I think it'd be a good idea to announce if there are any MORE visual revamps.

Just in case I haven't posted on a thread you've tallied up yet, count me as extremely opposed to this change. The old CoT look was great. It had a clear theme the suited the Circle perfectly. In addition, it was quite distinctive from the other mobs in the game, so it helped the CoT stand out.

The new look does none of that. They not only don't look like a coven of mages, they look like a random assortment of costume bits. Perhaps the stills aren't doing the new costumes justice, but it doesn't even look like the texture or details are any better than the old ones.

I know it's unpopular to to have NPCs wear costume pieces we players can't use ourselves, but forcing them to wear generic castoff gear instead is a cure that's worse than the disease. Please leave the CoT as they were.

-D

Thank you very much, Zwillinger, for posting this information! One reason I often either refrain from posting feedback or simply give rambling commentary when I do is that I've always assumed that feedback only ever reaches the devs in the form of "the players are saying [X general thing] on the forums." Knowing how you review and present our commentary to the devs makes it much easier for us to give feedback that might be useful or at least considered, rather than simply spouting our opinions.

Thanks again for your work for the CoH fan community.

Zwillinger, c'mon man! I corrected myself in the post you quoted! *pulls out gangsta voice* You copyin' me or sumthin'?!

*ditches poorly done gangsta impression*
Was this due to that "no caffeine yet" problem you were having with your earlier posts?

Well, you could post some posed shots of the new models in somewhere like Perez Park - it's not really going to be a spoiler now

Should've anticipated this?

Oh you mean the 'The changes were not designed for the pvp public, but to bring in new players, and even though we hear and will totally your objections/concerns to the changes, they are going to happen whether you like them or not!' Explanation? Ahhh, got you!

There's plenty of other stuff for us to be surprised by. Costumes, not surprisingly, is something that many people see as SRS BZNSS in this game.

As an aside, the reaction to the COT costume revamp reveals an amusing and deep-seated hatred that many who play this game secretly have for that other game .

Meh. I can see being surprised. I know I have done things I thought were really cool only to have people have a lot of people have a negative or neutral reaction. Since they did not have anyone in studio that disliked the proposed changes (and I am sure they normally have enough dissenting opinions to generally cross-check each other decently), it is not terribly surprising that they did not expect this reaction.

They all loved the new stuff. I am sure that if one or two of them would have said, "Hmmm. That is a pretty radical change. I am not sure they really match the CoT," then they may have anticipated it.

So why are you playing this instead of a MUD?

This is actually one statement given as fact that I'm tired of seeing misrepresented. As a percentage of population yes regular and even non regular forum posters are probably less than 1% of the games total population. The problem is that the statement assumes that only 1% of the many different types of gamers is represented. I am very sure that the more specific categories of gamers that the 1% of the general game population that posts here is comprised of is represented.

We have min/maxers and casuals on the forums. We even have "casually" purpled warshades. We have Content Police and we have What Stories? and even You read that stuff?!?. We have Spandex Lovers and we have Bulky Armor Lovers. We have Scifi fans and we have Medievil fans. We have Catgirls and we have Werewolves even "/e facepalm" Twilight Vamps. I could go on and on with the various differenet types of people that I've seen while lurking these forums for more than 5 years and I could go on and on with the more general groups I could fit them in.

The point is that in this 1% of the general population that posts here on the forums are a great many and varied voices from all walks of life that represent the general views of more than 1% of the general game population.

I don't think anyone complained that the Council looked worse or more out of place than the 5th Column, with the possible exception of the Mexican Lucha Libre wrestlers. The Council, like the Column, was a paramilitary organisation staffed by masked soldiers. People did miss the skull-like WW2 German army helmet plus gas mask combo, but that's because it's iconic of Stupid Jetpack Hitler more than anything else. The space man helmets were just as good for the neo-fascist alien fanboys, and the variety in both powers and looks that the Council brought is significant. In fact, putting the Column soldiers against the Council ones, the Column looks very dated.

What people opposed to back then the merit of ostensibly renaming a faction and taking away a good story to replace it with a mediocre one, compounded by the "Devs hate Nazis!" arguments. Both the Council and the Column had and have their perks, and the smartest thing to do would have been what they ended up doing eventually anyway - put them both in the game.

---

What's a bit upsetting to me is the straw men being built around "the horrible conduct" of the Circle of Warcraft thread, like it's full of juvenile idiots who are having nerdrage episodes and demanding changes. Well I happened to read through most of it, and it's very little more than a bunch of people sharing their opinions of a change, which just happens to be negative. Occasionally there will be one who goes "This sucks! Change it back!" but for the most part we're just trying to verbalise why we dislike the change and what could possibly happen to mitigate it without requiring the scrapping of existing work wholesale.

In general, I find it profoundly unhelpful for people keep on arguing about how other people shouldn't express their opinions, or should only express their opinions a certain way. I'm glad the development team seem to know better than this, and their recent action have earned them a LOT of credit with me, so I'll trust them to sort this out without needing to be told which feedback to read and which feedback to ignore.

Originally Posted by Arcanaville Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

Forumites = that relatively small bit of the iceberg you can see poking above the water.

See also: "Where there's smoke, there's fire."
Extra Credit: "The Macrocosm is as the Microcosm."

It´s not that I want to sparkle... Dark Armor just fits for a Vampire -.-

Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.

Frankly, as a member of the community, this comment borders on the insulting - because it implies that the only reason we dislike the new look is because it wasn't properly marketed.

Have you even read the comments?

We don't like the new look because it doesn't look like the CoT. This isn't like the Rikti upgrade where they got a cool and spiffy new look. This is taking a unique look away and replacing it with something that looks like every bad costume contest ever held under Atlas' globe.

Do. Not. Want.

+1 for the TVTropes reference.

That is all.

I think you're just looking for a reason to feel insulted.

"we were unable to present this revamp on our own terms" means that they could preface this with an explanation of what they hoped to accomplish, why other decisions weren't done, and what this means going forward. There's a good chance that this wouldn't change a person's opinion on the merits of the work, but it would give them insight in the devs' rationale, and that can help channel the discussion into more constructive directions.

Well, wouldn't you think that would ENCOURAGE them to make a big fanfare and show their design plans on their own terms rather than letting us just be surprised with it and flip out?

I'm honestly willing to bet that a lot of people could have been suckered into accepting the CoT revamp if they'd had marketing dress it up some. I don't think most of us would have been HAPPY with it, but right now it looks like they were just going to SURPRISE us with it, and the howls would have been even louder.

At the risk of being ever so unnoticeably off topic, I really wish they'd Bassy's "Demon facepalm girl" image for a caption contest!

Closed beta family and friends is probably going on...if so enough said.