I can solo Trials and TFs in less then 30 mins
By
anarchicgorilla,
Posted on: 2007-02-16 13:05 in The Market and Inventions
I have a quick question, how does the "Monster" Jurassic at the end of the Numina TF compare to an AV?
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Thing is, fire/fire isn't a particularly uber build. It's nifty, but there are far better brute builds. Nerfing fire/fire won't do much good to prevent this kind of thing, that's Ultimus' point.
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By definition, the process of changing every build that can solo AVs(or the temp powers involved) would prevent soloing AVs, if a sufficient adjustment is made.
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Yeah, but that's a lot more work in fixes than enforcing rarity on recipes by limiting drop rates of TFs and Trials.
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Or just nerfing shivans. I'd waiger what Ultimus does can be done with many brute and scrapper combos at least. He's done it with at least one tank build and thinks he could do it with his illusion controller. It's much easier to limit a rare drop to one per TF per day (NOT to one TF a day) or nerf shivans to bosses. Maybe 10 boss summons instead of 5 EB summons or something...
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Except Castle already said they weren't planning on nerfing Shivans.
Sgt Liberty - 50 Martial Arts / Super Reflexes
Verdigris Eagle - 50 Archery / Energy Manipulation
Stormeye - 50 Storm Summoning / Electric Blast
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I have a quick question, how does the "Monster" Jurassic at the end of the Numina TF compare to an AV?
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He's about the same. I should note he is not a GIANT Monster.
Monster = AV just a different name.
Monsters in normal missions are even subject to the EB coding.
The DE Monster in a portal mission for example
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
Quick question... has anyone ever claimed to have solo'd Lusca in the game's modern incarnation? Even with nukes and Shivans, that -would- be a feat.
Thanks.
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Disable travel powers while carrying meteorite samples.
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Bloody Bay is empty most of the time. So I'll just walk from meteor to meteor instead of superspeeding, big deal. What difference does that make? 30 minutes instead of 15?
I'd prefer the acquisition method be kept as-is, but the power limited to one charge.
Villainside I don't have über power builds, and getting a shivan has been the only way for me to get past EBs solo.
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OK, then disable travel powers AND add frequent Shivan ambushes towards the carriers of the meteorites. Also suppress all stealth powers.
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And then, the Langoliers come.
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And here I thought I was the only one who throughly enjoyed this movie. Everytime it is shown on sci fi I can sit through the 4 hours and watch the guy from perfect strangers go crazy. (Although he is gone after the first 2)
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I don't mind that he can solo trials and TFs. I don't mind that he likes to brag about it. I mind when he comes around and tries to get the drop rate for the rest of us nerfed because if everyone has access to rare recipes it'll make him feel less 'special'.
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I could understand your resentment if inventions were live but they aren't. The developers have stated the drop rates will get tweaked and I am trying to point out an early flaw.
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Then why don't YOU wait until Inventions are released and see if the game becomes 'flooded' as you say? You are making huge assumptions about a system not even implemented yet not to mention a potential influx of so called farmers. You are also making an assumption that a large enough subscriber base plays at your level.
The only one making huge baseless leaps about broken mechanics of gameplay is you.
<why do I get the feeling my first paragraph is something Ultimus loves to hear no matter how much he denies it. I just get the feeling he really soaks up the comments that no one else plays at his level.....please note this musing Castle>
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Boss I have identified a problem with the braking system on the new cars; it might result in abnormal breaking under stress and may result in a total failure of our new system
Boss: I think we should let this go live, if enough problems pop up we can do a recall of the whole system (nerf) cause that is better I think
oh I c
So what happens if system does get flooded with purple lewt for cheap and it degrades the whole lewt system that the devs spent god knows how long neglecting everything else in favour of?
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Well, seeing as my post went by the wayside again--I'll address the newest topic. I can't get nukes or shivans, either. Again, I'm just trying to put things in perspective--but why am I going to be nerfed if I can't solo anything--can't do mayhems, can't do safeguards, can't get nukes, and can't get shivans. Again, I think all this discussion is a bit skewed and premature.
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Any changes made to shivs, nukes or TF limits would have no effect on you then if you cant get shivs, nukes and do mayhems at such a pace, then I doubt you would be attempting to do multiple runs of the same TF in one day 
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I don't see any problem, 1% can solo with a shivan, 99% can't or don't. Just because someone is so good in CoV that he has figured out how to solo with a Shivan, does not mean the average Joe or anybody, more than a hand full could do the same.
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The problem is: if it becomes recognized as a fast, reliable and relatively easy way to get rares (purple) lewt, then more and more people will exploit it. The devs have the reaction time of a tortoise, so what will happen when the system has more purple lewt then it was supposed to? They bring in the sledgehammer sized nerf bat . And we all cry and the devs cry cause they just spent god knows how long on this project while neglecting other things. That is the potential outcome anyway, we know from other games that people love duping rares and exploiting easy to get uber lewt, this issue raised potentially undermines the system.
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Except Castle already said they weren't planning on nerfing Shivans.
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He also said the range on impale was fine at 80 and it was cut in half like a month or so later lol.
For the record I think shivs are the problem and the only problem in this whole equation. Hopefully the devs recognize the problem and fix it rather than ham-fisting some other solution into the game that wreaks a bunch of other stuff
Frosticus
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Quick question... has anyone ever claimed to have solo'd Lusca in the game's modern incarnation? Even with nukes and Shivans, that -would- be a feat.
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I did it on my storm/earth controller with one inspiration in my tray...
Okay, so that was a lie. Ah well, what are you gonna do?
Please leave Shivans alone. They are very useful to the squishier AT's in the game.
The simple thing to do is to make the rewards tie into the minimum team size. If the TF need 4 to start, you must have 4 to get rare drops. Make the missions scale to the TF minimum, instead of for a solo player. Leave it so that you can still complete the TF if under the minimum, just no rares will drop.
I think that would solve the problem.
"Sorry bucko, but CoH and CoV are the same game." -BackAlleyBrawler
"Silly villain, CoX is for Heroes!" -Saicho
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Thing is, fire/fire isn't a particularly uber build. It's nifty, but there are far better brute builds. Nerfing fire/fire won't do much good to prevent this kind of thing, that's Ultimus' point.
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By definition, the process of changing every build that can solo AVs(or the temp powers involved) would prevent soloing AVs, if a sufficient adjustment is made.
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Yeah, but that's a lot more work in fixes than enforcing rarity on recipes by limiting drop rates of TFs and Trials.
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Or just nerfing shivans. I'd waiger what Ultimus does can be done with many brute and scrapper combos at least. He's done it with at least one tank build and thinks he could do it with his illusion controller. It's much easier to limit a rare drop to one per TF per day (NOT to one TF a day) or nerf shivans to bosses. Maybe 10 boss summons instead of 5 EB summons or something...
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Except Castle already said they weren't planning on nerfing Shivans.
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Plans can easily change.
I've already been "strongly encouraged" before to go get a shivan by TF team leaders. As one who doesn't like to use the things, that is bothersome to me. So, call me a nerfherder, I'm all for Shivans being nerfed.
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Please leave Shivans alone. They are very useful to the squishier AT's in the game.
The simple thing to do is to make the rewards tie into the minimum team size. If the TF need 4 to start, you must have 4 to get rare drops. Make the missions scale to the TF minimum, instead of for a solo player. Leave it so that you can still complete the TF if under the minimum, just no rares will drop.
I think that would solve the problem.
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What about making the Shivans more or less powerful depending on your AT? Similar to how Leadership is a lot more uber in the hands of a Defender or Controller than in the hands of a Scrapper or a Tank... ie the less your AT needs it to help avoid damage when taking on tougher foes (AVs, GMs, etc), the weaker the Shivan, while the "squishies" (though obviously still in danger due to their inherent squishiness) get the tougher versions.
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Please leave Shivans alone. They are very useful to the squishier AT's in the game.
The simple thing to do is to make the rewards tie into the minimum team size. If the TF need 4 to start, you must have 4 to get rare drops. Make the missions scale to the TF minimum, instead of for a solo player. Leave it so that you can still complete the TF if under the minimum, just no rares will drop.
I think that would solve the problem.
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This strikes me as the most sensible option. TFs are not meant to be soloed even though many can be. Tie the rewards to a team being present for the last mission.
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Please leave Shivans alone. They are very useful to the squishier AT's in the game.
The simple thing to do is to make the rewards tie into the minimum team size. If the TF need 4 to start, you must have 4 to get rare drops. Make the missions scale to the TF minimum, instead of for a solo player. Leave it so that you can still complete the TF if under the minimum, just no rares will drop.
I think that would solve the problem.
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This strikes me as the most sensible option. TFs are not meant to be soloed even though many can be. Tie the rewards to a team being present for the last mission.
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I don't like this idea for 2 reasons:
1) Teammates might drop, or crash and not return; this seems unfair to the remaining teammates.
2) Based on my current understanding of how this will be implemented, I would *guess* this will be a pain to code.
But of course #2 is really just a supposition on my part; #1 is really my main objection.
- Protea
And for a while things were cold,
They were scared down in their holes
The forest that once was green
Was colored black by those killing machines
True, it's not an ideal solution and maybe it needs to be knocked around a bit to make it fair to all still on a TF. But I prefer it to nerfing Shivans, which I see as an issue that should be dealt with separately from Task Forces.
Or to put it another way, whatever the solution is, I'd prefer it apply to the TFs directly.
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I see no reason for blasting the OP for pointing out a possible exploit of the rare drop system. He does it because he wants it fixed, not to brag. A new economy is coming to the game and he has pointed out a potential exploit and yet everyone either wants him to hush up about it (which is silly since data mining can find out if it's rampant anyway) or they dismiss him as an anomaly. Trust me, even if this is anomaly, it won't be once I9 hits the servers as there will be a gold rush to get those rares to market before anyone else. Let's get this issue out in the open now and deal with it.
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Um, bull. He is doing it to brag about is uberness. It's obvious. Who cares if you can solo a TF? Can you solo a Mind/Rad? Meet me on test and show me, Ultimus. I'll bring a nice cookie for you and your soloing ability.
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Can you solo a Mind/Rad?
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nobody kin solo a mind/rad.
JFS
-The Legendary J-Man-
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I see no reason for blasting the OP for pointing out a possible exploit of the rare drop system. He does it because he wants it fixed, not to brag. A new economy is coming to the game and he has pointed out a potential exploit and yet everyone either wants him to hush up about it (which is silly since data mining can find out if it's rampant anyway) or they dismiss him as an anomaly. Trust me, even if this is anomaly, it won't be once I9 hits the servers as there will be a gold rush to get those rares to market before anyone else. Let's get this issue out in the open now and deal with it.
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Um, bull. He is doing it to brag about is uberness. It's obvious. Who cares if you can solo a TF? Can you solo a Mind/Rad? Meet me on test and show me, Ultimus. I'll bring a nice cookie for you and your soloing ability.
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Will you earn a recipe for soloing a mind/rad?
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Please leave Shivans alone. They are very useful to the squishier AT's in the game.
The simple thing to do is to make the rewards tie into the minimum team size. If the TF need 4 to start, you must have 4 to get rare drops. Make the missions scale to the TF minimum, instead of for a solo player. Leave it so that you can still complete the TF if under the minimum, just no rares will drop.
I think that would solve the problem.
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No, it doesn't, because you then are penalizing people who have had things happen to them - i.e. I have run TFs where we started with the minimum, then had people drop because we hit a rough spot.
Which means if they finish that TF, they are NOT getting the full reward.
Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
www.repeat-offenders.net
Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
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Please leave Shivans alone. They are very useful to the squishier AT's in the game.
The simple thing to do is to make the rewards tie into the minimum team size. If the TF need 4 to start, you must have 4 to get rare drops. Make the missions scale to the TF minimum, instead of for a solo player. Leave it so that you can still complete the TF if under the minimum, just no rares will drop.
I think that would solve the problem.
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No, it doesn't, because you then are penalizing people who have had things happen to them - i.e. I have run TFs where we started with the minimum, then had people drop because we hit a rough spot.
Which means if they finish that TF, they are NOT getting the full reward.
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A better solution would be to figure out a way for AVs to scale based on number of opponents -- this could even be a dynamic scaling thing.
Then you could make the minimum it would scale down to be for a team of 4, but a team of 8 wouldn't just be steamrolling AVs because they don't get much harder (Actually as it stands now, many duos can easily take out AVs as well). I am aware that a few AVs consistently give teams fits -- Infernal, etc. Since the AV scaling would have to be done per AV if it were going to be at all effective, these would be handled on a case by case basis.
Yes, it would be a lot of work. I think it would increase the end-game replayability and fun immensely though.
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Issue:
Certain characters are over-optimal with respect to soloing material designed to be difficult enough to challange a team.
Solution:
The primary/secondary combinations that can solo the team content will be adjusted down, until they can no longer do so.
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That is what we call a bad solution.
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Issue:
Certain characters are over-optimal with respect to soloing material designed to be difficult enough to challange a team.
Solution:
The primary/secondary combinations that can solo the team content will be adjusted down, until they can no longer do so.
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That is what we call a bad solution.
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But based on what we've seen in the past, it's the one that's most likely to happen unfortunately.
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Issue:
Certain characters are over-optimal with respect to soloing material designed to be difficult enough to challange a team.
Solution:
The primary/secondary combinations that can solo the team content will be adjusted down, until they can no longer do so.
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That is what we call a bad solution.
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But based on what we've seen in the past, it's the one that's most likely to happen unfortunately.
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It depends on what you call team content.
If you mean things like soloing spawns for multiple (as in four or more) people... that isn't the same as having peoples start a TF for you and soling it.
Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
www.repeat-offenders.net
Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
They may not be the same, but they're very similar in that they were designed with needing a team in mind... thus in terms of whatever nerf we're likely to see, they're similar enough.
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I can solo Trials and TFs in less then 30 mins
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Pfft.
Shenanigans.
Q. Just wondering Posi, where are the new dance emotes we were told would come with GR?
A. Positron: Whoops, my bad.
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