Is knockback underrated

I like knock backs but sometimes I hate it because you don't have a wall to knock to.

And I really don't like pbaoe Knock Back like the one in Solar Flare. I like pbaoe knock down.

Target AoE can also be headache too. Cone knock back is much easier to control.

No, it's highly useful, but on the same coin can be used in unnecessary and counterproductive ways.

If the tank has herded everything into a nice tight bunch and then someone lays a Tar Patch under them, it might be a good time to stow the knockback powers for a minute.

But if your blaster friend is about to be hacked by a Tank Swiper, knockback ahoy!

The only major issues I see are with powersets that have no choice between using their AoE attacks and not knockbacking (e.g. Energy Blast/Peacebringers), and then issues like knocking off of Tar Patches or knocking things away from a Scrappers taunt aura ensue because the choice is either attack 'and' knockback or don't attack.

Here is the beauty that surpasses..............what just what happens if we LET EVERYONE USE ALL OF THEIR POWERS!

Imagine that?

You can hold, knockback, immobilize or anything else you want to do whenever you want to do it.

Life doesn't need to fit in an 8 ounce glass. Take big bites moderation is for monks. Seriously do you see what these posts all have in common?

You want to control other people and not explore the fun of Chaos. You want the Hulk to punch people just not TOO hard. You want Ironman to use his repulsor jets - just not much. You want Thor to use his hammer but only knock things down.

Really it sounds like you want the boring and mundane and not the extraordinary. Gather 'em up slaughter, rinse and repeat. Those players daring to be having FUN - well ban them to the deepest of hells for daring to muss up the conga line.

Knockback,

::sighs::
*Begin Cheesy 50s PSA Announcer Voice*
Ok knockback is a form of Soft Control... it keeps the enemy on they're tuckus and not shooting at you... so, #1, it is all in all a GOOD THING. Now, when it is used improperly, either irresponsibly by unknowing individuals, or purposefully to annoy teams, then it is a Horrible thing...

So Here is the Proper Way To Use Knockback...

Corner Smash...: by aiming a cone with knockback at the rear of the spawn you ensure you hit everyone in the group, you fire into the spawn knowing hte corner behind that rear member is going to funnel them all into one nifty package for your teammates to Roast/Smash/do what have you...

Center Spaced... AOE with a radial knockback are EXCEEDINGLY difficult to use properly and often involve needing height over the battlefield to see what your doing. My advice is aim to the outside of a group, with the tank in the center, and fire for that outside minion, it will knock badguys toward the tank, while minimizing the chance of knocking them away...

Single Target Knockback: Always Move... move so you are aiming your badguy, as if bowling, into corners, walls, pillars anything that will arrest his movement. This is two fold... one it limits his flight distance, two the Longer the ragdoll animation, the longer he can't attack, if you stick a bosses head in a wall with knockback well he will be there for a minute or so while he tries to get loose... be wary though in caves as the walls are made of plasters and seem to be one way... badguys get in and can't get out, causing failed trials, missions, and frustrations all around..

All in All Knockback is a TOOL, a good tool that gets misused with such enormity that people are more used to seeing it misused them properly applied. As such it has gotten a foul reputation, however if you practice your three A's "Aim, Apply, Aim Again" you'll be sweeping them off they're feet in no time...

*End cheesy 50s PSA announcer voice...*

First and foremost, knockback is a super-heroey effect . . . what better way to show the effect of a super-hit than to send the foe halfway across the room? So from a role-playing, having fun point of view, knockback is great.

Knockback is a form of control . . . as mentioned, foes can't attack if they are trying to get up. Knockdown works great this way, but knockback accomplishes the same thing only better, as the foes spend time flying back and bouncing. And if they were knocked back some distance, it will take them a little while to get back into melee again, which further mitigates damage . . . or they might have second thoughts and run away (which again fits with a role-play, having fun point of view).

From a melee fighter's point of view, or an AoE controller or damager's point of view, large amounts of knockback disrupt the optimal use of your powers. When I'm playing a tank or a scrapper, I mostly hate knockback that I can't control.

But there are some situations where knockback is great:

From the point of view of a single-target ranged attacker, knockback is wonderful . . . even AoE knockback. It gives more time for your powers to recharge and keeps you safely at a distance.

From the point of view of a squishy character who needs that extra second for his powers to recharge, knockback is wonderful.

In a few limited situations where doors or hallways may be blocked so that you can't get through, then knockback can be wonderful.

For a ranged fighter who is being overrun with melee foes, knockback can be wonderful. Sometimes you just need a second or two . . .

Strategically, even AoE knockback can be used effectively as an aggro tool. Fire off a PB AoE knockback, then run back around a corner or through a doorway . . . the foes will be a bit spread out as they come around the corner or through the doorway to chase you when they meet their doom one by one.

Despite the general hate for PB AoE knockback, there ARE a few situations where it can be used strategically . . . usually not on large teams. Solo or small teams, it can have a some strategic uses.

But most importantly . . . sometimes knockback is just fun.

Knockback is something used irresponsibly the majority of the time it's used.
This is why people dislike it. A large number of abilities in this game benefit more from having everything clumped together. This includes defensive toggles for tanks.

Irresponsible knockback = Friendly fire debuffs. You're debuffing your team by using it incorrectly.

You see the narrow minds. I used to run an ALL knock back TEAM.

It was required to have one disorient, knock back or other "undesirable" power and to use it.

It was AMAZING to see what we could do. Taking a +1 Elite Boss throw him into the air and knock him cartwheeling and dead on the floor - was awesome to behold.

I played an Energy/Energy blaster on a TF and never had a single word but praise - because - I lined up my knock backs properly. I used 'em all and tore stuff up. It can be done to use knock back and if you talk to the tank and folks with powers like - Tarpatch, say to them can you drop it after I use torrent? I will zap all of them into the wall. Then the tank knows, hey I will taunt over by this wall here and I knock all the mobs TO him.

You need to lighten up and have fun, for folks who are supposed to be the uber gamers you lack in adaptability!

Gale? Is an awesome power for pulling stuff! You knock 'em down and run back to the group. Using your powers and letting others use there's requires - skill and patience. So could you play with a 7 year old on your team who is just having fun knocking things around?

I did and it is what changed my attitude towards it.

Quick summary:

* Knockback has its benefits, namely: damage mitigation; mob positioning

* Knockback can be highly entertaining

* Knockback takes skill to use, and a bit of communication with other teammates and pre-planning doesn't hurt

* Knockback can be easily misused, particularly be unskilled or careless players, and that can cause irritation or even endanger a team

* Knockback increases the level of chaos, which is enjoyed by some who value dynamism and challenge but generally not by those who value order and xp/min

So, it's one of those powers that sees it effectiveness start off below average when used by inexperienced players, but which becomes more effective when used by more experienced players. However, on average it's probably less effective than most other secondary effects, and its main benefits are selective.

That about sum it up?

I think knockback is generally under-rated, or at least the case against it is overstated.

Teammates can do a number of things to unintentionally ruin your day.
Area Immobilises that leave enemies spread out, as mentioned earlier.
Overconfident melee artists who run in before everyones loaded, and then die, leaving aggro'd enemies at the missions door.
Scaredy-tanks who need a personal "ready" off everyone befroe engaging a spawn.
Empaths who only buff the tank.
Its the price of playing with other people instead of AIs, I guess.

I love knockback, use it well, and rarely see it causing trouble from other teammates.