Trapdoor is getting harder.


Adeon Hawkwood

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arbegla View Post
Actually Archer is ranked pretty high on the single target list. Right under Fire blast, due to high damaging, quick attacks, (and all of your single target goodness is at 80ft)

Even on a corrupter or defender, which have lower damage then blasters. Just so ya know.
That may be true, but it doesn't mean the damage I was putting out was very high by any means. The clones are easy and can be taken out quickly to stop the regen buffs.

The attack chain I used was Blazing Arrow > Snap Shot > Snap Shot. Being generous and calculating this chain with no gaps yields about 80 DPS and 96 DPS for the duration of Aim, which again I wouldn't categorize as 'uber' ST damage. Now, this is without factoring in Scourge, which really doesn't need to be factored in since if you can get Trapdoor below 50% in the first place, you could take him out without Scourge.

The point I'm trying to make is if the build isn't completely terrible, anybody should be able to take Trapdoor down solo, especially by using inspirations and pulling him into the lava.


[U][URL="http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=251594"][/URL][/U]

 

Posted

Ya know, I'm starting to wonder if ol' Trapdoor is as buggy as the forum software (waves at whoever hasn't managed to fix this thing yet - logged out twice today, thank you very much). I watched the video of the dark/dark corruptor taking him out very quickly, so naturally I got MY dark/dark corruptor and tried it.

Well.

Even with a Dark Servant *and* a Fortunata Mistress also attacking and my corr going after the clones ASAP his health bar might as well have been made from cast rodinium, adamantium, and a day old Kraft American cheese single.

I finally just said to HELL with it and did something else.

Flashback to - pre-patch - when my WS and a single fluffy kicked his butt. And now we have not fully slotted controllers defeating him in ten seconds or less and my guys who, even though slotted for damage, can barely scratch his paint. Ah, well.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiery-Enforcer View Post
That may be true, but it doesn't mean the damage I was putting out was very high by any means. The clones are easy and can be taken out quickly to stop the regen buffs.

The attack chain I used was Blazing Arrow > Snap Shot > Snap Shot. Being generous and calculating this chain with no gaps yields about 80 DPS and 96 DPS for the duration of Aim, which again I wouldn't categorize as 'uber' ST damage. Now, this is without factoring in Scourge, which really doesn't need to be factored in since if you can get Trapdoor below 50% in the first place, you could take him out without Scourge.

The point I'm trying to make is if the build isn't completely terrible, anybody should be able to take Trapdoor down solo, especially by using inspirations and pulling him into the lava.
Yeah, basically anyone should be able to solo this, especially if you have -regen, or knock him into the lava while clone hunting. Using my Archer/EM (granted, i just finished his build and tossed quite abit of IO into him) I was able to take him out pretty quickly. Went after his clones when they spawned, and tagged him with blazing arrow while i was clone hunting (the DoT may not have lowered his regen, but its damage while im not attacking him) and i downed him pretty easily.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flarstux View Post
Ya know, I'm starting to wonder if ol' Trapdoor is as buggy as the forum software (waves at whoever hasn't managed to fix this thing yet - logged out twice today, thank you very much). I watched the video of the dark/dark corruptor taking him out very quickly, so naturally I got MY dark/dark corruptor and tried it.

Well.

Even with a Dark Servant *and* a Fortunata Mistress also attacking and my corr going after the clones ASAP his health bar might as well have been made from cast rodinium, adamantium, and a day old Kraft American cheese single.
I don't know if it's enough to explain the difference, but my Corr is pretty tweaked out. I like jack-of-all-trades builds who are strong at a lot of things but therefore truly excellent at no one thing, but I'm sure that character is pretty above average in effective DPS for a D/DC (including the uptime for the -regen in HT). Other than sheer stubbornness, it's the main reason I fought him at +2 instead of something lower, which I think most people are doing. (I wanted to be up front about that, so it's why I posted the build, too.)


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by StarKitten View Post
I ran this before maint. with my controller. He took all of 10 seconds to take down. I notice no change in difficulty. *shrugs* And my toon has a lot of empty slots, the majority of my slots filled with generic IO's. I have 0 sets.
This would be the exact definition of "luck." I assume "10 seconds" is hyperbole because you can't even attack twice in that amount of time, and unless you've got a pocket nuke that's ACTUALLY A NUKE, then this didn't happen. It physically can't.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny_Butane View Post
If it was an either-or proposition, that would be another story; brute force it and face a typical drawn out moderate-hard EB fight OR find a sneaky trick like dropping the roof on top of him or flooding the chamber with lava. That would actually be kind of cool.
I mentioned that earlier in the thread -- I really wish there were alternate ways to beat an encounter rather than just standing there and having a slugfest. I specifically mentioned dropping the cave on top of the Honoree because that would be terrifically cool. Make it so there's some sequence of events you have to perform to make it something of a challenge other than hitting the "I Win" button. Other games have mini-puzzles players solve to bypass safes or locked doors as an alternate method to just blowing the thing off its hinges. A recent one I saw involved what is essentially an 8-piece game of Concentration where you have to match up items under a timer.

It seems like the logical outgrowth of the branching storylines we've been getting lately.


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Posted

I agree that would be cool. I love running around DPS-ing stuff to death, but having an option to do something else would be an awful lot more satisfactory for folks who, well, don't love that as much as I do.

Very broadly, something like that is a request that has been floating around the community pretty much from the beginning.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironik View Post
This would be the exact definition of "luck." I assume "10 seconds" is hyperbole because you can't even attack twice in that amount of time, and unless you've got a pocket nuke that's ACTUALLY A NUKE, then this didn't happen. It physically can't.
I know you have to axe to grind, but how exactly is killing him quickly "luck?"


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flarstux View Post
Ya know, I'm starting to wonder if ol' Trapdoor is as buggy as the forum software (waves at whoever hasn't managed to fix this thing yet - logged out twice today, thank you very much). I watched the video of the dark/dark corruptor taking him out very quickly, so naturally I got MY dark/dark corruptor and tried it.

Well.

Even with a Dark Servant *and* a Fortunata Mistress also attacking and my corr going after the clones ASAP his health bar might as well have been made from cast rodinium, adamantium, and a day old Kraft American cheese single.

I finally just said to HELL with it and did something else.

Flashback to - pre-patch - when my WS and a single fluffy kicked his butt. And now we have not fully slotted controllers defeating him in ten seconds or less and my guys who, even though slotted for damage, can barely scratch his paint. Ah, well.
I wonder if he's bifurcating in the walls so that there are clones you don't even know exist and thus insane regen rates.


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Posted

Thats certainly possible.

All I can report is my own experiences, which are kill the clones as they appear and its no issue. Teamed or solo. That works for me.

I also can report reading in a global channel of a player who has recently returned, not realizing the clones gave regen and he was surprised he just could not out do the regen of an EB.



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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Catwhoorg View Post
I also can report reading in a global channel of a player who has recently returned, not realizing the clones gave regen and he was surprised he just could not out do the regen of an EB.
I'm not sure what the devs could do to make it more clear than the flashy pop-up message. I mean, I can sorta see not getting what that means at first, but the combination of that and then not being able to overcome his regen seems like something most people could put together and figure out.


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Red
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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Djeannie View Post
I wonder if he's bifurcating in the walls so that there are clones you don't even know exist and thus insane regen rates.
Anything is possible, but my guess is that would be pretty odd. I get the feeling his clones appear in hand-picked spots. Who knows, though.


Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
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Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by UberGuy View Post
Anything is possible, but my guess is that would be pretty odd. I get the feeling his clones appear in hand-picked spots. Who knows, though.
I speculated as much earlier. I think his clones have static spawns to prevent wonkiness like possibly spawning inside terrain or having their pathing AI get messed up trying to follow Trap.


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Posted

Yeah. Can they even move? They never seem to, but I didn't give them much chance.


Blue
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Red
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Posted

Juuuuuuuust finished the new and "improved" Trapdoor mission with a fire/WP scrapper. Had to call in support to assist. One clone was nothing big and I could still damage his regeneration, but two and I was stonewalled, and as soon as I peeled off to kill one of his (immobile, immune to Confront) clones, he regenerated to full from half health, often spawning another clone. Nemstaffed him into the lava, he regenerated right through it as I hopped all over the room from level to level looking for where the latest clone had spawned.

Now, I don't know that it was that big a deal. I intentionally didn't come prepared, no daggers or shivans, to see how it went. I wonder if that would have done it. In any case, it was trivial to ask someone to come along and just shoot the clones while I beat his ***. One thing that changed is that I was much less inclined to let him live at the end


 

Posted

When I was fighting my way through the all those clones on my Widow, they were often 'paired up' - two in one spot - which suggests they do spawn according to a set pattern. At that time I thought maybe he summoned them in pairs - since they were not an issue with my previous two runs on the arc, I hadn't really paid any attention to them. Later runs proved that to not be the case.


 

Posted

The guy is still a slug-fest. If you don't have the DPS up front, or the Immob to lock him in the lava, your screwed. After two clones, there's no stopping him and he does clone faster after being attacked.


"Samual_Tow - Be disappointed all you want, people. You just don't appreciate the miracles that are taking place here."

 

Posted

My Earth Control/Fiery Assault Dominator (No purple IO sets, no perma-dom, only a few IO sets but otherwise common IOs) was able to hold him after a short period of time chasing and destroying clones. I was able to take him out before he freed himself.

I don't know if luck was a factor or not, but I nailed him to the top of the central platform with Domination / Volcanic gasses and fossilize (both with complete sets of Lockdown with the +2 mag proc, though I did not see the electrical effect indicating that the +2 mag had procced). I was surprised when it happened, and turned back to pour on the damage.

He didn't clone while I had him held, but I took him down fast (I popped everything I could).

Luck? Or is he Holdable at a low Mag? I don't know.


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Posted

My robots/traps MM had no problem bringing Trapdoor down. It was no contest.

My WP/DB tank did have a problem, though. That fight was a perpetual stalemate. At first I thought maybe I could defeat his clones, but that was pretty useless. So I exited the mission and got myself a Shivan and a Snow Beast temp power (and crafted the Backup Radio power just for sake of overkill), and then went back in. That was more than enough to turn the tide in my favor.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mallerick View Post
Luck? Or is he Holdable at a low Mag? I don't know.
He's just a run-of-the-mill EB, so he's not that hard to hold. Looks like mag 6 is required, so three stacked holds for most folks, much less for a Dom with Domination running.


Blue
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Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
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Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA

 

Posted

Just tried him with my Shield/DM tank and as soon as the 2nd pet spawned I had to leave him and kill pets...which took maybe 6-7 hits but he was at full health non the less..this went on for 20 or so minutes trying pulling him, killing pets, putting him in lava...even had friend bring in rad def....this is the 1st time I can recall ever fighting anything that a rad def could not out debuff its regen...so plan C ...he brought in damage and killed the pets while I killed EB...yes, this was a challenge and I don't mind challenges but I have better things to do with my life than fight one mob for 30-40 minutes and I hate FORCED teaming....it's one of the reasons I don't play LOTRO much anymore...I team all the time but not everyone wants to run the same missions over and over..I have a lot of 50s and its boring enough without making it a chore...
Devs, you need to go back and fix this.


 

Posted

I think it's pretty obvious that to defeat Trapdoor you need... more DoTs...


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by AmericanPhantom View Post
Just tried him with my Shield/DM tank and as soon as the 2nd pet spawned I had to leave him and kill pets...which took maybe 6-7 hits but he was at full health non the less..this went on for 20 or so minutes trying pulling him, killing pets, putting him in lava...even had friend bring in rad def....this is the 1st time I can recall ever fighting anything that a rad def could not out debuff its regen
Were you trying to ignore his clones while doing this, because the video I posted in here shows that, in fact, regen debuff levels equivalent to Lingering Radiation work just fine against him... if you defeat his clones. In fact, Lingering Rad recharges faster than Howling Twilight, and I was fighting a +2, so I was at 80% effectiveness.

Quote:
yes, this was a challenge and I don't mind challenges but I have better things to do with my life than fight one mob for 30-40 minutes and I hate FORCED teaming....it's one of the reasons I don't play LOTRO much anymore...
It's not even remotely forced teaming. It may have been forced for that particular character of yours, but it's not even close to forced in general. Forced means to me that no matter who you are or what you bring in terms of powersets, you have to have a team to proceed. This isn't that.


Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA