Enhancement Proc Changes


Agent White

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombie Man View Post
Procs are a chance to happen. Which necessarily mean a chance not to happen. The new PPMs had a mechanical side effect that in some powers their chance to happen went to 100%. A decision was made to allow that to happen.

Now that the PPM formula is being revamped, the PPMs are getting an over all buff (we don't know how much, but I'm assuming the buff is to compensate for how the change in mechanics might slightly nerf how some PPMs currently work). With that over all buff, it's likely that the PPMs which were going off at 100% would be too over powered, which justifies capping their proc rate to 90%.

That's not a built in chance to fail, unless you purposely misconstrue what procs are meant to be and assume that 100% proc rate is normal... it's not. It was an aberration which was at one time allowed and will now be disallowed.

(And please don't bring the 100% procking Health and Stealth IOs into this... they are different creatures and were made to be 100% procking from their inception.)
This last part is where they stand to piss off more people than they know.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by firespray View Post
I really feel like the whole PPM mechanic was unnecessary from the start. Procs worked fine the way they have for several years.
Not really. Legacy Procs favored fast charging powers over slow charging powers. They also favored powers that hit multiple targets or were continuously active in Toggles, Auto Powers, and Rains/Patches.

Also, many procs had effects which were negligible and worse than slotting a SO Damage.

And some procs were thought to be so much da bomb, that they were made unique (like the barely ever procking for a few seconds Build Up Procs) which then destroyed the possibility of six slotting that set -- or any other set with a Build Up proc -- more than once in a build.

There were lots of bad decisions that went into the original Procs design. But they were made at a time the Cryptic hobbled the development team down to the Freem Fifteen, and so, things hastily went out the development cycle door and had no time for revisiting.

Unfortunately, the same bad decision making process has gone into the new PPMs, though it didn't have to be. The Devs were warned in Beta, but didn't listen.

So, while I get the drama over the changes to PPMs, what I don't get is any nostalgia for the Legacy Procs since they also have their own set of problems. I think people just got used to the poor mechanics of the old Procs... they shouldn't. Something should be done to make Procs a good mechanic.

But folks who leveraged the old bad mechanics or who have leveraged the new bad mechanics are crying 'nerf' to protect their niche, which is not helpful.

Now, I'm not saying the proposed new mechanics for I24 are the right fix; but I am saying I have little regard for those whose arguments are not based in refuting problems of the I24 changes, but who are trying to selfishly protect the bad mechanics they've successfully leveraged for their own gain whether they be the Legacy Procs or the new PPMs.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombie Man View Post
Procs are a chance to happen. Which necessarily mean a chance not to happen. The new PPMs had a mechanical side effect that in some powers their chance to happen went to 100%. A decision was made to allow that to happen.

Now that the PPM formula is being revamped, the PPMs are getting an over all buff (we don't know how much, but I'm assuming the buff is to compensate for how the change in mechanics might slightly nerf how some PPMs currently work). With that over all buff, it's likely that the PPMs which were going off at 100% would be too over powered, which justifies capping their proc rate to 90%.
No, it really doesn't. If they are already modifying it so chance to proc is based on the modified recharge, then they're already accounting for what happens when procs are put in a high recharge power that gets modified by a massive amount of recharge. That's the entire point. *If* they left it at base recharge, then it might make sense to add a cap. Though if they just left it at base recharge, an internal CD on the proc would be preferable to yet another random chance for something to not work.

Quote:
That's not a built in chance to fail, unless you purposely misconstrue what procs are meant to be and assume that 100% proc rate is normal... it's not. It was an aberration which was at one time allowed and will now be disallowed.
If the chance was previously 100% and is being brought down by anything but the change to account for modified recharge, then yes, it is a new chance to fail. If I'm using a power that recharges once every 20 seconds with a PPM of 4, that proc should be activating 100% of the time because it cannot proc more per minute, on average, than it is intended to be. At most (well, a bit less accounting for animation times) it can proc 3 times per minute if you're doing nothing but using that power. So going below 100% does, in fact, make it a chance to fail on top of the inherent 5% chance to miss that all powers already have. If said power is, for some reason, now recharging in 6 seconds due to large amounts of recharge then the power should naturally not be procing every time the power goes off *anyway*.

There is absolutely no point in adding in a new cap in addition to the (needed) change of accounting for the modified recharge of a power. It's messy design that doesn't add anything to the system that lowering the intended amount of procs per minute won't do in a more sensible fashion while not adding more cruft to the system than makes it hard to explain to people. We're already going to have to consider the PPM rate of procs to decide which power would be best suited to take it based on the amount of recharge we have and powers available, so is there a point in adding another layer by saying, "oh, if you think a power will ever go above X seconds to recharge don't bother slotting this proc in it because you'll get nothing more out of it than if you put it in a power that gets the same number of procs on average but can't go above X seconds to recharge."

Quote:
(And please don't bring the 100% procing Health and Stealth IOs into this... they are different creatures and were made to be 100% procing from their inception.)
I wasn't evening considering those, and I realize they're a different beast.


 

Posted

Just piping up again saying how aggravating the PPM's being affected by Modified recharge rate is likely going to be with all the +recharge buffs flying around especially for sets like Energy Aura that has +Recharge in its Status protection toggle. Just commenting because 3 of my favorite characters are Energy Aura with Hasten..


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Synapse View Post
3) Procs Per Minute will use modified recharge instead of base recharge. The reason for this is that the whole idea of Procs Per Minute goes right out the window when we keep the base recharge even though that value can be dramatically altered.
4) To compensate for this, the Procs Per Minute on all enhancements will be increased.
Before we DOOOM this change, let's find out how #4 may affect #3. It's entirely possible that the balance between those two may end up placing the minimum at or near the recharge cap. If that's the case, then this would be a net gain instead of nerf.


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Posted

I certainly don't think makes a valid case to argue against this change, but I will say that PPM mechanics turn procs into something you need Mids, a calculator or maybe both to know what the heck they will do for you.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roderick View Post
This is a MASSIVE nerf to the Stalker ATO proc, especially since the 100% proc rate in Assassin Strike was stated to be working as intended.

Slotting the full set in Assassin Strike (At level 50, counting the recharge from the set and the +Recharge set bonus, but no other sources of recharge) gives a 48% proc rate for the regular and 59% for the purple versions.
Proc rate being calculated off the actual recharge means high-recharge builds are penalized even worse: A stalker with the full purple set slotted in AS and 100% global recharge (for example: Purple set bonus, Quickness from SR and Hasten active) will have a 41.6% proc rate. Sufficient recharge for perma-hasten drops it to less than 33%

Even if the proc rate were doubled, a Stalker would only ever hit the 90% proc rate cap if they had virtually no +recharge bonuses.
/repeats everything this person has said.

I do NOT like this one bit, Synapse. Don't gimp my Stalker


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zybron1 View Post
Before we DOOOM this change, let's find out how #4 may affect #3. It's entirely possible that the balance between those two may end up placing the minimum at or near the recharge cap. If that's the case, then this would be a net gain instead of nerf.
It may be a net gain in a static situation, but as soon as you get recharge buffs above whatever your baseline is, your proc rate will go down, and your attack rate may not.

I'm only vaguely concerned that the static situation will create a net nerf. I'm really not fond of the implications of the dynamic situation.


Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
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Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA

 

Posted

Wow. Design-wise this makes no sense, you're punishing builds that use fast recharging attacks or anything that that benefits from +Recharge. This affects Super Reflexes and Energy Aura builds. Speed Boost, Chrono Shift, and Ageless Destiny hurt more than they help.

I do not approve.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by UberGuy View Post
It may be a net gain in a static situation, but as soon as you get recharge buffs above whatever your baseline is, your proc rate will go down, and your attack rate may not.

I'm only vaguely concerned that the static situation will create a net nerf. I'm really not fond of the implications of the dynamic situation.
Well, I do agree that it's probably a bad idea to have any part of the game penalize +recharge since everything else in the game teaches us that +recharge is a good thing.

My point was that if the PPM rate is adjusted so that the current %proc rate occurs at or near the recharge cap, then anything less than the cap would actually mean greater performance than the current %proc rate.

This may not be the case, and, still, I agree that we shouldn't be penalized for +recharge at all, but many posters have been completely ignoring #4 in the OP.

Overall, I think the goal of equalizing the procs between SBE and in-game is good. Perhaps this implementation is not the way to do it, though.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaosAngelGeno View Post
Wow. Design-wise this makes no sense, you're punishing builds that use fast recharging attacks or anything that that benefits from +Recharge. This affects Super Reflexes and Energy Aura builds. Speed Boost, Chrono Shift, and Ageless Destiny hurt more than they help.

I do not approve.
The problem is kinda more with animation windows than recharge here. Basically to sustain your proc rate as your recharge goes up Synapse seems to be assuming that you'll be triggering the power more often to compensate. But when you've got a lot of powers vying for that animation time this may simply not be the case.

EG I may be happy to fire off an attack every 10 seconds with some proc in it, but if I get chronoshifted & speed boosted it doesn't mean I'm therefore going to be firing it off every 5.5 seconds or whatever it would be to compensate.

He says he's in turn compensating for that by upping the PPM limit but it just seems to me to be a classic case of a developer getting themselves into a tangle with a new system or mechanic and then throwing more and more tweaks and modifications at it in order to somehow make it all balance itself out again (see the addition of the 90% ceiling, which I'm not against in general; but in this case it just seems to be a counterbalance to the PPMs going up, which is a counterbalance to the fact that Current Power Recharge is now used in the Formula of Bewilderment).


 

Posted

Alright, a bunch of people have posted the problem I'm about to describe, but I figured I'd pitch in with an actual example of a character I have on live, and do the math through. So, first, a few points.

-This is a claws/SR scrapper
-I am NOT a min-maxer. Especially on this guy. Almost every power he has, I either threw one/two commons into, or a single full/mostly full set. He probably represents a somewhat typical IO-set-heavy, non-minmaxed build.
-I don't know the full AoE modification for PPMs offhand. That said, I do know how it works with ST attacks, and every attack I'm going to discuss is ST.
-While I may not have squeezed the hell out of this guy's build, it's not for lack of math skills. My degree is math-related, and I have taken a few courses in probability theory, so I have a general idea what I'm talking about.
-I don't know the game's underlying numbers by heart, and have pulled my data from Mids'. That said, all calculations of proc rates based on that data, are mine, and you could change pretty much every number I grabbed from there, and still see the same conclusion.

So, on to the scrapper. Claws/SR. With Hasten off, he sits at about 86.25% global recharge. Nearly every power he has takes LotG, and SR also has quiickness, so this wasn't terribly difficult.
Against single targets, his attack chain is one of the following:
Slash - Strike - Follow Up - Strike
Follow Up - Strike - Slash - Strike.
You'll notice that these are the same chain. Basically, I open based on whether an enemy is likely to dodge me (and thus Slash's def debuff will help make sure Follow Up lands), or is gonna be pretty easy to hit (start with the buffs from Follow Up). Now, the exact details of these three powers are mostly irrelevant, since this discussion is going to be about one thing, and one thing only: The procs.
Two of the above powers have procs. Strike and Follow Up each have a full set of Mako's Bite. This also means that they have the same accuracy, the same damage buff, etc., so I'm going to completely ignore those, and assume that every attack hits.
(As an aside, if someone wants to recheck my math, the last thing you may need to know is that Slash has a full Scrapper's Strike)
Also, my recharge isn't enough to have perma'd hasten. It ends up with about eight seconds every two minutes where it's off. I usually spend those eight seconds not attacking, making sure Practiced Brawler is up, etc. Since the below discussion will be about a very short loop, I'm pretty safe in ignoring this as well.

The gist of my argument is this:
Making PPM rates based on modified recharge values is a downright toxic decision. Any build including procs will suffer when given recharge boosts, because this will NOT increase the rate at which the powers fire, but will decrease the proc rates.

Alright, on to the numbers.
So, the first problem I have pops up right away. We've been told the PPM rates will increase, so I don't actually know what PPM rate is going to be. That said, it's actually mostly irrelevant. Nonetheless, let's analyze my current proc rates, and see what we come up with.

CURRENT VALUES:
One full cycle of my attack chain takes 5.28 seconds to execute. I queue up each power before the previous one executes, and I generally have a very low ping time to the server, so I am generally able to maintain that speed as long as I want.
The proc in Mako's Bite has a 20% chance to fire, and deals 71.75 damage at lvl 50.
So, in Follow Up, MB's proc has a chance to fire once every 5.28 seconds, with a 20% chance to fire. This averages out to 2.2727.... PPM. At 71.75 damage, this gives 2.71780303... DPS added to my attack chain by the proc.
In Strike, MB's proc has the same chance, and twice as many chances to fire. That gives a proc rate of 4.5454... PPM, and a DPS boost of 5.4356060... DPS.

So, the point of looking at my current values was to see what PPM I should expect from Mako's Bite. Strike fires off quite a lot, and only gets up to about four and a half procs per minute. So, just to allay anyone countering me with "But they said the PPMs will go up!", let's assume Mako's Bite gets a whopping 6PPM rate. It's absurdly high, and it's also nice and even (average of one proc every ten seconds), so it makes the maths easier on me.

New Proc, assuming 6PPM:
Assuming Mako's Bite is converted to a PPM-based proc, is given a whopping 6PPM rate, and all PPM-based procs are converted to use actual recharge, not base, I get the following numbers.

Follow Up now triggers the proc at a 45.5% chance.
This gives a rate of 5.1704545... PPM
This gives an added DPS of 5.4356060... DPS from the proc.

Strike now triggers the proc at a 21.6% chance.
This gives a rate of 4.9090... PPM
This gives an added DPS of 5.8704545... DPS

Already, I see a problem. My scrapper is triggering this new 6PPM proc less than six times per minute, per copy. Strike is actually firing at less than five! What gives? Well, I can't fire Strike as often as it recharges. In fact, it spends a lot of its time sitting in my tray, recharged, waiting for me to animate through Slash or Follow Up. Similarly, Follow Up recharges right around when I start the Strike before it, so it doesn't fire as often as it could.

This isn't my argument. This? This is acceptable, sort of. The fact is, the existing for of Mako's Bite also only fires, at maximum, as often as I cycle my powers. This, in and of itself, still isn't my issue. My issue is what happens next.

Let's say I get hit with Speed Boost. Kinetics is a fairly common set, I have a corruptor with it myself, and Speed Boost is generally considered a very solid buff. My scrapper doesn't really benefit from it much, but it certainly doesn't harm him, and if nothing else, it brings Hasten up to the point of being permanent. Currently, if I'm hit with Speed Boost, my Mako's Bite procs still fire once every five attacks, my attacks still animate in the same time, and I still have the same DPS. But what about these new procs?

New proc, 6 PPM, Speed Boost:
Same assumptions as last time, only now, we add 50% global recharge from somewhere (it actually doesn't have to be SB, I'm just offering that as a possibility)

Follow Up now triggers the proc at a 40.5% chance
This gives a rate of 4.6022727... PPM
This gives an added DPS of 5.50355113636... DPS

Strike now triggers the proc at a 20.3% chance
This gives a rate of 4.982727... PPM
This gives an added DPS of 5.5171401515...DPS

Whoa! I was hit by Speed Boost, and it made my main attacks weaker? Yup. Speed boost now has a hidden -DMG component on any proc powers. At this point, Strike is already recharging noticeably faster than its cast time. I could probably fire it non-stop. Nonetheless, I still slip Slash and Follow Up into my attack chain, since the buffs/debuffs are very nice. And look, neither of the powers I have that Mako's Bite proc in is actually able to trigger it at a rate of six times per minute.

Okay, this is interesting, but now let's try something else. My server has Rikti Ship Raids once a week, and at such a raid, it's not unheard of for me to get so many recharge buffs flying around that I sit at the recharge cap for much of the Raid. Let's try doing the math with that, shall we?

New proc, 6PPM, Recharge CAPPED!:

Follow Up now triggers the proc at a 32.3% chance
This gives a rate of 3.6704545... PPM
This gives an added DPS of 4.38925189393... DPS

Strike now triggers the proc at a 18.1% chance
This gives a rate of 4.113636... PPM
This gives an added DPS of 4.9192234848...DPS

Yeah. They both went down quite a lot. I've got a 6PPM proc in these powers, and it's firing about three and two third times a minute in one, and about four times a minute in the other.


I honestly do like the fact that all IO procs are moving to PPM-based procs. That's great, and I support it.
I don't particularly like that the cap is going to be 90%. But, while I oppose it, that's certainly a matter of opinion, and I'll accept it moving to 90%.
And, of course I like PPM rates being increased.

I CANNOT accept the fact that PPM rate will be based on modified recharge. If this happens, any character with a consistent attack chain will be unfairly penalized by outside buffs. Until now, recharge-boosting buffs could only help. If I didn't want the extra recharge, I didn't have to fire my powers any earlier. Now, every bit of recharge I get will make my procs less powerful, even if I can't fire that power any faster. Does this affect minmaxers more? Sure, they tend to have heaps and heaps of recharge. But lots of people participate in things like Zombie invasions, Rikti Ship Raids, Rikti Invasions, etc., and any of those things can easily attract enough people with recharge buffs to cap anyone's global recharge.

I do understand where the devs are coming from. A power with, say, a 20s base recharge, will get a 100% rate on a 3 PPM piece, even if it gets fired WAY more than once every 20s. But using the modified recharge goes too far in the other direction, especially since you actually have to be an incredibly good minmaxer to make sure you're firing every single power you have, exactly at the moment it recharges.

All this being said, I have to wonder if there's a balance somewhere in the middle. I'm not willing to go through the math over and over, but I have a few thoughts, and no idea if any of them would work.

Only use enhanced rech, ignore buffs.
Only use enhancements and set bonuses
Only use constant recharge bonuses (i.e. enhancements, sets, auto powers)
Only use recharge bonuses coming from self.

At the very least, I don't think that other players' recharge-boosting powers should somehow weaken my attacks, as it almost makes me want to shelve my /Time Mastermind and my /Kinetics corruptor.

(Oh, and if anyone spots any actual math errors, please feel free to let me know.)


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zwillinger
If you have concerns regarding your purchase, those should be addressed with customer service.
That's a cop-out, Z, and you know it.

*sigh* Whatever. At this point I'm all about damage control. If the modified procs release like this, it's going to be a global nightmare. The modified recharge component is downright sinister, and the only ones who'd be satisfied are the trolls. As such, I'm far more concerned about my performance than a mere $40+.


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Posted

Soooo, essentially, don't buy any of the in-store IOs. Got it.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by UberGuy View Post
Here's another use case where making the PPM based on actual recharge seems to create what I think are undesirable side-effects.

Imagine you have two Scrappers, one DB/WP and one DB/Regen.

DB can get a seamless attack chain that's pretty respectable at fairly low levels of global recharge. WP has one power that benefits from +recharge - it's self-rez. So basically the DB/WP can get enough recharge for their DB chain and not worry about more.

Regen benefits significantly from very high levels of global recharge, and it's quite reasonable to build Regen for more global recharge than is needed for the basic seamless DB attack chain.

So, built in ways that make sense for their primary/secondary, and using the same attack chain, the same procs in the DB/Regen's attacks would activate less often than those in the DB/WP's, simply because the DB/Regen built in a way that is optimized for their secondary.

That really feels wrong to me.
This is a very valid concen that I would like to see Synapse address.
Kudos Uberguy.

As for the people claiming bait and switch: You either could not do math, or you are not very sincere.

Who in their right mind thought the situation with the SBE PPM and ATIO PPM procs was working as intended?

I don't care that Synapse on a off the cuff respones said "These are ok" they were just mathmatically so superior that they were a massive incongruence in a game where the dev team had a committment that: Pay to Win would not exist.

I am happy they are being addressed, but I am not happy its going to take till issue 24 for it to happen.

I am saying this as a player who builds his toons to perform in the top tier of builds in the game (definately a recharge addict).

Lets calm down, wait to see the new PPM figures and see how it goes.


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Posted

I want to clarify my suggestion for future PPM procs.

  1. Implement a minimum chance to activate so that any given PPM proc is no worse than an existing "X% chance of Y" proc, no matter how fast the power it's slotted in cycles.
  2. Be sure that AoE factors are calculated before the "floor" is checked.
  3. Make the PPM rate based on fixed recharge, and not on either slotted or buff/global recharge.
  4. Set the PPM rate to some middle-of-the road value, smaller than the ones we see today, not greater. Choose the rate based on some "typical" expected level of recharge in powers. Alternatively, make PPM non-linear with cylce time - a progression like LOG(t*C) or SQRT(t*C) for some scale factor C might make more sense, but may be computationally prohibitive.
  5. Keep the 90% ceiling, though #3 makes it less necessary.
Yes, I do realize that #4 would be a nerf compared to today's PPM procs. I am suggesting what I think is a compromise, because this change is going to nerf something, and I'm trying to choose a course that (a) doesn't nerf non-SBE procs (because there are far, far more of them in play) and (b) tries to avoid needing dynamic scaling of proc rate with recharge time.


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American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
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WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Synapse View Post
1) All IO procs will have their flat percentage chance to trigger updated to use Procs Per Minute.
I'm worried this will penalize a lot of builds with regular procs in fast recharging attacks. Please consider setting the current proc chances as minimum.


Quote:
2) Proc chance will cap at 90%. This means that there is always a small chance for the proc to not trigger even if slotted into a power that would previously guarantee a proc.
While I don't agree they need a nerf, this way of going about it makes sense.

Quote:
3) Procs Per Minute will use modified recharge instead of base recharge. The reason for this is that the whole idea of Procs Per Minute goes right out the window when we keep the base recharge even though that value can be dramatically altered.
4) To compensate for this, the Procs Per Minute on all enhancements will be increased.
You're basically penalizing all high-end builds, builds which are made by the same people who actually care about proc performance.

I'm definitely against 3+4, 1 needs a closer look and 2 is fine.

EDIT: Oh yeah, there will be refunds for these right?


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Synapse View Post
1) All IO procs will have their flat percentage chance to trigger updated to use Procs Per Minute.
2) Proc chance will cap at 90%. This means that there is always a small chance for the proc to not trigger even if slotted into a power that would previously guarantee a proc.
3) Procs Per Minute will use modified recharge instead of base recharge. The reason for this is that the whole idea of Procs Per Minute goes right out the window when we keep the base recharge even though that value can be dramatically altered.
4) To compensate for this, the Procs Per Minute on all enhancements will be increased.
I know that this is the direction you've stated that you're going, but if it had to change I'd prefer the flat-percentage to the newer PPM version. This eliminates the need for points 2-4 entirely, and since both systems penalize certain types of powers (low damage/short recharge and AoEs for PPM, high damage/long recharge for flat rate) I'd rather deal with the system that's been in place for years.

Also, if this change is to bring PPM procs more in-line with the older performance and there is a minimum at the current flat proc rate to deal with all of the issues that have been brought up about using modified recharge in this thread you're simply introducing a lot of extraneous steps only to clamp it and get the same effect at high recharge.

However, with the assumption that everything is going to be PPM, I personally would say to ditch either point 2 or 3; in my mind they both attempt to address the same problem and you don't need both - it reminds me of how the i13 PvP revamp went, where several ideas to address the same problems were all done at once instead of incrementally, so you couldn't look at the results and state what was and wasn't working, only that people didn't like the result. Of the two I find point 3 more palatable (mostly because I couldn't believe that they weren't set up that way to start when I first heard about balancing around PPM) but you're back to the +recharge being a debuff issue without clamping the low end (and for that, see the first paragraph of my response).


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agent White View Post
Leveling the playing field is quite fine with me.
^^^

Very happy to hear this. You just made some sales today. Will deal with specifics once it's in beta.


The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.

 

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Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Only in the jurisdiction of your own mind.
Don't assume you know what a State Attorney General or U.S. Attorney would do in regards to a video game. I don't. I don't think this is a crime either, but then there are people in prison right now for things that don't seem to be fraud on their face.


The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Dogma View Post
Dont like it one bit.... PPMs should be discarded altogether. my perf shifters, numinas, regen tissues, and miracles will be severely adversely effected and my planning for proc-ing in AoEs is tough already... this will just make it way more complicated than it needs to be.

Let me repeat: PPM is a horrible idea and should be discarded entirely.

Caveat: I'm willing to admit I don't understand the whole thing, please inform me if I'm missing details.
I agree with this, entirely, including the Caveat. I understand the chance to proc pretty well, but I have trouble 'getting' the PPM mechanic... aoe powers? High recharge builds? Balancing Toggles vs clicks? I r slo.


Arc #6015 - Coming Unglued

"A good n00b-sauce is based on a good n00b-roux." - The Masque

 

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Originally Posted by UberGuy View Post
Implement a minimum chance to activate so that any given PPM proc is no worse than an existing "X% chance of Y" proc, no matter how fast the power it's slotted in cycles.
While I know the PPM mechanic was put in to help procs be more useful in longer cycle powers, I am not entirely convinced it wasn't also put in to help regulate their strength in low cycle time powers.

I know I might want to moderate the way standard Apocalypse works in Flares, for example.


Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.

 

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Originally Posted by Test_Rat View Post
Lets calm down, wait to see the new PPM figures and see how it goes.
this