. In addition, a large percentage of those votes came from people who signed up for the forums just yesterday, so it's not just the "vocal minority" having their say. A lot of new-to-the-boards players got their voice in this.
In addition, there is a weirdness in the forum software that would force us to re-put up the polls (again) allowing you all a chance to vote twice, and that would have a far greater impact on the poll results than the data we received.
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Meanwhile a 2 year player like myself didn't even get a chance to vote and therefore won't have his voice heard either.
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So, you won't be voting on the new poll?
NCIS: Best gorram show in the 'verse.
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We did plan out Power Sets for the retail box, but we've gone the route of free updates instead (woohoo!). Yep, we had some planned...and we thought about just putting those into updates as schedule permitted...
but then we thought it'd be cool if we polled the players what they wanted first. Not all of these power sets are of equal difficulty - some are tougher than others - but they are all possible. I can't promise exactly when it'll get in, but please know that we've heard loudly and clearly that players want new power sets.
BTW...Ball and Chain was my little addition last minute. It would be just be SO cool!
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Firstly...The retail idea switch back to the free update idea was a bad move. Paid retail updates would actually help turn this game back to the game it once was by weeding out the now endless list of 12 year olds that play this game now. I miss the days when I actually teamed with a 35 year old dude like myself..now I'm dealing with "MrBombadilREBORN" or "xwolverinesuperclarkx".
Second...
I mentioned it earlier, and I'll mention it again...
Power Customization. The core community has been asking for this for AGES now, and you, Statesman, have spouted the same thing "We want to put this in, we really do!" sice I2. You have had the time to create MAJOR updates and re qorkings of CoH, and entire NEW game with CoV, and you are now deciding what new powersets to put in for Scrappers and Tankers? This should have been done last year my friend. Changing the colors on the powers or changing the AR gun can't be THAT hard. You've added rocket boots, like 10 more types of wings, and changed auras on Blaster primaries....why am I STILL firing a GD Supersoaker with my AR blaster? Why does my NRG Blaster STILL fire light blue gobs of whatever the hell that is? Why does my claw/invuln scrapper STILL glow like an xmas tree? (BTW, you STILL haven't addressed the Claw/invuln scrapper issues I've brought up before, let alone acknowledge them when the rest of the community has)
And now you want Ball and Chain? You've done nothing but suggest mostly weapons, am I right? I thought you made this a SUPER HERO game Jack, not World of Superhero Weaponcraft.
Somewhere along the way, you lost something. Positron tried to get it back, but it's beyond fixable. I'm not going to mention names here, but another avid poster on here, who introduced me to this game 3 years ago and is one of the most outspoken and recognizable people in this community used to be this games biggest fan. Now he states, and I quote:
"I don't know about the Marvel MMO. I don't trust Jack anymore." Plain and simple, but the bottom line is, this game is not what it was three years ago. Sure, I've left a few times and come back, but if something isn't done in the next issue to show a hint of interest in keeping the core fanbase around, I'll be cancelling for good. Yes, I can hear you now
"Fine, leave Syxxblade, you're loss."
Actually...no. Banging my head against a wall wasn't getting me anywhere anyways, so really, my gain. I remain optimistic that this hasn't fallen on deaf ears, but really, I think I know the end result.
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Why put up a poll then hide the results? How long was the pull up anyhow, just saw it yesterday.
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Err ... yesterday?
As to the "hiding" ... like most things here on the CoH boards, to mittigate the complaints of ... "It suxors that x got the most votes, it's a soopid set, do y insteed." "You Devs suck if you do x insteed of y" ... etc.
That's not to say it won't happen when they announce that they are putting in x set when it gets done, it just won't be drawn out from now until when ever it is. 
NCIS: Best gorram show in the 'verse.
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I couldn't just outright pick two...there are some very good suggestions here. So I just ordered them. I know its basically like picking the top two, but at least I feel better about it hehe...
O Shield Fighting *
O Street Fighting
O Electric Hammer
O Energy Blade
O Psionic Weaponry
O Dual Blades
O Ball and Chain * (This should be for brutes imho)
O Growth *
O Shield Defense *
O Willpower *if it is a more natural form of defense*
O Density Control
O Force Field
O Vibration
On a side note , these things would greatly add to the game.
1) Port Electric Armor/Melee over from villains to heroes with blue lightning instead of red.
2) Give us some damn pistols already.
3) Add Radiation Brutes/Tankers to this list
4) Port Axe and Morning Star to brutes. Never understood why they didn't get weapons.
5) Add some more weapon Anicallary Pools for scrappers from existing sets. Namely Archery and Pistol stuff from the MMs.
Classic Dungeon Crawl Arc ID: 2232-"A satirical look at your average dungeon"
Down the Rabbit Hole Arc IDs: 24346 24397-"Rescue a little girl from an insidious dream invader."
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4) Port Axe and Morning Star to brutes. Never understood why they didn't get weapons.
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Problems with fury.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
i think psionic weapons would suit one of the 3 builds i have in mind if they do them right...btw my 3 builds are psi/ff, psi/regen, and psi/reflex
Poll didn't give me any interest to vote. The Density thing may work with one of my toons I have in mind but a better power set will never happen except in RP.
Alternate Form
I'd also like to put a vote in for more powerset sharing.
I'd like to see an Electric or Dark tank.
I'd like to see an Ice Brute (yes, I know it was already tried, but if a DA brute "works" then I'm gonna say an Ice one can too )
Broad Sword for Tanks/Brutes
Mace for Brutes
Dark Blasters
Etc etc etc...
-ASYLUM- (nsfw)
St. Lucifer: lvl 50 D3 Defender
Satanicus: lvl 38 E2 Blaster
Diabolus The Dark: lvl 36 SS/DA Brute
Old Man Death: lvl 33 TH/DM Mastermind
Misses Claus: lvl 33 Ice Controller
I wouldn't be too in favor of Street Fighting as Tankers/Brutes got Super Strength and Scrappers/Stalkers got Martial Arts. It would be like a repeat of each other but combined in my way of view. Sure its a good idea but again, to me, it seems like combining fighting from different powers 
What we should see is a power thats different, something like a Boomerang as a long distant fighter for Scrappers. Be like Ripper on Spines Power but everything is like Ripper. I know some of you are tilting your head about now while reading this but why not go for something completely different with an edge?
On the last note, I hope Ball & Chain, Dual Wield, and Shield Defense make it. I'm really looking forward to these kind of powers IF they are favored. I know it would make me stay here for years to come 
Edited
Forgot to add. An idea for Dual Wield (said it earlier in the topic) would be to select which weapon you can choose from either once or multiple times like a costume piece to display with the character using and while performing the powers. Say like chains, bamboo sticks, dual katanas, axes, ninchakus, sais, chacrams(spelling is off), cutlasses, butterfly knives, etc. Only thing to make it sensible is to NOT change the colors on them to give it a sensible look and less complications on the programming and arts department
I just want to say thank you for re-opening the polls.
You don't hit smiling monsters - Sister Flame
I'm a little annoyed that they didn't post the results like they said they would. At the bottom of the original poll, it said that the results would be viewable after the poll had closed.