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nonono..I know you aren't really raging - that's the problem.|
Originally Posted by PuceNonagon
Lol! I'm not really raging, just trying to have some discourse. It's not going so well.
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GIVE IN to your inner-nerd rage. Only then will you understand how we think and feel.
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I didn't say I do it myself, just that others have the right to.|
Originally Posted by PuceNonagon
Attack all the afkers you want. I'm fine with it.
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If you willingly go and sit in the middle of a freeway, you can't complain when you get hit by a car.
unless it is a runaway prius then you can sue toyota.
One thing is pretty apparent, Ill have to play with my graphics settings, or upgrade my graphics card. Even w/o running Ultra, Im seeing a lot of lag now, when before I wasnt getting any.
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I agree 100%.
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Originally Posted by Supermax
I didn't say I do it myself, just that others have the right to.
If you willingly go and sit in the middle of a freeway, you can't complain when you get hit by a car. |
Never argue with stupid people. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
@vanda1 and @nakoa2
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I forget to add that because quite frankly the scoreboard sucks. Doesn't update live, shows individual scores instead of team scores, and is a huge window that you can't realistically keep open during a match unless you're an observer bot (and with those broken no one is going to be watching matches anyways).|
Originally Posted by Phillygirl
You forgot the score board thing in arena. That's new too.
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Originally Posted by B_Witched
unless it is a runaway prius then you can sue toyota.
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@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
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Yeah the 2003 model year for something to do with traction...
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Originally Posted by macskull
...I hear they're recalling some Sequoia models too.
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Haha wow.
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Originally Posted by Rent_
I actually did raise this issue early on in CB. Ignoring players is what they do best.
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Originally Posted by Supermax
Jesus they really are 100% incapable of doing anything without adding 5 new bugs in the process, huh?
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Originally Posted by Supermax
lol god forbid the devs do ANY actual testing themselves.
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People complain that the devs never listen to them, and then say things like the above.
If I got that kind of attitude after every action I made, I'd ignore you too.
Ever stop to think that maybe, just maybe, the devs would be more receptive to your ideas if you weren't such a jerk about it?
Disclaimer: I'm not trying to paint all PvPers with the same brush here. I've just noticed that the people who give the devs the most crap about stuff are also the ones who are the most vocal about them not listening.
Example:
"You suck! Why can't you do your job right?! You're obviously incompetent idiots!"
and then:
"Hey...I have a valid complaint about this thing you did. Why aren't you listening to me?"
You treat them like crap, and then wonder why they don't pay attention when you have a complaint? Makes me think the devs have ignore lists as well.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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Wow.
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Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
That's funny.
People complain that the devs never listen to them, and then say things like the above. If I got that kind of attitude after every action I made, I'd ignore you too. Ever stop to think that maybe, just maybe, the devs would be more receptive to your ideas if you weren't such a jerk about it? Disclaimer: I'm not trying to paint all PvPers with the same brush here. I've just noticed that the people who give the devs the most crap about stuff are also the ones who are the most vocal about them not listening. Example: "You suck! Why can't you do your job right?! You're obviously incompetent idiots!" and then: "Hey...I have a valid complaint about this thing you did. Why aren't you listening to me?" You treat them like crap, and then wonder why they don't pay attention when you have a complaint? Makes me think the devs have ignore lists as well. |
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Are you new? Because you sound like it.|
Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
You treat them like crap, and then wonder why they don't pay attention when you have a complaint?
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Players don't just start talking bad about their developers for no reason. Please learn the history of what happened to PvP in this game since it was introduced. Then we can talk again.
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Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
That's funny.
People complain that the devs never listen to them, and then say things like the above. If I got that kind of attitude after every action I made, I'd ignore you too. Ever stop to think that maybe, just maybe, the devs would be more receptive to your ideas if you weren't such a jerk about it? Disclaimer: I'm not trying to paint all PvPers with the same brush here. I've just noticed that the people who give the devs the most crap about stuff are also the ones who are the most vocal about them not listening. Example: "You suck! Why can't you do your job right?! You're obviously incompetent idiots!" and then: "Hey...I have a valid complaint about this thing you did. Why aren't you listening to me?" You treat them like crap, and then wonder why they don't pay attention when you have a complaint? Makes me think the devs have ignore lists as well. |
A little history lesson for you there champ. We did care. We did play nice. They bent us over and called us a segment. The end.
Hard to treat someone nice at all the does that to you. But hey I am sure you make sure to stroke on people who do you wrong all the time. Not all of us can be the kind of special and awesome that you are though. So go back to whatever section you hang out in and try not to talk about **** you don't know about, deal?
Duel me.
I will work on my sig pic more when I have time.
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Con, who are you to prove the Internet wrong?
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Originally Posted by ConFlict
A little history lesson for you there champ. We did care. We did play nice. They bent us over and called us a segment. The end.
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Support the Mentor Project - http://tinyurl.com/citymentorproject
[JFA2010]Mod08: And I will strike down upon thee (enrious) with great vengence and .... oh wait wrong script
@enrious, @sardonicism, @MyLexiConIsHugeSon
If you haven't joined a global channel, you're not really looking for team.
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Uhh.....wow...o_O
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Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
That's funny.
People complain that the devs never listen to them, and then say things like the above. If I got that kind of attitude after every action I made, I'd ignore you too. Ever stop to think that maybe, just maybe, the devs would be more receptive to your ideas if you weren't such a jerk about it? Disclaimer: I'm not trying to paint all PvPers with the same brush here. I've just noticed that the people who give the devs the most crap about stuff are also the ones who are the most vocal about them not listening. Example: "You suck! Why can't you do your job right?! You're obviously incompetent idiots!" and then: "Hey...I have a valid complaint about this thing you did. Why aren't you listening to me?" You treat them like crap, and then wonder why they don't pay attention when you have a complaint? Makes me think the devs have ignore lists as well. |
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i stoppd reading after ur name, claws and effect... really??|
Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
That's funny.
People complain that the devs never listen to them, and then say things like the above. If I got that kind of attitude after every action I made, I'd ignore you too. Ever stop to think that maybe, just maybe, the devs would be more receptive to your ideas if you weren't such a jerk about it? Disclaimer: I'm not trying to paint all PvPers with the same brush here. I've just noticed that the people who give the devs the most crap about stuff are also the ones who are the most vocal about them not listening. Example: "You suck! Why can't you do your job right?! You're obviously incompetent idiots!" and then: "Hey...I have a valid complaint about this thing you did. Why aren't you listening to me?" You treat them like crap, and then wonder why they don't pay attention when you have a complaint? Makes me think the devs have ignore lists as well. |
wat a joke
http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/6685529/3-hot-and-vex-3
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Check my reg date. It's legit. |
Originally Posted by Supermax
Are you new? Because you sound like it.
Players don't just start talking bad about their developers for no reason. Please learn the history of what happened to PvP in this game since it was introduced. Then we can talk again. |
I am very well aware of what happened to PvP.
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Originally Posted by ConFlict
A little history lesson for you there champ. We did care. We did play nice. They bent us over and called us a segment. The end.
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| Hard to treat someone nice at all the does that to you. But hey I am sure you make sure to stroke on people who do you wrong all the time. Not all of us can be the kind of special and awesome that you are though. So go back to whatever section you hang out in and try not to talk about **** you don't know about, deal? |
Just because you shop at a store doesn't mean you can tell them what to sell. If you don't like what's on the shelf....don't shop there.
I didn't like the PvP changes any more than anyone else did.
But I also had the sense to realize that insulting the people who control whether the things I dislike are ever changed isn't in my best interest. Why didn't you?
Personally, I don't really care if you want to insult the devs because you want to act like they singled you out to screw over. All it accomplishes is making sure they never listen to you again, which doesn't bother me in the slightest.
But, if you choose to be insulting, don't turn around and complain about them ignoring you, because you brought it on yourself.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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Dude, you do realize a huge chunk of the PVP playerbase provided plenty (and I MEAN plenty) of well thought out ideas and suggestions on how to improve PVP. The devs response was i13 which sent a likewise huge chunk of the playerbase to other games. The players who stayed have continued to voice their concerns in constructive suggestions about how to address the problems and the devs have continued (for the most part) to ignore those suggestions. |
Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Check my reg date. It's legit.
I am very well aware of what happened to PvP. I was here for the whole thing. It doesn't really count as history if you were around for it. That makes it a memory. Um.....yeah. They really did you so wrong there by changing their game without your permission. I mean, since you pay a subscription fee and all, they should clear everything through you first, right? Just because you shop at a store doesn't mean you can tell them what to sell. If you don't like what's on the shelf....don't shop there. I didn't like the PvP changes any more than anyone else did. But I also had the sense to realize that insulting the people who control whether the things I dislike are ever changed isn't in my best interest. Why didn't you? Personally, I don't really care if you want to insult the devs because you want to act like they singled you out to screw over. All it accomplishes is making sure they never listen to you again, which doesn't bother me in the slightest. But, if you choose to be insulting, don't turn around and complain about them ignoring you, because you brought it on yourself. |
Luckily for the devs there is and always has been a small PVP population compared to the PVE-centric population othwerwise the devs would all be out of work.
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A store owner would be pretty idiotic to completely ignore his shoppers' requests. Of course he can decide what he wants to sell, but if every 2nd shopper tells him he should sell so and so and not sell so and so, it would be a good idea to listen. Without the shoppers, the store wouldn't exist.|
Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Just because you shop at a store doesn't mean you can tell them what to sell. If you don't like what's on the shelf....don't shop there.
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The above poster is right. If this game's PvP community wasn't so small, the CoH devs would not have a job right now, and it's doubtful they would ever find one in the gaming industry again. That's how badly they failed. Thankfully for them, their decisions lost only a small percentage of the total profit.
But in the end, you know what would fix everything? Honesty. Having them say a single honest thing, instead of the generic PR crap, would be nice. Admitting that I13 was an utter failure would be nice. Saying "yes, you told us this would happen, but we were stupid and didn't listen" would be nice. An apology would be nice. We know it's a fact that I13 failed. They know it's a fact. Yet they continue to lie, saying it's a success....just not "perfect".
Well, they get what they deserve.
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| But I also had the sense to realize that insulting the people who control whether the things I dislike are ever changed isn't in my best interest. Why didn't you? |
If you had the memory you think you do you would remember about 3 people arguing with cool and calm heads. Making valid points and counter points during the **** storm that was i13 beta til i13 release. I was one of those voices. I fought the good fight. While you don't really see me flaming up on the devs I have zero problems with people doing it. I can completely see where they are coming from. Where I do see a problem is when people say our attitude or tone effects the outcome in any manner. As you stated yourself its their game and they really don't care what we say or do. So with that we may as well throw our two cents in. Sucking up or trying to sugar coat it will not help at all.
Again, when you have a clue come back and talk.
Duel me.
I will work on my sig pic more when I have time.
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HAHAHAHA! Huge chunk. Now THAT'S funny.|
Originally Posted by Mercury_Down
...which sent a likewise huge chunk of the playerbase...
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I am so glad that the developers of this game pisses off most PvPers. So, very glad.
As for civility, for every clear headed, intelligent idea, there were hundreds of posts full vitriol and hate by the PvP community. Why would ANYONE want to bother to please people like that, even for money?
It really is simple. It's game, like it and stay or don't and leave. If you are incapable of realizing that, oh well, keep on being miserable I guess.
As for the "I love the game and want it to be better" retort, that's fine, but if the makers of the game want to go in a direction different from yours, that's reality. The developers obviously want the PvP game to be something other than what the hardcore PvPers want it to be. Is it really so hard to see that?
"The side that is unhappy is not the side that the game was intended to make happy, or promised to make happy, or focused on making happy. The side that is unhappy is the side that is unhappy. That's all." - Arcanaville
"Surprised your guys' arteries haven't clogged with all that hatred yet." - Xzero45
I like how the slightest bit of negativity draws all the PvE carebears out of the woodwork.
There's a huge difference between "the makers want to take it in a different direction to make it more fun for everyone, and succeed in doing so" and "the makers want to take it in a different direction to make it more fun for everyone, but utterly fail and the people the changes were intended for still don't participate." All I13 did was drive away most of the existing PvP population and introduce a few new zone scrubs who insist they're good because they get kills thanks to broken mechanics rather than actual skill.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
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I love how PvPers cannot help but pull the carebear card. |
Originally Posted by macskull
I like how the slightest bit of negativity draws all the PvE carebears out of the woodwork.
There's a huge difference between "the makers want to take it in a different direction to make it more fun for everyone, and succeed in doing so" and "the makers want to take it in a different direction to make it more fun for everyone, but utterly fail and the people the changes were intended for still don't participate." All I13 did was drive away most of the existing PvP population and introduce a few new zone scrubs who insist they're good because they get kills thanks to broken mechanics rather than actual skill. |
I agree I13 drove away most of the PvPers at that point.
I agree that the efforts made by the developers have had a negative effect on the number of PvPers.
I think players should attempt to have rational discourse with the developers to get what they want in the game, PvP or not.
But, the mere fact that so many of the PvP players cannot interact with players or developers without name calling and vitriol, would tell me, were I a developer, that the PvP population is not worth trying to court.
BTW. I help manage a multi-million software company. I can tell you point blank that the customers that treat us rationally and civilly get what they want and the ones that don't get shafted, one way or another. Period. The way you interact with humans matters, whether you like, understand it, or not.
"The side that is unhappy is not the side that the game was intended to make happy, or promised to make happy, or focused on making happy. The side that is unhappy is the side that is unhappy. That's all." - Arcanaville
"Surprised your guys' arteries haven't clogged with all that hatred yet." - Xzero45
This thread turned from hopeful to a full out QQ thread.
This is pretty cliche, but the PvE community would have been just as inflamed if the i13 changes were applied to PvE.
Along similar lines: Most people who claim that the "hardcore" PvP community is ____ don't actually know anyone in the "hardcore" PvP community. In fact, most of the "hardcore" PvPers are the same people who run 25 minute STFs alongside PvErs.
Never argue with stupid people. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
@vanda1 and @nakoa2