SG mode to determine base rent?
By
Accualt,
Posted on: 2005-08-22 09:50 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
So what about those of us who are in an SG that is big enough to have 5+ sub-SGs for Mains, Alts, etc?
Since there is nothing for us to do with 50s, we make alts and because SGs are limited to 75, we need to make a new SG for those members to be apart of.
So while we aren't playing our "Mains" from the original SG as much, we will be seen as inactive and not gain any prestiege?
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If this is a confirmation that you must be in SG Mode to earn prestige, let me add my voice to those saying "That sucks"
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Something new, to be added to the game, and GadgetDon hates it. Wow, who would have thought.......
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I don't consider it great. Why?
There is a 75 character limit in a SG. That means there is:
Legion of Freedom (limit one player, for mains)
The Legion of Freedom (limit one player, for mains, overflow)
Legion of Freedom - HotC (for 50's)
Legion of Freedom - Reserves (alts)
Legion of Freedom - SpecOps (themed)
You'll notice that the first 3 are for current mains. Until they increase the amount of toons you can have in a single SG, then this system that is being talked of sucks hairy monkey nuts. All members should have access to SG items that are being purchased in the game, SG bases not being a currency sink means that enhancements will rise to compensate (hurting the newer players), and my personal favorite...it's another in a long line of ham fisted attempts to encourage players to do something they don't want to; whether that be because it's unfun, or just a stupid schtick. The developers can't seem to make SG mode remotely appealing by any other means, and while it may seem novel at first, the wider vision of this craptastic idea isn't hard to grasp.
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You have 5 SGs worth of alts and characters that are regularly played. You'll be getting 5 various bases. A full 75 main SG is as big as they can get. You'll be at the top end of what a SG can get in Bases by design. You don't know what that top end is but you already want more than that.
Your argument about influence is confusing. On the one hand you complain that influence is useless now and then on the other hand you complain that this will mean raising the price of enhancements. Influence is not part of an economy. It IS useless after a certain level. How is that a bad thing? Are you asking them to put in some hamfisted method of forcing us to spend Influence and farm it? There is no reason to believe that they are going to increase the cost of enhancements. This is wild speculation used to fuel doom-mongers.
You say they are hamfistedly trying to encourage you to do something that you don't want to. If they said SG colours gave you 10% bonus xp or damage, you'd be in SG colours in a shot. People are whining that they have to wear SG colours now and don't get more uber because of it.
This approach gives us a great option: We either look cool and play the non-conformist rogue or we look less cool and help our team get its base. Its a roleplaying/fluff solution and that's commendable. We have enough powergaming/farming solutions to problems.
There ought to be an incentive to wear those less cool SG uniforms and it should be one that is all about fluff and SG bases are, IMO, all about fluff.
Out of interest, does ANYONE think datamining this is a good idea?
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Out of interest, does ANYONE think datamining this is a good idea?
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Doesn't bother me in the slightest.
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As to my comment that is so insulting, it wasn't me who said it originally. It is what is said almost everytime a dev speaks nowadays because...it actually is. I mean, just when you think they've mined the farthest depths of ignorance, they find another vein. All I've done is make the observation that it's a widespread comment, expectation, and undeniable truth.
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Oh, Puh-LEEZ! So if I kick your dog, and you say "don't kick my dog!" I can say "Well, THAT guy kicked your dog, so I figured it was OK." And that makes it so?
You shoot your mouth off, and then hide behind the spectre of "someone" you're quoting? Again I say, Puh-LEEZ. If I were a dev making this decision, and had only your comments by which to judge the validity of the decision, the LAST thing I would want to do is appease you given that attitude. Actually, I'd say "all players have to dress as Heidi to get a base."
Oh, and here's another that's been said before: "I had no idea how much fun I wasn't having 'til I read the forums".
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Check... and Mate (poster) - Arc ID# 15095 (comments)
Invasion on Earth BX1132! (poster 1) - (poster 2) - Arc ID# 98943 (comments)
Global @ARH
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Just because you're in SG mode doesn't mean you automatically get Prestige. You still have to do things.
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A question about this and the upcoming datamine. What if a hero has changed SG's? Since the hero has to 'do things' to earn the Prestige, is it tied to the hero or the SG? In other words, if a player left a SG for another, would that Prestige go with the player (both before datamine, and after)?
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Just because you're in SG mode doesn't mean you automatically get Prestige. You still have to do things.
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This sounds like a confirmation.
Wow, does this suck. I team almost exclusively with my SG (I mean like, 99.9% of the lifespan of my characters), and you know what? We have hideous (to all but a couple people) SG colors, which can't be changed, and a mostly inappropriate symbol for lots of our characters.
I ask you this: Do the Justice League or the Avengers ever replace their chest symbols?
I love my SG, I wouldn't leave it for the Freedom Phalanx themselves, but putting our SG symbol on the chest of any of my characters is like putting a happy face on Batman's chest, and the chest symbol ain't optional in SG mode.
Please try my custom mission arcs!
Legacy of a Rogue (ID 459586, Entry for Dr. Aeon's Third Challenge)
Death for Dollars! (ID 1050)
Dr. Duplicate's Dastardly Dare (ID 1218)
Win the Past, Own the Future (ID 1429)
I am getting more and more frustrated with the game I love every day. This is just another example of why. I don't even feel like getting into the particulars of why I think this is a horrible idea, others have covered most of the reasons already.
/e shakes head in disbelief
The Legion of Freedom
Hmm. Here's a question:
If being in SG mode and Doing Things earns you Prestige, then what the hell is the point of ever being OUT of SG mode?
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Out of interest, does ANYONE think datamining this is a good idea?
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I would not object to data-mining if they gave us a date from which to start wearing our colors, and then data-mined back to that point.
Example: Let us know that when Bases are added, they will data-mine back to Septemeber 15th, 2005. So that when the 15th comes around, we can decide whether or not to start wearing our colors more often.
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Out of interest, does ANYONE think datamining this is a good idea?
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This leads back to the informal poll I tried to run on this topic. For all the ranting and gnashing of teeth, I believe this all boils down to a fundamental issue:
Some people want their complete uber base on the first day they are available. Their main complaint about this system really is that it means that they are losing out any advantage they thought they had in dropping a base on day one.
Some people want bases to be something that they build over time. These people will cheerfully, I think, start with a clean slate and embrace the idea of making a point of wearing Supergroup colours (yes, colours not just logos) when they adventure in a concious decision to either look different or look uniform. Building a base and what your costumes look like because of this becomes a mini-game.
Still. When it comes down between a base or no base, you'll all click the SG Mode button. 
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I would not object to data-mining if they gave us a date from which to start wearing our colors, and then data-mined back to that point.
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Same here. I'd be all over that.
Otherwise, it's like giving you a special present if you've been wearing a cape. Informed choices are what we need, always.
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Hmm. Here's a question:
If being in SG mode and Doing Things earns you Prestige, then what the hell is the point of ever being OUT of SG mode?
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Aesthetics. This is going to be a very tough decision for me on most of my characters and there'll be times when I say 'To Hell with the Base' and put on my old comfortable fighting tights.
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Still. When it comes down between a base or no base, you'll all click the SG Mode button.
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If Sanction decides we don't need a SG Base, we won't click the SG Mode Button.
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Aesthetics. This is going to be a very tough decision for me on most of my characters and there'll be times when I say 'To Hell with the Base' and put on my old comfortable fighting tights.
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Okay, I get that, but it seems like a massively wacky approach. If your COSTUME and your AESTHETICS allow it, you can earn Prestige all the time, because you never need to turn SG mode off. If not, you won't.
Why not have a much more concrete limitation to define SG mode? Award only half influence for enemies defeated and tasks accomplished, but add Prestige to the SG fund. That's much more of a mode in the mechanical sense than changing the colour of your socks and having an emblem stuck on your chest.
If you are proud of your SG then you should wear your SG colours. Period. Make a costume slot specifically for this so when you are in SG mode(should be most of the time), it looks nice.
Have some heart people, represent your SG !
My SG mates are actively encouraged to wear SG colours any time they are grouped together or recruiting or doing any SG-related tasks.
UNITY !!!
I for one think if this idea does indeed go into action, as a benchmark for your SG base, that I will not even consider getting a base for my SG. If it is going to rely on datamining something that we as a player base were not even aware we should have been doing then I don't even want a part of it.
Lone S.T.A.R. hasn't used the archaic SG costume toggle since the new costume slots were implemented and we dedicated a slot for our SG costume that way. There is absolutely no functionality in the SG screen. Colors? Can't change them! Chest Emblem? Can't change that either!
The SG screen was used quite a bit before the extra costume slots were opened up but I can't even remember the last time I had any characrter of mine in the SG screen it has been so long.
If this indeed goes in and is datamined I see no point in even using it. To throw this "prestige" junk at us and change the entire direction of how we have been told for months the bases would be instituted is purely bad form.
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Still. When it comes down between a base or no base, you'll all click the SG Mode button.
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Not me, hell this is making me want to use super group colors less than I already do. Its not like bases are going to do anything all that spectacular unless you are into raiding...
We don't know that what you suggest won't be happening.
If it were me, I'd say you got no influence when in SG mode but instead it all went into the SG fund as prestige.
Then I'd make it so that one of the things that a base can offer is to give non-sellable enhancements to its members for free (with some limiters). That way the lower level characters can get a benefit from being in a SG and can pay the SG back by wearing team colours. or something
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We don't know that what you suggest won't be happening.
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Well, we DO know that if that were implemented it couldn't be datamined fairly, because people have been happily earning full Inf while in SG mode since day one.
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If this is a confirmation that you must be in SG Mode to earn prestige, let me add my voice to those saying "That sucks"
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Something new, to be added to the game, and GadgetDon hates it. Wow, who would have thought.......
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Specifically...the SuperGroups I've been in NEVER use supergroup mode. Even the special supergroup I'm in where they have similar uniforms and team together for missions don't use supergroup mode. And as others have set forth, there are issues with big supergroups.
Now, from what was seen in prestige points that snuck into the beta briefly, that does look cool. Basically, it seems to be doing something above and beyond the call that puts you at risk. I'll reserve judgement until I see exactly what gets prestige, but it is promising.
I think there still should be some use of influence in there. Say, prestige for the base rent and very powerful hardware, influence for eye candy and maybe minor hardware.
Datamining, as others have explained, is because it isn't measuring accomplishments, it's doing something that has had no known benefit and does have the downside of removing the choice of chest decal (and for costumes that just don't fit with a chest decal forces one on it).
A couple of options that, IMHO, wouldn't suck...
(1) Change SuperGroup mode. Give the leader more choices about what costume is required, from "no changes required" to essentially an additional costume slot. SuperGroup mode lessens influence earned (from missions, defeating villains, glowies, etc., but not selling enhancement drops).
(2) Untie Prestige from Supergroup mode. Instead, tie it to teaming with other supergroup members. The prestige points you earn are multiplied by the number of supergroup mates in the same team with you. So, if you're lone wolfing or teaming with random heroes, you get the base prestige. If you're on a full team of people from your supergroup, then you get eight times as much.
And as others have mentioned, there is a concern about SGs that split into separate subgroups because of the limit. Allow supergroups to form an Alliance. A supergroup can only be in one alliance. They can combine for a base. Good solution for SGs that had to split. And if completely unrelated SGs choose to team up that way...that's a good thing.
There are many new things I like. If you check the Suggestions forum you'll see my suggestions there on a semi-regular basis.
But just tying prestige to being in SG mode as it exists now, yeah. It sucks.
My arcs are constantly shifting, just search for GadgetDon for the latest.
The world beware! I've started a blog
GadgetMania Under Attack: The Digg Lockout
Ok, let me see if I can boil this down.
Reasons this idea 'sucks':
- People have been saving up influence, and now have millions, even hundreds of millions, with nothing to spend it on.
- Datamining would be hugely unfair, because there's never been the slightest mention there would ever be a concrete advantage to being in SG mode.
- SG Mode is often quite ugly, even the SGs that use it often use an entirely seperate costume slot for a uniform.
- Switching alts between SGs (which happens often in larger SGs that have a 1-alt-only policy) could possibly mean wiping out the prestige they've built up (depends on if this is stored by the character or the SG).
Reasons this idea 'is great':
- Uhhhh...SGs made of completely broke level tens will be able to afford better HQs than some major 75-player SGs.
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Just because you're in SG mode doesn't mean you automatically get Prestige. You still have to do things.
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So if I enter SG mode with some other members of my SG, I then break out the boombox and dance a jig for 12 hours, I get prestige for "doing something?" BRILLIANT! You sir, are SUPER DESIGNER!
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You know that half full glass in front of you? Its not actually empty.
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Don't you mean, "You know that half full glass in front of you? It's not actually half empty." What you said was a classic non-sequitur. But I understand what you were trying to say - it's adorable, btw.