plans from a parallel dimension -- Bases 2.0
By
Acroyear2,
Posted on: 2012-08-06 10:51 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Da'Frick did I just read?
<.<
>.>
Is this a leak? In which case, someone is in trouble. Or is this Nerd-ERP? O.o
Level 53: Arrows/Devices/Munitions Blaster
....and hopeless Science-Natzi.
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Me thinks this. (the date seems rather suspect even)
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Originally Posted by Mr_True_Shot
Or is this Nerd-ERP? O.o
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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Methinks this belongs in suggestions.
Open Archetype Suggestion thread!, Kirsten's Epic Weapon Pools, Feudal Japan, Etc., Alignment specific Rularuu iTrials!
If Masterminds didn't suck, they'd be the most powerful AT in the game.
That's some interesting speculation there!
:-)
~Freitag
Kevin Callanan
Community Specialist
Paragon Studios
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If there's any ounce of truth to that "speculation," I'll tell you now it's time to advertise another "CoH subscription" deal. I'll gladly pay a full year's subscription now just to ensure this proposal comes to fruition in 2013 (or sooner if the document's original source date is true).|
Originally Posted by Freitag
That's some interesting speculation there!
:-) ~Freitag |
GLADLY...
The one thing I think should be done is to divorce bases for PVP and raid from the current bases entirely. The current bases should remain as "player housing" and not much more.
Bases for raiding PVP should basically be a predefined map. You get a set of maps to choose from, you can customize them a bit (place defenses) and then you're good to go. No messing around lots of fiddly details that in the end don't matter.
This allows much more expressive bases too. If I'm a villain, I want my base to be IN ROGUES ISLES. Not just a bunch of square boxes underground. Heroes should start outside in Nerva or Port Oaks, break in, and eventually raid the central computer or power system or even the super doomsday machine.
Ditto for Heroes. Bases should be in Paragon City and look like they're in Paragon City.
And this would also allow maps to be more "fair." Home build raiding bases aren't really that interesting. PvP maps, all of them including bases, need a professional designer and some review process because otherwise you get stuff that looks like it was built by, well, a player. 
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Yeah, I think it's time to move ahead with this. Base raiding can't be fixed as it currently stands, not with the current base builder software. There's no point in retaining any appearance of this ever coming back, so just seal off those mechanics and leave the pieces as pure decoration. We haven't had base raids in several years, so it's not like we're missing out on anything at this point.|
Originally Posted by gameboy1234
The one thing I think should be done is to divorce bases for PVP and raid from the current bases entirely. The current bases should remain as "player housing" and not much more.
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If we ever get new base building tools, that would be wonderful, and I'd gladly buy at least $50 or $100 worth of something to help finance more base love. Having the ability to flesh out our characters' bases (and homes, for some of them) provides an outlet for creativity that's hard to find elsewhere ingame, and I really enjoy spending time creating bases, like many players do as well. Hopefully we will something in the future, whether it's just a few new items or a torrent of base building goodies; either way, it's adding to a part of the game that many of us love.
*reads the post.
*reads the comments.
*reads Freitag's comment.
*reads more comments.
Data insufficient for a reasonable conclusion. Where's our danged Bio Armor at?
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Considering that I've "cornered" Dark Watcher (and other programmers) for conversations on the topic of a completely revamped (and thus, supportable!) base editor at the last two Player Summits ... and will be again at the next one I attend ... I'd like to think that such speculation is not exactly idle. After all ... anything the Devs can build now for Base Editing has a very obvious application in being able to do Map Editing for Mission Architect *AND* could potentially be used as a tool to expand the available list of Indoor Maps used for regular missions (see SSA 1.5 for an example of this already in action).
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Originally Posted by Freitag
That's some interesting speculation there!
:-) ~Freitag |
It's the end. But the moment has been prepared for ...
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I definitely like this suggestion. It certainly makes sense to use a quasi-predefined map for raiding (RP explanation: Different section of base, or even a different, more 'secure' base), letting the players choose a variety of defenses as well as having spots to put them.|
Originally Posted by gameboy1234
[snip]
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Draw lots of inspiration from the Tower Defense games, and basically having a path (that can't be built upon), but leaving space around it for defenses. This would also allow the possibility of having NPC invasions, where you basically have a stream of them trying to break into your base, having to depend on a combination of your defenses and SG players to hold them off / do something.
There could be a few classes of items that could be built, including offensive turrets (wall turrets, big ones on the ground / ceiling, etc), defensive systems like 'shields' that block (a 'force field' that could be destroyed) / slow down (repel / knockback / slow field) / weaken enemies (any other debuffs). Each map would also have a maximum amount of placeable items (different items hit the quota a different amount).
Seems like it shouldn't be too insanely difficult to come up with a system that'd work fairly well for both NPC and player invasions. Hell, it could be recycled for player invasions of NPC bases as well (Mission Architect, baby!
).Based on everything the Devs have said, I think the OP's assumptions (/source/whatever) are true, and that really the only way to 'fix' bases is to create a new system from scratch (that the old bases could be migrated to). Although, 2 engineers taking 6 months is probably on the conservative side of things (fragile systems like the base system is often have very convoluted data formats that have tons of oddities).
Until a red name comes out and basically says any of this is what's happening (or we get a reliable leak
), I think it's best to not start counting your chickens, and just continue on as if it's not going to happen.Edit: Redlynne scooped me on the MA part! The fact that it could potentially be recycled for multiple things is probably the biggest pro to the whole thing.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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I'm from Missouri
One man's terrorist is another man's freedom (or freem?) fighter; just as one man's exploit is another man's feature.
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Show me!
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Originally Posted by Fire_Away
I'm from Missouri
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My postings to this forum are not to be used as data in any research study without my express written consent.
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Ha!! I get it!
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Originally Posted by Draugadan
Show me!
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Open Archetype Suggestion thread!, Kirsten's Epic Weapon Pools, Feudal Japan, Etc., Alignment specific Rularuu iTrials!
If Masterminds didn't suck, they'd be the most powerful AT in the game.
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I like this idea. Someone make it so. ;] Also the holding room idea for base editing is good.
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Originally Posted by gameboy1234
The one thing I think should be done is to divorce bases for PVP and raid from the current bases entirely. The current bases should remain as "player housing" and not much more.
Bases for raiding PVP should basically be a predefined map. You get a set of maps to choose from, you can customize them a bit (place defenses) and then you're good to go. No messing around lots of fiddly details that in the end don't matter. This allows much more expressive bases too. If I'm a villain, I want my base to be IN ROGUES ISLES. Not just a bunch of square boxes underground. Heroes should start outside in Nerva or Port Oaks, break in, and eventually raid the central computer or power system or even the super doomsday machine. Ditto for Heroes. Bases should be in Paragon City and look like they're in Paragon City. And this would also allow maps to be more "fair." Home build raiding bases aren't really that interesting. PvP maps, all of them including bases, need a professional designer and some review process because otherwise you get stuff that looks like it was built by, well, a player. |
We can only hope the Devs are secretly working on an updated version of Bases for our heroes and villains.
Founder/Leader of the JUSTICE F0RCE
http://JusticeForce.guildportal.com
*cries*
Why couldn't THIS be in I24?!
Ohhh, the pain! The pain!
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| Da'Frick did I just read? |
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| The document below was obtained by a Portal Corps researcher, from Dimension PQ53-874a |
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Originally Posted by gameboy1234
The one thing I think should be done is to divorce bases for PVP and raid from the current bases entirely. ..
Bases for raiding PVP should basically be a predefined map. You get a set of maps to choose from, you can customize them a bit (place defenses) and then you're good to go. No messing around lots of fiddly details that in the end don't matter. |
I always thought the hard-wiring of bases to PVP was... F--wonky.
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Originally Posted by Redlynne
Considering that I've "cornered" Dark Watcher (and other programmers) for conversations on the topic of a completely revamped (and thus, supportable!) base editor at the last two Player Summits ... and will be again at the next one I attend ... I'd like to think that such speculation is not exactly idle. After all ... anything the Devs can build now for Base Editing has a very obvious application in being able to do Map Editing for Mission Architect *AND* could potentially be used as a tool to expand the available list of Indoor Maps used for regular missions (see SSA 1.5 for an example of this already in action).
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Originally Posted by Draugadan
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Originally Posted by Acroyear2
We can only hope the Devs are secretly working on an updated version of Bases for our heroes and villains.
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Don�t say things. What you are stands over you the while, and thunders so that I cannot hear what you say to the contrary. - R.W. Emerson |
YUMMY Low-Hanging Fruit for BASE LUV
I would be darn happy if we simply got pre-made "base themes" with spaces to hold trophies and storage.
Like a large cavern, a techy lab, an arcane temple, etc.
I would be satisfied with being able to email Super Group invites so you can invite your own characters without having to bribe players to join just to do invites or convincing someone to drop their SG, join yours do invites then get a join back into their own again.
For those of us who like creating characters this is very annoying.
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You can't please everyone, so lets concentrate on me.
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Simple 5 step solution. 1) get free account (B). 2) Create new character (Account B) 3) Invite character on account B to SG with character from (Account A), promote as high as you want. 4) Anytime you create a new character (Account A) log into character from (Account B) and invite/promote your alt (Account A). 5) Enjoy
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Originally Posted by Ultra_Violence
I would be satisfied with being able to email Super Group invites so you can invite your own characters without having to bribe players to join just to do invites or convincing someone to drop their SG, join yours do invites then get a join back into their own again.
For those of us who like creating characters this is very annoying. |
I'd leave bases as a legacy system, functional, editable etc and make a new system with better shiney to encourage people to migrate.
So no downside for those invested in bases, but opening up something that can be worked on.
I don't suffer from altitis, I enjoy every minute of it.
Thank you Devs & Community people for a great game.
So sad to be ending ):
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Yes, yes, yes...|
Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
Draw lots of inspiration from the Tower Defense games, and basically having a path (that can't be built upon), but leaving space around it for defenses. This would also allow the possibility of having NPC invasions, where you basically have a stream of them trying to break into your base, having to depend on a combination of your defenses and SG players to hold them off / do something.
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I would love to be a part of this and most likely to join a large super group instead of making solo SGs like I do now. Defending your home(from a PvE invasion) where much time and resources were dedicated and preparing for the next attack by gathering resources or building sounds like a good reason for a bunch of people to stay together long term. And if elements from a Tower defense like mobile game can make it in, so much the better. I had many hours of fun playing those.
And best of all for PS/NCSoft, it could open up many more items for sale on the market.
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Heh, I remember the days when an indefinite red name comment on bases like this would generate dozens of speculation posts on what's coming.|
Originally Posted by Freitag
That's some interesting speculation there!
:-) ~Freitag |
Now we have this one from the former head base cheerleader:
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Originally Posted by Impish Kat
I wish I could hold onto this hope.... but I just can't anymore.
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. Show Me.
One man's terrorist is another man's freedom (or freem?) fighter; just as one man's exploit is another man's feature.
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I swear to Christ, Freitag, if you're messing with my mind there will be blood.|
Originally Posted by Freitag
That's some interesting speculation there!
:-) ~Freitag |
Said blood will probably be mine, on the wall, where my head impacts, but THERE WILL STILL BE BLOOD!
The off-beat space pirate...Capt. Stormrider (50+3 Elec/Storm Science Corruptor)
The mysterious Djinn...Emerald Dervish (50+1 DB/DA Magic Stalker)
The psychotic inventor...Dollmaster (50 Bot/FF Tech Mastermind)
Virtue Forever.
The document below was obtained by a Portal Corps researcher, from Dimension PQ53-874a. It seems to show plans to upgrade an eerie game version of our world.
= - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - =
City of Heroes Freedom
Software Development Overview for Bases 2.0
6 August 2011
Goal
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Rewrite the software for bases so that it is properly documented, maintainable, and extensible.
Scope
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The software for supergoup and villaingroup bases shall be rewritten from scratch. It was originally designed by a new team as part of the City of Villains release. The team was talented but under heavy time pressure to get the system implemented. They were not only building the base infrastructure itself, but the associated systems of base raids, Cathedral of Pain Trial, and Items of Power. The result is legacy software which is complex, poorly documented, and generally considered "read only" by the current development team.
The new design will be developed from scratch. Version 2.0 will concern itself with only bases, but extensibly designed so that systems such as base raids and functioning Items of Power can be naturally added at a later date.
"Clean-Room Design"
===================
The current software will be available for reference, but it will be replaced, not "fixed". The data files defining how bases appear will be retained, however. It may be useful and/or necessary to modify these files. Any modifications must be accompanied by a scriptable conversion routine to transform the current files into the new format. A 2.0 base must appear to players just as their 1.0 base did. They may of course edit their base, but the upgrade itself should not affect the look and feel of pre-existing bases. Hence:
* artwork for base items will be maintained
* geometry of base items will be maintained so that adjacent items function as they do now
* data files will be maintained, though likely upgraded
* existing code will go away
Features
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This effort is not undertaken to add new features, or change the way bases work from a player perspective. However, two features will be added and the functionality of one base system will be extended.
* players will be able to undo, save, and restore their base edits
* during editing, a hold-all room will exist for temporary storage of any item or base room
* Empowerment Stations will offer enhanced buffs and powers that players will actually use
Undo/Save/Restore
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For whatever reason, this basic editing paradigm is unavailable to a player editing their 1.0 base. A player will be able to save his current valid base design to a local disk file, and restore a saved design from the disk file. Undo will be of limited scope. When a player enters base-edit mode, their base design will be temporarily saved on the server. When done editing, the interface will allow an Accept or Abandon, with the Abandon button causing the "undo" state to be restored. Levels of undo will often be indirectly available during edit, as any valid base structure can be saved locally or restored at any time.
Hold-All Room
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A player editing his base will have access to a hold-all room. It will be a drop area for any items and/or existing rooms with items already placed. Editing mode may not be completed until the Hold-All Room has been emptied.
Empowerment Stations
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See plans from another dimension -- Empowerment Stations
Deviations
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A player entering his 2.0 base should not notice any difference to how their base appeared under 1.0. Anything they could do editing their 1.0 base must still be doable to their 2.0 base. Any deviations to this principle must be individually approved by agreement of the project lead, the CoH lead designer, and the CoH producer.
Manpower
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We provisionally estimate that it will take two engineers six months to implement this change, with 70% of their time allocated to the project.
-- Rich
* Thresholds CoH: What to do When
* My Comics Collection