Who *don't* you want to die?
By
Agent White,
Posted on: 2011-11-14 18:39 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
I don't want to see Statesman die for one.
He is the iconic hero, the art, the 'face' of the game.
No matter how he is written by the officials of the game, he does still represent what they wanted a 'Signature Hero' to be. Sure.. he may be an A**hat, but he is OUR A**hat!!
The way he has been written has led many to believe he isn't a good enough character to keep around. While it is always tough to write a story for the near undefeatable, if any failings have happened, only the writers can be blamed for that. Not the character itself who they have wrapped so much of the game image and art around.
Besides.. for those that want him to bite it.
He is the counterpart to the villains big guy. Not just as being a leader of a group, in power level as well.
Recluse is an incarnate and it would take raising one of the other 8 to that level to 'match' and 'keep' Recluse from feeling he could simply stomp on over.
Remember the game doesn't really recognize the players as incarnates per say. Recluse still feels he is a more powerful incarnate.
I don't see Paragon Studios removing one incarnate, and raising another up to incarnate level to keep the balance. I also don't see them just taking one out without it affecting his counterpart and I DO NOT see them doing all the rewriting needed to justify why Recluse would not launch a full scale invasion once Statesman was defeated.
Now... the idea of losing Miss Liberty and then later Statesman in the story could also be a decent story, but I doubt they would go that direction.
Bab's is the easiest to phase out as once you remove his avatar from AP he is not really used again. You could even phase him out of Galaxy without much trouble I would think.
We only have the surviving 8 to choose from and each could go but I would not want to see the big guy go.
Too much of the game is wrapped around his image and I think we have seen enough 'change' of late without having to change about the 'face' of the game.
Just my humble opinion.
Member of Team Awesome���
Justice Server
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Actually, it was clearly stated as a power, not a gadget. Prometheus himself granted it to Manticore in the comics, and another of the Phalanx (I think it was Synapse) said, "Looks like you've got your very first superpower now!" |
Originally Posted by Agent White
That's not necessarily a power as it could be a gadget arrow. Given how much he emphasizes he has no powers I think it's safe to say it's the specific arrow that does the trick and not that Manticore actually does anything to make it do that. He just doesn't give the trick to making them to anyone so only he gets to use it.
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Originally Posted by Jagged
I do not agree that the dislike/hate for Statesman is mainly lingering hate for Jack, although no doubt that doesn't help.
The Statesman character is generally written as an authoritarian, belligerent no-it-all. The Statesman character in game (until the introduction of the Incarnate stuff at least) was operating at dreamy heights our characters could never achieve. None of this is particularly conducive to warm relationship. I, as a player, do not like the character. The characters I play in this game (hero and villain) don't like Statesman either. Thats not entirely bad though because on a number of occasions I have been able to put him in his place, either but saving his bacon or whuppin his butt! |
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Are we talking about Old Maria or new Maria?|
Originally Posted by Kurrent
I think that makes rescuing him at the end of Maria's arc that much more enjoyable, knowing your character succeeded where he and his ego failed.
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'Cuz in the new arc, the only reason he 'fails' is because your *** was too slow, then he was binded by something specifically made to hold him
Although to whoever mentioned Galaxy City basically not even existing anymore, I did think it was weird that it is never brought up, especially when Atlas was supposed to get rocked by meteors?
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This would be awesome IF that meant they changed that horrid piece of monotony known as Synapse TF!
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Originally Posted by Ironblade
Personally, I think either Positron (maybe) or Synapse (most likely, IMO) will die and the 'man without a zone' (Back Alley Brawler) will take over as contact for that task force. |
Global Name: Denver Nugget
Playing since i3 on 8 servers
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If they're trying for a story that impacts the CoH universe and not as a gimmick (let's kill a "major" character - yeah! what a great idea!), then to me, Statesman is a good choice as he's the face of CoH. I don't know that anyone else dying would have the same impact for the story going forward as losing Statesman. IMO, it would make things more interesting storywise.|
Originally Posted by Psychoti
I have a feeling it will be Statesman though, in a "No! Not another person I love! *jump in front of bullet*"-sorta way.
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That said, of the eight, I'd like to keep Numina, she's been through enough. But as she's already *dead*, I don't know that she counts for the OP's question.
Certified: Altaholic as defined by Memphis_Bill since 2005
Coming to you from a galaxy far, far away...
I also don't want to see States die...because, as it has been said, it would seem for all the wrong reasons.
Global Name: Denver Nugget
Playing since i3 on 8 servers
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This was exactly the point of my post... you said Positron being the new guy in charge if Statesman were the one to bite it wouldn't change things up at all, and then five seconds later turned around and said how it can't be Statesman that dies because that would change things up too much.|
Originally Posted by BrandX
Hmmm? What? Every comic book universe needs it's Superman type hero. Marvel has one (obviously not as popular), Wildstorm had one. It's needed! And for CoH that's Statesman.
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Personally, it is my opinion that the cliche you're describing is exactly why it's Statesman who needs to go.
@Draeth Darkstar
Virtue [Heroes, Roleplay], Freedom [Villains], Exalted [All Sides, Roleplay]
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This is Oscar worthy.
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Originally Posted by eth_Nargy
I kind of do hope he bites it, just cause I don't like his character.
Here's how I imagine the cutscene playing out: Random Evil Dude/Cole: Statesman, if you touch this bomb, you will DIE! Statesman starts to run towards the bomb, but is stopped as Sister Psyche puts her hand on his arm. Psyche: no dont do it statesman (in all lowercase) Statesman gently pushes her away and turns his head back towards the bomb, a single teardrop streaming down his cheek. Statesman: Come now, I've always been this way. Statesman rushes to the bomb and uses hand clap, as the camera pans offscreen and all you see is a huge number float upwards as the bomb explodes. At this point, everyone in Paragon City, even the Vahz in the sewers and the Devouring Earth in Eden let out an echoing "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO" as our valiant hero is no more. Camera cuts back to statesman's faceplate flying through the sky like a frisbee above steel canyon, as images of his past are shown in the background. The scene ends as the mask eventually flies into outer space, creating a sparkle and, seconds later, exploding into fireworks in the shape of statesman doing a thumbs up. Make it happen! |
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If the devs can manage this as a cutscene, I will cheerfully commit seppuku as a concession to the greater talent.|
Originally Posted by eth_Nargy
I kind of do hope he bites it, just cause I don't like his character.
Here's how I imagine the cutscene playing out: Random Evil Dude/Cole: Statesman, if you touch this bomb, you will DIE! Statesman starts to run towards the bomb, but is stopped as Sister Psyche puts her hand on his arm. Psyche: no dont do it statesman (in all lowercase) Statesman gently pushes her away and turns his head back towards the bomb, a single teardrop streaming down his cheek. Statesman: Come now, I've always been this way. Statesman rushes to the bomb and uses hand clap, as the camera pans offscreen and all you see is a huge number float upwards as the bomb explodes. At this point, everyone in Paragon City, even the Vahz in the sewers and the Devouring Earth in Eden let out an echoing "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO" as our valiant hero is no more. Camera cuts back to statesman's faceplate flying through the sky like a frisbee above steel canyon, as images of his past are shown in the background. The scene ends as the mask eventually flies into outer space, creating a sparkle and, seconds later, exploding into fireworks in the shape of statesman doing a thumbs up. Make it happen! |
Michelle
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Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
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Unfortunately I have been informed that the nature of that mission has changed. You no longer go in and beat up Tyrant but just one of his goons in a Tyrant suit |
Originally Posted by Kurrent
I think that makes rescuing him at the end of Maria's arc that much more enjoyable, knowing your character succeeded where he and his ego failed.
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This is a song about a super hero named Tony. Its called Tony's theme.
Jagged Reged: 23/01/04
Right now it feels like Statesman is going to be the one to bite it, but I can also see them pulling the switcheroo at the last minute.
"Men strunt �r strunt och snus �r snus
om ock i gyllne dosor.
Och rosor i ett sprucket krus
�r st�ndigt alltid rosor."
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It's going to be Back Alley Brawler.|
Originally Posted by Arilou
Right now it feels like Statesman is going to be the one to bite it, but I can also see them pulling the switcheroo at the last minute.
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The dev has left.
He doesn't have a zone anymore.
Since GC got destroyed where is he? Hidden away in a police station.
He never had a TF.
He only appears in a couple of missions.
And of course, he's the black guy.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
I don't want to see: Sister Psyche, Manticore, Back Alley Brawler or Numina die.
don't care: Synapse, Positron and Citadel (very lame.. i'm sure there must be copies of his program somewhere, so destroying his body won't do much, unless they actually erase every single copy of him)
Want to die: Statesman.
"What counts is not what sounds plausible, not what we would like to believe, not what one or two witnesses claim, but only what is supported by hard evidence rigorously and skeptically examined. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan
Since day one of my gameplay, Statesman has been the symbol of this game to me. (Not the man behind him who left, but what States represented.) It might sound strange, but I hold him in high regard for being the hero of heroes in the game. So many people make fun of him. Whenever I get the Tyrant mish I LOVE it....I love the end, taking pics with 'my hero' and love watching him fight. He's amazing. If they kill him off, I will truly feel a loss of something that has been a wonderful, familiar part of my game for seven years.
�Many things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done.�
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I was talking about the Old Maria arc. Didn't realize that the ending of the arc had changed with GR. So now we get an extra dose of arrogance to go with our reward merits at the end, I suppose.
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Originally Posted by G_Savior
Are we talking about Old Maria or new Maria?
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Originally Posted by Kurrent
Actually, Manticore does have a power. Teleport Arrow. It hurts when you get hit with it, either in RV or in Recluse's strike force. I'm sure someone out there has a screenie of it. It's too late for my mind to work tonight, so I'm not going to log back on and grab one, but if no one posts one before tomorrow evening, I'll try to remember to post a pic of its info. Link to a pic of the CCG version of it below.
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/COHCCG/Teleport_Arrow K |
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Originally Posted by Agent White
That's not necessarily a power as it could be a gadget arrow. Given how much he emphasizes he has no powers I think it's safe to say it's the specific arrow that does the trick and not that Manticore actually does anything to make it do that. He just doesn't give the trick to making them to anyone so only he gets to use it.
And you know given the unpopularity of Twinshot's arc maybe a rewrite wouldn't hurt >> Will be kind of disappointed if it does rule him out. Mostly because he's probably the one I'd offer up for sacrifice XD Edit: You know, looking over how often the heroes show up in various missions, it really seems like killing someone is going to involve more rewrites to villainside content than heroside, excepting the Signature Taskforces (assuming they don't just hand them off to a new NPC). |
In the hands of anyone else in the group, though, it would be pretty worthless. None of them have shown the skill to shoot a bow or other ranged weapon, much less with the skill to use it in a fight against metahumans. That's why I put the word nothing in quotes. For anyone else, it would be a non-power until they took a lot of time to practice at using it. The power is useless without the skill.
"I do so love taking a nice, well thought out character and putting them through hell. It's like tossing a Faberge Egg onto the stage during a Gallagher concert." - me
@Palador / @Rabid Unicorn
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I actually thought this may be what kept him alive. Look at the WIR thread.
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Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
And of course, he's the black guy.
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BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
you know who i don't want to die...Fusionette and Flamebeaux.
Why you ask? Because they annoy all of you.
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Alternatively: If Statesman/whoever dies. BAB would be an ideal candidate for them to shoe-horn into all the missions/TFs/etc that would now have space for a hero.
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Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
It's going to be Back Alley Brawler.
The dev has left. He doesn't have a zone anymore. Since GC got destroyed where is he? Hidden away in a police station. He never had a TF. He only appears in a couple of missions. And of course, he's the black guy. |
I don't want to see any of them die. Although if it is States, will that make our old game boxes, game cards, artwork, etc. of him collectors items?
Who did I think will? Blue Steel, since he has not been mentioned once in this entire thread and seems easily forgettable.
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Because he's not a Phalanxer?
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Originally Posted by Victoria_BC
I don't want to see any of them die. Although if it is States, will that make our old game boxes, game cards, artwork, etc. of him collectors items?
Who did I think will? Blue Steel, since he has not been mentioned once in this entire thread and seems easily forgettable. |
My mistake, I thought he was. I just now read his article on Paragon Wiki, he should be involved in the cutscenes when BABs is at risk.
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They don't annoy me! I actually like Fusionette! She's so comic booky!
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Originally Posted by ryu_planeswalker
you know who i don't want to die...Fusionette and Flamebeaux.
Why you ask? Because they annoy all of you. |
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
never really understood why people hate fusionette, while flamebeaux is delibrately made to be annoying as hell
He gains it during one of the old Comic Book runs. Even he was surprised when it happened the first time.