skippable dark/dark powers?

I know it's early....but...
Any powers that I should skip on a dark/dark controller?
I'll soon be up to a level where I dont want to reroll or respec.

Remember that in addition to respecs, you've got Build 2 and eventually Build 3 as another way to "fix" your build.

For both, it totally depends on your playstyle. In Dark Control, some people don't like the stun because it requires you to be in melee range - others LIVE in melee range and love it. Possess is likely unimpressive in groups, unless you're good at targeting it at a critical foe in a large group. But solo, Possess can be awesome, since it doesn't aggro and can let you whittle down tough groups before jumping in. Those are just some examples.

In Dark Affinity, Black Hole is probably the one completely skippable power. Fade and Soul Absorption are currently somewhat weak, but are probably going to be fixed in an upcoming patch (red names have already stated how they'll fix those powers, it just didn't make it through testing yet). All the others are very useful but, again, may depend on your playstyle.

From the looks of it the only really skipable powers are the st immob, black hole and the stun in dark control since howling twilight is far more potent AND autohit. Its a really tight pair with very little wiggle room.

Howling Twilight is only magnificence 2 stun. It's a good power, but it won't stop lieutenants. And I use the immobilize for single-target damage while leveling. (Though it can be replaced by an ancillary pool blast later on.)

In the end, most of the powers have their uses one way or another, depending on playstyle. Black Hole is definitely the most marginal power, though.

Yeah. No. Don't skip the ST Immobilize. That's your opener to not be useless on Bosses/AV's.

The AoE Immobilize can be respecced out of later if you NEED an open slot.

The AoE Hold in Dark Control is skippable garbage.

Haunt is alright. Depends on your secondary.

I wouldn't skip anything else in Darkness Control.

As for Darkness Affinity? Fade is garbage right now until it's update. Soul Absorption is garbage until it's update. Black Hole is garbage period.

When Fade and Soul Absorption are updated, Fade is a great power and Soul Absorption is possibly skippable but it's serviceable.

So, TL;DR - Skip Black Hole and Shadow Field or whatever the AoE Hold is, because it sucks.

You may choose to drop the AoE Immobilize (Because Heart of Darkness sets up your AoE Containment anyway), or keep it for AoE Damage. I'd keep it, really.

You can drop Haunt if your secondary isn't heavy debuffing or damage buffing, as Haunt is pretty lackluster but it has a bit of a purpose on Controllers for doing SOME damage.

I don't get the AOE hold is skippable garbage. Wow....

I don't plan to skip anything other than Black Hole and the single target Immob. The single target Immob can be used as a damage power, but if you plan to mostly team, it is skippable.

I would not skip the AoE Immob. Darkest Night + AoE Immob is almost like an AoE hold, since the foes can't move and can't hit you.

I also would not skip the AoE stun, since the stun will stack with the stun in Howling Twilight. A mag 3 stun (with a 20% chance to add an extra mag) can stack with a Mag 2 Stun to get bosses.

Dark/Dark seems to have a lot of powers that will combine to provide an overall effective control. Just remember that while a power by itself may be unimpressive, it can be more effective in combination with other powers. I plan on trying everthing other than Black Hole. (I've tried Black Hole on both my Dark/Elec Defender and my Thugs/Dark MM, hated it both times.)

I like this reppu guy.....

I believe a controller should never skip the ST immobilize either since it does decent damage, is very spammable, sets up containment and keeps pesky hard targets where you want them(gm's not included). I think a dominator OTOH can skip the ST for more damage from their secondary.

I'm also a firm believer in slotting damage in the ST hold. I can't count all of the builds I've seen posted with zero damage slotted. I'm a fan of slotting 5 unbreakable constraints(one of those being the damage proc) and one damage IO.

I'd say a tight build with lots of desirable powers in both the primary and secondary warrants enough reason to skip the single target immobilize.

When it comes down to it, if you're weighing the value of the single target immobilize vs. the AoE immobilize, the AoE wins out. It's going to be more useful in more content; it sets containment when HoD isn't available, it's a stackable AoE debuff, and it's your primary source of AoE damage until APPs. There's a lot of proc potential in the AoE immobilize and any spamnable AoE becomes much better with the inclusion of Interface powers. The single target immobilizes are good for damage, better DPE than the single target blasts from APPs in some cases. However, AVs are minority of enemies that you will fight and, unless you specifically seek them out, are going to be faced with a team.

Shadow Field is good for an AoE hold due to its persistence and debuffs, but it gets hit with a 4 minute recharge. I personally don't skip the AoE holds often, but I think the case can be made especially in high recharge builds or in the presence of other control methods. I skipped Paralytic Blast on my elec/time, for instance, because of already having ample control with Static Field, Synaptic Overload, and endurance drain. I think Dark/dark may present a similar case. However, I'm staying any judgment until I've had the opportunity to experiment with it more. I am considering the proc potential that it shares with Distortion Field from Time. However, that long recharge prevents multiple patches like Distortion Fied.

Soul Absorption might be skippable. We'll have to wait until the changes come through to know for sure. If it's a worthwhile team buff I'll take it. If not the APPs/PPPs offer a variety of other endurance management powers.

Geez guys, bring it down a level, when it is all said and done, almost none of you guys even play the same way. Some of you guys are known for your AV soloing, other, pure teaming.

When it is all said and done, let the build fit the player that is all that really matters when it is all said and done.

Myself personally I will more then likely skip black hole and try to keep the other stuff, but heck I got like what 2 (or 3) builds to play with, I think there is room to play around with.

As for the single Immbo, I used to not take mines at first for the longest, but that came form playing in the days before containment, and people seemed to only want you on the team for your secondary...man how things have changed huh? Now I pick mines up not only for setting up containment but to keep bosses/AVs in place while debuffing them.

With that said if someone wants to no pick up their ST Immob that is on them, no skin off my back nor am I mad at them, heck I am too busy locking down, debuffing, and healing to even really care!

Wow. I am about to make use of my ignore list for the first time. Unreal.

Anway, for me, the only skippable powers are Black Hole, and possibly the single target immob, depending on your preferences. I will also consider the pbaoe defense and the end drain powers skippable until they get their promised buffs.

Lewis

All of this arguing for the ST immob assumes I want to bash my head against AVs all day. Sorry, but I'm not speccing into an immob that I use in a fraction of the content; you'll just have to be happy with the -regen I can provide. Yes, controllers can (and should) deal damage when they get the chance. But I've never come across a situation where that damage was the tipping point.

And against bosses? I'd rather spend that time stacking holds. Maybe the first hold will even overpower.

wow I'm having flashbacks to a thread in the Tanker forum where someone claimed TANKS are primarily damage dealers and have been since I1.. Controllers are IMHO more support based than Defenders.. We don't get a blasty damage set (even a neutered one) hell my main controller is Earth/Emp.. I lock things down (even Rommy permanently durring the fight) and off heal when necessary.. unless my pet rock is out I don't really out damage even a Defender and they heal better..
On my Dark/Dark that I've started it's a huge toolbox of control so no Controllers aren't damage dealers and if you're wasting slots on anything but the pet trying to make us into one try a Blaster or Dommy..
Reppu you said you were surprised by Local's response that the ST imob is skippable? the ST Imob is the first thing that gets thrown out when power choices gets tight.. It's been that way for a long time..
Get down off that high horse and realize what Controllers are built to do.. CONTROL combat NOT DAMAGE!

p.s. @Uni, there's an ignore list on the forums? >.> where

Now people are just getting silly. As if controller powers do no damage at all.

Sure, slotting them for damage is a silly idea, but extra damage is still damage as long as the controller/defender in question is still buffing, debuffing and all that stuff.

::shrug::

Personally I solo quite a bit, sometimes I solo more than teaming sometimes the other way around. While soloing I find the ST Immob to be invaluable, it's far more end efficient than the vet attacks, and can be slotted to be quite useful. It's a decent attack with an excellent side benefit.

Late in the build I'll generally respec out of it and replace it with a APP/PPP ST blast, but on the way up I generally take it.

On Dark/DAff I had more important things to get till 10 or 12, but I still picked up the ST Immob to help (a lot) with taking down bosses/LT's when solo.

That said, depending on the build/playstyle driven priorities it can certainly *be* skippable.

Black Hole on the other hand, is a hands down and walking away kind of skippable.

Arg

Argentae,

Some individuals find the single target immob to be skippable, some dont. But people got irritated when someone suggested that it was flat out a mistake and a bad advice for any controller to ever skip it.

I myself took it on one of my dark controllers, and skipped it on the other two. Therefore, I consider it skippable. YMMV.

Lewis