Purple Drops: +0/8x+Bosses vs +0/8x+No Bosses
By
Cainus,
Posted on: 2010-04-02 17:59 in Player Questions
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It depends entirely on how fast your character can kill bosses compared to lieutenants.|
Originally Posted by chriz2ferx
Which setting is faster statistically for more purples? +0/8x+Bosses or +0/8x+No Bosses?
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The drop rates for Pool A recipes (of which purples are a subset) are as follows:
Minion - 2.666667%
Lieutenant/Sniper - 5.333333%
Boss/Elite Boss - 7.999999%
So, if it takes you any more than roughly 50% longer to kill a boss than to kill a lt, you're worse off with bosses on the map.
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Bosses have a higher chance for drops, so it depends on how fast you can take down bosses. If you're a brute, blaster or scrapper that can destroy a boss and all the minions/LTs in very short order, then you should include bosses. If you're a tanker or controller or something else that takes forever to whittle a boss down, then it will depend on exactly how slow you are at taking down bosses.|
Originally Posted by chriz2ferx
Which setting is faster statistically for more purples? +0/8x+Bosses or +0/8x+No Bosses?
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The answer will vary for different characters and how they fare against certain mobs. Without more information we can't really say. We would need to know how long it takes on average for you to take out a spawn with a bosses vs. one without bosses.
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Just because they both come from the same source, doesn't mean they're part of the same drop pool. Purples have a much lower rate than Pool A, and as far as I know, it's a flat % unrelated to rank.
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Originally Posted by Grouchybeast
The drop rates for Pool A recipes (of which purples are a subset) are as follows:
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"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
When I'm looking for Purples, I generally run at -1/x8, no bosses or AVs. Thus far, I've done about 1 purple per game session.
The downside is that most non-purple set recipes will be lv49, which don't sell as well.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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As far as I understand it (and cross-checking in the wiki), Purples are a Pool A drop. Just a Pool A drop with a very low drop chance. Pool A contains Common, Uncommon, Rare and Ultra Rare recipes in a fixed ratio. It might have changed, but I'm pretty sure that's been tested on live and found to be accurate.
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Originally Posted by Lemur Lad
Just because they both come from the same source, doesn't mean they're part of the same drop pool. Purples have a much lower rate than Pool A, and as far as I know, it's a flat % unrelated to rank.
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Death is part of my attack chain.
Just as a quick question without starting a new thread. Which scrapper would be best for farming?
Willpower has more passive regen than Regen does. Who thought that was a good idea?
Can we get a fix for Energy Melee instead of more new sets?
Quick reply:
Yes.
*SLAPS Cainus* That's not how that works >=(
Gobbledygook: All scarpeprs are pretty well balanced with one another. Some sets are slow to animate and activate, bu in general they have higher damage. Then you have Dual Blades which animate very quickly and smoothly, but iirc it has lower damage.
Spines is good because it has a constant PBAoE and a damage type that's not too resisted. Along that same vien, Dark, Elec, and fire are good secondaries because they oo have a pbaoe aura. They won't protect you the most, but they'll still do well for what you want.
-STEELE =)
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The current understanding is that they are, indeed, pool A. This is based on a variety of testing, things devs have said in betas, etc. Some of the best evidence so far relates to the non-random drop bug, where some maps always dropped a recipe on the same mob from restart to restart. Those mobs would drop purples.|
Originally Posted by Lemur Lad
Just because they both come from the same source, doesn't mean they're part of the same drop pool. Purples have a much lower rate than Pool A, and as far as I know, it's a flat % unrelated to rank.
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As far as we know, when a mob is eligible to drop from multiple pools, it can always drop from all those pools at the same time. For example, I have received a pool A rare and a costume recipe from the same mob. I have never heard of a mob dropping both a purple and a less rare pool recipe.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
I don't have a link atm, but I'm pretty sure I've seen a screenshot from many issues back where a single boss defeat (finishing the last mission of a TF) generated a piece of base salvage, invention salvage, Pool A recipe, Pool B recipe, Pool C recipe, and costume recipe. Whether Purples and/or the pool C random drops from bosses can drop in addition to a pool A drop, I don't know... but I do know you can get plenty of other types together.
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Do the repeatable missions from Borea in the Rikti War Zone have a lower chance for Pool A recipes, or am I just terribly unlucky? (also, does anyone know of a contact who offers repeatable Circle of Thorns missions heroside?)
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Missions that aren't in the AE have no influence over drop rate. Drop probabilities are defined at the mob rank level. All minions have a certain chance to drop something, all LTs a different chance, and so on. A check is made for every drop pool and category a mob can drop.|
Originally Posted by Kierthos
Do the repeatable missions from Borea in the Rikti War Zone have a lower chance for Pool A recipes, or am I just terribly unlucky? (also, does anyone know of a contact who offers repeatable Circle of Thorns missions heroside?)
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If you do get a drop for a given category, what you get within that category is random, and controlled by additional weighting. For example, from a mob you can get a common, an uncommon, a rare, or a purple, all (as we understand it) from the same drop pool. Obviously, you are much more likely to get a common than anything else, and more likely to get an uncommon than a purple, etc.)
What mission you're in isn't supposed to matter at all. The AE is clearly distinct and separate. It's worth noting that the AE mobs are separate from the ones we meet in the "normal" game - they can be modified to have different powers or powers that work differently without affecting the regular PvE versions of those mobs. This may also be how they have a completely different drop mechanic - they only drop from the "ticket pool".
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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It probably makes sense that "pool C" boss drops are actually in their own pool. I am not sure there is any other way to assign them to bosses only. My understanding is that "Pool E", the one with costume drops in it, was only supposed to drop from minions, so I'm not sure it's reasonable that a boss defeat generated a costume drop.|
Originally Posted by Doctor_Kumquat
I don't have a link atm, but I'm pretty sure I've seen a screenshot from many issues back where a single boss defeat (finishing the last mission of a TF) generated a piece of base salvage, invention salvage, Pool A recipe, Pool B recipe, Pool C recipe, and costume recipe. Whether Purples and/or the pool C random drops from bosses can drop in addition to a pool A drop, I don't know... but I do know you can get plenty of other types together.
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Another thing to be careful of is how to interpret reward messages in a team context. You can defeat something and then immediately get a reward from someone else on your team essentially simultaneously defeating something else. If that boss in the example above was the only thing anyone was fighting then it suggests that what we think we know and what is going on may be two different things. But if anyone was fighting anything else as the TF ended, the correct interpretation really isn't clear.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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Here's my other question, and maybe this should be directed towards the OP, but here goes anyway. Why ignore the -1 setting for difficulty? Does that diminish the amount of LTs in a mish?
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Originally Posted by EmperorSteele
*SLAPS Cainus* That's not how that works >=(
Gobbledygook: All scarpeprs are pretty well balanced with one another. Some sets are slow to animate and activate, bu in general they have higher damage. Then you have Dual Blades which animate very quickly and smoothly, but iirc it has lower damage. Spines is good because it has a constant PBAoE and a damage type that's not too resisted. Along that same vien, Dark, Elec, and fire are good secondaries because they oo have a pbaoe aura. They won't protect you the most, but they'll still do well for what you want. |
Willpower has more passive regen than Regen does. Who thought that was a good idea?
Can we get a fix for Energy Melee instead of more new sets?
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Recipes other than purples will be worth significantly less than if they dropped at level 50.
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Originally Posted by Gobbledygook
Here's my other question, and maybe this should be directed towards the OP, but here goes anyway. Why ignore the -1 setting for difficulty? Does that diminish the amount of LTs in a mish?
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@Demobot
Also on Steam
I know that you said you are not concerned about non-purple recipes but something to still consider when you have bosses in the run is that a boss has a small chance of dropping a TF recipe instead of a normal recipe and that can be worth having them in the mix.
As others have said the real balancing factor if they are worth being in the mix is how long it takes to take out the boss. If it slows the run down significantly then it is not worth having them there.
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Purples are Pool A.
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Do EB's have the chance to drop Pool C or only regular bosses? I think I asked this once before but even searching my own posts I couldn't find the answer.
"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
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Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
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Anyone have an answer for this?
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Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade
Do EB's have the chance to drop Pool C or only regular bosses? I think I asked this once before but even searching my own posts I couldn't find the answer.
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"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
I THINK I got a Pool C drop off an EB, but I'm not positive.
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Archie Gremlin's Dropstats program lumps Bosses and EBs together when parsing for Pool C/D drops. You might PM him and ask if he knows for certain. With all the data he was collecting, if anyone knows, it would be him. Though, it's been a few months since his last post, so he may not be active atm.
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Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade
Do EB's have the chance to drop Pool C or only regular bosses? I think I asked this once before but even searching my own posts I couldn't find the answer.
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Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade
Anyone have an answer for this?
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I once got a Pool C drop from a CoT Portal, which I believe is labeled "Object." At the very least, this tells me that it's possible for things that are not labeled as Boss-class to give the Pool C drops, and if an Object can drop one, I'd be surprised if an EB can't.
(And ever since, I've had a harder time ignoring those stupid portal rooms...)
My postings to this forum are not to be used as data in any research study without my express written consent.
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I too also run my level 50 MM Bots/Traps at -1/+8 though I am not as lucky as you on 1 purple per game session. I recently posted a thread in Markets and Inventions titled "My Second Purple". Yes, that's right, only two purples in the past month and a half. Now, I have not been playing my MM at full-bore as I have other toons that I am working on. I do agree though that a large majority of drops are more 49's versus 50's being that I am running a -1 versus +0 or +1. |
Originally Posted by Fleeting Whisper
When I'm looking for Purples, I generally run at -1/x8, no bosses or AVs. Thus far, I've done about 1 purple per game session.
The downside is that most non-purple set recipes will be lv49, which don't sell as well. |
To be honest, I have tried the +0 and +1, I have found it to be much more difficult to clear a group without getting slaughtered. If I need to raise my level up to +0 to give me a better percentage to get purples, then that's what I need to do. But, it seems based on what wiki says and from what I read in some of these posts, to get a purple is more of a random thing based on how many kills you average. The level of the foe should have no baring on this. Though, I am still a bit confused because as the original poster of this thread stated, there are different answers to this question and having something that is more concrete would be wonderful in knowing the best possible odds at getting more purples.
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Purples are part of Pool A drops. Any time you get a Pool A drop, there is a chance of it being a Purple (or Super Rare) drop. Can't tell you the exact percentage, however.| Though, I am still a bit confused because as the original poster of this thread stated, there are different answers to this question and having something that is more concrete would be wonderful in knowing the best possible odds at getting more purples. |
If an NPC can drop a level 50 common/non-set IO upon defeat, it can drop a Purple. So, mobs 47+ can drop Purples.
Pool A are dropped from NPC defeats, on a chance. Thus, the more mobs you defeat, the more chances at a Pool A, which in turn mean more chances at a Purple.
Actual level does not change any drop chances. So the decision to play at -1 (and mow down mobs a bit faster) and +0 is based on, usually, the fact that most people would rather get that extra .1% on their enhancement values, and pay way more for level 50 recipes in a set than 49s.
So if going for purples only, I'd say -1. Money, +0.
As to bosses - as posted above, bosses have a nearly 8% chance to drop a Pool A of any kind, while Lts are about 5%, and minions lower. But bosses have more HP, thus if you take twice as long defeating a boss compared to a LT, most would recommend you go "No bosses".
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When I search, I not only get conflicting answers to this, but also a lot of outdated answers, meaning this may have changed over time
Goal: Purple drops
Let's assume influence, salvage, and non-purple drops are of no concern
Let's also ignore the existence of the -1 difficulty setting for now
I have a nicely geared level 50 farmer running level 50 non-AE missions
I am soloing
Which setting is faster statistically for more purples? +0/8x+Bosses or +0/8x+No Bosses?
Thanks in advance!