[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sure then give blaster mez protection also.
[/ QUOTE ]
Seriously, though. Give everyone mez protection, just a little bit.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'd buy into something like this. Change the way all MEZ works. DONT let toggles drop when mezzed. Toggles should stay up as long as you have the END to use them. But change Tank, Brute, and Scrapper MEZ protection to MEZ resistance (the way Accelerate Metabolism works).
That would give the 'Tank' classes the ability to absorb much more damage at all times. They could be held in place here and there, but the status effect would end much sooner than normal. And while under status, no toggles would drop.
Then you give some limited MEZ protection to the squishy classes, and take away their resistances. This makes them truly vulnerable to raw damage. If they get caught up in a brawl they are in a bad spot. But you give them more opportunity to avoid getting put in that bad spot. It also lets the support archetypes do more support due to less frequest MEZ downtime.
It also seems more 'comic-booky' to me. Superman gets held here and there but he doesnt need to become squishy at the same time.
[ QUOTE ]
Scrappers out damage blasters in melee. Blasters AT mod is 1, while scrappers is 1.125. Scrappers also get unresistable criticals of 2x damage 5% of the time, which can be compared to Blasters 33% unresistable damage.
[/ QUOTE ]
The mods don't matter. Blappers can do more damage in quick spikes than a Scrapper can hope to attain reliably. Certainly when Headsplitter crits its more, but that is unreliable. Blappers can do that level of damage in shots all the time, everytime. I'm not championing more changes, I want to see what happens with the WW and toggle dropping being toned down before more adjustments are made that hurt blapping.
[ QUOTE ]
Energy Melee's Stuns coupled with toggle dropping pretty much make the damage a secondary effect. While the blasters (who have little or no mez protections) are used to functioning with break frees active, most scrappers are not, as they rely on their inherent protection powers to keep them safe.
[/ QUOTE ]
Since PvP is balanced around teams I don't understand this statement. A Blapper only needs to pop Break Frees proactively if he doesn't have decent buffing. The problem is that a Blapper buffed up has only slightly lower safety and greater killing power than a Scrapper with the same buffs.
Thorizdin
Lords of the Dead
Old School Legends
[ QUOTE ]
if you get more people to post the same thread over and over again in all the forums I bet you can get blasters nerfed some more hell you might even get it implemented in I7 why wait till tommorow if you can do it today lol.......
[/ QUOTE ]
Of course this might enrage enough the dedicated blaster out there to stop playing their mains and _all_ roll up scrappers. Of course then the number of scrappers online doubles and nothing would be left alive in any zones.
[ QUOTE ]
Of course, this would all be a moot point if PvP weren't predicated and designed around 5-second battles.
If they'd go and do a global damage nerf against PvP targets, we'd get knock-down, drag-out fights that ... wow ... would feel comic-y.
Then, the scrappers could shut up, because their high DPS would matter more than the burst that a blaster's able to do with three powers. Of course, you'd have to let the blasters kite in such a situation, too, so by this time you're not really talking about City of Heroes/Villains anymore.
It'd sure be nice if a PvP one-on-one was more like an elite boss or AV battle than a lieutenant one.
[/ QUOTE ]
Extended cat n' mouse or slugfest fights are fun when they happen 1v1, but it's just not practical to support that in the team game. PvP rewards would have to be rebalanced around the idea that hardly anyone would ever die. For one thing, healing and buffing would have to get nerfed through the floor or nobody would ever die. Can you imagine a team of AVs fighting a team of AVs, each with pocket empaths healing them to full on every hit? It'd be worse than watching a Night Widow on Night Widow gladiator fight.
Uh-oh. Tough questions emerging about AT system! 
Blaster: "Hey, why does a Scrapper get both superior damage and superior defenses?"
That's because Scrappers take such a risk to fight in melee range.
Blaster: "But I take a *greater* risk at melee range, right?"
That's right.
Blaster: "To do less damage than the Scrapper would? Why?"
Because you're a Blaster.
Going by those descriptions on the AT select screen, one might think Blasters are the "damage kings," but the actual multipliers combined with the time one can survive to inflict damage in most real-world situations suggest to many that the Scrapper comes out on top. On the other hand, the Tanker description states they are second only to the Scrapper in melee power, and of course Blasters trump them there, so at least Blasters are out-meleeing *someone.*
[ QUOTE ]
The biggest problem is that many who play melee ATs refuse to alter their tactics from what they use in PvE.
[/ QUOTE ]
I think this has a large part to do with it. I know the first couple times I PvPed with my scrapper I would go in with no breakfrees. Why bother when I have mez protection, right? And like other people said, when you hear bu and aim, just back off for ten seconds.
[ QUOTE ]
But, as far as I can tell, the blaster community is by far the whiniest community in this game, and definately the one with the least reason to whine.
[/ QUOTE ]
a lil pot calling the kettle black?
Mister Weekly's BOOM box - Lvl 50 ar/FIRE/fire/
Hellion Girlfriend - EM/Stone brute
I have a few 50's...
[ QUOTE ]
In other words, despite your toggle powers protections, pretend you don't have them and prepare based on that -- because those protections will be knocked down at some point.
[/ QUOTE ]
I can't believe no one picked up on this. More nerfs!!! I love it!!! Keep em' coming!!! I wanna see everybody nerfed down to Brawl and Flurry!!!!!!!!!
Dude, he's not saying he's going to nerf mez protection...
He's saying that if a Blaster and a Scrapper were to fight, The Scrapper had better prepare to fight him like he has no toggles, because said Blaster will Detoggle him and he WON'T have those toggles.
In other words: Scrappers should pop breakfrees BEFORE the fight instead of only after they get mezzed. Read the whole thing and you'll see it. This was only clarified 40 times...
[ QUOTE ]
I'm all for it, it would'nt really diminish an Ice/EM's ability, just make it harder to play. People seem to forget the reason that /EM is so good is conserver power and boost range, not bone smasher and total focus.
[/ QUOTE ]
People forget? No, it's just not true. Bonesmasher is the premier power from the Energy Manipulation set for PvP. Boost range is completely optional. A strong PvP build doesn't rely on range, because blasters don't do enough damage at range to kill anyone before they die. They survive on burst damage, so in PvP, they have to make heavy use of their secondary sets to be very strong. I'm sure that ranged blasters *can* be effective against certain enemies, but the universally dangerous blaster relies on high burst damage and toggle dropping.
Since Blasters have less defenses, balance suggests they should do more damage in melee.
But...
Blaster's melee damage is part of their Secondary, and therefore should do less damage than a Scrapper's Primary.
Hmmm...
If the two factors balance out, maybe they should do roughly equal damage to Scrappers in melee
Hey!
That's how it works now!
Maybe the Devs are ahead of us on this one...
Story Arcs I created:
Every Rose: (#17702) Villainous vs Legacy Chain. Forget Arachnos, join the CoT!
Cosplay Madness!: (#3643) Neutral vs Custom Foes. Heroes at a pop culture convention!
Kiss Hello Goodbye: (#156389) Heroic vs Custom Foes. Film Noir/Hardboiled detective adventure!
[ QUOTE ]
A blaster's melee damage was lower than a scrappers, for the most part? So Blapper's dont out scrap, scrappers.
[/ QUOTE ]
Blappers don't outscrap Scrappers. They outdamage Scrappers in melee, but damaging is only part of scrapping. The other part is surviving damage. Consider sending in a Regen scrapper into a +1 Hazard zone spawn, vs sending in a Blapper.
How much more incoming damage can a Scrapper survive than a Blapper? Easily 2x as much. Probably 4-5x as much. Do Blappers do 2x as much DPS in melee than Scrappers? No.
And that's completely ignoring the mez resistance that Scrappers have and Blappers do not.
It seems to me that if you lower Blapper damage to balance them differently with Scrappers, then you would need to raise Blapper/Blaster defenses. And I don't see that happening at all.
[ QUOTE ]
Sure then give blaster mez protection also.
[/ QUOTE ]
Part of the problem here is that people are playing poorly against blappers. Blappers are all about front-end damage. If you survive their alpha, you should be able to get an advantage against them every second you stay alive. I've PvP's with my ice/en mostly in Siren's, but I can't imagine how I'd take on a regen scrapper, for example. If they turn on IH, for example, I have NO WAY to kill them, period, until it ends. My damage is simply not high enough to overcome their hp, and after BU+aim wear off, it's a totaly joke. Against an enemy with a click defense power, again, I'm screwed. Elude, MoG, Unstoppable are all the end of me.
In fact, any heal sort of wrecks me. Once BU+aim are gone, my damage is not so impressive any more. We get one shotted by stalkers, one and two shotted by scrappers, and overcoming the defenses of a brute is a task, let alone a tank which is hopeless.
I do think *certain* blapping powers are overpowered as toggle droppers. As much as I love it, Bonesmasher feels abusive, frankly. But that's already being nerfed in I7, no?
At this point, no one should be even considering any sort of nerfing of blasters or blapping until significant I7 data is in.
Keep in mind also that level is an important thing. Blaster's high end powers don't really make a huge difference in PvP. You can have Bonesmasher, Energy Punch, BU+aim all by like L10 or L12, and that's all you need to be REALLY dangerous. At the high end, you're getting stuff like nukes that is useless in PvP (while scrappers are getting headsplitter), and at best you get the marginal Total Focus while scrappers are getting stuff like MoG and Unstoppable. (And if you're not /EM, then you are getting crap like hot feet)
defiance makes blasters stronger than scrappers.
[ QUOTE ]
Dude, he's not saying he's going to nerf mez protection...
He's saying that if a Blaster and a Scrapper were to fight, The Scrapper had better prepare to fight him like he has no toggles, because said Blaster will Detoggle him and he WON'T have those toggles.
In other words: Scrappers should pop breakfrees BEFORE the fight instead of only after they get mezzed. Read the whole thing and you'll see it. This was only clarified 40 times...
[/ QUOTE ]
If, as the devs had said, toggle dropping is going to be toned down/ditched......then this statement from Castle contradicts that. But believe what you want dude. After all, it has been clarified "40 times".
[ QUOTE ]
If, as the devs had said, toggle dropping is going to be toned down/ditched......then this statement from Castle contradicts that.
[/ QUOTE ] Toned down is nowhere near 'ditched'. It's lowered in frequency yes, but not completely removed. So take it to mean that even after toggle dropping's reduced in frequency it's still going to happen. You are, however, probably going to see less attacks that can drop three toggles at a time, with likely somewhat lower frequencies of the detoggles happening.
MA Arcs: Yarmouth 1509 and 58812
[ QUOTE ]
Energy Melee's Stuns coupled with toggle dropping pretty much make the damage a secondary effect. While the blasters (who have little or no mez protections) are used to functioning with break frees active, most scrappers are not, as they rely on their inherent protection powers to keep them safe.
In other words, despite your toggle powers protections, pretend you don't have them and prepare based on that -- because those protections will be knocked down at some point.
[/ QUOTE ]
What do you mean, most scrappers aren't used to functioning with Break Frees active? I get held all the time whenever I take my scrappers into a PvP zone. Toggle dropping is so prevalent that I might as well not even turn Integration/Unyielding on, unless I'm fighting someone who relies on stacking holds (i.e. controller). Mostly it's blasters and stalkers, and against them, those status powers are worthless.
The only way I can function effectively, on ANY character, is to have a ton of Break Frees. This is the main reason I don't like PvP. When fights come down to "who has more inspirations", what's the point?
Skip
My Char. List and Market Transactions
HeroStats Developer
Legion of Valor
Iron Eagles
[ QUOTE ]
Part of the problem here is that people are playing poorly against blappers. Blappers are all about front-end damage. If you survive their alpha, you should be able to get an advantage against them every second you stay alive. I've PvP's with my ice/en mostly in Siren's, but I can't imagine how I'd take on a regen scrapper, for example. If they turn on IH, for example, I have NO WAY to kill them, period, until it ends. My damage is simply not high enough to overcome their hp, and after BU+aim wear off, it's a totaly joke. Against an enemy with a click defense power, again, I'm screwed. Elude, MoG, Unstoppable are all the end of me.
In fact, any heal sort of wrecks me. Once BU+aim are gone, my damage is not so impressive any more. We get one shotted by stalkers, one and two shotted by scrappers, and overcoming the defenses of a brute is a task, let alone a tank which is hopeless.
I do think *certain* blapping powers are overpowered as toggle droppers. As much as I love it, Bonesmasher feels abusive, frankly. But that's already being nerfed in I7, no?
At this point, no one should be even considering any sort of nerfing of blasters or blapping until significant I7 data is in.
Keep in mind also that level is an important thing. Blaster's high end powers don't really make a huge difference in PvP. You can have Bonesmasher, Energy Punch, BU+aim all by like L10 or L12, and that's all you need to be REALLY dangerous. At the high end, you're getting stuff like nukes that is useless in PvP (while scrappers are getting headsplitter), and at best you get the marginal Total Focus while scrappers are getting stuff like MoG and Unstoppable. (And if you're not /EM, then you are getting crap like hot feet)
[/ QUOTE ]
Most pvpers know how to handle blasters. The problem is that most good blasters ONLY go near their target when BU and AIM are up. They jump in with a quick string of toggle drop atts and joust away with hi powered ranged attacks for the finish. The rest of the time theyll run for the hills in PFF like a Mexican jumping bean on crack. This applies to arena and pvp zones. Now if you dont have a way of stopping an opponent like this dead in their track during that 5 secs of burst dmg, then your in trouble.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sure then give blaster mez protection also.
[/ QUOTE ]
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, its called "Pool powers", ever hear of them? 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sure then give blaster mez protection also.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, its called "Pool powers", ever hear of them?
[/ QUOTE ]
Gee, I think I detect sarcasm.
Skip
My Char. List and Market Transactions
HeroStats Developer
Legion of Valor
Iron Eagles
Didnt have my coffee yet. 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sure then give blaster mez protection also.
[/ QUOTE ]
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, its called "Pool powers", ever hear of them?
[/ QUOTE ]
Dang, I missed the pool power that allows me to get Stun or Sleep protection on my squishies. Thanks for pointing it out to me.
Aid Self gives you resistance to Disorient. And Health resists Sleep. Although resists arent protection.
[ QUOTE ]
Scrappers out damage blasters in melee. Blasters AT mod is 1, while scrappers is 1.125. Scrappers also get unresistable criticals of 2x damage 5% of the time, which can be compared to Blasters 33% unresistable damage.
Energy Melee's Stuns coupled with toggle dropping pretty much make the damage a secondary effect. While the blasters (who have little or no mez protections) are used to functioning with break frees active, most scrappers are not, as they rely on their inherent protection powers to keep them safe.
In other words, despite your toggle powers protections, pretend you don't have them and prepare based on that -- because those protections will be knocked down at some point.
[/ QUOTE ]
so
if Scrapper melee> Blaster Melee and
Blaster melee> Blaster Range then...
Scrapper melee >> Blaster Range
Actually non of the above made any sense.
Blaster BI on melee attacks supass scrappers damage in melee. I can only imagin that you mean DoT and are only considering the melee attacks of blasters. There is nothing that says you cant use the range attacks as time fillers.
The damage on EM is far more important than you realize. With out that damage a blaster wouldn't be able to capitilze off the toggle dropping effect of the attack. Also with the changes to mez resistance there are other way to break through.