Quote:
I am almost always at the dmg cap for my attacks on my SS/fire/mu, as i use macros for combining and popping insp. Of course, that is after the 80%+ they have slotted in attacks, as i am not always at the actual cap for dmg in the combat numbers window. That prolly averages 590%ish(690%) . I do generally hit the cap in every mish just not the whole time.
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Originally Posted by Deevian
Tanks have higher base damage, brutes get 175% from full fury bar. It seems like that is the true center of gravity in their difference in this case, who runs anywhere close to the 775% damage cap on a solo farming brute?(And are these numbers correct?)
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"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
Quote:
Macro to combine inspirations? How does that work? Wouldn't that require some sort of logic?
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Originally Posted by ultrawatt
I am almost always at the dmg cap for my attacks on my SS/fire/mu, as i use macros for combining and popping insp. Of course, that is after the 80%+ they have slotted in attacks, as i am not always at the actual cap for dmg in the combat numbers window. That prolly averages 590%ish(690%) . I do generally hit the cap in every mish just not the whole time.
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I'm surprised how nobody mention Claws for farming...
Maybe because Spin is only 8' radius, but rech and damage are really that good. And now eviscerate can hit 3-5 target with not much difficulty.
I do very well with my claws/elec, but must admit that it's lot's more active playstyle than ss/fire for ex.
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Here's a link to the guide (it's a thing of beauty): http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showt...aker%27s+guide
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Originally Posted by Deevian
Macro to combine inspirations? How does that work? Wouldn't that require some sort of logic?
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Quote:
Dark Melee will never be a top farming choice. Not saying you can't farm with it, but you won't be beating any competent SS/Fire.|
Originally Posted by PBaRmy
my DM/Fire/Mu will challenge any ss/fire
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Mc Carbonara
I'm surprised how nobody mention Claws for farming...
Maybe because Spin is only 8' radius, but rech and damage are really that good. And now eviscerate can hit 3-5 target with not much difficulty. I do very well with my claws/elec, but must admit that it's lot's more active playstyle than ss/fire for ex. |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Deevian
Hanging questions still linger about scrappers in particular
Spines/Fire and Elec/Shield Kitted out blaster? |
I don't remember right now, but if I haven't already stripped my Spines/Fire I'll do a few runs with it. The last times I tested it, it wasn't as good as my Brute.
[U][URL="http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=251594"][/URL][/U]
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Yep, but i removed purples from the macro, as i need to use those. And then added either $$powexec_name Foot Stomp, powexec_name Ball lightning, or powexec_name Electrifying fences. So the combine macros were what i used for attacking as well, burn i still the normal power icon though. I can say this is the number 1 thing that has increased my inf/min and tix/min rates.|
Originally Posted by Fuzzy Kittens
Here's a link to the guide (it's a thing of beauty): http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showt...aker%27s+guide
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by PBaRmy
my DM/Fire/Mu will challenge any ss/fire
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"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
Quote:
Why couldn't you do it with another person on a team?|
Originally Posted by YoumuKonpaku
Darn shame I can't do that with a second person on the team, wouldn't mind farming my alts up via leveling pacts.
How much recharge is enough? My warshade (the build is on the kheld boards) has 171.25% + tier 1 spiritual, hasten being permanently up. |
Recharge is king for this, because, as you know, you don't have to worry about anything else: damage buffs, endurance and survival are all taken care of by massive recharge. Everything you have is dependent on recharge. I would tell you how much my build has, but I am at work right now... I know that it keeps 3-4 pets out all the time though. If you reach the point that you are getting ridiculously small returns on recharge, you could then focus on defense or +hp.
The Inspiration Maker's Guide [i12] UPDATED with POPMENUS and Movement Binds!
A Flash in the Dark: The Electric/Ninjitsu Stalker [i23]
Kheldian Inspiration Macros UPDATED with POPMENUS and Movement Binds!
Guide to the Katana~Ninja Blade/Electric [i23]
at the risk of sounding completely n00b, can someone explain
1) What exactly is an ambush farm?
2) Do you have to make them yourself in the AE creator?
3) Everyone does this with Fire-only mobs to make running Fire Armor toons easy?
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I can field this one.|
Originally Posted by Granite Agent
at the risk of sounding completely n00b, can someone explain
1) What exactly is an ambush farm? 2) Do you have to make them yourself in the AE creator? 3) Everyone does this with Fire-only mobs to make running Fire Armor toons easy? |
1) What exactly is an ambush farm?
The are farms that are basically small rooms with triggers that spawn massive numbers of mobs. There are pros and cons to this with various different powersets, most non-tank/brute/scrapper simply can not survive in such farms, as you will assuredly be at aggro cap and you better be able to take the hits. Obviously, if you can survive, there is a definitely time advantage to not having to run around to find mobs(trust me, they find you)
2) Do you have to make them yourself in the AE creator?
No, you can join a mission created by another.
3) Everyone does this with Fire-only mobs to make running Fire Armor toons easy?
Da! Fire aura gets tons of fire resist, cheaply =P Then fire also happens to be the set most able to put out the damage.
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From what I was told +X/x8 without bosses turned on will spawn bosses as soon as you bring a second person into the team (unless the mission is already open), and since you can't bring an outside person in during an active AE arc...|
Originally Posted by Microcosm
Why couldn't you do it with another person on a team?
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Also, I can't see building my triform WS for Defense and getting any reasonable return. Do have some HP bonuses already.
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Hrmm, I haven't experienced that, not that I bring people along often. I believe that thing about AE was changed; I remember reading something about it and I definitely remember inviting someone while inside an AE mission.|
Originally Posted by YoumuKonpaku
From what I was told +X/x8 without bosses turned on will spawn bosses as soon as you bring a second person into the team
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You can actually get some good defense numbers and still have your recharge with the very rare spiritual alpha. But WS defense builds are also really easy to mess up if you are not super comfortable with your powers and the dance. +HP will serve you well, though.
The Inspiration Maker's Guide [i12] UPDATED with POPMENUS and Movement Binds!
A Flash in the Dark: The Electric/Ninjitsu Stalker [i23]
Kheldian Inspiration Macros UPDATED with POPMENUS and Movement Binds!
Guide to the Katana~Ninja Blade/Electric [i23]
Quote:
I've got my 'final', currently live build on the Kheld boards. You commented on the non-final build in the past, but not sure about the current one. I updated the OP in my thread to reflect the one I run in game.|
Originally Posted by Microcosm
Hrmm, I haven't experienced that, not that I bring people along often. I believe that thing about AE was changed; I remember reading something about it and I definitely remember inviting someone while inside an AE mission.
You can actually get some good defense numbers and still have your recharge with the very rare spiritual alpha. But WS defense builds are also really easy to mess up if you are not super comfortable with your powers and the dance. +HP will serve you well, though. |
I will do some tweaking and see what I can do. My concern is that the def would all come from set bonuses and not amount to a whole heckuvalot due to not running any defensive toggles.
I'll try the AE thing later.
Quote:
The original post stated bonus damage not total damage.
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Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA
You forgot to add the 100% base everyone starts off with. That gives you 381 in total.
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Since I see several questions about which archetypes work best, here's a quick, non-numbers-heavy breakdown just for starters.
* Blaster: Blasters were semi-popular before AE (Fire/MM and especially Arch/MM) because they could tackle standard-sized mobs before the mobs were able to return fire, thus negating their squishiness. I've seen some well-built Arch/MM's do great things on the Battle Maiden and Council farms, but those are old hat post-I14. When utilizing efficient farms, Blasters fall behind these days.
* Controller: Fire/Kin, Plant/Kin (decent but not as good). Again, popular before I14 but unless you are running Stone Mastery or carrying lots of purples you won't do well on the current farms. They're still decent at regular content.
* Defender: lol
* Scrapper: Spines, Fire Melee, Elec, with Shield, Fire. Probably the fastest of the hero ATs currently, though Brutes outclass them due to Fury and taunt auras. If you've already got a farm-ready Scrapper these can work but if you're starting from scratch a Brute is the better choice.
* Tanker: not much point, honestly. They can't kill mobs as fast as a Brute or Scrapper and their extra survivability is more than what's needed. When a "squishier" melee AT can already survive long enough to defeat the mobs, the Tanker is just trading damage for unnecessary survivability, which isn't a good trade.
* Peacebringer: lol
* Warshade: Warshades actually work decently if you put enough inf into them to build for recharge and potentially HP. I have used my triformer in the past to farm Freakshow and Battle Maiden, though I prefer my Brute since it's simpler. Again, these can work but a lot of inf is required to get them to a good point, and they've got no way of keeping the mobs packed tightly so you need to kill quickly or risk chasing mobs down.
* Brute: Likely the best, given their survivability and ability to more or less outdamage Scrappers. Even with the lower damage cap, a Scrapper only beats out a Brute when capped by a small amount, but under normal circumstances (i.e. lots of Fury) the Brute will be closer to that cap than the Scrapper. Simply put, given the current farming trend there is no other AT that can outfarm a Brute in terms of raw inf gain per minute (and by association, kills per minute).
* Corruptor: People liked Traps Corrs (especially Fire/Traps) before the Poison Trap nerf in I13. Don't really see them much anymore except as support (often Fire/Kin or Rad/Kin or really anything/Kin). An odd cross between a Defender and Blaster as far as farming goes. Some of the fastest farming I've seen post-I14 was a very early boss farm where a SS/Fire Brute, Fire/Kin Corr, and Fire/Psi Dom ran through together, but more on that later.
* Dominator: Dominators were probably second to Brutes before the I15 changes to the archetype, which not only lowered the effectiveness of high-recharge builds but also gutted the /Psi set as used for farming (basically, high-damage and high-recharge PSW). Way back when Family still gave full XP someone ran some numbers and a Fire/Psi Dom was actually able to outpace an SS/Fire Brute in inf/min but that hasn't been the case since that XP nerf, let alone the Dom changes. They're still decent, and I'm not sure how they stack up to Controllers anymore, but I abandoned my Fire/Psi as soon as I had a workable SS/Fire.
* Mastermind: Again, Traps was okay before I13. The last time MMs were relevant was that one farm with the GMs where MM pets stayed at native level, but for standard stuff they're just not good.
* Stalker: No. Just no.
* Soldier/Widow: Crabs can work since they have respectable AoE output and good survivability, but more money needs to be put into them to obtain higher levels of performance. Banes aren't all that wonderful as they lack meaningful AoE and are relatively squishy. Forts again lack AoE, even if they are survivable. Widows have respectable AoE, but it's the same issue that Crabs have - costs money to make them competitive and that money's better spent on something that would be better out-of-the-box.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
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Forts has loads of aoe its just they do little damage on their own and have to pick up webs to mitigate scatter. |
Originally Posted by macskull
snip.
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You could probably make a decent elec/x/blaze stalker since you can control fireballs criticals but you would have isssues with scatter.
P much everything that isn't something with a taunt aura or have a good mass immob is going to suck for farming.
Update:
Based on the advice given in this thread, I started a SS/FA brute last Friday night. As of Sunday night he is lvl 49. I was solo the whole time out of Praetoria, no PL from other players at all.
I did team up in Praetoria and got into a few very good groups, it took me 6-7 hours to hit 20. I went straight to paragon from there( I hate CoV side), although this turned out to be a mistake, more on that later.
At 20 I went straight into a -1/8 AE fire farm. Surprisingly enough, I was easily able to tank the damage with judicious use of purps. I think somebody said they didn't take the damage aura in their build, this is a huge mistake, I did 80% of my damage with blazing aura. Just run in group and stand there, I also bought hand grenade and tazer temp powers. I didn't get any IO's, as I leveled I just bought SO's from AE vendor using tickets, then I spent the rest of the tickets on salvage to sell at the marketplace. It only took a few hours of PL'ing myself to hit 32.
As I level'ed I slowly started turning up difficulty and ended up on +3/8. Things started to accelerate when I got burn, then further still when I got FS. I figured it would take a week or two to get to 50 solo, it turns out 3 days. Which is a problem since I figured as I was level'ing up I'd be doing the tip/morality missions to get to red side to pick up MU. If somebody else is going to follow this path I would suggest starting on red side. None of the EPP's make any sense for a brute farmer.
By the time I hit 49 I made somewhere around 300 mil Inf off the salvage bought with tickets and a little bit of marketeering. I didn't manage to find a good SS/FA farm build that I agreed with( I really really hate the forum search utility) so I just bought Obliterates for all my PBAE powers as they seemed like the best deal. Not long after I hit 50, I'll have 3 full sets of obliterate in burn, damage aura and foot stomp.
I'll be grinding tip/shards on him for a bit, but when I finally get him red side with mu I'll be ready to produce some numbers.
Could somebody post an 80/20 build(Tries to get 80% of the benefit for 20% of the cost, ie best bang for the buck) for a SS/FA/MU please? (=
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Here, its prety much a farm only build though. But its got 102% rech with a cost of about 1-2 bil (my build has 130% or so and costs about 10 bil lol). But since you already have oblits it shouldnt be too bad.|
Originally Posted by Deevian
Could somebody post an 80/20 build(Tries to get 80% of the benefit for 20% of the cost, ie best bang for the buck) for a SS/FA/MU please? (=
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Code:
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"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
Ultra - Wow on some of that slotting. You achieved nice rech in that build, but it seems kinda gimp for the sake of what you accomplished.
I'd probably at least slot *some* acc in FootStomp, and keep my attacks slotted for DMG, instead of chasing set bonuses. To each their own though!
Ah yes, you could defently say its gimped, it's STdps, and non-farm potential is for sure haha.
But the ST attacks dont need to be used anyway, as you have a full AoE attack chain. And as far as acc in FS you're tohit capped against +4s with just one rage.
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
Question about IO slotting
Is slotting blazing aura with a lot of chance for damage procs as good as I think it is?
Quote:
No, i learned this the hard way *sigh* |
Originally Posted by Deevian
Question about IO slotting
Is slotting blazing aura with a lot of chance for damage procs as good as I think it is? |
But the proc will only have a chance to go off every 10 seconds which means on average it will go off every 50 seconds or so. Proc are much better in attacks, my build happens to have two in Foot Stomp.
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
Also to note, that is every 10 seconds if there are mobs around you or not. Does not really mean anything on ambush farms but if you are moving from spawn to spawn there are times it could fire with no one in range.
Quote:
well i just ran a PL map with a lowbie there, so i veng off them, and w/o any insp my damage bonus was about 345, so sry its not 400 but thats not bad for dark/fire. that takes into account my damage bonus from IO's and running assault and fury at 85, seems to stay right at that point. |
Originally Posted by HelinCarnate
Perma sould drain with max targets will only get you a constant damage buff of +96%, plus "full" fury for another 150% plus veng will get you to +281%. Which makes me wonder why you include veng in your numbers unless you bring a corpse with you just for buff purposes.
Now I'm pretty good at math and I'm pretty sure that does not come close to 400+. This means you are either lying, leaving out other buffs or you have no idea what you are talking about. Also just because people say it is the fastest they have seen does not mean that it is the fastest. Not saying it is slow, just that there is faster. |
Also i use the macros for reds cuz thats all i need since my s/l/fire/melee is softcapped and im usually around 500-600 damage most the time. I just ran fuzzy kittens FRONTLOAD map #482818 in 3:40 at 4/8 diff. very respectable for dark/fire. and i made 2.2 bil in 2 days with no annoying rage crash so for all those that are looking for something other than ss/fire...dm/fire can be great if built right like mine.
stats are 176.3% rech, burn rech in 6.2 secs, healing flames in 9.9 secs,ball lightning rech under 8 secs, elec fences rech 5.7 sec., perma hasten/soul drain.
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So leaving out information it is. You seem to do that alot. You don't mention you have your 2nd account as veng bait and that is the reason you are soft capped. To many, if you require a 2nd account to farm it does not really count as being the best. I am also curious as to how much of that 2.2 billion in 2 days was made from charging others for farms or comes from the 2nd account sitting there and its ticket sales.|
Originally Posted by PBaRmy
well i just ran a PL map with a lowbie there, so i veng off them, and w/o any insp my damage bonus was about 345, so sry its not 400 but thats not bad for dark/fire. that takes into account my damage bonus from IO's and running assault and fury at 85, seems to stay right at that point.
Also i use the macros for reds cuz thats all i need since my s/l/fire/melee is softcapped and im usually around 500-600 damage most the time. I just ran fuzzy kittens FRONTLOAD map #482818 in 3:40 at 4/8 diff. very respectable for dark/fire. and i made 2.2 bil in 2 days with no annoying rage crash so for all those that are looking for something other than ss/fire...dm/fire can be great if built right like mine. |
As far as the time goes, Video or it didn't happen.
Tanker base damage for the same attacks is 158.53. Slotted with 3 level 50 IOs it is 315.3. The only other bonuses they can stack on are the same ones brutes can get. BU and rage and such.
Convinced yet?
On my SS/Fire brute, it is not uncommon to have +400 to +500 damage bonus due to double rage, fury and a fairly constant stream of insp that can be turned into reds pretty easily. You go right ahead and try to get +500% damage on a tank.
Hanging questions still linger about scrappers in particular
Spines/Fire and
Elec/Shield
And Dominators/Controller
Plant/Fire or Plant/Psi?
The obvious Fire/Rad/Fire?
Kitted out blaster?
What kind of numbers can these guys put out? Until we see numbers it is only a guess as to how superior the ambush farm is. I would really like to get more information about farming in general here.