Why do the devs hate COV?
By
Acanous_Quietus,
Posted on: 2008-01-06 17:57 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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No? Pretty much everything else that villains do has Arachnos sticking their nose in it... to suddenly take that element out without explanation is a bit strange. Of course, Freedom Corps doesn't say much about the invasion either, but for heroes it's sort of expected that they're going to go help save the world.
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Not exactly true. Most of your storyarcs have you freelancing as a mercenary. Even the ones that have you working with an arachnos contact usually tell you that you are an agent that they can deny works for them. It seems to me that for the most part Arachnos doesn't care what you do, as long as you don't interfere too heavily with their operations.
@Deadedge and @Dead Edge
Peace through power! Freedom is slavery!
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a yo-yo
Okay, then here's a thought, why has Recluse allowed an -ambassador- to remain alive in his tower after having it bombed every couple of hours. I loved the RWZ but it needed more thought from a few more angles. There are too many opportunities to make a profit off the Vanguard, heck finding out who the honoree is should net you the biggest black mail in existence, that is if you even know how he is *the vanguard think you know but you've never heard his name ever in CoV :P* So yeah, as great as it was there are some things that are a little odd... Like recluse's alliance with the rikti that bombed him and yet here he is turning the other cheek with a smile. You can't tac on new things without considering the old, Recluse should have at least said something or given an explanation on the situation to the Destined ones.
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Okay, then here's a thought, why has Recluse allowed an -ambassador- to remain alive in his tower after having it bombed every couple of hours. I loved the RWZ but it needed more thought from a few more angles. There are too many opportunities to make a profit off the Vanguard, heck finding out who the honoree is should net you the biggest black mail in existence, that is if you even know how he is *the vanguard think you know but you've never heard his name ever in CoV :P* So yeah, as great as it was there are some things that are a little odd... Like recluse's alliance with the rikti that bombed him and yet here he is turning the other cheek with a smile. You can't tac on new things without considering the old, Recluse should have at least said something or given an explanation on the situation to the Destined ones.
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Sometimes countries/entities at war have modes of communication, like a diplomat or negotiator.
@Deadedge and @Dead Edge
Peace through power! Freedom is slavery!
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a yo-yo
Yea, there's a lot of ways they could have worked Ambassador Kuhr'Rekt's presence into the story for I10. He could have been there as cover, could have been there to pass info on, could have been turned off for the duration, etc. etc... But the point is, they didn't bother to do anything with him. He's still sitting there in Grandville sticking out like a sore thumb and passing out missions to villains who come asking while his kind and bombing the city.
Part of the problem is, frankly IMHO, villains need goals. As things are, you can be... a lackey of Arachnos, a lackey of Arachnos, or hey! you can be a lackey of Arachnos! And as you advance you can become a higher paid, more feared and respected... lackey of Arachnos. Hmm.
Six of one, half a dozen of the other.
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Yea, there's a lot of ways they could have worked Ambassador Kuhr'Rekt's presence into the story for I10. He could have been there as cover, could have been there to pass info on, could have been turned off for the duration, etc. etc... But the point is, they didn't bother to do anything with him. He's still sitting there in Grandville sticking out like a sore thumb and passing out missions to villains who come asking while his kind and bombing the city.
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I'm almost positive it was in an outer-site interview, but Positron said it would take a couple issues for all the storyline inconsistencies resulting from Issue 10 to be worked out. (A contact heroside getting leery of a second invasion, for example)
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He's still sitting there in Grandville sticking out like a sore thumb and passing out missions to villains who come asking while his kind and bombing the city.
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and a villain should care about that why exactly?
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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He's still sitting there in Grandville sticking out like a sore thumb and passing out missions to villains who come asking while his kind and bombing the city.
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and a villain should care about that why exactly?
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That's actually a good point.
"Ok, I need you to *BOOM!* go and steal these weapons *BOOM!* and plant them."
"Hey, think you can *BOOM!* call them off?"
"Ohhhhh.... yeaaaaaaaaah, I'm gonna have to veto that, mmmkay?" *BOOM BOOM BOOM!* "I'll let them know you're ok, though."
"the reason there are so many sarcastic pvpers is we already had a better version of pvp taken away from us to appease bad players. Back then we chuckled at how bad players came here and whined. If we knew that was the actual voice devs would listen to instead of informed, educated players we probably would have been bigger dicks back then." -ConFlict
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Thing is, Recluse WAS allied to the Rikti, untill they ATTACKED HIS ISLES.
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And like any super-powerful villain, he immediately ran inside his tower and locked the door, and no one's heard from him since.
Seriously, what does he think about the fact that his "Destined Ones" are running off to join the Vanguard and play around in Paragon City?
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You'd have to ask him directly.
Which means that unless this is actually addressed in-storyline, there's no reason to even care.
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No? Pretty much everything else that villains do has Arachnos sticking their nose in it... to suddenly take that element out without explanation is a bit strange. Of course, Freedom Corps doesn't say much about the invasion either, but for heroes it's sort of expected that they're going to go help save the world.
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Except that the entire Arachnos storyline is contrived BroadSword anyway.
It's part of the many reasons why I stopped bothering with Villainside. The arcs are just plain bad.
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He's still sitting there in Grandville sticking out like a sore thumb and passing out missions to villains who come asking while his kind and bombing the city.
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and a villain should care about that why exactly?
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Curiosity? Insurance? Awareness? It seems irrelevant whether one is good or evil from where I'm standing. You see an ambassador being welcomed into a city that's being bombed by the very people he represents. It's unusual, so it seems only natural that everyone who has to deal with him should care.
It's sort of like going to speak with Lord Recluse one day and he asks you how you want your name spelled on your gravestone. Kind of makes sense to ask why he needs to know that, no?
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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What makes you think that, as a villain, my own safety is somehow not my concern? I see the ambassador of a faction that's actively trying to kill me, and your response is "you're a villain, what do you care?"
Simply put, ambassador is now on my hit list. I shouldn't be doing jobs for him, I should be taking him out.
Depending on the villain, anyway. To some, the bombs are just an annoyance, if that. Then again, so is the entire Rikti "threat"....
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It seems irrelevant whether one is good or evil from where I'm standing.
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It seems very important from where I'm standing.
And this is why RP arguments about game mechanics are a pointless waste of time.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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What makes you think that, as a villain, my own safety is somehow not my concern? I see the ambassador of a faction that's actively trying to kill me, and your response is "you're a villain, what do you care?"
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See my post above about RP arguments being pointless.
Your opinion is only valid for your character and carries no weight in my fantasy world, and vice versa.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
You asked why a villain would care. We answered you.
If you don't want questions answered, don't ask them.
Yes, that includes rhetorical questions.
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None of my villains care. The ones that are high enough to have done Khur'rekt and RWZ see it as good business, but then lucky for me most of my villains really are mercenaries out to make a buck (oh and blow stuff up, they all tend to like explosions).
@Deadedge and @Dead Edge
Peace through power! Freedom is slavery!
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a yo-yo
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You asked why a villain would care. We answered you.
If you don't want questions answered, don't ask them.
Yes, that includes rhetorical questions.
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It takes a certain type of literal minded drone to answer a clearly rhetorical question with a straight face and then complain about being responded to.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
Text does not translate emotion. All questions and answers are flat. Keep that in mind.
And don't ask stupid questions.
And yes, there ARE stupid questions.
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You asked why a villain would care. We answered you.
If you don't want questions answered, don't ask them.
Yes, that includes rhetorical questions.
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It takes a certain type of literal minded drone to answer a clearly rhetorical question with a straight face and then complain about being responded to.
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Answering a rhetorical question is no more absurd than challenging a statement. In reality, that's all a rhetorical question is - a statement in the form of a question. You made a statement, then dismissed the responses given to you on a base of nothing other than that they do not apply. I'm afraid I'm having a difficult time accepting that.
You suggest a villain wouldn't care about Khur'rekt's continual presence in Grandville even though the faction he represents is now openly attaching. I don't see that, and offered you reason why a villain should care. But tell me, then: if RP arguments do not apply, why even bring up the question about a villain caring? How is this anything BUT an RP argument?
If your assertion is that a player of CoV shouldn't care about an inconsistency in the plotline, then I'm afraid I cannot agree. The plotline is an integral part of the game, and like any other, we don't want it to be broken. If we accept that people shouldn't care about this particular inconsistency, then by the same logic we can accept they shouldn't care about any bit of story the game has to offer, because "why would we?" I don't think that's what the developers have in mind for the game, though.
So, for a change, I'd like to hear a reason for validity of what you're saying, rather than a statement of fact. And before you take the trouble to post it, yes, it is very good that I'm not a supreme authority and people don't have to listen to me about what they care about. I'm asking for reason, not submission.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I almost never play Villain-Side, but I seriously hope that the upcoming issue is almost entirely Villain focused, if only so these posts will go away.
CoV has a higher percentage of polished missions than does CoH, but it has less variety too (even if the variety portion in CoH tends to be the earlier more generic missions given by standard city contacts).
So here's hoping that there'll be another bought of wacky island hijinks available for all you red side focused folks.
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I doubt that will work. It's been like this since CoV launch or shortly thereafter. I-7 gave CoV the Mayhem missions and added 40-50 level content. I-8 gave heroes the safeguard missions and revamped one zone that no one harldy ever used. So they were roughly alternating in focus.
I-9 then added the invention system as it's main feature, I-10 added a new co-op zone and high level content with the Rikti invasion as its main feature. I-11 featured Ourorobos allowing you to revisit content and new sets for the 4 melee ATs, two each side. So the last three have been more or less equal to both CoH and CoV.
And yet somehow the Devs hate CoV and don't do anything for it, only for CoH. It's not true at all, regardless of how many recurring threads we see that say so.
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Really? are we play the same game here? villina need GV rework or give a new zone much more the fault line need revamp just because ppl dont go there. thast BS. Ppl have no choice but to go to GV , faultline is skipable. So where were the dev priorties there? Mayham missions are REQUIRED tin cov. you have to run them to get contacts and you NEED them to fill in content gap. you CANT solo from 1-50 and not do a single paper mission. Hero side got radio just cause we got something that we NEEDED. radio missions are just more fluff and content for them to play with. but villian side its a nessesity. As far as RWZ were is the real co-op. its hero missions that let villian tag along. my villians aren't into saving longbow and other vanguard. leave that crap for heros. As far as the O stuff goes. again hero content. coming storm? what do i really care as a villian? coming storm=more greif for statesman and if recluse is consered with it then. then great. he'll be distracted and wont notice me and my plans. why do i care about 'helping' im a villian.
So plz , befor you post actualy think about what was giving to who and why first. then look at the actualy content. the 'added" stuff aint so villiany if you look at it. villians 'NEED" more villians content . Actualy be villian like. its bad when you have to 'kidnap' some1 and at the end of the mission they tell you 'thank you'. wth is wrong with that pic.
Lets not even talk about pvp balance, lack of SF , trials ,PPP vs APP, lack of Epic AT after 2yrs do i really need to go on? seriously dude wake up. though i enjoy cov very much. it is vastly lacking in content. and if after 1yr nothing has closed the disparity gap and in fact by your own post . hero actualy got more the villians this yr. when it was hero that already had 2x more as it was.
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CoH has a bigger population, who whine more, and whine louder than the CoV community. They hold forum population majority. CoV was made specifically to generate more econ to pump into CoH. The devs can save both time and funds simply by creating co-content that short-changes CoV but is specifically, for some reason, beneficial and useful to players of CoH. Any and all one-sided villain content is eventually transferred to CoH and given a buff. Content that was originally hero-side, will, with some reluctance, will be given to CoV. However, said content will be thouroughly re-worked, and it will be stated said content will be 'more powerful' than its hero counterpart, and it will turn out to be craptastic in comparison. Villain issues will be backburnered in favor of hero issues. There will never be any more villain-side only content, but expect more hero-side only content in the near future.
The Devs do not give a [censored] about CoV in the short run. They only care about it as long as it brings in money so they can fuel blue-side, which in turn, means they have to make a few mediocure attempts at improving the red-side content. They do so slowly, reluctantly, and poorly.
That turned into a rant. All of the above is OPINION, only SOME of it is necessarily fact.
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This entire thread is a good testament to why I'm not enjoying the game right now.
The side I'm playing, I've done all I want in, and the other side gets shafted in terms of fun content.
Maybe the devs can tell us why they hate COV?
or..
Maybe they don't hate it, but are incompetent nincompoops?
The way I see it is the troll who started the thread is no longer responding in it. We all agree that the devs do not hate CoV, and we ALL agree that CoV needs a little extra love each issue. I think this point it would be best to start (or have a mod start) a consolidated thread in the suggestions form, to outline some things that will make CoV better.
Right now this thread is going back to reasonable people arguing over small things.
Types of Swords
My Portfolio
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Maybe the devs can tell us why they hate COV?
or..
Maybe they don't hate it, but are incompetent nincompoops?
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Is it just me or does this thread seem to repeat itself every few days?
Perhaps I should bow out of the thread. We've gone over many things that could be done to help CoV... in some cases more than once. Our voice has been heard, methinks.
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Thing is, Recluse WAS allied to the Rikti, untill they ATTACKED HIS ISLES.
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And like any super-powerful villain, he immediately ran inside his tower and locked the door, and no one's heard from him since.
Seriously, what does he think about the fact that his "Destined Ones" are running off to join the Vanguard and play around in Paragon City?
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You'd have to ask him directly.
Which means that unless this is actually addressed in-storyline, there's no reason to even care.
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No? Pretty much everything else that villains do has Arachnos sticking their nose in it... to suddenly take that element out without explanation is a bit strange. Of course, Freedom Corps doesn't say much about the invasion either, but for heroes it's sort of expected that they're going to go help save the world.