Discussion: Featured Items at the Paragon Market - 2/21/12
By
Agent White,
Posted on: 2012-02-21 10:42 in News, Events and Announcement Discussion
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I bought going rogue.|
Originally Posted by Ghost Falcon
I guess it wasn't enough to just give away the Going Rogue Expansion features away as a benefit for VIP subscription and allow just any subscriber to change their alignment for free.
I guess we're also morally bankrupt to give away free server transfers a month for free to VIP subscribers, too. And for anyone that never purchased the Going Rogue expansion or let their subscription lapse, we're apparently lower than dirt to charge a $10 "service" fee to change a character's alignment that a non-paying customer spent time on.... C'mon folks. *This is not profiteering on the backs of VIPs. ALL VIP subscribers and any customer that purchased the Going Rogue expansion have a FREE option to EASILY and FREELY change their character's alignment. Come at me with the pitchforks, but really? *Are you not seeing the reasons for introducing this service? Non VIP customers can now change their character's alignment to try the content on the other side without deleting thir character and grinding up to a power level where they were before (if they got up to level 20). * VIP customers get 400 points every month that they can apply to this 800 point service...., or as I pointed out earlier, VIP customers can change their alignment for FREE using the in-game system. If you want to provide more constructive feedback like "this is a great feature that i would rather get free per month as part of my VIP membership than server transfers or 400 points per month" then we're all ears. |
The server transfers VIPs get aren't 'free', it's part of the VIP package that we pay for.
I can understand you trying to profit from your game, obviously, but your prices are ridiculous. Two months of paid for points and I can change the alignment of one of my characters... wow.
My feedback would be, why don't you offer the same services for less for VIP customers, you know, the people who have been supporting your game from the beginning and continue to show loyalty by paying monthly fees? Or how about letting VIP customers cash in their 'free' stuff like the server transfers for points that they can spend on something else?
Come at me with a pitchfork, but really? You charge 800 pts for one alignment shift and you're surprised you're getting some complaints? And this is profiteering on the backs of VIPs, because that's the majority of your paying customers, because they're the players that have the most invested in this game.
I wouldn't call what you're doing 'morally bankrupt', but it could be bad for business long term, but then maybe (probably) you guys aren't thinking that way.
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...now, if we could just get you to take your own advice :P
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Just keep it below the level of stupidity that calls something added to a superhero video game "morally bankrupt"
 Don't swear, don't be aggressive, don't be sarcastic, and keep everything in perspective. |
Ignoring anyone is a mistake. You might miss something viral to your cause.
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Spot on mate.
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Originally Posted by MrHassenpheffer
...now, if we could just get you to take your own advice :P
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The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
I'm not trying to start a fight here. I actually agree with some of what she and others have said about giving more options. that's a really good idea and one I can get behind.
That being said, One thing that grates my nerves to no end is when some bully finds it necessary for whatever reason to get up on that skyscraper of a high horse, start pointing fingers at anything that that has a different opinion, and lets loose with the insults and name callings as if he/she were raised to think it's okay to do so to random strangers.
Not cool.
Ignoring anyone is a mistake. You might miss something viral to your cause.
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On a scale from one to ten, where five is what the current level of commentary likely deserves and eight is what I'd personally be leveling if I was a dev, Ghost Falcon's post scores a zero.
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Originally Posted by Crysys
Ghost, not a diss as I know that's bannable but just gotta say...
That's likely the snarkiest post I've ever seen from a redname in my 6 years of playing this game. Congrats? |
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This I also agree with... sort of... I can definitely understand the level of frustration the devs go through. I also think that it probably would have been a good idea to add something like *Caveat- this is geared towards the Premies* I think adding a disclaimer ...or something like that...TO that would have canceled the firestorm.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
On a scale from one to ten, where five is what the current level of commentary likely deserves and eight is what I'd personally be leveling if I was a dev, Ghost Falcon's post scores a zero.
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Ignoring anyone is a mistake. You might miss something viral to your cause.
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Hmm... You obviously missed a metric ton of Jacks posts...OBVIOUSLY.
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Originally Posted by Crysys Ghost, not a diss as I know that's bannable but just gotta say... That's likely the snarkiest post I've ever seen from a redname in my 6 years of playing this game. Congrats? |
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
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What a minute there. Allow me to retort. You didn't GIVE me nothing.|
Originally Posted by Ghost Falcon
I guess it wasn't enough to just give away the Going Rogue Expansion features away as a benefit for VIP subscription and allow just any subscriber to change their alignment for free.
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I bought COH (x3), COV (x2), COH collectors, COV collectors, COH Architec, and COH Going Rogue. I've been paying a sub for 1 account for almost 4 years now another off and on for 2 years. I've bought every little pack you put out. I paid for the ablity to swap sides, I paid for the ability to use AE, I paid for to change the sex/model and looks of toons. I've paid for transfers, toon slots, and renames.
As far as saying the VIPs can use their FREE 400 points to go toward this. The points aren't free.
For $15 I either get 1320 points, a token, 1 pargon reward and the goodies of that reward up front, and about 80% of the content. Or I can get 100% of the content, 550 points (at the end of the month, Pargon reward (whenever you decide to reward it) and now throw away crap or 1/3 a costume set after waiting for the reward since I'm top tier. Nothing is Free its a choice of A or B. One bundle or the other.
But you want to know what would be a great service? How about VIPS get their rewards up front like the free players get? At least this way we will know when we will be getting them. Or conver that $10 transfer to a choice of several $10 services (Transfer, character slot, rename, or side swap) See Choice is good telling someone look what we gave you when you are giving them something that they dont want or will never use is the same as not giving anything at all.
Oh wait I'm wrong you did give me something. I won a party pack in a pocket D event. So I guess we are all good now Bro!
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I think this is a nice option. I know a few people who would have done this just to avoid the missions or because there was a time constraint (like a PvP match night where they wanted a villain patron power)|
Originally Posted by Ghost Falcon
I guess it wasn't enough to just give away the Going Rogue Expansion features away as a benefit for VIP subscription and allow just any subscriber to change their alignment for free.
I guess we're also morally bankrupt to give away free server transfers a month for free to VIP subscribers, too. And for anyone that never purchased the Going Rogue expansion or let their subscription lapse, we're apparently lower than dirt to charge a $10 "service" fee to change a character's alignment that a non-paying customer spent time on.... C'mon folks. *This is not profiteering on the backs of VIPs. ALL VIP subscribers and any customer that purchased the Going Rogue expansion have a FREE option to EASILY and FREELY change their character's alignment. Come at me with the pitchforks, but really? *Are you not seeing the reasons for introducing this service? Non VIP customers can now change their character's alignment to try the content on the other side without deleting thir character and grinding up to a power level where they were before (if they got up to level 20). * VIP customers get 400 points every month that they can apply to this 800 point service...., or as I pointed out earlier, VIP customers can change their alignment for FREE using the in-game system. If you want to provide more constructive feedback like "this is a great feature that i would rather get free per month as part of my VIP membership than server transfers or 400 points per month" then we're all ears. |
I know many PvP'rs have been begging for something like this for accolades.
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Unless I've missed something, EvilGeko's post didn't cross any of those lines, outside of maybe a vague interpretation of the already vague fourth point. Ghost Falcon's, on the other hand, crosses anywhere from one to three of them.|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Just keep it below the level of stupidity that calls something added to a superhero video game "morally bankrupt"
Don't swear, don't be aggressive, don't be sarcastic, and keep everything in perspective. |
Now I'm left wondering if it was an epic level misquote or something, because I have no idea where the morally bankrupt part came from that you're so dutifully parroting.
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Probably has something to do with some of the discussion surrounding the Supergamble Packs.
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Originally Posted by IanTheM1
Now I'm left wondering if it was an epic level misquote or something, because I have no idea where the morally bankrupt part came from that you're so dutifully parroting.
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The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
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Actually I have no problem with you selling a fully disclosed service that gives the customer a choice between time and money. This is a set price for a set service with the customer getting exactly what they want: an alignment change.|
Originally Posted by Ghost Falcon
I guess we're also morally bankrupt to give away free server transfers a month for free to VIP subscribers, too.
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Originally Posted by Ghost Falcon
Come at me with the pitchforks, but really? *Are you not seeing the reasons for introducing this service?
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Originally Posted by Ghost Falcon
If you want to provide more constructive feedback like "this is a great feature that i would rather get free per month as part of my VIP membership than server transfers or 400 points per month" then we're all ears.
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And sorry, I still can't find anything constructive to say about the "super packs" other than they are a cash grab that will pull in money for the company at the expense of customer goodwill.
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Originally Posted by IanTheM1
Now I'm left wondering if it was an epic level misquote or something, because I have no idea where the morally bankrupt part came from that you're so dutifully parroting.
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That was humor about the tone of GF's response, not a comment against it. As in marketing always tries to go for the "softer" response. |
Originally Posted by _Klaw_
And you're not in marketing either. The freebie is an enticement to attract more people to vip status. If you drop the freebie and up the points slightly it's not the same effect.
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I'm not by far saying Paragon's system is unfair - because I've seen some REALLY unfair ones, especially in a certain Paramount franchise themed game. But they do ask periodically what would make it better, so I tell them what I believe will do that. It does not mean I'm ungrateful or demanding. Though I also wouldn't say no to anything that helps me afford more costume packs.
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I thought having context would make things look a bit better than they do, but no, that just makes it look worse.
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Originally Posted by Snow Globe
See last week's "featured items" thread.
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I don't view alignment change in equal value of a respec, thus I reiterate that it should be 600 not 800. At that current price point it is too high even for VIP's. That is my feedback and thank you. Edit: I don't understand the outrage over Ghost Falcon's post as it was an honest point of view.
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I'm not going to be buying any of these tokens, but since one of my accounts is VIP and both have GR codes, it sounds like I'm not the target audience anyways.|
Originally Posted by Ghost Falcon
If you want to provide more constructive feedback like "this is a great feature that i would rather get free per month as part of my VIP membership than server transfers or 400 points per month" then we're all ears.
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I, and several others, have had little to no use for the Transfer Tokens included with the sub, so if you're open to suggestions, here's mine:
Ditch the free monthly token, and replace it with a generic token that, when claimed, can be redeemed for a Server Transfer, Alignment Change, Rename, or Respec. Write the code for the menu so that it's easy to add new items to it, just in case you add new services in the future that would be appropriate to add.
I'd suggest making it retroactive, but I suspect that there's no difference between the free transfer and the purchased one, so the system wouldn't be able to tell which ones to convert and which to leave.
Maybe just ditch all the $10 service tokens and make one master token (available in stacks of 1, 3 and 5 with small discounts for the stacks), that can be redeemed for whichever single service you want, via the menu I mentioned above. This would cut down bloat in the market somewhat, and add versatility to the token purchases.
@Roderick
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It seems a little too pricy to me. Just like what you said.|
Originally Posted by Necrotech_Master
i think its more of the pay to save time thing
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Originally Posted by Necrotech_Master
although it does seem kinda pricey at 800 pts
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That analogy doesn't work at all. You have a massive difference in server population which means more resources have to be put into hardware and customer service to handle the number of requests. Also their price is high to discourage people from using it regularly both to prevent strain on the service itself and to prevent gratuitous exploiting. |
Originally Posted by Draeth Darkstar
Furthermore, to people who feel the need to complain about this... the 800 pound gorilla in the market offers a "Faction Change Service" similar in concept to Alignment Changes.
It costs $35 US. The same company charges $25 for a single server transfer, $25 to change the race of your character, and $15 to change the way your character looks. Paragon's service charges are the lowest in the industry in my experience, and I have played a LOT of MMORPGs. |
CoH's population is dramatically small by comparison so the price is also dramatically smaller. Though since side switching has no real exploitative impact on the game's economy or really pvp in CoH like it does that other game, the cost of the alignment changes even for non-GR players is still too high.
I like the idea of making the "free server change token" more flexible. Specifically, I'd like to see the server change token change into an "account service token" as suggested previously, with the following features:
1 Account Service Token can convert into the player's choice of:
-1 Server Transfer Token
-1 Character Rename Token
-1 Alignment Change Token
-1 Character Respec Token
-10 Super Packs
-500 Paragon Points**
**Specifically less than the 800 the above would cost as conversion into Paragon Points is significantly more flexible. Furthermore, stocking up these tokens and being able to swap them for more than 600 paragon points would allow some "abuse" of stored tokens when any of these services go on sale for 600pp. 500, IMO, seems a reasonable markdown for having full "point" flexibility.
Premium accounts can't edit signatures.
Huh.
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I second this.|
Originally Posted by DJ_Korith
I like the idea of making the "free server change token" more flexible. Specifically, I'd like to see the server change token change into an "account service token" as suggested previously, with the following features:
1 Account Service Token can convert into the player's choice of: -1 Server Transfer Token -1 Character Rename Token -1 Alignment Change Token -1 Character Respec Token -10 Super Packs -500 Paragon Points** **Specifically less than the 800 the above would cost as conversion into Paragon Points is significantly more flexible. Furthermore, stocking up these tokens and being able to swap them for more than 600 paragon points would allow some "abuse" of stored tokens when any of these services go on sale for 600pp. 500, IMO, seems a reasonable markdown for having full "point" flexibility. |
/signed
Ignoring anyone is a mistake. You might miss something viral to your cause.
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I also agree this would be a very good idea. For instance I rarely ever bother "server transferring" characters so almost any of the other options you suggested would be far more useful to me. Ultimately allowing people to choose the reward that's most desirable to them would make this feature much better for everyone. |
Originally Posted by DJ_Korith
I like the idea of making the "free server change token" more flexible. Specifically, I'd like to see the server change token change into an "account service token"
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I love the 400 a month, I've been spending it on fun stuff I don't have the cash to buy at the moment.|
Originally Posted by Ghost Falcon
If you want to provide more constructive feedback like "this is a great feature that i would rather get free per month as part of my VIP membership than server transfers or 400 points per month" then we're all ears.
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If you wanted to provide a monthly choice between server transfer, alignment change, name change, a couple of super packs, storage increase etc. (basically the stuff under account services in the marketplace) I'd be all over that. I have yet to use a server transfer token and really don't anticipate using one, but several of those other services I'd use, but am in the financial situation where it would be financially irresponsible of me to pay for them at the moment.
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Please put these on sale (half-price or more) and I would buy points if I didn't have them to pick these up at that price.|
Originally Posted by Energizing_Ion
.. snipped for brevity ..
Speaking of pricing; any plans on putting the 2 extra 10 enhancement slot storages on sale (you know for like 600 points each)? |
I will admit I was one of those that didn't think I would use any server transfers, but since they're sitting there, I've used a few for convenience. BUT - I really like the idea of having a choice of "like" account services because choice is always better.
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If watching a small number of posters repeatedly use the dev team as a punching bag, accusing them (sometimes in so many words) of being immoral and strongly implying that they don't care about the players, doesn't explain why we might get strong reactions eventually, then I don't know what to tell you.|
Originally Posted by IanTheM1
I thought having context would make things look a bit better than they do, but no, that just makes it look worse.
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This was the straw that broke the camel's back. Every person has a tipping point, and GF reached his. I don't blame him. For all that people like to say, "We're customers, and we deserve to be treated with nothing but respect!" a lot of folks on the internet still forget that the person on the other end of their pixelated bile is an honest-to-goodness human being who probably cares very much about what they are doing, and is just as prone to being hurt as you and me. I'd rather see an honest, human, reaction than I would more marketing-speak -- or worse, nothing at all.
My postings to this forum are not to be used as data in any research study without my express written consent.
If you want to provide more constructive feedback like "this is a great feature that i would rather get free per month as part of my VIP membership than server transfers or 400 points per month" then we're all ears.
I know milk_weasel asked this question during a Community Coffee Talk before Freedom launched but I'll ask again, like others have said already.
If there was a way to have a player account say, "no I don't want a free server xfer token, please give me x instead."
That x could be:
1.) An Alignment Change Token
2.) More Paragon Points
3.) And so on...
I, personally, would take more points per month but maybe an ACT wouldn't be too bad either. I know I have 4 server xfers stacked and probably won't use 'em....
But when MW asked "can we get more points instead of a server xfer" Positron (?) said, "no...it can't be done."
So this can be done now?
Oh and I think the ACT price is a bit much too but then again I wasn't really planning on buying them so... *shrugs*
Speaking of pricing; any plans on putting the 2 extra 10 enhancement slot storages on sale (you know for like 600 points each)?
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